Why no diesel cars?

[lorus59]

In Europe diesel cars out sell petrol ones by a considerable margin. But apart from pick-ups and a few top luxury brands, there are no normal family sized diesel cars on offer. Why? Diesel here is much cheaper than petrol. Around 9 Baht per litre. I did a small calculation using the popular Honda Civic as an example. I used a 1.8 petrol version and a 1.6 diesel version on sale in Europe. I calculated how many kilometers one could do for 1000 Baht. The petrol version would do 440 km but the diesel would do 911 km. I used the official consumption figures in the UK. That is a huge difference. If one manufacturer had the foresight to put one on the market and highlight the advantages they could make a killing.

[casualbiker]

The Thai dealer answer will be "Thai people not like diesel car " but then again that's what they said about small hatchbacks 3-4 years ago. And now we have many eco car hatchbacks .. when the Japanese get serious about diesel then they will be here.. the Honda city is available in India with a diesel!

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[IMHO]

While small capacity diesel engined passenger cars sell will in EU, that does not translate to US, South America, SEA, Australasia, or pretty much any of the rest of the world.. including Thailand.

[bkkjames]

sorry, missed the part about luxury... edit to remove bmw

Edited April 28, 2014 by bkkjames

[casualbiker]

While small capacity diesel engined passenger cars sell will in EU, that does not translate to US, South America, SEA, Australasia, or pretty much any of the rest of the world.. including Thailand.

Wonder why that is? Anything to do with vehicle manufacturers in the other regions NOT having decent small diesel engine technology?

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[lorus59]

While small capacity diesel engined passenger cars sell will in EU, that does not translate to US, South America, SEA, Australasia, or pretty much any of the rest of the world.. including Thailand.

Thais are buying small capacity petrol cars in their droves. I am sure the Honda City, Toyota Vios and the Nissan Almera are by far the best selling cars in Thailand. The driving experience of a modern diesel would be virtually no different.

[Wong!]

While small capacity diesel engined passenger cars sell will in EU, that does not translate to US, South America, SEA, Australasia, or pretty much any of the rest of the world.. including Thailand.

Wonder why that is? Anything to do with vehicle manufacturers in the other regions NOT having decent small diesel engine technology?

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Just the usual ignorance outside of Europe.

[IMHO]

While small capacity diesel engined passenger cars sell will in EU, that does not translate to US, South America, SEA, Australasia, or pretty much any of the rest of the world.. including Thailand.

Wonder why that is? Anything to do with vehicle manufacturers in the other regions NOT having decent small diesel engine technology?

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They all either have their own tech, or access to other's tech via alliances like PSA/Mitsubishi, Nissan/Renault/Daimler-Benz, Toyota/BMW etc, so it's not that.

[Ace of Pop]

Perhaps there are folks who don't like the Sound of them. Im one.

[dominique355]

In Thailand, appearance is all, substance is not important. That's why people here buy such crappy cars like a Benz E200. The cheapest way to get the 3-pointed star on the hood.

That is also why cars like Toyota Vios or Honda City sell so well: they appear like real cars with hood and trunk. Hatchbacks are still not as popular as these 3-volume cars, although hatchbacks have more passenger space and are much more versatile.

And only "agricultural" cars like pick-ups have Diesel engines, poor people cars.

And Thais don't want to appear poor, dark skin, Diesel engine etc.

Consequently they buy gasoline cars.

Doesn't make sense I know. But as I said: Appearance over substance!

It doesn't matter that a modern Diesel engine (I am not talking about Diesel engines used in pick-ups ) are at least equal to their counterpart using gasoline in terms of sound and top power. But are way better in terms of low-end power (torque) and of course mileage.

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[IMHO]

In Thailand, appearance is all, substance is not important. That's why people here buy such crappy cars like a Benz E200. The cheapest way to get the 3-pointed star on the hood.

That is also why cars like Toyota Vios or Honda City sell so well: they appear like real cars with hood and trunk. Hatchbacks are still not as popular as these 3-volume cars, although hatchbacks have more passenger space and are much more versatile.

And only "agricultural" cars like pick-ups have Diesel engines, poor people cars.

And Thais don't want to appear poor, dark skin, Diesel engine etc.

Consequently they buy gasoline cars.

Doesn't make sense I know. But as I said: Appearance over substance!

