Staying in Thailand

[Non Jon]

Hello! First post here but been lurking awhile.

I've done a fair amount of searching on the site in the past few days and am pretty overwhelmed with the ins and out of visas and permits etc. So, I was wondering if you could help me with a couple of questions?

I used to live and work in Thailand on a Non-B visa. I've since married a Thai woman and we have been living in the UK for a few years but we are now returning to Thailand permanently. I want to stay permanently and not have to leave every 90 days or do visa runs, so I'm thinking of getting a Non-O single or multiple entry visa and applying for 12 month extension of stay for 3 consecutive years until I can apply for residency.

Is this feasible do you think?

Would there be any advantage getting a 12 month multiple entry visa over a 3 month single entry?

[Satcommlee]

If you deposit 400K in a Thai bank and leave it alone, it's not difficult at all and you can do it all on a single entry O visa.

[wayned]

How old are you? Where did you get married, UK or Thailand?

If you get a 1 year multiple entry visa you will have to leave the country every 90 days.

If you get a single entry Non-O You will get 90 days permission to stay on entry. During the last 30 days of your permission to stay you could apply for a 1 year extension based on marriage to a Thai. In order to qualify you you would either have to have 400000 baht in a Thai bank in your name only seasoned for 2 months, OR a letter from your Embassy in Thailand stating that you are receiving at least 40000 baht/month income with the supporting documentation to prove it. When you apply you receive a 1 month "under consideration" stamp and then go back and get the balance of 11 months after it is approved. You do not have to leave Thailand, only make 90 day address reports at your local immgration office which, in most cases, can be done by mail. Any entry of a multiplke entry visa can be extended in the same manner.

If you are over 50 you can extend for retirement purposes but the financial requirements go up to either 800000 baht or 65000 baht/month or a combination of both. Easier to do, less paperwork and only one visit to immigratin.

Permanent residecy takes a long time to receive after you apply and I don't think that you can get it if you are retired and not working in Thailand.

[ubonjoe]

You should get a single entry non-o based upon marriage to a Thai before traveling.

You can get a one year extension of stay based upon marriage if you can show 400k baht in a Thai bank or proof of 40K baht income. You can get a work permit and work with this extension.

If you needed more time to get things sorted out you could get a 60 day extension to visit your wife and then the one year extension.

In order to get permanent residency you need a work permit and to have been working for 3 consecutive years on extensions of stay.

if 50 or over you can also get an extension of stay based upon retirement if you want to show double the money in the bank or 25k baht per month extra income. You cannot get a work permit and work with this extension.

Edited March 8, 2014 by ubonjoe
Fixed typo

[TerryLH]

OP, you should check the requirements to apply for citizenship. I might be a better route to go for you than PR.

"if 50 or over you can also get an extension of stay based upon retirement if you want to show double the money in the bank and 25k baht per month extra income. You cannot get a work permit and work with this extension."

ubonjoe, is this new?

[ubonjoe]

Citizenship has the same requirements as PR you still have to be working to get it.

Showing 400k baht in the bank is half of 800K baht. So that is double the money the bank. The other is 65K baht minus 40K which equals 25K baht more. Certainly not new.

[TerryLH]

"if 50 or over you can also get an extension of stay based upon retirement if you want to show double the money in the bank and 25k baht per month extra income.

Shouldn't that be double the money OR 25k (not and) more per month?

[ubonjoe]

Just a typo that has been fixed now.

[IMA_FARANG]

"if 50 or over you can also get an extension of stay based upon retirement if you want to show double the money in the bank and 25k baht per month extra income.

Shouldn't that be double the money OR 25k (not and) more per month?

-----------------

No

Unlike a marriage extension where you must show 400K in Thai bank account OR a monthly income of 25K baht equivalent income .....

for a retirement extension you may show:

1. 800K Baht in Thai bank account

2. OR a monthly income of 65K Baht

3. OR a combination of the two sources equaling 800K annually

That combination option is not available for a marriage extension as it is for retirement.

Don't ask me why, I don't think it makes sense either. But it's just the rules.

