Starting a Tutoring Service in Thailand

[arcturaz]

I am interested in starting a Tutoring Service here in Thailand. I have several years of ESL Experience in Indonesia; Taiwan and Thailand; I also have many years experience starting and running my own businesses in New York City and Thailand - The future looks good for well run language services. I will not go into extensive details about ES, BP or BS :-) because building a business is all about hard work on a daily basis.- As a footnote I will say I currently have a Company in Thailand under the Amity Agreement. I am not sure if that company can be useful in a scenario such as this.

The questions I have are entirely about government regulations and 'ownership'. Unless I am mistaken to obtain a School license the director needs to have a Master's Degree in Education; however I am not sure that person needs to be a citizen of Thailand?

Therefore my primary questions are as follows

- What is the precise company makeup; viz., Share percentages?; Foreign ownership allowed?

- What degree of 'control' does the director have in such a company, i.e., Can they just be a hired head?

- What are the requirements for capital (registered amount? Proofs?)

- What are the primary license(s) needed?

- Curriculum; can one be purchased preapproved from the government itself? Is this just a rubber stamp process? (later we develop our own in relation to obvious technical and academic advances)?

- Tax situation. I understand a teaching organization is not taxed if it makes money on any curriculum attached to their school license; so is it advisable to attach several curriculum to the initial license? and if so what extra difficulty would this add to the process?

Thank anyone who replies for their patience with my groping for answers in what is certainly a difficult yet intriguing business area.

E

[Torrens54]

Hi "arcturaz",

Congratulations on an excellent idea. You didn't mention what part of Thailand you are in. If you are in Chiang Mai, I'd like to catch up and chat about the proposal and offer some assistance.

Please send me a Personal Message via Thaivisa with your contact details.

Cheers,

Murray.

[arcturaz]

simon43 posted an excellent question so I would like to add this to my already bloated list of questions. Please see excerp below.

"In other words, when one establishes a language centre, it always starts off as a business, and then becomes an 'informal school' after the MOE issue the school. licence further down the line."

Is one obliged to seek an MOE licence? Or can one simply operate as a business throughout the life of the language centre, (without the tax advantages of being a licenced school)?

[simon43]

Perhaps someone such as MacWalen or BruceTEFL can answer this important question.

I cannot believe that anyone who intends to start a language centre (teaching English to small grouips - not an international school or suchlike), has to wait up to 2 years for the MOE licence before they can actually start giving lessons.

Simon

Edited February 14, 2014 by simon43

[arcturaz]

I have long since ceased to be flummoxed by the quagmire of indolence, arrogance and contradiction that is the governmental status quo here in Thailand. However it IS THE LEGEM TERRAE as well :-)

Therefore whomsoever does business here needs to have a firm grip on the details of legislation and protocol. I pray for some guidance from knowledgeable individuals.

I agree with Simon that 2 years sounds inordinately long. It only took me a week for a Tour License back n 2003.

[Loaded]

It can take a long time for the license to come through. The MoE want to ensure that the school has a viable business strategy before awarding the license. Running the school during the license application period is tolerated. However, without the license plus audited accounts, shareholder lists etc, it won't be possible to provide paperwork for non-immigrant B visas and work permits for foreign teachers. And yes, I know it's difficult to run a viable language school without foreign language teachers.

[simon43]

However, without the license plus audited accounts, shareholder lists etc, it won't be possible to provide paperwork for non-immigrant B visas and work permits for foreign teachers. And yes, I know it's difficult to run a viable language school without foreign language teachers.

We are going round in circles here - this thread is also identical in content to the other thread that I started.

Specifically, do you need an MOE licence to open a Thai limited company that employs 4 Thais and 1 non-Thai with a WP, for the purposes of teaching English to Thais?

I understand that the licence is needed if you want to claim tax-free status on your curriculum where it is approved by the MOE, but is it obligatory/a legal requirement to obtain that licence? Or can I simply operate my registered business, pay tax, submit accounts etc, exactly as I already do for my Thai hotel businesses?

I am beginning to think that someone is trying to hide the secret from me - that there actually is no requirement to obtain an MOE school licence before your registered company starts offering English lessons.

Simon

Edited February 15, 2014 by simon43

[sirchai]

It can take a long time for the license to come through. The MoE want to ensure that the school has a viable business strategy before awarding the license. Running the school during the license application period is tolerated. However, without the license plus audited accounts, shareholder lists etc, it won't be possible to provide paperwork for non-immigrant B visas and work permits for foreign teachers. And yes, I know it's difficult to run a viable language school without foreign language teachers.

Or the ocean without fish and water.-

[Loaded]

However, without the license plus audited accounts, shareholder lists etc, it won't be possible to provide paperwork for non-immigrant B visas and work permits for foreign teachers. And yes, I know it's difficult to run a viable language school without foreign language teachers.

We are going round in circles here - this thread is also identical in content to the other thread that I started.

Specifically, do you need an MOE licence to open a Thai limited company that employs 4 Thais and 1 non-Thai with a WP, for the purposes of teaching English to Thais?

