Unusual money withdrawal of cash from GSB

[modafinil]

Please answer this one simple question.

How much money in Thai banks is the real folding stuff, not just numbers on paper?

Sorry, two questions.

Who will suffer the most when that runs out, the people with empty pockets, or the people with numbers on paper?

The amount of folding cash in circulation is peanuts in most countries. $1.2 Trillion is the total paper USD out there worldwide, which you can compare for example to the US national debt of $17 Trillion.

Assuming that total cash is about 10% of GDP, the whole of Thailand probably has around ($366B/10*30) - something in the region of 1.3 Trillion Baht in cash money.

[DrTuner]

Large scale bank runs are probably the only way to bring the banksters down on their knees. I'm a bit surprised the farmers haven't figured that out. No wait .. actually, not that surprised.

[modafinil]

You can't really have a run on a government-owned bank. Since the GSB are operated by the Ministry of Finance, they have all kinds of ways to keep the bank going indefinitely.

Depositors withdrawing 20 Billion today is a powerful political statement, though. I don't think any other banks will make the same mistake.

And yes, if the big withdrawals continue tomorrow the GSB might be forced to take out some liquidity loans of their own from the other big banks.

[Skywalker69]

Another happy GSB customer.

Another happy ex-GSB customer.

[Beetlejuice]

What run? almost as much money was deposited from what was withdrawn, as 80 withdrawal were fairly large as the rich playing with their money but the little man made up for the money the rich withdrew.

Why would the government want that dirty money in their bank anyway.

Cheers

Just because you choose to believe this bullshit doesn't make it true. Did you expect the GSB bank facing a run on its assets would issue a statement telling the exact scale of it? Would that help their situation? No, it would make their situation worse.

Almost everyone in the country with internet, or TV will here about this run on the banks and will follow suit if they have money in the GSB. It only takes 10% of the deposits to be removed and the GSB will have to close its doors.

Now for some facts.

Sister in law has 80,000 baht in there. She had no intention of withdrawing her money, but once she saw the pictures of the queues and also some people at her workplace asking for an hour off work to withdraw their money, she decided to do the same... gets to the bank and is given a cashiers check saying that all the cash money was gone.

At least she can deposit that check into her KBank account where it is safe.

Please give the name of this branch that you claim ran out of money and I will phone and check.

It only takes 10% of the deposits to be removed and the GSB will have to close its doors. Really; so you are an expert on the Thai banking system and their economics are you? Please give a credible source of this information? Or how you estimate these figures?

I have been watching you on other threads and to me you are suspect, a scaremonger who gives so-called facts that have no foundation whatsoever.

A bank maintains normally between 10% and 20% (in extreme cases) liquidity.

The rest is out in loans and mortgages etc.... This is what earns revenue for the bank, without this a bank can not pay interest on deposits. It could not also pay its massive overheads... any idea how much it costs to run a bank???.

The money out on loan has to hugely outstrip its liquidity (money in hand) to keep everything from breaking down. When money is loaned out it can be up to 30 years before it comes back,, all money out on loan pays for day to day actual cash movements, and all the other costs of banking

Anything less than 80% out on loan and it will struggle to cover all the costs, money not out working for the bank is costing the bank in lost potential profits and also they have to pay interest on that money.

On another thread the GSB president gave all the figures, go find it yourself, I can't be arsed to help your lazy ass.

It went something like (off the top of my head) 1.7 trillion in deposits, with 2.1 trillion in assets and 200 bn in liquidity.

Forget the assets, they are not liquid and would take a miracle to return to liquid funds. The deposits are out on loan minus the 200 Bn that means 1,500 Bn (1.5 trillion) is out earning the bank profit to cover the interest on 1.7 trillion plus all bank running costs.

So its liquidity of total deposits is about 12.5%

If the bank is suddenly pulled up for 10% of its deposits (170 Bn) then they are in the shit and it is goodbye Vienna.

This I thought was common knowledge among mature educated adults. Seems I am wrong.

Don't try to tell me I don't know what I am talking about because my dad had 5000 shares in Northern Rock and they webt from £21 a share to £0.60 within days. He should have got less than that but the UK government subsidized it from about £0.14 to £0.60. I know what happens first hand when that shit happens. I read enough about it to try to explain to my elderly dad why he lost all his investment.

