Malta warns EU waters 'a cemetery' after fresh tragedy

[simple1]

Folk should fight to make their own country better, the same as my ancestors and l did in the UK. Not take off to find an easy touch country that has been fought for, for them to milk . Sad reality but my folk paid a heavy price to look after our own.

Were you fighthing in your home town/country against your own government. A government that's a brutal dictatorship that owns heavy weapons, employs secret services & deaths squads that will torture, rape and kill your family if you take up arms? Kind of caught between a rock & hard place that if you do take up arms you are more likely than not, not supported and supplied by "freedom loving democracies", but obliged to rely on extremist organisations

Yeah, I get that, but a lot, not all, of these immigrants commit these same violent acts in their host countries from which you say they are fleeing. Perhaps they are seeking something else, not getting caught or are on the lamb. This leaves proposed host countries between the rock and the hard place and I think the proposed host countries have a duty to its own citizens.

From media reports the majority crossing the Mediterranean head to Italy and Spain. As an example, Italy has very strict illegal migrant policy and those captured are detained and assessed, it not passing the assessment criteria, are deported. Most illegal migrants/refugees not detected are illegally employed, underpaid and exploited by the wonderful nationals of their host country.

http://strugglesinitaly.wordpress.com/equality/en-immigration-policies-in-italy/

Can you provide a link to backup your assertion that many illegal migrants have committed violent acts in their home countries? e.g. Australian immigration, who have a very rigorous assessment process, have only identified this issue in a very few cases.

[F430murci]

Folk should fight to make their own country better, the same as my ancestors and l did in the UK. Not take off to find an easy touch country that has been fought for, for them to milk . Sad reality but my folk paid a heavy price to look after our own.

Were you fighthing in your home town/country against your own government. A government that's a brutal dictatorship that owns heavy weapons, employs secret services & deaths squads that will torture, rape and kill your family if you take up arms? Kind of caught between a rock & hard place that if you do take up arms you are more likely than not, not supported and supplied by "freedom loving democracies", but obliged to rely on extremist organisations

Yeah, I get that, but a lot, not all, of these immigrants commit these same violent acts in their host countries from which you say they are fleeing. Perhaps they are seeking something else, not getting caught or are on the lamb. This leaves proposed host countries between the rock and the hard place and I think the proposed host countries have a duty to its own citizens.

From media reports the majority crossing the Mediterranean head to Italy and Spain. As an example, Italy has very strict illegal migrant policy and those captured are detained and assessed, it not passing the assessment criteria, are deported. Most illegal migrants/refugees not detected are illegally employed, underpaid and exploited by the wonderful nationals of their host country.

http://strugglesinitaly.wordpress.com/equality/en-immigration-policies-in-italy/

Can you provide a link to backup your assertion that many illegal migrants have committed violent acts in their home countries? e.g. Australian immigration, who have a very rigorous assessment process, have only identified this issue in a very few cases.

Educated, hardworking immigrants can be a great addition, but those arriving on boats, as with the in flux of boat people from Cuba in the 70s, usually don't work out so well. I agree with you that not all immigrates are bad, immigration and crime rates seem to correlate to origins of immigrants.

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Sweden has imported huge numbers of Muslim immigrants with catastrophic effect. Sweden now has the second highest number of rapes in the world, after South Africa, which at 53.2 per 100,000 is six times higher than the United States. Statistics now suggest that 1 out of every 4 Swedish women will be raped.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3057621/posts

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Muslim Immigrants Five Times More Likely to Commit Crimes than Australians

http://frontpagemag.com/2012/dgreenfield/muslim-immigrants-five-times-more-likely-to-commit-crimes-than-australians/

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1 in 5 Teenage Criminals in England is Muslim

http://frontpagemag.com/2012/dgreenfield/1-in-5-teenage-criminals-in-england-is-muslim/

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Norway: Immigrants Of Muslim Descent Have A 400% Higher Crime Rate Than Native Norwegians

http://midnightwatcher.wordpress.com/2013/02/12/norway-immigrants-of-muslim-descent-have-a-400-higher-crime-rate-than-native-norwegians-video/

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5 % of the Muslim population in Sweden commit 77 % of the rapes

http://shariaunveiled.wordpress.com/2013/06/17/muslims-earn-sweden-the-title-of-rape-capital-of-the-world/