I understand that the licence is needed if you want to claim tax-free status on your curriculum where it is approved by the MOE, but is it obligatory/a legal requirement to obtain that licence? Or can I simply operate my registered business, pay tax, submit accounts etc, exactly as I already do for my Thai hotel businesses?

I am beginning to think that someone is trying to hide the secret from me - that there actually is no requirement to obtain an MOE school licence before your registered company starts offering English lessons.

Simon

The company normally comes first.

Then, you are obligated to a apply for a non-formal school license if the nature of your business is providing classes (language, cooking, massage etc). Think of the license as 'supervision'. The MoE need to supervise and approve your school, building, facilities, staff etc.

However, the reality is that some 'schools' are run without a license. The owners get away with it at present because the MoE has very little authority to enforce regulations. I know that there is currently a big push from licensed school owners to give the MoE more authority to close unlicensed schools and prosecute their owners. This could happen soon, then again TiT and it may not.

If you think a company can run a school without any supervision from the MoE (license, registration etc), go for it.

Edited February 16, 2014 by Loaded

[simon43]

If you think a company can run a school without any supervision from the MoE (license, registration etc), go for it.

The whole point of my comments is that I do not know if I can do the above - that is why I am asking those members who already run language schools, such as Macwalen and Brucetefl, if they had to wait 2 years for their MOE licence before they taught their first lesson to students.

I cannot believe that all these language schools sat in a empty building and did nothing for 2 years, and then suddenly sprung into action after the MOE licence was obtained. More realistically, I assume they opened their language school and then applied for the licence, paying tax on their business until their school and curriculum was approved by the MOE.

The curriculum approval also interests me. I intend to offer short (20 -30 lesson) courses in areas such as IELTS preparation, aviation English, hotel English, business English, technical English, conversational English etc, (subjects which I already experienced to teach). Any course should have an evolving curriculum, flexible in nature and able to be modified according to the needs of the students, availability of teaching materials etc.

Bearing the above in mind, how does the MOE approval of my curriculum work in practice?

Simon

[Loaded]

If you think a company can run a school without any supervision from the MoE (license, registration etc), go for it.

The whole point of my comments is that I do not know if I can do the above - that is why I am asking those members who already run language schools, such as Macwalen and Brucetefl, if they had to wait 2 years for their MOE licence before they taught their first lesson to students.

I cannot believe that all these language schools sat in a empty building and did nothing for 2 years, and then suddenly sprung into action after the MOE licence was obtained. More realistically, I assume they opened their language school and then applied for the licence, paying tax on their business until their school and curriculum was approved by the MOE.

The curriculum approval also interests me. I intend to offer short (20 -30 lesson) courses in areas such as IELTS preparation, aviation English, hotel English, business English, technical English, conversational English etc, (subjects which I already experienced to teach). Any course should have an evolving curriculum, flexible in nature and able to be modified according to the needs of the students, availability of teaching materials etc.

Bearing the above in mind, how does the MOE approval of my curriculum work in practice?

Simon

From post #6

"Running the school during the license application period is tolerated."

Curriculum can be part of the initial license application or they can be added at a later date. Each one will be reviewed by a panel from the MoE or people associated with the MoE (representatives of the Private Schools Association for example). The curriculum covers a specific area, such as EFL or Thai. There is a lot of flexibility once you have that curriculum approved to adapt or develop courses within that specific area. You will save a lot of time if you find an experienced expert to write for you. You could certainly contact the MoE for guidance.

[ajarnsiam]

OP, do you really think you can get this type of advice from this forum?

[Loaded]

OP, do you really think you can get this type of advice from this forum?

It seems like I am wasting my time.

[ajarnsiam]

OP, do you really think you can get this type of advice from this forum?

It seems like I am wasting my time.

Not at all LOADED, your advice is always first class.

[cgphuket]

I would skip the whole "school license" route and register it as a consulting agency. Unless you want recognition by the minister of education or issues education visas, you would not want to mix up wiuth the higher ed bunch just for a tutoring service.

[arcturaz]

1st Thank you to those members who gave constructive and very valuable information (Never a waste of time I owe u more then a few cases of beer);

So lets just assume a tutoring Service can be started while a license is 'in process' (technically without a license for maybe 2 or 3 years) from the MoE. The BIG question then is what about foreign teachers? I cannot imagine launching an effective language service without skilled native speakers on board. How would we arrange the Visas? While I agree with cgphuket (better to skip) I also am aware of the rather inflexible laws governing Work visas in Thailand. So where would a company stand that wants to issue Work Permits to tutors? Maybe some loophole exists where these 'Teachers' become' via legem magicae; (presto) CONSULTANTS? Opinions Please!

Thank You All

E

[mmh8]

this is interesting, one can tutor but name oneself a consultant of education be it language or something more academic. avoiding the potential beurocratic nonsense

is that correct?

[arcturaz]

will essentially that was my question as well but so far I have not received an answer from anyone knowledgeable. I really don't know I was basing this assumption on one of the posts from someone earlier.

