Wot Camera?

[phusingpete]

Hi, I am looking to buy my first digital camera and would really appreciate some advice. Apart from general photography I want to take photographs of my paintings, to create a catalogue type thingy. So good detail and colour rendition are important. I am familiar with photography using film but am a complete novice with computerised digital stuff, so it needs to be reasonably easy to use.I assume an SLR would be preferable but which one..? I am not too fussed price wise although I do not want to spend squillions, say up to 40.000 baht ish. Cheers in anticipation....

[udon]

Here's a few.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0605/06053001fujiz3.asp (pocket sized with optical Image Stabilizer technology and video functionality)

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/specs/Cano...non_sd700is.asp (Pocket sized with optical Image Stabilizer technology and video functionality)

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/specs/Canon/canon_s3is.asp (SLR with optical Image Stabilizer technology and video functionality)

My choice? sd700is. Take it anywhere!

40,000B...... I wish

Check out the prices via bizrate.com

[tigerbeer]

nothing beats fuji F11 in terms of features and specs for the novice. my sister who doesnt know anything about ptotography swears by her F10. superb CCD, iso range up to 1600 with minimal noise. its an award winner and if not mistaken selling at 14,900 now with 256 or 512MB XD memory.

[silvero]

I'd suggest you first decide whether you need an SLR or whether a P&S will be ok for the work with the paintings, and whatever else you want to be using the camera for. e.g Are you going to take images of your paintings for print or for the web? Exactly how good do you need the images of your paintings? What else are you going to use the camera for?

[astral]

Don't forget a good solid tripod.

An essential item for photographing static objects like paintings.

[phusingpete]

Hi, many thanks for your advice, I will look at your recomendations when I next visit Bangkok. I did think that an SLR would be preferable simply because what you see is what you get,image wise.I assume these other camera's have some facility to correct parallax error.My main concern is to get good detail and colour rendition when taking shots of my paintings. In the past, when using film, I have found that the lighter tonal area's are completely washed out,and appear white although there was a lot of colour in those areas. So I hope to avoid this in future. I do want to print the images, as I want to take them around some galleries when I take my annual trip to London,the quality of the image is therefore important.

However I do appreciate that for general photography the SLR is quite bulky and a pain to carry around. I used to have a Bronica ETRS and hauled that around the Oz outback,Uluru and Kings Canyon nearly killed me.More than once I was tempted to dump the thing.

Point taken re. Tripod will bear that in mind. Another aspect on my mind is the gismo thingy needed to down load the images to the computer, this I assume (hope) is straight forward.

Once again many thanks for your comments and advice....cheers

[marktomaras]

I suggest the Canon 20D for a few reasons.

To start with, I am a Canon shooter, so I know the system well enough to recommend it. I used to shoot Nikon digital, but I have since converted.

The 20D is a remarkable camera. It is a normal sized, DSLR with an excellent 8.2 megapixel CMOS sensor. I say excellent because megapixels are not the only thing to consider here. I use the Canon 1DsMKII, which is a camera that costs about 7 times more than the 20D. A friend of mine, also a photographer by trade, bought a 20D to shoot digital with (he also uses large format film). Anyway, we did a scientific comparison between images that these cameras produce. We set up a scene and make photos at various settings, specifically interested in the quality of the photos as the camera moves into the high ISO settings. To our surprise and delight, the 20D really was a trooper and held its own against the flagship of Canon's Digital line.

I have always believed that there is a trickle down effect on the quality from the high end pro gear to the prosumer and consumer gear from Nikon and Canon.

The 20D will cost you about 30,000 ~ 35,000 baht on the second hand market. They should be available used because the replacement, the 30D was recently introduced.

For a lens, I would suggest a simple, fixed-focal lenth pro quality lens, rather than the all in one cheap zooms that are often bundled with the cameras when they are sold new. The cheap zooms are not very sharp and have poor light gathering ability.