It doesn't matter that a modern Diesel engine (I am not talking about Diesel engines used in pick-ups ) are at least equal to their counterpart using gasoline in terms of sound and top power. But are way better in terms of low-end power (torque) and of course mileage.

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E200 isn't the cheapest Benz, LOL. Far from it

[bazmlb]

In Thailand, appearance is all, substance is not important. That's why people here buy such crappy cars like a Benz E200. The cheapest way to get the 3-pointed star on the hood.

That is also why cars like Toyota Vios or Honda City sell so well: they appear like real cars with hood and trunk. Hatchbacks are still not as popular as these 3-volume cars, although hatchbacks have more passenger space and are much more versatile.

And only "agricultural" cars like pick-ups have Diesel engines, poor people cars.

And Thais don't want to appear poor, dark skin, Diesel engine etc.

Consequently they buy gasoline cars.

Doesn't make sense I know. But as I said: Appearance over substance!

It doesn't matter that a modern Diesel engine (I am not talking about Diesel engines used in pick-ups ) are at least equal to their counterpart using gasoline in terms of sound and top power. But are way better in terms of low-end power (torque) and of course mileage.

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E200 isn't the cheapest Benz, LOL. Far from it

Its the baby of the E series though, in other countries where there are no tax issues for cars over 1990cc you would only see an e series start at e320 minimum

[Ace of Pop]

Funny thing to say that any Benz is Crap. Value for money here is questionable. My Friend has just had a new Mini Benz, same performance as any everyday Toyo/Mitsu. at twice the price. Will take it to the Car Wash and report back.

[Woodsie888]

Funny thing to say that any Benz is Crap. Value for money here is questionable. My Friend has just had a new Mini Benz, same performance as any everyday Toyo/Mitsu. at twice the price. Will take it to the Car Wash and report back.

Does your Car wash do car road tests and reviews Ace?

The Car wash I use only clean the cars or truck or bikes for me. I'm not sure I'd trust them road testing on my behalf as the staff appear to only have experience with small scooters.

[Ace of Pop]

No.i do a round trip of 50 Clics for the lazy to the Wash , enough to get an idea , and a Beer..

[Woodsie888]

No.i do a round trip of 50 Clics for the lazy to the Wash , enough to get an idea , and a Beer..

Hopefully they pay for it and it's very, very cold beer! hehe

[Spoonman]

Having just put down a deposit on a mazda 3 It would have been awesome to tick the box for the 2.2 diesel engine, sadly the 2.0 benzine is the best that is available.

Edited April 28, 2014 by Spoonman

[lorus59]

I can never understand why Thais will pay double the price for a Merc or BMW over a Camry for example when in other countries there is not such a great price difference. I think I would resent having to pay huge tax payments to the government.

[keemapoot]

Having just put down a deposit on a mazda 3 It would have been awesome to tick the box for the 2.2 diesel engine, sadly the 2.0 benzine is the best that is available.

The most beautiful mass market car to come along in a long time, and according to all reviews, is punching way above its weight, comparing to cars a class up. Good decision. I'm tempted to replace a car I have with one, but agree that 2.2 diesel would be great.

It's hard to believe that people are plunking down the same money on dogs like a Nissan Pulsar or whatever when that beauty is now on the scene.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

LPG is even cheaper.

About 25/40k to transform your petrol to LPG

[sjonburi]

Congrats. Did you go for the hatch or sedan? Normally I prefer hatches but the sedan has better proportions imo and looks very similar as the Mazda 6..

Did you test drive the car? What's your opinion on the Skyactiv transmission in terms of smoothness and gearshifts?

Having just put down a deposit on a mazda 3 It would have been awesome to tick the box for the 2.2 diesel engine, sadly the 2.0 benzine is the best that is available.

[keemapoot]

Congrats. Did you go for the hatch or sedan? Normally I prefer hatches but the sedan has better proportions imo and looks very similar as the Mazda 6..

Did you test drive the car? What's your opinion on the Skyactiv transmission in terms of smoothness and gearshifts?

Yeah, I think I read somewhere that this new 3 is so impressive, and upsized, that they are afraid it will erode sales of the Mazda 6 in those markets, AND Mazda are planning on poaching sales of Accord/Camry etc., with it. That's a pretty bold strategy. Wonder if that would happen in such a limited choice market like Thailand?

