best deal Asian nations to buy, bring in and store precious metals?

[hermespan]

Experiences please, especially from those with regional experience. Anyone familiar with the markets in Mumbai, Hong Kong and Bangkok because they frequently travel between the three and they have a taste for baubles and bullion? Add Dubai too? I restrict my travels to non-West Asia however.

I have bought precious metals in the west, plus in Cambodia, Thailand, Malaysia, India etc. I keep trying to find the perfect strategy of where to buy both coins (rare and standard bullion), bullion bars, anf bullion (or close to Bullion standard) jewellery. Challenge is prices, laws and enforcement keeps changing.

Thus far it seems that Thailand is very good value, but only for gold, especially jewellery. BTW, that one shop in Yaowart that claims to sell 24K, is that true? The Thai standard is 965, yes? That's what - 23K?

I thought Hong Kong would be better value for sterling jewellery but the price at a teeny kiosk was about the same as a Khao Sarn jewellery shop (I regret not buying, the designs were more to my taste. Funny, The HKG vendor said the items were from THAILAND yet I cannot find these chunkier western styles in Bangkok). In PNH got ripped off for those silver thin bits that girlies get wrapped around their luscious Khmer waists for good luck. But at a Poipet jewellery repair shop found second-hand men's bracelet at close to spot (unlucky gambler pawning?)

I am in India right now and disappointed with premiums. Indians seem to want brand name now and you try buying a platinum ring at Joylukka in Kochi at an affordable price. I just bought a used 995 platinum wedding band at a reputable jeweller in Javeri Bazaar in Mumbai. Talk about a premium! OK, high melting point and limited market. Maybe it was the famous US store mark. Still much cheaper than Hawaii, USA (I checked at Harry Winston's in Honolulu). Warning: don't make my mistake and not check size, Pt is costlier to resize).

Want to get paladium and rhodium rings. Supposedly AMERICAN METALS in USA sells, but they never answer my emails. COHEN MINT sells various odd ball metals medals but high premium and they have a dodgy reputation for fulfilling orders. Kitco (Canada) sells rhodium bullion (out if stock of powder) but today's spot price is $975. Thus $1175 is a splurgevpremium. And Kitco doesn't sell rhodium to Canada. How weird. I have given up asking for rhodium rings in India. Jewellers have only rhodium plated gold. Suppose I'll have to go to an Uncle Kumar's type custom jewellery maker. India has piles of zillion dollar of stock AC jewellers seling fancy stuff. I am just looking for the metal, portable and discreet with no brand name from an honest sonar (goldsmith).

I thought India was supposed to have *cheaper* prices than Thailand, but I think that at the moment this just isn't true. Anither problem is I don't dress like a Hindu bride. I read that the Indian federal gov't in its wisdom to control the weak rupee added import tax of 15%. That could be the crunch.

In small town Vietnam I got a 24K wedding band in a shop where everyone was lining up since at the time their federal gov't was restricting bullion purchase.

Where NOW is the best place to buy good delivery list gold and bullion jewellery? And BTW, how does CGK compare? I gave an upcoming trip to Jakarta. I try to buy one precious metal item in every nation, but sometimes its so poor value that I don't.

For storage Singapore is excellent value, especially as all good delivery list bullion is now duty free, you can bring in negotiables of up to something like USD23,000 and secure storage can be had. My problem is travelling with ONE pesky bar or even 50 ounces of silver just isn't cost effective unless I am going anyway. Oh, and you have to pay duty on collectible coins and rhodium. Not that they check... Warning: The red dot is a poor place to BUY bullion.

Hong Kong is best value, that satellite of a communist nation actually has much more of a free market for the little guy like me than Thailand does.

Canadian Mint bullion you'd think would be chepest in Canada but the national mint only sells through retailers now so I think AMPEX in USA might be better deal (especially as right now free domestic delivery).

I think there is room for a co-operative or small business catering to gold bug expats - we buy whatever you want in precious metals wherever on the planet is currently the best deal, personally courier it to you. And as it is jewellery or in personal luggage there is no duty or taxes.

Still looking for my paradise - where precious metals are low premium, no tax and secure storage. So far, I have to scramble in a patchwork effort.

[Bpuumike]

Premiums and the buy/sell spread for Thai gold in Thailand I think are the lowest in the world but your problem will be storage as safe deposit boxes are not readily available and no 'vaults' that I know of.

You mentioned buying rings - don't do that for investment purposes.

[hermespan]

Premiums and the buy/sell spread for Thai gold in Thailand I think are the lowest in the world but your problem will be storage as safe deposit boxes are not readily available and no 'vaults' that I know of.