Edited March 8, 2014 by IMA_FARANG

[ubonjoe]

"if 50 or over you can also get an extension of stay based upon retirement if you want to show double the money in the bank and 25k baht per month extra income.

Shouldn't that be double the money OR 25k (not and) more per month?

-----------------

No

Unlike a marriage extension where you must show 400K in Thai bank account OR a monthly income of 25K baht equivalent income .....

for a retirement extension you may show:

1. 800K Baht in Thai bank account

2. OR a monthly income of 65K Baht

3. OR a combination of the two sources equaling 800K annually

That combination option is not available for a marriage extension as it is for retirement.

Don't ask me why, I don't think it makes sense either. But it's just the rules.

You misread or misunderstood that he was commenting about a typo I made In my reply that should of been or instead of and which I have since corrected.

The income requirement is 40K per month. The 25K was the amount above 40K baht income needed for an extension based upon retirement.

No mention of a combination option for marriage was made.

[Garnethoyes]

so what happens if you are on a marriage visa and the Thai wife dies ?

[ubonjoe]

so what happens if you are on a marriage visa and the Thai wife dies ?

If you had a visa nothing.

If on an extension of stay based upon marriage you would need to change the reason for your extension or go out for a visa.

If you had children you could change to one based on that or if 50 or over change to retirement.

[Non Jon]

Thanks for your replies.

You have confirmed I was on the right track. And you also confirmed how easy it is to misinterpret or misread the rules and regs! So thanks for clarifying.

One question it does pose is, if I have a work permit for the three years prior to being granted residency, would I have to keep working with a work permit to retain residency?

Also, is it possible to qualify for residency after three years of following the retirement criteria?

I was also wondering about the question of whether we were married in UK or Thailand. When I phoned the embassy with an enquiry about non-O visas I was asked the same question but my answer, that we were married in the UK, didn't seem to alter the application criteria i was given.

[Non Jon]

Thanks for your replies.

You have confirmed I was on the right track. And you also confirmed how easy it is to misinterpret or misread the rules and regs! So thanks for clarifying.

One question it does pose is, if I have a work permit for the three years prior to being granted residency, would I have to keep working with a work permit to retain residency?

Also, is it possible to qualify for residency after three years of following the retirement criteria?

I was also wondering about the question of whether we were married in UK or Thailand. When I phoned the embassy with an enquiry about non-O visas I was asked the same question but my answer, that we were married in the UK, didn't seem to alter the application criteria i was given.

[ubonjoe]

Once you are granted permanent residency you do not have to continue working.

You cannot work when on an extension based upon retirement meaning you could not even apply for residency.

If you got married in the UK before being able to apply for an extension based upon marriage you will have to register your marriage at the Amphoe. This requires doing a certification of your marriage certificate at the UK embassy (you do a declaration for this) and then have it translated to Thai and the translation certified at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. When you complete the registration they will do a Kor Ror 22 that you will need when applying for the extension.

[akentryan]

Citizenship has the same requirements as PR you still have to be working to get it.

Showing 400k baht in the bank is half of 800K baht. So that is double the money the bank. The other is 65K baht minus 40K which equals 25K baht more. Certainly not new.

The best bank deal I know of is at Krung Thai Bank. A five-year fixed deposit of 800K at 4% with monthly interest payments. Nothing else I can find even comes close. No BS at Immigration here in Pattaya with a letter and your passbook. Don't forget to file a Thai tax return and get your 15% tax withheld back. The income exemption is up to 150K now. Just had a 28K return of taxes withheld. Sweet.

[kjun12]

After looking at the replies to the OP it has confirmed my belief that one should NOT rely on information posted on here.

[ubonjoe]

After looking at the replies to the OP it has confirmed my belief that one should NOT rely on information posted on here.

Perhaps you could be so kind as to tell us what info you believe to be incorrect.

[DLP]

How old are you? Where did you get married, UK or Thailand?

If you get a 1 year multiple entry visa you will have to leave the country every 90 days.