[Spoonman]

I got the SP20 Hatch. first drive of one will be when I pick it up in 2 weeks.

Edited April 28, 2014 by Spoonman

[Wong!]

I can never understand why Thais will pay double the price for a Merc or BMW over a Camry for example when in other countries there is not such a great price difference. I think I would resent having to pay huge tax payments to the government.

I cant understand why anone would waste money on a Camry either. Overpriced, gutless sofa on castors with no brakes.

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[Woodsie888]

I can never understand why Thais will pay double the price for a Merc or BMW over a Camry for example when in other countries there is not such a great price difference. I think I would resent having to pay huge tax payments to the government.

I cant understand why anone would waste money on a Camry either. Overpriced, gutless sofa on castors with no brakes.

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No brakes?

How do they stop?

[arthurwait]

No one imports them so is it down to Thais choice or people who control........ well things and have major shares in well you know and the less economic the cars are the more money they make ?

[Wong!]

I can never understand why Thais will pay double the price for a Merc or BMW over a Camry for example when in other countries there is not such a great price difference. I think I would resent having to pay huge tax payments to the government.

I cant understand why anone would waste money on a Camry either. Overpriced, gutless sofa on castors with no brakes.

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No brakes?

How do they stop?

Very poorly in my experience

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[I knew this would happen]

While small capacity diesel engined passenger cars sell will in EU, that does not translate to US, South America, SEA, Australasia, or pretty much any of the rest of the world.. including Thailand.

Thais are buying small capacity petrol cars in their droves. I am sure the Honda City, Toyota Vios and the Nissan Almera are by far the best selling cars in Thailand. The driving experience of a modern diesel would be virtually no different.

Those shitty 1.2CVT eco cars drive like crap. Such little asthmatic engines with no displacement worth to talk of and no turbo either are terrible dull and slow.

I´ve driven a lot of cars, rental, from friends or by any other chance just to try it. I think I know how these small 50-80HP eco cars feel. And most of them with their gasoline engines are underpowered, specially with auto and aircon like in LOS. It´s ok for the permanent traffic jam maybe but when you leave town and have 2-3 passengers it´s crap!

A while ago I got a chance to drive a friends Nissan Micra (March?) diesel, 86HP 200NM, this engine doesn´t have a lot more power than the 1.2 80Hp but it got the DOUBLE amount of torque. It will never feel underpowered, you can climb a hill with a full trunk and overtake with some more confidence. And you can achieve 5-6 liters per 100km without trying hard to save fuel. Or the Ford Ecoboost 1.0 125HP, great, I loved it in the new Fiesta.

I guess it´s a price and maybe an image problem, those simple 1.2-1.4 engines are cheap and uncomplicated, good for develepong markets. All Thai cars are build to a price and stripped down. Sometimes just 1 Airbag (still), missing features from other markets.

[I knew this would happen]

Perhaps there are folks who don't like the Sound of them. Im one.

The only downside of a Diesel yes. Of course I´m in love with everything that has 6 cylindes +, but I also really like Diesel cars for some reason, maybe cause I grew up in the countryside and developed some passion for tractor sounds.

But I think Vdub did an ok job with the sound design on the new Golf VII GTD 184. A great car, was at the dealer for a test drive.

Edited April 29, 2014 by I knew this would happen

[I knew this would happen]

In Thailand, appearance is all, substance is not important. That's why people here buy such crappy cars like a Benz E200. The cheapest way to get the 3-pointed star on the hood.

That is also why cars like Toyota Vios or Honda City sell so well: they appear like real cars with hood and trunk. Hatchbacks are still not as popular as these 3-volume cars, although hatchbacks have more passenger space and are much more versatile.

And only "agricultural" cars like pick-ups have Diesel engines, poor people cars.

And Thais don't want to appear poor, dark skin, Diesel engine etc.

Consequently they buy gasoline cars.

Doesn't make sense I know. But as I said: Appearance over substance!

It doesn't matter that a modern Diesel engine (I am not talking about Diesel engines used in pick-ups ) are at least equal to their counterpart using gasoline in terms of sound and top power. But are way better in terms of low-end power (torque) and of course mileage.

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Everyday in BKK, 320d, 525d, E250CDI, don´t think these Thais would consider themself poor, the diesel seems a popular choice. Even saw a 535D import, some seem to want it