You mentioned buying rings - don't do that for investment purposes.

Does anyone have experience buying gold etc in Hong Kong and Mumbai/Kolkata so can compare?

You make a good point about secure storage - United Building's EMERALD on mezanine indeed has safe boxes and at a very affordable prices. There is at least one other such service in BKK but the Israeli jeweller I spoke to prefers number two on Silom because they try harder (actually because fewer queues). A huge box can be had in United building for something like THB400 a month.

Rings and necklaces I buy to avoid any taxes transferring between nations. Singapore has excellent boxes but a fifth of the size for same price. However for serious money I trust girls with pistols in Singapore more than the nice guards at Emerald.

I buy metals as disaster insurance. i hope for the sake of the world that prices go down (less panic). Plus then I can buy more.

[Naam]

Does anyone have experience buying gold etc in Hong Kong and Mumbai/Kolkata so can compare?

why would anybody buy gold in India with an added tax premium of meanwhile 18%?

[hermespan]

Does anyone have experience buying gold etc in Hong Kong and Mumbai/Kolkata so can compare?

why would anybody buy gold in India with an added tax premium of meanwhile 18%?

EXACTLY

[Ludacris]

Why don't you just trade ETF's or futures contracts of precious metals?

Avoid all the hassles you just described - transportation, storage, local regulations, taxes, etc.

Maybe you're shopping locally for good prices, but surely the time and hassle involved isn't worth it.

I don't understand why any retail investor would actually buy and sell the physical metals when you can just trade electronically.

[Bpuumike]

Why don't you just trade ETF's or futures contracts of precious metals?

Avoid all the hassles you just described - transportation, storage, local regulations, taxes, etc.

Maybe you're shopping locally for good prices, but surely the time and hassle involved isn't worth it.

I don't understand why any retail investor would actually buy and sell the physical metals when you can just trade electronically.

Trading is one thing, and something I never do in PM's. It's a good way to lose money.

On the other hand, buy physical metals as there is no counter party risk and just tuck them away somewhere.

I doubt most of the major ETF's actually hold enough. You will find out if (or rather when) a crunch comes.

My regular gold shop is on the way to my regular bar so no hassle at all.

Prices here in BKK are pretty much the same at every shop and they display the current price on large electronic boards.

Edited December 21, 2013 by Bpuumike

[Ludacris]

I still don't get it.

If you want to hold long-term just buy the ETF's since they don't have an expiry date like futures contracts do. Buying and selling electronically also gives you more flexibility since you can go short, which of course you can't do with the actual metals.

Instead of going into an actual shop and then carrying a bunch of gold in your pocket when you're drunk in a bar, and then storing it at home (which is a huge risk in Thailand!), isn't it easier to make a couple clicks on your computer?

If you're one of those doomsday preppers who is collecting physical gold for when the financial system collapses, that's a different topic altogether and nothing I say on here will convince you otherwise, and that's not what the OP was talking about. Although you should be aware that the financial crisis has been over for a few years now and if you are still worried about the US dollar, just hold a few different currencies (including Asian currencies of course), which you can also do online...

[hermespan]

I am somewhere inbetween a doomsday prepper and an investor. I buy physical precious metals not so much because I think that the world economy will collapse, as that I don't understand, or more importantly don't 'grok' derivatives. I understand gold and silver. I can hold it in my hand. It is more or less anonymous. I don't trust governments, banks etc. But I keep 15-20% of my net assets in precious metals.

I intend to buy stocks, bonds, etc but bristle at the regulations and controls. If I could buy bearer bonds I would do so. But these days one doesn't even actually own the stock, it's in the name of the broker. I am no financial genius to be sure, but I find financial markets complicated and the movers and shakers (especially central banks) suspect.

The only significant disadvantage I find to silver is the storage costs and lately collapsing prices.

[SheungWan]

Premiums and the buy/sell spread for Thai gold in Thailand I think are the lowest in the world but your problem will be storage as safe deposit boxes are not readily available and no 'vaults' that I know of.

You mentioned buying rings - don't do that for investment purposes.

I buy metals as disaster insurance. i hope for the sake of the world that prices go down (less panic). Plus then I can buy more.

Never mind that gold has been the disaster for 2013 and holding shares has been the better insurance against the 'make up a bogus theory to justify gold' club.

Edited December 25, 2013 by SheungWan

[Ludacris]

Hermes, please note that the commodity ETF's move almost exactly with the spot price. So really there's nothing extra to understand to trade electronically.

For most people the regulations and controls for buying and selling stocks are very minimal.

You should definitely look into electronic trading.