If you get a single entry Non-O You will get 90 days permission to stay on entry. During the last 30 days of your permission to stay you could apply for a 1 year extension based on marriage to a Thai. In order to qualify you you would either have to have 400000 baht in a Thai bank in your name only seasoned for 2 months, OR a letter from your Embassy in Thailand stating that you are receiving at least 40000 baht/month income with the supporting documentation to prove it. When you apply you receive a 1 month "under consideration" stamp and then go back and get the balance of 11 months after it is approved. You do not have to leave Thailand, only make 90 day address reports at your local immgration office which, in most cases, can be done by mail. Any entry of a multiplke entry visa can be extended in the same manner.

If you are over 50 you can extend for retirement purposes but the financial requirements go up to either 800000 baht or 65000 baht/month or a combination of both. Easier to do, less paperwork and only one visit to immigratin.

Permanent residecy takes a long time to receive after you apply and I don't think that you can get it if you are retired and not working in Thailand.

At Pattaya immigration the 400,000 bt has to be seasoned for 3 monthes, it seems to vary depending on which immigration office

one goes to.

[ubonjoe]

How old are you? Where did you get married, UK or Thailand?

If you get a 1 year multiple entry visa you will have to leave the country every 90 days.

If you get a single entry Non-O You will get 90 days permission to stay on entry. During the last 30 days of your permission to stay you could apply for a 1 year extension based on marriage to a Thai. In order to qualify you you would either have to have 400000 baht in a Thai bank in your name only seasoned for 2 months, OR a letter from your Embassy in Thailand stating that you are receiving at least 40000 baht/month income with the supporting documentation to prove it. When you apply you receive a 1 month "under consideration" stamp and then go back and get the balance of 11 months after it is approved. You do not have to leave Thailand, only make 90 day address reports at your local immgration office which, in most cases, can be done by mail. Any entry of a multiplke entry visa can be extended in the same manner.

If you are over 50 you can extend for retirement purposes but the financial requirements go up to either 800000 baht or 65000 baht/month or a combination of both. Easier to do, less paperwork and only one visit to immigratin.

Permanent residecy takes a long time to receive after you apply and I don't think that you can get it if you are retired and not working in Thailand.

At Pattaya immigration the 400,000 bt has to be seasoned for 3 monthes, it seems to vary depending on which immigration office

one goes to.

I have never seen a report of 3 months being needed for an extension based upon marriage in Pattaya.

Are you sure that was not for a retirement extension.

[DLP]

How old are you? Where did you get married, UK or Thailand?

If you get a 1 year multiple entry visa you will have to leave the country every 90 days.

If you get a single entry Non-O You will get 90 days permission to stay on entry. During the last 30 days of your permission to stay you could apply for a 1 year extension based on marriage to a Thai. In order to qualify you you would either have to have 400000 baht in a Thai bank in your name only seasoned for 2 months, OR a letter from your Embassy in Thailand stating that you are receiving at least 40000 baht/month income with the supporting documentation to prove it. When you apply you receive a 1 month "under consideration" stamp and then go back and get the balance of 11 months after it is approved. You do not have to leave Thailand, only make 90 day address reports at your local immgration office which, in most cases, can be done by mail. Any entry of a multiplke entry visa can be extended in the same manner.

If you are over 50 you can extend for retirement purposes but the financial requirements go up to either 800000 baht or 65000 baht/month or a combination of both. Easier to do, less paperwork and only one visit to immigratin.

Permanent residecy takes a long time to receive after you apply and I don't think that you can get it if you are retired and not working in Thailand.

At Pattaya immigration the 400,000 bt has to be seasoned for 3 monthes, it seems to vary depending on which immigration office

one goes to.

I have never seen a report of 3 months being needed for an extension based upon marriage in Pattaya.

Are you sure that was not for a retirement extension.

No not retirement definatly marriage visa

[SDM0712]

.............In order to get permanent residency you need a work permit and to have been working for 3 consecutive years on extensions of stay...........

Without wanting to start a new thread, what is your understanding of " permanent residency". Does this mean an "indefinite leave to remain " as we have in the UK, does it need to be renewed every year, or say every ten years, do we still need to do the 90 days registration at Immigration...what does it mean ? I'm at the 3 year stage, and it is annoying renewing every year.

