Thai Women Married Outside Thailand

[BKK90210]

Will thai women lose some rights if she got married outside thailand? What are those rights?

Edited March 31, 2006 by BKK90210

[lopburi3]

No. None.

[BKK90210]

We got married in the US - 20 yrs ago....but didn't registered our married at the Ampur, is this OK?

Also we're planning to move to thailand in 2 more yrs, will this be a problem for me getting the visa?

Edited March 31, 2006 by BKK90210

[lopburi3]

Yes.

You are married under Thai law regardless and your wife should change her Thai ID card to "Mrs" if she has not done so. Her Home Register should also be updated and passport. A visit to Thai Consulate in US can get this started if you are planning on re-locating to Thailand (which I think I recall).

Am sure there are others who have had exactly the same experience who can provide a play-by-play if they see this post.

[BKK90210]

Lopburi

Yes....to which one? to the 1st or 2nd question?

Over last X'mas....We went to the Ampur Bangkapi in BKK, and the official there said it's ok to keep her "MISS" status. Now I'm confused!

[lopburi3]

Sorry but there was no second question when I started my answer - that came later and we don't have pop up telling us a post has been edited (I type slow).

As long as she has proof of being Thai you should be able to receive a non immigrant O visa with your US marriage papers.

[BKK90210]

Thanks so much

BKK

[OldAsiaHand]

We got married in the US - 20 yrs ago....but didn't registered our married at the Ampur, is this OK?

Also we're planning to move to thailand in 2 more yrs, will this be a problem for me getting the visa?

I couldn't disagree any more with the earlier answer you received.

We followed exactly the same road and there were no consequences whatsoever to not registering our marriage in Thailand. I'm not even sure I can imagine what sort of consequences you might be concerned about, but in any event, there are none.

As to changing your wife's name on her Thai ID based on a foreign marriage, that can be tricky. If you do decide to do it (we did only because my wife was applying for US residency), you will have to get a whole pile of certificates and certifications, including one from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs that your US marriage certificate is valid. They, in turn, will require you to get a letter from the US Embassy attesting to the validity of your marriage certificate. Naturally, the US Embassy isn't willing to give you anything of the sort. How could they? They're just notaries, not examiners of disputed documents.

At the time we went through it, the US ambassador was a good, personal friend, and even he couldn't get the Foreign Ministry to budge. We finally solved the problem in a very Thai way. I wrote an affidavit saying our marriage certificate was valid and signed it myself. The embassy notarized my affidavit saying that I was who I claimed to be and that was indeed what I said.

Even then there was one more hurdle. The Foreign Ministry rejected the affidavit on the grounds that it was attached to the notary certificate with a staple, not a permanent rivet. So we had to do it all over again. Eventually my wife threw a fit, called the Minister's wife who she knew, and the whole thing was fixed in two days.

Weclome to Thailand. And good luck.

[BKK90210]

We're still living in the US. So what should we be doing during our last 2 yrs here.

Should we get the marriage certificate translate by the Thai embassy here?

I will be 46 when we decide to move there in 2008, what other documents should I prepare now to get myself ready when the time comes?

[Dragonman]

We got married in the US - 20 yrs ago....but didn't registered our married at the Ampur, is this OK?

Also we're planning to move to thailand in 2 more yrs, will this be a problem for me getting the visa?

As to changing your wife's name on her Thai ID based on a foreign marriage, that can be tricky. If you do decide to do it (we did only because my wife was applying for US residency), you will have to get a whole pile of certificates and certifications, including one from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs that your US marriage certificate is valid. They, in turn, will require you to get a letter from the US Embassy attesting to the validity of your marriage certificate. Naturally, the US Embassy isn't willing to give you anything of the sort. How could they? They're just notaries, not examiners of disputed documents.

It always amuses me how the thai legal system is so strict about certifications and notarizations of foreign documents whilst having no Public Notary system. Foreign countries are expected to accept the certification of Somchai at the Travel Agents, otherwise known as a certified translator.

[lopburi3]

Have your marriage certificte authenticated per instructions at http://www.state.gov/m/a/auth/:

Office of Authentications

The Department of State, Authentications Office is responsible for signing and issuing certificates under the Seal of the U.S. Department of Sate (22 CFR, Part 131) providing authentication services to U.S. citizens and foreign nationals on documents that will be used overseas. This office receives a variety of documents from commercial organizations, private citizens, and officials of the Federal and State governments. Documents include but not limited to: company bylaws, powers of attorney, trademarks, diplomas, transcripts, distributorship agreements, articles of incorporation, good standing certificates, home studies, letters of reference etc. It also ensures that the requested information will serve in the interest of justice and is not contrary to U.S. policy.

Fees

The authentication fee is $6.00 per document*. A personal/company check or money order made payable to the U.S. Department of State must be submitted with document. Visa and Mastercard are accepted for Walk-in Service only.

*Effective May 1, 2006 the Authentication Office fee will change from $6.00 to $7.00 per document. If you have any questions, please email or fax your questions to the fax number or email address listed under Contact Us.

Mail Service

The Authentication of documents takes approximately 3 business days to process from time of receipt**. Please include a cover-letter (see example) with your name, telephone number, address and email address. Please indicate the name of the country where the document will be used. We suggest using a self- addressed stamped envelope for faster return of your documents. Documents received without a return evelope and postage will be returned through the State Department regular mail, which can result in a 2-3 week delay. You can use DHL, Fed/Ex, UPS and express mail services for faster receipt/return of your documents. However, you must enclose a prepaid airbill and envelope.

