Demonstrations in Bangkok raise concerns about stability of Thailand

[webfact]

Demonstrations in Bangkok Raise Concerns About Stability of Thailand
By THOMAS FULLER
The New York Times

BANGKOK — Thailand’s governing party accused protesters on Tuesday of fomenting anarchy and trying to overthrow the government after thousands of people swarmed the streets of Bangkok, besieging crucial ministries and threatening to take their campaign nationwide.

In a country that has become less governable amid a grinding and bitter political rivalry, protesters surrounded the Interior Ministry on Tuesday and threatened to cut off power to the Agriculture, Tourism and Transport Ministries. Those actions followed the occupation of the Foreign and Finance Ministries on Monday.

“Occupying government property cannot be considered anything but insurrection,” said Kokaew Pikulthong, a member of Parliament for the governing party, Pheu Thai.

The party said it had filed a petition with the attorney general’s office accusing protesters of trying to overthrow the government. Demonstrators, Mr. Kokaew said, “want Thailand to descend into anarchy.” [read more...]

Full story: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/27/world/asia/bangkok-protests-spur-concerns-about-thai-stability.html

-- The New York Times 2013-11-27

[SamMunich]

Why do the PT people always equal their rule of corruption with the wellbeing of the country?

I talked to normally unpolitical people yesterday and they said they hope the Taksin clique will be swept away this time. They came out and cheered, small-scale business women, stall-owners etc. when a demonstration passed by on it's way to MCOT.

There was a Thailand before Taksin and there will be a Thailand after Taksin and his cohorts, so simple...

Now let's hope Yingluck gets so shamed in the no-confidence debate, that she calls it quits. And Yaowapa,- I don't think they can even push her in the party, as she is boss of a faction and the other factions would feel bad and be unhappy to support her.

Let's hope, by HM the King's birthday all this is history.

SamM

Edited November 27, 2013 by SamMunich

[noitom]

Of course Thailand is unstable. This obligatory NY Times article on Thai demonstrations features nothing new. Since 1932, there have been 18 or 19 coups, military takeovers, deadly demonstrations, pervasive corruption at all levels, and a black economy consisting of unregulated food vendors, rampant sex trade and human trafficking, counterfeit intellectual property trade, rampant crime with impunity by upper levels of society and anyone with the means to buy or bribe their way out. It's virtually a failed state with major rice, seafood, tourist and sex trade businesses.

One can easily see blatantly corrupted police taking cash settlements for violations on the road or anywhere, publicly traded businesses run by entire generations of families, boards manned by retired or in some cases active army officers, insider deals, land grabs, illegal poaching, lack of transparency in every aspect of the economy and society, and discrimination against those Thais of darker color and lower tiers of social structure and wealth are just a few of the hallmarks of the Thai game. It is no wonder yet again that foreign governments have issued warnings about the danger and risk of Thailand. Thailand is still very much a feudal culture with a system of points based on societal rank. and the associated frustrations of the majority population.

Mr. Fuller's article has little or no value to contribute to a real understanding of the above festering causes of unrest and potential violence in Thailand. Protests on a mass scale throughout Thailand's history have usually escalated to killing and violence as numerous protests at Thammasat University as well as on the streets of Bangkok have illustrated in the past. It should be no new surprise that Thailand is unstable.

The Thai south has been in a constant state of terror, bombings, shootings, and guerilla/military conflict for more than ten years. This conflict in the Thai south has resulted in something close to a reported 6,000 deaths, countless injuries and damage and has been largely ignored by the foreign and Thai press. The Thai south and its guerilla war and associated terrorism certainly would be a major factor in Thai instability. Not coincidentally, a major segment of the current protestors are from the south of Thailand as is Mr. Suthep himself.

[Spare]

I assure you, all will be over before Dec 5th.

[user82374298374]

Welcome to Asia, where 'corruption' in the Western sense is viewed as normal and even desirable. The populace are fine with corruption, as long as they can secure some of the spoils. This is true of all Asian countries, including Japan, Singapore, and the RoK - they just hide it better, although especially egregious examples do make it into their relatively constrained local media, and thus into the international media.