[fatdrunkandstupid]

Based the language school in say...the caymans. And then just open a video conferencing centre here in Thailand. Problem solved.

[simon43]

A short update. I had a meeting with a language school in Phuket who are fully licenced by the MOE and well-respected (I have been aware of this school since the early 2000's).

They offered 2 possible solutions for offering a language school/tutor service in my region:

- Work directly for their school, with a WP that covers working from a satellite office that I would establish. Split the tutor fees with them on a 60/40 basis (me/them).

- Buy the existing school licence for 200,000 baht plus 10,000 baht per month and open my licenced language school under my existing Thai ltd company (whose registered areas of business include language school and every other types of business that you can think of!).

The first option could be interesting if I simply wanted to do low-level tutoring, but the profit split is not attractive.

The second option is more interesting, since I want to open a 'real' language school,. not a 'hobby' school.

Of course, the third option is that I simply open as a language 'consultancy' and apply for the MOE licence myself. From the discussions in this thread, that seems to be the most favourable option.

Simon

[mmh8]

simon 43 do you mean that to be licensed you pay 200 k + 10 k per month? I was following this thread before but I don';t know where those numbers came from?

[simon43]

simon 43 do you mean that to be licensed you pay 200 k + 10 k per month

Those figures are basically a franchise fee and profit share if I want to 'buy' an MOE licence from an existing language school in Phuket. This is a fast-track route to opening a fully-licenced language school.

If I go it alone and apply directly for an MOE licence, then I need to jump through many administrative hoops and possibly have a long delay before I get the MOE licence.

Or I can reject both of the above and simply open a language consultancy operating under my Thai ltd company. Quite what the difference is between a language consultancy and a language school is not clear to me, (other than the latter has an MOE licence and some tax benefits).

I would appreciate if someone could explain why I should consider to go down the MOE licence route (with all the associated costs and admin hassles), when apparently I can achieve almost the same aim by simply opening a language 'consultancy'.

Perhaps I'm missing something in my understanding?

Simon

[mmh8]

I am as interested in knowing as well. I think that somewhere along the line there should be benefits by becoming licensed. just not sure which

[fatdrunkandstupid]

Get 2 non english speaking Thais to open a company as a business school. Lend the the setup money, with signed loan agreement and one of the terms of that loan agreement is that you are employed full time with a WP, taking x percentage of any tution you deliver pesonally. Let the Thais deal with the admin, you teach and make money.

[fatdrunkandstupid]

Simon

Last year I was looking for a Thai language school in Phuket Town. I road around for a couple of days visiting them. I went to eight in total. Only one actually offered Thai for farangs. ALL eight of them asked me if I could teach for them. All eight of them also declined to offer a WP if I commenced teaching. There is an old business district in over behind the old bus station. There was at least four language schools over there last year. I was over there just the other day and one or two have closed...or moved. I remember they had names like international business centre and the like, but clearly they were language schools as the kids attending still had their school uniforms on. I don't know for sure if they had licences but, I would assume not.

Pesonally I think that if you are just offering English for Thai kids you will not even be bothered by the MOE. There is no leverage for tea money from these operations. They just want to be in control of farang visa factory language schools, that is were the big tea money comes from.

[Scott]

An off-topic post has been deleted.

[simon43]

For this business idea, I have no plans to offer courses in Thai for foreigners. My market is purely Thai adults who work in the locality - there are very few foreigners living near to the airport, but many Thai staff working in the hotels and at the airport. Classes for Thai kids could follow if the adult classes prove successful.

I already have an operating ltd company with 4+ Thai staff, whose objectives include teaching - so it should be relatively easy to open the language 'consultancy'.

Simon

[Scott]

Teaching adults is tricky. Adults have lives and don't really like going to class. They can miss class and they can quit. Adults like taking their kids to class and then they can go shopping. The kids have to attend.

I taught an adult class that went on for many years -- I think I had them for 5 years, I then moved and turned the class over to another teacher. They were fantastic, but they were all from the same company and we just got along excellently.

I worked part time at a small tutorial school on the weekends and they were start adult classes, but they never stayed for long. There were a few students, like a bank employee, whose bank was being taken over by a Singaporean bank and the employees were told that who stayed depended on their English skills. He was motivated.

There were a few who were planning on traveling and thought they could learn English in 6 weeks.

[simon43]

Teaching adults is tricky. Adults have lives and don't really like going to class.

I should add that I will not market to individual adults, but to the various hotels in the area, as well as to the airport authorities. I already know that many 3/4/5 star hotels in this region pay 'over the odds' to bring in 'consultants' to teach their staff 'hotel English', - there being no local language school in the area.

As for the airport, there are many possibilities, ranging from ICAO English for ground-staff, through to conversational English for customer service/sales staff.

One point in my favour is that I have lived and worked in this area for 12 years - many local people know me from my TPV work at the airport. I have been asked on numerous occasions to offer English language lessons to airport security staff, immigration and police staff etc etc.

Now I just have to get them to pay for these lessons....

Simon