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In the first seven months of 2013, over 1,000 Swedish women reported being raped by Muslim immigrants. Over 300 of those were under the age of 15. The number of rapes is up 16% compared to 2012 numbers.

http://topconservativenews.com/2013/10/muslim-immigrants-raped-over-300-swedish-children-in-seven-months-of-2013/

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Numbers released now 85% of all rapes in Sweden committed by immigrants, likely Muslims and N. Africans

http://beforeitsnews.com/libertarian/2013/06/numbers-released-now-85-of-all-rapes-in-sweden-committed-by-immigrants-likely-muslims-and-n-africans-2510588.html

[F430murci]

*Deleted post edited out*

Dude asked for cites after I made a pretty benign statement. What is disgusting is that women in Sweden now live in fear and ever present danger. What is disgusting is how many women have been abused and assaulted. What is disgusting is honor killings and abuse of women in any country by anyone.

[antfish]

your sources are hate-blogs. nothing more.

[F430murci]

your sources are hate-blogs. nothing more.

Perhaps and I don't know what a hate-blog is because I don't read hate blogs. I just Googled when Simple1 asked for a source about immigrants from violent countries have a tendency to bring violence to new countries.

If those statistics are wrong, then cite statistics from a love-blog or harmony-blog.

The rape and abuse of women problem plaguing Sweden is pretty well documented though and so is the article about statistics on youthful offenders in the UK:

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/2255271

Edited October 15, 2013 by F430murci

[Scott]

Troll posts and replies deleted.

[F430murci]

your sources are hate-blogs. nothing more.

Perhaps and I don't know what a hate-blog is because I don't read hate blogs. I just Googled when Simple1 asked for a source about immigrants from violent countries have a tendency to bring violence to new countries.

If those statistics are wrong, then cite statistics from a love-blog or harmony-blog.

The rape and abuse of women problem plaguing Sweden is pretty well documented though and so is the article about statistics on youthful offenders in the UK:

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/2255271

Is Huffington Post racist?

A study by The National Counsel on Crime and Prevention regarding Sweden states:

"In the study, immigrants were found to be four times more likely to be investigated for lethal violence and robbery than ethnic Swedes. In addition, immigrants were three times more likely to be investigated for violent assault, and five times more likely to be investigated for sex crimes."

"The report is based on statistics for those "suspected" of offences, but Stina Holmberg of the Council for Crime Prevention said that there was "little difference" in the statistics for those suspected of crimes and those actually convicted."

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_and_crime

Edited October 15, 2013 by Scott

[antfish]

your sources are hate-blogs. nothing more.

Perhaps and I don't know what a hate-blog is because I don't read hate blogs. I just Googled when Simple1 asked for a source about immigrants from violent countries have a tendency to bring violence to new countries.

If those statistics are wrong, then cite statistics from a love-blog or harmony-blog.

The rape and abuse of women problem plaguing Sweden is pretty well documented though and so is the article about statistics on youthful offenders in the UK:

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/2255271

Is Huffington Post racist?

A study by The National Counsel on Crime and Prevention regarding Sweden states:

"In the study, immigrants were found to be four times more likely to be investigated for lethal violence and robbery than ethnic Swedes. In addition, immigrants were three times more likely to be investigated for violent assault, and five times more likely to be investigated for sex crimes."

"The report is based on statistics for those "suspected" of offences, but Stina Holmberg of the Council for Crime Prevention said that there was "little difference" in the statistics for those suspected of crimes and those actually convicted."

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_and_crime

the links you posted in your long entry lead to racists blogs.

hoffpost says nothing about your rape statistics.

the wikipedia entry everybody can edit says nothing about Muslims.

Edited October 15, 2013 by antfish

[F430murci]

Perhaps and I don't know what a hate-blog is because I don't read hate blogs. I just Googled when Simple1 asked for a source about immigrants from violent countries have a tendency to bring violence to new countries.

If those statistics are wrong, then cite statistics from a love-blog or harmony-blog.

The rape and abuse of women problem plaguing Sweden is pretty well documented though and so is the article about statistics on youthful offenders in the UK:

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/2255271

Is Huffington Post racist?