I suggest either the 24mm f/2.8 (8,500 baht used) or the higher quality 20mm f/2.8 (12,000 baht used). The 20D has a focal length multiplier factor of 1.6 which means a 20mm lens functions like a 32mm lens and a 24mm lens behaves like a 38mm lens. This is because the lenses were designed for 35mm film and the sensor in the 20D is physically smaller than 35mm film.

Either of these lenses will give you sharp, professional results for your artwork. Good color and good flat plane reproduction.

Some places to check for purcahse:

in BKK, fotofile in MBK has a lot of good quality used gear

eBay is an excellent source

KEH.com, a huge shop out of Atlanta in the USA is great

B&H in new york city, a fine place for mail order over the web. I buy most of my gear there.

In my opinion, there is not a point and shoot available that can even come close to this.

good luck, and feel free to ask me any questions. I am a camera nerd and am happy to help.

[astral]

Any good digital camera will come with sw and the cable to allow you to download the photos to your PC.

Then you need Photoshop.

This will allow you to compensate for washed out colours, if they occur.

It will allow you to do pretty well anything you want.

A standard camera will not allow for parrallax errors.

For SLR cameras there are special "architectural" lenses to compensate

for converging verticals.

You should not need this, if you can ensure that the camera is centred on (vertically and horizontally) and parallel to the item being photographed.

[phusingpete]

Any good digital camera will come with sw and the cable to allow you to download the photos to your PC.

Then you need Photoshop.

This will allow you to compensate for washed out colours, if they occur.

It will allow you to do pretty well anything you want.

A standard camera will not allow for parrallax errors.

For SLR cameras there are special "architectural" lenses to compensate

for converging verticals.

You should not need this, if you can ensure that the camera is centred on (vertically and horizontally) and parallel to the item being photographed.

Thanks for the information,I will look at the Canon 20D at Fotophile when I go to Bangkok

later this month. I am very wary about buying in stuff by mail having read on other threads

about the hefty taxes that may be imposed by Thai customs.

On a shopping trip in BigC or Macro, a Canon DSLR camera caught my eye for around 42.000

baht, which is why I mentioned this sum in the first place. I am not sure of the model though.

This was some months ago and anyhow I would prefer to buy in a pucker photographic store

where I would get sound advice, hopefully.Then I found this site which is perfect.

Converging verticals were certainly a major feature of my shots of paintings in the past, no

matter how carfully I tried to line up the camera with painting. However I did not have a tripod

then ,I will invest in one this time.

I have heard of Photoshop, clearly I will need to embark on a very steep learning curve in the

very near future. Once again thanks for all the advice and information, it really is appreciated...

Cheers

[Tywais]

However I did not have a tripod then ,I will invest in one this time.

Make sure it has bubble levels on it that way you can pretty much eliminate paralax errors.

[phusingpete]

Any good digital camera will come with sw and the cable to allow you to download the photos to your PC.

Then you need Photoshop.

This will allow you to compensate for washed out colours, if they occur.

It will allow you to do pretty well anything you want.

A standard camera will not allow for parrallax errors.

For SLR cameras there are special "architectural" lenses to compensate

for converging verticals.

You should not need this, if you can ensure that the camera is centred on (vertically and horizontally) and parallel to the item being photographed.

Thanks for the information,I will look at the Canon 20D at Fotophile when I go to Bangkok

later this month. I am very wary about buying in stuff by mail having read on other threads

about the hefty taxes that may be imposed by Thai customs.

On a shopping trip in BigC or Macro, a Canon DSLR camera caught my eye for around 42.000

baht, which is why I mentioned this sum in the first place. I am not sure of the model though.

This was some months ago and anyhow I would prefer to buy in a pucker photographic store

where I would get sound advice, hopefully.Then I found this site which is perfect.

Converging verticals were certainly a major feature of my shots of paintings in the past, no

matter how carfully I tried to line up the camera with painting. However I did not have a tripod

then ,I will invest in one this time.