Scaremongering my arse.... this shit is real, this shit happens, I am connected to it first hand.

Troll!

So as to meet sudden liquidity requirements, most Thai banks can borrow funds from other banks, known as the inter loan scheme or the Finance ministry. While funds are usually available for these banks, a sudden demand from multiple banks can drastically harm their profitability and in extreme cases, put them out of business.

Unless there is a crazed panic and everyone starts pulling their funds out of most of the Thai banks, than the worst will not happen. Of course there are no guarantees, but as yet this situation has not reached a crisis level as most of this is based on confusing information peddled by the media. My advice is for those who have savings in the Government banks, is to observe the situation and do not panic. As yet no Thai banks have requested emergency assistance from either the banks inter loan scheme or the Finance ministry.

As regarding the UK Northern Rock predicament, the bank run was again caused by journalists publishing a load of doom and gloom in the media. None of their customers lost their savings as the Bank of England provided backup and eventually the bank was taken over. Although I am very sympathetic regarding your Dad losing out on his Northern Rock stocks and shares (and I mean this sincerely with respect) everyone knows that dealing and investing in stocks and shares, either from banks or company shares do carry risks and in fact it`s a gamble. Some you win, some you lose, unfortunately that’s the deal regarding stocks and shares. The bank is still in business today, known as Virgin money. As I said previous, as yet no Thai banks have requested emergency assistance from either the banks inter loan scheme or the Finance ministry, unlike the situation pertaining to the former Northern Rock bank.

The main problems during this political dispute are the scaremongers in the public domain and the media creating panics among the banks customers. Perhaps in your case you are bitter about your Dad losing out on his shares? And like the Northern Rock fiasco, I do believe the present Government Rice Pledging Scheme will be resolved, but unfortunately there is still much uncertainty and speculation going on, which is causing confusion and panic.

[crobe]

My god I have never read such a load off rubbish in my life. After reading these posts from obviously bitter and twisted farang who have nothing better to do with there under used brains I will transfer 7million baht from BKK bank tomorrow to GSB to make this news a non event.

I hope it will get the same reaction as this scaremongering of people into withdrawing their money from GSB.

Why do some farang who are obviously very unhappy in Thailand bother to stay here only for the simple reason that they have f'all money/pensions to live in their own country like they live here.

Many posts by farang love to go on about the thais being uneducated when in fact they are highly uneducated themselves. They no nothing about interbank lending and how banks make money and economics in general.

The only thing I want is a stable government elected by the majority of the people which these protesters are hell bent on not allowing, they have reached an all time low now with the way they are playing with the millions of people who depend on rice as there source of income.

Shame on all the farang who support this puppet Suthep and his cronies. And if you cannot see that they are now playing with the farmers and have been from the start knowing full well that an inconclusive election would only result in suffering for the farmers.

Everybody needs to have a long hard look at there own education.

I hope you have 20 billion on you rather than 7 million, you may need it tomorrow

You may be surprised that a lot of people on here are highly educated but know first hand the corrupt and despicable way in which this present government acts.

I deal with people in this government regularly up to Minister level and so have first hand knowledge of exactly what they have been up to.

I have no time for apologists with no financial or political knowledge, like yourself, that can only repeat what their girlfriends tell them and cannot see past the rhetoric.

Although I am personally against Suthep as he is as bad as the Shins, but if it was not for his demonstrations, the government would not have been dissolved and the sorry mess that is the rice pledging scheme would not have been forced into the open - it would have taken another year and another 700Bn Baht to come home to roost which would have been even mor disastrous for the national economy - even as it is there are many worthy projects that will now have to be cancelled to pay for this fiasco.

This was predicted by many people who saw the financial folly of such a pledging scheme above market prices, but were arrogantly dismissed by an incompetent bunch of crooks.

If you knew them as well as I do you would know that it is family first and the farmers are way down the list of their priorities, at least until it threatens their eminent domain.

I suggest you take some time to read up on the inception of the rice pledging scheme and the economists comments at the time before posting again and criticising other members for lack of financial acumen.

Sarcasim has obviously been lost somewhere inside your vastly superior brain to me who has absolutely no financial or political knowledge or at least up to your obviously superior level.

Maybe with your dazzling knowledge of all things financial and political in Thailand you might be able to explain to me how this country is going to get out of this mess it is in.