Thaksin's insight was that if he gave back a small portion of the money extracted from the populace directly to the peasantry, rather than to the neo-feudal elite, he could in effect become the Huey Long of Thailand.

It's important to understand that there are no 'good' actors in this ongoing Hobbesian struggle - it is merely a clash between competing elite patronage networks.

'Democracy' in the Western sense does not exist in Asia, and is largely a facade intended to placate Western liberals in order to gain trade advantages and military alliances against neighboring countries. I find the foreign partisans on both (all?) sides here to be quite amusing, as they don't seem to grasp the fact that this is business as usual in Asia, that it's been this way for thousands of years, and is likely continue to be this way in future, with little prospect of meaningful of change.

Edited November 27, 2013 by disambiguated

[Robby nz]

“Occupying government property cannot be considered anything but insurrection,” said Kokaew Pikulthong, a member of Parliament for the governing party, Pheu Thai.

As a red shirt leader in 2010 he should know.

[Lupatria]

Stability of Thailand? I did not know such thing exists. Maybe I'm stupid too.

[Thainy Tim]

I assure you, all will be over before Dec 5th.

Wishful thinking.

It could be over by tomorrow if the PTP wise up and pull a reversal on their allegiance with the House of Thaksin.

Then proper dialog can begin to clean up the current system.

I really do believe that the Dems and Suthep want a non-corrupt democratic state. Even if there has been history of vested interests from that side of the divide in the past, it is nothing compared to what is going on and will continue to go on with the current makeup.

We have to give them the benefit of the doubt because the current situation is unacceptable. Try to woo the PTP into seeing sense and dumping Thaksin and Yingluck and let them finish their term of office albeit under close scrutiny, and using only practices within the constitution and the rule of law so that all can see what they are really made of. The results will be one of two things. They will make a mess of it and require huge vote buying in the next elections or they will show themselves as an adequate party to govern without the need for Thaksin and his string pulling.

Edited November 27, 2013 by Thainy Tim

[bigbamboo]

Technically (with nine post war coups) Thailand is the least politically stable country in the world and it looks like they trying for number ten.

It is already a veritable 'hub' of instability.

[tingtongteesood]

“Occupying government property cannot be considered anything but insurrection,” said Kokaew Pikulthong, a member of Parliament for the governing party, Pheu Thai.

How about closing down the central shopping district and tourist centre, stopping people going to their homes, burning down buildings, throwing grenades at houses of people who disagree with you etc etc. could these also be considered insurrection ? How is this idiot not rotting in prison !? As soon as PT are out I see dark days ahead for him. RIGHT ON !

[thailandpeter2]

it takes one to know one... the expert is speaking... but i guess he and also the today's protesters would see themselves as innocent as they do not regard anything as government property (as they denounce and do not acknowledge the government), but as the property of the people. therefore, in their eyes, no violation of the law...

“Occupying government property cannot be considered anything but insurrection,” said Kokaew Pikulthong, a member of Parliament for the governing party, Pheu Thai.

As a red shirt leader in 2010 he should know.

[thailandpeter2]

regarding: Mr. Kokaew said, “want Thailand to descend into anarchy.”

that's really funny! does this idiot not realize that thailand HAS descended already some way into anarchy, and not only since now?

but, to do him justice, he is by far not the only idiot amongst the proponents - on both sides...

[billd766]

Government property is NOT really the property of any government at all but that of the state.

As the people actually paid for it it truly belongs to the people o let them enter if they wish.

As long as no damage is done and people can work if they want what is the problem?

[Dap]

Government property is NOT really the property of any government at all but that of the state.

As the people actually paid for it it truly belongs to the people o let them enter if they wish.

As long as no damage is done and people can work if they want what is the problem?

As a guess, PTP"s lack of control.

[super22k]

Shall I go back home to England?

[icare999]

really theirs none so blind they can't see as they say Thialand has been in a state of instability since Taksin came on the scene and will be until he is finally gone and lets hope that day is now near