Mailing Address

U.S. Department of State

Authentications Office

518 23rd Street, N.W. SA-1

Washington, D.C. 20520

** U.S. Postal mail entering the U.S. Department of State must go through a screening process which may delay the time in which we will receive the document.

The Authentication Office will mail documents directly to the Foreign Embassy or Consulates if provided with a transmittal letter, fee, and a pre-addressed stamped envelope. Please enclose an additional pre-addressed stamped envelope for the embassy or consulate to return the document.

Walk-in (Counter Service)

Open - 7:30 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. Only

Monday thru Friday except Federal Holidays

Each customer (company) is limited to 15 documents per day on a while-you-wait basis.

Location

Authentications Office Columbia Plaza Store Front

518 23rd Street, N.W.

Washington, D.C. 20520

Directions by Metro Rail

Nearest Metro Station - Foggy Bottom-GWU

Use Blue or Orange Metro rail to Foggy Bottom-GWU stop.

Exit Metro onto 23rd Street and turn right. Walk down 3 blocks,

Cross Virginia Avenue, walk down to Columbia Plaza on right.

Go through courtyard of Columbia Plaza to 518 23rd Street, N.W.

The office is at the far left corner of the courtyard area.

[Rinrada]

K Wife has never changed her details and we have had no probs.

Last year at our annual invite to the Ambassadors party (in London)I even asked him if/will there be and he assured me.. NO way...

Then we both got stuck into the Chiang Rai wine...... hic

[BKK90210]

Lopburi.....Thanks so much for the link!

Do you happen to know what other usual/common documents need to be authenticated? So we can do them at the same time. I didn't see any expiration clause on that website. Do you know how long it is good for once authenticated?

Mrs BKK

Edited March 31, 2006 by BKK90210

[lopburi3]

It should be forever. It is exactly the same as registering with the Ministry of Foreign Affairs here in Thailand for a Thai document. It makes it legally acceptable worldwide. Don't believe there will be any other documents that you will need, unless children, and they should have been registered with Embassy for passports/birth certificate. You might get it done on your birth certificate but I have never needed mine for anything here.

[BKK90210]

No birth certificate! I lost mine many moons ago...and no one ever asked me for it.

When I was making the new biometric passport at Bangna branch over X'mas, they didn't even ask for it......strange isn't it? So now I have the new Thai-ID and new Thai passport under the same name before married!

Mrs. BKK

[vinny]

Of course, you would have to use your birth certificate in order to get your first ID. After that, you use your ID for everything else.

[BKK90210]

Of course, you would have to use your birth certificate in order to get your first ID. After that, you use your ID for everything else.

Nope....for the first time in 23 yrs, I renewed my ID at Ampur Bangkapi-BKK this past X'mas, they didn't ask me for it. But of course my thai family has been living there for at least 4 generations.

[autonomous_unit]

Not to contradict earlier posts, except we did the local registration of our US marriage and it seemed straightforward, at least for us in BKK. My wife simply created a Thai translation of the original US state marriage certificate (using MS Word to create the same basic layout with Thai labels and values instead of English), and then took it to the MFA in Bangkok to get certified as an accurate copy. I think this is then sufficient to prove the marriage to anyone who understands the law (the validity of foreign marriages here).

However, we went the extra step of registering at the Amphur too, which was entered into the records as a pre-existing marriage, back-dated to the date in the US. Then, a normal certified copy of the record from the Amphur can be presented to anyone who understands Amphur records. When she did this, she also changed her ID records to "Mrs." but kept her own name since neither of us really cares for the hassle of name changes.

I don't think you gain or lose anything, except slightly different wrinkles in various bureacracies. We did it because it made it simpler to claim family health coverage for me from her employer.

[lopburi3]

Of course, you would have to use your birth certificate in order to get your first ID. After that, you use your ID for everything else.

Not for an immigrant visa to the USA. I suspect she had it at that time or obtained other evidence. In any case I was thinking of his US birth certificate.

[vinny]

Of course, you would have to use your birth certificate in order to get your first ID. After that, you use your ID for everything else.

Nope....for the first time in 23 yrs, I renewed my ID at Ampur Bangkapi-BKK this past X'mas, they didn't ask me for it. But of course my thai family has been living there for at least 4 generations.

If you 'renewed' your ID, doesn't this mean that you had already an old ID to renew? I would be surprised if they didn't require your birth certificate for your first ID; what would they use instead?

[BKK90210]

Vinny,

Yes, you're absolutely correct! I had my first ID when I was about 15, about 1 month before going to the US on F-1 visa as a student 25 yrs ago. I believe I lost my thai birth certificate a few yrs after that during my stayed in the US......but somehow never needed one since then.

I just didn't feel the need to renew my ID up until recently when my husband expressed his desire to retire in thailand. At the Ampur they just took my old ID, asked me if I can still read and write thai, took my picture, and paid them 25 bths + 300 bths penalty fee for being soo late. They will not renew my ID if I couldn't read and write thai anymore.

So they gave me a written test. I had to fill out some forms in thai, I filled out most of the blank spaces, but not all......then they said it's fine/ good enough. And that was it!

Mrs. BKK

Edited March 31, 2006 by BKK90210

[vinny]

I think that the Thai language requirement is for Thai naturalisation only. See Thailand’s Nationality Act B.E. 2508 as amended by Acts B.E. 2535 No. 2 and 3 (1992), section 10(5). As your family is Thai for 4 generations, this should not have been a necessary test for you. Anyway, it's good that you remember how to read and write Thai!