I dislike both sides equally but I do believe in democracy find it quite despicable when somebody takes away this fundamental right and which in turn has untold hardship on the poorest 10% of the population just to score political points. Surely there are ways of doing this within the political/judicial/constitution powers in this country. Not just throw the toys out of the cot and bring the country to a standstill.

Surely cutting off your nose to spite your face is for children.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

It is pretty simple really

1) The government rice pledging scheme was not working, the offer price to the farmers was above the market price and so there was a loss pure and simple

2) Covering the loss has meant borrowing from other programs, arranging government backed loans etc. all this last year up until September - well before any protests - in effect this became a government backed Ponzi scheme with ever increasing liabilities

3) The protests happened due to arrogance and stupidity by the ruling party trying to manipulate a bill via committee stage

4) As a political manouver the ruling party called a snap election - forgetting the procedural consequences that in caretaker mode the government cannot commit new funding or raise new loans

5) The government - through the BACC, cannot now meet the liabilities to the farmers

At no point in this process was anyone, other than the PTP, to blame for the consequences and the hardship caused, you can say that the protests were a spur, but it was a government decision, taken in Dubai, to call the election and dissolve the parliament, bringing down the house of cards.

The issue you should be asking yourself is - in order to pay the farmers as promised where will the money come from? - It will be other programs that will get hit, whoever has to pick up the tab, and that will mean real hardship for some sectors of the economy and people who depend on government programs. Whoever has to pick up this mess will have a bill far larger than 700Bn Baht when all the accounting is done and the real cost of the scheme is known as it will take some rice growing seasons to unwind.

Yes there will be real hardship coming down the line, and the budgets for October 1st onwards may have to see some drastic cuts, but that is the only way out as printing money could cause a massive devaluation and a rerun of 2007.

The way out of this mess is to immediately make transparent the financial details of the scheme and the commitments - a forensic audit of the rice stockpiles has to be made independently, and the rice pledge price has to be transformed as soon as possible in line with the current market price but with the government remaining the buyer of last resort at the market price.

A competent interim authority has to take over the government finances (I am not talking about a peoples council here, but rather a competent management committee and not politicians), A complete overhaul of the criminal code and stiffer penalties for corruption (15+ year mandatory sentences for any public official, from a DPM to a traffic cop),

If Thailand could remove the 30% corruption charge going to politicians and civil servants there would be enough money in the coffers to cover the liabilities built up they should endure some hardship not just the farmers.

That is the way out of the mess

[retsdon]

Not quite a united country....wonder why?

Edited February 17, 2014 by retsdon

[Basil B]

Another happy GSB customer.

Another happy ex-GSB customer.

I hope the ink is dry...

[Basil B]

Another happy GSB customer.

Another happy ex-GSB customer.

]And they wonder why there's political conflict in Thailand....

how many note in each bundle? 50?

if so she has half a million THB + £10,000/$15,000 probably the cost of a new cheap car.

Presume "lady Penelope" (the puppet) has the chauffeur (Parker another puppet) wheel in a truck load of suitcases which they stash in the boot of the pink Rolls just to have enough readies for her next shopping trip.

Edited February 17, 2014 by Basil B

[SICHONSTEVE]

my husband and i we take out all the money from the bank today too.

we have the account more than 10 year but today is close.

no more.

I assume that you are Thai Poncho - if so, welcome to Thai visa.

[Mosha]

Could it be that after years of "They don't vote for us, why should I care about the South". Is coming back to haunt Thaksin et al, in the shape of these withdrawals?

[belg]

thank god farmers are poor and wont cause much a fuzz

[vincentc]

In a Trang branch 10 million baht was withdrawn.. Is that impressive? Maybe a customer wanted to but land or a condo... Why spread fear for a 10m bath?

[NeverSure]

how many note in each bundle? 50?

If those were USD it would be 100 notes. That's how thick 100 notes are.

Source: Former US banker.

[RobthaiIre]

My god I have never read such a load off rubbish in my life. After reading these posts from obviously bitter and twisted farang who have nothing better to do with there under used brains I will transfer 7million baht from BKK bank tomorrow to GSB to make this news a non event.

I hope it will get the same reaction as this scaremongering of people into withdrawing their money from GSB.