A study by The National Counsel on Crime and Prevention regarding Sweden states:

"In the study, immigrants were found to be four times more likely to be investigated for lethal violence and robbery than ethnic Swedes. In addition, immigrants were three times more likely to be investigated for violent assault, and five times more likely to be investigated for sex crimes."

"The report is based on statistics for those "suspected" of offences, but Stina Holmberg of the Council for Crime Prevention said that there was "little difference" in the statistics for those suspected of crimes and those actually convicted."

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_and_crime

the links you posted in your long entry lead to racists blogs.

hoffpost says nothing about your rape statistics.

the wikipedia entry everybody can edit says nothing about Muslims.

I guess you just missed the sentence right after the ones I quoted in first paragraph that state:

"Among foreigners suspected of offences, those from North Africa and Western Asia were overrepresented."

This is directly from a report by Crime and Prevention and not some wiki racist editor conspiring to defame any one. Follow the citations and see where it takes you if you think wiki is wrong.

The point is, you criticize and condemn, but you never ever offer anything to back up your criticism and condemnation.

Why are you so afraid to acknowledge a terrible immigration problem experienced by Sweden or any country for that matter?

Edited October 15, 2013 by F430murci

[antfish]

I guess you just missed the sentence right after the ones I quoted in first paragraph that state:

"Among foreigners suspected of offences, those from North Africa and Western Asia were overrepresented."

This is directly from a report by Crime and Prevention and not some wiki racist editor conspiring to defame any one. Follow the citations and see where it takes you if you think wiki is wrong.

The point is, you criticize and condemn, but you never ever offer anything to back up your criticism and condemnation.

Why are you so afraid to acknowledge a terrible immigration problem experienced by Sweden or any country for that matter?

That wiki entry does not back up your muslims-rape-innocent-blonde-swedish-girls stories.

Yes, i condemn racism. do i have to back it up or justify my opinion any further to explain why i condemn racism? Don't you understand whats wrong with racism and those blogs full of hate you linked to?

Edited October 15, 2013 by antfish

[Mosha]

Those "ramshackle" boats may not be traveling laden as far as some people believe,

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-24541425

[simple1]

your sources are hate-blogs. nothing more.

Perhaps and I don't know what a hate-blog is because I don't read hate blogs. I just Googled when Simple1 asked for a source about immigrants from violent countries have a tendency to bring violence to new countries.

If those statistics are wrong, then cite statistics from a love-blog or harmony-blog.

The rape and abuse of women problem plaguing Sweden is pretty well documented though and so is the article about statistics on youthful offenders in the UK:

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/2255271

What I asked for was proof of your assertion that a lot, with the inference the majority, of these boat people have committed crimes in their home countries. Without going thought all of your links I would assert that the crimes committed are by a small minority of the new arrivals. However I did some investigation of the statistics quoted for Norway & Sweden refer below.

Statistics regarding assault rapists:

The Oslo Police District has given a report of rapes in Oslo in 2010. The report shows that for all types of rape, except assault rape, European perpetrators are in the majority, and they are mostly Norwegian. Assault rapes covers only five identified unique person. These have all a foreign origin. The number is however, so low that it does not provide a basis for drawing conclusions with regard to country of origin. Two of them were very young (under 18) and two had severe psychiatric diagnoses and cannot be regarded as representative of their ethnic culture. It is highlighted in the report that generalizations like “Oslo’s rapists are foreigners”, which have been seen in media, are wrong. The report gives no statistics regarding religion of rapists.”

Yours Sincerely,

Grethe Kleivan

Deputy Director General

http://www.loonwatch.com/2011/12/gil-ronens-fabricated-statistics-about-oslo-rapists-being-all-muslim/

http://itsnobody.wordpress.com/2011/08/15/debunking-the-atheistracist-muslim-rape-lie-in-sweden/

Edited October 16, 2013 by simple1

[F430murci]

your sources are hate-blogs. nothing more.

Perhaps and I don't know what a hate-blog is because I don't read hate blogs. I just Googled when Simple1 asked for a source about immigrants from violent countries have a tendency to bring violence to new countries.

If those statistics are wrong, then cite statistics from a love-blog or harmony-blog.