I'm interested if anyone has "permanent residency " status and what this actually means, and if they had to give up nationality to their birth country.

SDM

[nithisa78]

I always get a lawyer. Have found new one in recent years. We've cultivate good communications. They are not high priced. When his name is mentioned here, I am flagged. The upside, he knows us. What we want to achieve. Knows the path of least resistance. No gimmics, results. He has his feet on the ground and is good man. Whatever papers I receive, I understand, I'm guest of the Thai people. No complaints, life is good. Let the good times roll. Possession of lawyer is 9/10ths of law.

Edited March 8, 2014 by nithisa78

[ubonjoe]

.............In order to get permanent residency you need a work permit and to have been working for 3 consecutive years on extensions of stay...........

Without wanting to start a new thread, what is your understanding of " permanent residency". Does this mean an "indefinite leave to remain " as we have in the UK, does it need to be renewed every year, or say every ten years, do we still need to do the 90 days registration at Immigration...what does it mean ? I'm at the 3 year stage, and it is annoying renewing every year.

I'm interested if anyone has "permanent residency " status and what this actually means, and if they had to give up nationality to their birth country.

SDM

It is very similar to ILR.

You report every 5 years to the police and that is it. You do have to get a re-entry permit and can only be out of the country for a year.

You still are required to get a work permit but they are normally issued for 2 years.

No need to give up your nationality.

[PattayaPhom]

.............In order to get permanent residency you need a work permit and to have been working for 3 consecutive years on extensions of stay...........

Without wanting to start a new thread, what is your understanding of " permanent residency". Does this mean an "indefinite leave to remain " as we have in the UK, does it need to be renewed every year, or say every ten years, do we still need to do the 90 days registration at Immigration...what does it mean ? I'm at the 3 year stage, and it is annoying renewing every year.

I'm interested if anyone has "permanent residency " status and what this actually means, and if they had to give up nationality to their birth country.

SDM

From the UK you can have dual nationality if you gain citezenship here. PR allows you to stay permantly without the need for visas and do not need to show funds transferred from overseas for purchase of condo. The laws changed a few years ago for males married to a Thai whereby they can apply directly for citezenship after three continuous extensions and holding a WP with tax payments rather than obtaining PR and then waiting another three years. Search citezenship or permanant residency, there are many threads worthwhile reading.

[hvdkerkh]

Citizenship has the same requirements as PR you still have to be working to get it....

Is it really necessary to have a work-permit and labour in Thailand to apply for citizenship? I pay taxes on my world-income here (pension and investment income from abroad).

I´m currently on a retirement extension. Also married with a Thai for 12 years.

[thepool]

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Citizenship has the same requirements as PR you still have to be working to get it....

Is it really necessary to have a work-permit and labour in Thailand to apply for citizenship? I pay taxes on my world-income here (pension and investment income from abroad).

I´m currently on a retirement extension. Also married with a Thai for 12 years.

How much of that tax is paid to the Thai Government ?

Sounds as if the tax is paid within your country of origin .

[Travel Dude]

It's not really worth it...

[hvdkerkh]

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Citizenship has the same requirements as PR you still have to be working to get it....

Is it really necessary to have a work-permit and labour in Thailand to apply for citizenship? I pay taxes on my world-income here (pension and investment income from abroad).

I´m currently on a retirement extension. Also married with a Thai for 12 years.

How much of that tax is paid to the Thai Government ?

Sounds as if the tax is paid within your country of origin .

The double-taxation prevention treaty allows Thailand to raise taxes on 100% of my current income categories. Home-country 0%.

From age 67 onwards I will get an additional government pension. Only that part will be taxed in the home-country, not in Thailand. All well described in the treaty.

Still no answer to my question. Is labour and WP required for citizenship application or just paying taxes here?

[thepool]

The answer is yes , working , possession of a Wp and paying taxes on earned income are all required.

Suggest you look at that double-taxation prevention treaty again and claim back all that tax paid into the Thai coffers !

Just as a matter of interest which country has this agreement that allows Thailand to raise taxes on income which is derived from without the country.

Edited March 8, 2014 by thepool