Why do some farang who are obviously very unhappy in Thailand bother to stay here only for the simple reason that they have f'all money/pensions to live in their own country like they live here.

Many posts by farang love to go on about the thais being uneducated when in fact they are highly uneducated themselves. They no nothing about interbank lending and how banks make money and economics in general.

The only thing I want is a stable government elected by the majority of the people which these protesters are hell bent on not allowing, they have reached an all time low now with the way they are playing with the millions of people who depend on rice as there source of income.

Shame on all the farang who support this puppet Suthep and his cronies. And if you cannot see that they are now playing with the farmers and have been from the start knowing full well that an inconclusive election would only result in suffering for the farmers.

Everybody needs to have a long hard look at there own education.

I hope you have 20 billion on you rather than 7 million, you may need it tomorrow

You may be surprised that a lot of people on here are highly educated but know first hand the corrupt and despicable way in which this present government acts.

I deal with people in this government regularly up to Minister level and so have first hand knowledge of exactly what they have been up to.

I have no time for apologists with no financial or political knowledge, like yourself, that can only repeat what their girlfriends tell them and cannot see past the rhetoric.

Although I am personally against Suthep as he is as bad as the Shins, but if it was not for his demonstrations, the government would not have been dissolved and the sorry mess that is the rice pledging scheme would not have been forced into the open - it would have taken another year and another 700Bn Baht to come home to roost which would have been even mor disastrous for the national economy - even as it is there are many worthy projects that will now have to be cancelled to pay for this fiasco.

This was predicted by many people who saw the financial folly of such a pledging scheme above market prices, but were arrogantly dismissed by an incompetent bunch of crooks.

If you knew them as well as I do you would know that it is family first and the farmers are way down the list of their priorities, at least until it threatens their eminent domain.

I suggest you take some time to read up on the inception of the rice pledging scheme and the economists comments at the time before posting again and criticising other members for lack of financial acumen.

Sarcasim has obviously been lost somewhere inside your vastly superior brain to me who has absolutely no financial or political knowledge or at least up to your obviously superior level.

Maybe with your dazzling knowledge of all things financial and political in Thailand you might be able to explain to me how this country is going to get out of this mess it is in.

I dislike both sides equally but I do believe in democracy find it quite despicable when somebody takes away this fundamental right and which in turn has untold hardship on the poorest 10% of the population just to score political points. Surely there are ways of doing this within the political/judicial/constitution powers in this country. Not just throw the toys out of the cot and bring the country to a standstill.

Surely cutting off your nose to spite your face is for children.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

It is pretty simple really

1) The government rice pledging scheme was not working, the offer price to the farmers was above the market price and so there was a loss pure and simple

2) Covering the loss has meant borrowing from other programs, arranging government backed loans etc. all this last year up until September - well before any protests - in effect this became a government backed Ponzi scheme with ever increasing liabilities

3) The protests happened due to arrogance and stupidity by the ruling party trying to manipulate a bill via committee stage

4) As a political manouver the ruling party called a snap election - forgetting the procedural consequences that in caretaker mode the government cannot commit new funding or raise new loans

5) The government - through the BACC, cannot now meet the liabilities to the farmers

At no point in this process was anyone, other than the PTP, to blame for the consequences and the hardship caused, you can say that the protests were a spur, but it was a government decision, taken in Dubai, to call the election and dissolve the parliament, bringing down the house of cards.

The issue you should be asking yourself is - in order to pay the farmers as promised where will the money come from? - It will be other programs that will get hit, whoever has to pick up the tab, and that will mean real hardship for some sectors of the economy and people who depend on government programs. Whoever has to pick up this mess will have a bill far larger than 700Bn Baht when all the accounting is done and the real cost of the scheme is known as it will take some rice growing seasons to unwind.

Yes there will be real hardship coming down the line, and the budgets for October 1st onwards may have to see some drastic cuts, but that is the only way out as printing money could cause a massive devaluation and a rerun of 2007.

The way out of this mess is to immediately make transparent the financial details of the scheme and the commitments - a forensic audit of the rice stockpiles has to be made independently, and the rice pledge price has to be transformed as soon as possible in line with the current market price but with the government remaining the buyer of last resort at the market price.