The rape and abuse of women problem plaguing Sweden is pretty well documented though and so is the article about statistics on youthful offenders in the UK:

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/2255271

What I asked for was proof of your assertion that a lot, with the inference the majority, of these boat people have committed crimes in their home countries. Without going thought all of your links I would assert that the crimes committed are by a small minority of the new arrivals. However I did some investigation of the statistics quoted for Norway & Sweden refer below.

Statistics regarding assault rapists:

The Oslo Police District has given a report of rapes in Oslo in 2010. The report shows that for all types of rape, except assault rape, European perpetrators are in the majority, and they are mostly Norwegian. Assault rapes covers only five identified unique person. These have all a foreign origin. The number is however, so low that it does not provide a basis for drawing conclusions with regard to country of origin. Two of them were very young (under 18) and two had severe psychiatric diagnoses and cannot be regarded as representative of their ethnic culture. It is highlighted in the report that generalizations like Oslos rapists are foreigners, which have been seen in media, are wrong. The report gives no statistics regarding religion of rapists.

Yours Sincerely,

Grethe Kleivan

Deputy Director General

http://www.loonwatch.com/2011/12/gil-ronens-fabricated-statistics-about-oslo-rapists-being-all-muslim/

http://itsnobody.wordpress.com/2011/08/15/debunking-the-atheistracist-muslim-rape-lie-in-sweden/

I'd call this a demographic based immigration problem in Switzerland:

In 2010, a statistic was published which listed delinquency by nationality (based on 2009 data). To avoid distortions due to demographic structure, only the male population aged between 18 and 34 was considered for each group. From this study it became clear that crime rate is highly correlated on the country of origin of the various migrant groups. Thus, immigrants from Germany, France and Austria had a significantly lower crime rate than Swiss citizens (60% to 80%), while immigrants from Angola, Nigeria and Algeria had a crime rate of above 600% of that of Swiss population. In between these extremes were immigrants from Former Yugoslavia, with crime rates of between 210% and 300% of the Swiss value.

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You also did not address Sweden who has unfortunately just had a nightmare lately with crimes, rapes and riots.

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In Stockholm and other towns and cities last week, bands made up mostly of young immigrants set buildings and cars ablaze in a spasm of destructive rage rarely seen in a country proud of its normally tranquil, law-abiding ways.

The disturbances, with echoes of urban eruptions in France in 2005 and Britain in 2011, have pushed Sweden to the center of a heated debate across Europe about immigration and the tensions it causes in a time of deep economic malaise.

The riots, now subsiding, have produced less damage than the earlier ones in Paris and London, which also involved mostly immigrants. But the unrest has shaken Sweden, which has a reputation for welcoming immigrants and asylum seekers, including those fleeing violence in countries like Iraq, Somalia and Syria, and regularly ranks in surveys as one of the worlds happiest places.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/world/europe/swedens-riots-put-its-identity-in-question.html?_r=0

[sean in udon]

This may be off topic. Apologies if it is.

I am completely opposed to the EU's open door policy imposed on it's member countries. The asylum system in the UK is abused beyond comprehension.

However, consider it from the perspective of the alleged asylum seeker. The streets of London are literally paved with gold for them. Get into the UK and you have the chance of getting free accommodation, free money, free healthcare, etc in a relatively civilised society.

If you play your cards right maybe bring your family over. Want a guarantee of getting asylum? For men, stick your tackle in some bird and make a baby. For the ladies, give birth in the UK.

The point I'm trying to make, which should be relevant to all countries being inundated with asylum seekers, is, in the same circumstances as them, what would you do?

I know I'd be on the next available boat, train, lorry, whatever. Free money, free house, free food and a potential future - I'm only human!

Edited January 29, 2014 by sean in udon

[Scott]

A post with messed up quotes has been deleted and an off-topic post.

Please stay on topic.

[sean in udon]

To clarify my previous post a little (the free house, free money, etc) take a look at http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1293730/Somali-asylum-seeker-family-given-2m-house--complaining-5-bed-London-home-poor-area.html

You are in some far off, war torn country and a friend shows you a printout of that article. Or any other inflammatory Daily Mail article.

In fact, if I could change my identity and go back to the UK as an asylum seeker, I would.