A competent interim authority has to take over the government finances (I am not talking about a peoples council here, but rather a competent management committee and not politicians), A complete overhaul of the criminal code and stiffer penalties for corruption (15+ year mandatory sentences for any public official, from a DPM to a traffic cop),

If Thailand could remove the 30% corruption charge going to politicians and civil servants there would be enough money in the coffers to cover the liabilities built up they should endure some hardship not just the farmers.

That is the way out of the mess

Thank you. I agree completely with your comments. You obviously have genuine knowledge of what is going on and not the usual spoof you get here. I agree with the basis for the way out of this mess however you seem to to be implying that because of the corrupt acts of the current government the farmers will have to suffer. They have no bargain power as they have already handed over their rice. The scheme has turned into a disaster for the country and the people in power have to pay for it with jail time. This doesn't sort out the farmers plight as a hugh majority put everything and more into the rice crop and to have the little they have taken away from them seems very harsh. The farmers have to be paid and the government should be jailed.

Corruption is part of life in Thailand and openly accepted and expected. Until this mentality is addressed Thailand is just going to bounce from one crises to the next. The goal being who is in control of the corruption. Until it is cut out at the top it cannot filter down the system and nobody has the balls to bring the whole thing down

[animatic]

Turn on the lender?

No, more like they fear the lender to go under and take their money with it.

The lender makes a huge loan, beyond the dreams of most of it's customers,

to an entity that may or may not be legally doing so, and they are worried,

since the people getting the loan are needing it for obvious mismanagement.

[bkkdave1220]

Another happy GSB customer.

Another happy ex-GSB customer.

Has such an intellegent look about here doesn't she.

wonder how many locals see this pic!

and this is the supposed ruling class in action. give me thaksin anyday

[ggold]

Another happy GSB customer.

Another happy ex-GSB customer.

Has such an intellegent look about here doesn't she.

wonder how many locals see this pic!

and this is the supposed ruling class in action. give me thaksin anyday

I think you'll find even red shirt sympathisers are withdrawing their money from GSB, maybe they don't sympathise with Thaksin any more!

[bkkdave1220]

Another happy GSB customer.

Another happy ex-GSB customer.

Has such an intellegent look about here doesn't she.

wonder how many locals see this pic!

and this is the supposed ruling class in action. give me thaksin anyday

I think you'll find even red shirt sympathisers are withdrawing their money from GSB, maybe they don't sympathise with Thaksin any more!

What is really funny if you read more than the headline propaganda is the bank is making money from a lot of these educated people withdrawing money.

there are people cashing in bonds and savings structures that incur losses if redeemned early.

so intellegent are these people and the ones who lose some, get mugged of fritter away the cash in their hands only add to the impression that people from this walk of life have no monopoly on intellegence, right to rule or autonomy and indepmendent thinking.

Suthep says take your cash out... they do it.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Do you imagine that the chairman of the bank is rubbing his hands in glee at a few bond holders losing a small amount of money through cashing their bonds in early? I think that he might be a little more concerned that there was a net withdrawal of 20 BILLION baht on the day. He won't be smiling about the days business I assure you!!!

Suthep didn't need to tell them to do this - they did it of their own volition because they were worried about losing their money if the run persists (once these things start they accelerate until the bank runs out of funds).

[Chicog]

The lady likely pays her taxes

[MikeOboe57]

TNN 24 just reports that the GSB president resigned.

Sent from my GT-N5100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[ggold]

Another happy ex-GSB customer.

Has such an intellegent look about here doesn't she.

wonder how many locals see this pic!

and this is the supposed ruling class in action. give me thaksin anyday

I think you'll find even red shirt sympathisers are withdrawing their money from GSB, maybe they don't sympathise with Thaksin any more!

What is really funny if you read more than the headline propaganda is the bank is making money from a lot of these educated people withdrawing money.

there are people cashing in bonds and savings structures that incur losses if redeemned early.

so intellegent are these people and the ones who lose some, get mugged of fritter away the cash in their hands only add to the impression that people from this walk of life have no monopoly on intellegence, right to rule or autonomy and indepmendent thinking.

Suthep says take your cash out... they do it.

Which kind of makes me wonder about your intelligence! Better to lose the penalty fee than all of it! The bank also lose out when this amount of money is withdrawn, it may mean they have to cancel future loans for lack of liquidity.

Also what has Suthep got to do with this! Once it became public knowledge what did you think people would do, tell the bank keep my money?

I can tell your another of these BS posters, no real contribution, just pushing the red agenda!

[Prbkk]

By the very evident strength in the Baht today, it looks like a lot of money is coming into Thailand ( reversing the trend last month and December and probably reflecting higher interest rates...but no lack of confidence in the sector or the country).

Suthep and his acolytes, both well-meaning and otherwise, have done much damage to the economy. It will recover once he is in jail

[Robby nz]

It would seem that today 10 of PT's finest turned up at the GSB main branch in BKK in a show of support for the bank to make deposits.

Between the 10 of them they planned to deposit 3 million.

That's right only 3 million between ten of them.

They were booed and chased out of bank by all those waiting to attempt to withdraw their money to comments like "why aren't you depositing 3 billion each you have stolen enough from the people"

Oh, and the bank man says he wont resign.

Government Savings Bank exec board cancels Bt20 billion interbank loan to BAAC, recalls Bt5 billion loan granted; GSB president will not resign /MCOT

[SICHONSTEVE]

It would seem that today 10 of PT's finest turned up at the GSB main branch in BKK in a show of support for the bank to make deposits.

Between the 10 of them they planned to deposit 3 million.

That's right only 3 million between ten of them.

They were booed and chased out of bank by all those waiting to attempt to withdraw their money to comments like "why aren't you depositing 3 billion each you have stolen enough from the people"

Oh, and the bank man says he wont resign.

Government Savings Bank exec board cancels Bt20 billion interbank loan to BAAC, recalls Bt5 billion loan granted; GSB president will not resign /MCOT

You are a bit behind the times my friend - he has resigned!!!

[ratcatcher]

By the very evident strength in the Baht today, it looks like a lot of money is coming into Thailand ( reversing the trend last month and December and probably reflecting higher interest rates...but no lack of confidence in the sector or the country).

Suthep and his acolytes, both well-meaning and otherwise, have done much damage to the economy. It will recover once he is in jail

Suthep, like his opposite Thaksin, will not see jail anytime soon no matter how hard you dream about it.

As soon as Yingluck has been relieved of duty things will start to normalize.

[Prbkk]

By the very evident strength in the Baht today, it looks like a lot of money is coming into Thailand ( reversing the trend last month and December and probably reflecting higher interest rates...but no lack of confidence in the sector or the country).

Suthep and his acolytes, both well-meaning and otherwise, have done much damage to the economy. It will recover once he is in jail

Suthep, like his opposite Thaksin, will not see jail anytime soon no matter how hard you dream about it.

As soon as Yingluck has been relieved of duty things will start to normalize.

No, no $200. He's a ratbag, Ratcatcher

[ggold]

By the very evident strength in the Baht today, it looks like a lot of money is coming into Thailand ( reversing the trend last month and December and probably reflecting higher interest rates...but no lack of confidence in the sector or the country).

Suthep and his acolytes, both well-meaning and otherwise, have done much damage to the economy. It will recover once he is in jail

Even as the curtain drops on the PTP caretaker government, their day's numbered you still fail to see the reality of the situation.

What are you on?

[SICHONSTEVE]

By the very evident strength in the Baht today, it looks like a lot of money is coming into Thailand ( reversing the trend last month and December and probably reflecting higher interest rates...but no lack of confidence in the sector or the country).

Suthep and his acolytes, both well-meaning and otherwise, have done much damage to the economy. It will recover once he is in jail

Suthep, like his opposite Thaksin, will not see jail anytime soon no matter how hard you dream about it.

As soon as Yingluck has been relieved of duty things will start to normalize.

The Thai protests are the headline news at the moment on the BBC world news and Jonathon Head has just reported (through teary eyes no doubt) that Yingluck cannot go on for much longer and that she may not have any other choice but to stand down and agree to Suthep's plan to have an unelected commission!!!

Now please don't tell me that this is some fake yellow talk as it came from the red's very own JH!!!

He also said "it is looking very bleak for Yingluck as she has been officially charged with fraud over the G2G scandal and faces impeachment!!

Well done Suthep - our warrior!!

Note to Yingluck - why don't you follow the lead of the GSB president, gracefully fall on your sword and step down to avoid further bloodshed!!