I have heard of Photoshop, clearly I will need to embark on a very steep learning curve in the

very near future. Once again thanks for all the advice and information, it really is appreciated...

Cheers

Sorry about the confusing layout of my last post. Did not look like that when I typed it out...

[silvero]

The 20D is a great camera but i'd look at the differences for your purposes between it and the 350D, may be not much benefit to you for the extra baht.

Also remember that the lens that comes with these cameras isn't ideal for your work, as mentioned above, an appropriate focal-length prime will be your best bet, and that will probably be a 5-digit purchase also.

You won't need an extremely heavy/expensive tripod just for doing the work with paintings, a light one is fine if you use the timer or a remote control so you aren't touching the camera when it shoots.

[Nordlys]

Canon 20D had a very good reputation and ratings but I'm sure it's long been sold out and been replaced and upgraded to 30D now, but for a less price than 20D from what I heard.

Don't forget to ask for VAT refund at fotofile if you are visiting LOS as a tourist!

Edited June 16, 2006 by Nordlys

[Nordlys]

We set up a scene and make photos at various settings, specifically interested in the quality of the photos as the camera moves into the high ISO settings. To our surprise and delight, the 20D really was a trooper and held its own against the flagship of Canon's Digital line.

Why didn't you get a 5D then? I do have a 5D and it's remarkably noiseless at ISO800, although at this ISO you probably can't tell much difference between 5D and 1DsMk2. Is 12 million pixels not enough resolution for your work? Same size sensor (well, almost) but at 400 mega less pixels, I've read in a magazine 5D is the most noiseless camera in the market today perhaps with the exception of medium format size sensor cameras (Mamiya, Fuji, etc). I also find 1Ds to be too heavy and cumbersome (+ too expensive) a camera to take on the field, although I'd like the water proof feature available for 1Ds on my 5D. Not the kind of a camera I want to use other than in studios!

Edited June 16, 2006 by Nordlys

[hughden]

Doubt you will find a new 20D anywhere. 30D is a nice upgrade of the 20D and is similar in price.

[phusingpete]

Doubt you will find a new 20D anywhere. 30D is a nice upgrade of the 20D and is similar in price.

Thanks again for all your advice and info. I understand that a specific fixed focal length is preferable to the usual zoom, the 5 digit sum may be ok, depends on the size of the digit's...Will also look at the Canon 30D. Nordlys, good point re. vat return I never gave that a thought,although I have support wife visa I assume it still applies. BTW love your avatar.

I have looked at the thread on camera sources but could not find the location of Fotophile in Bangkok.I am based in Issan and have little knowledge of Bangkok.Could you tell me where it is and if it is near any overhead rail station. Many thanks........

[silvero]

Fotofile has 2 shops in MBK shopping centre - accessible by covered walkway from National Stadium BTS station. Their website is www.fotofile.net, but don't trust that the prices are up to date.

[Tywais]

I have looked at the thread on camera sources but could not find the location of Fotophile in Bangkok.I am based in Issan and have little knowledge of Bangkok.Could you tell me where it is and if it is near any overhead rail station. Many thanks........

Mahboonkrong Shopping Center (MBK for short), by the National Stadium Skytrain (BTS) stop. The shop's in the ground floor, near the center of the mall towards the main street.

http://www.photo.net/thailand/bangkok

[Nordlys]

Foitofile is on the ground floor of MBK on the east side, facing Payathai Road. Their another outlet on 3rd floor (called Photo Thailand) is near the northeast corner of the same building, surrounded by restaurants. It's the same floor where the Tokyu Department store next to MBK has a flyover connecting the building directly to BTS National Stadium station. There's more floor space in Photo Thailand on the 3rd floor than Fotofile on 1st floor, with chairs to sit (and free coffee served to customers) so if you plan to spend some time inspecting different models I suggest you go to Photo Thailand.

[hughden]

To reach their third floor shop (which is more pleasant than the ground floor outlet), walk into MBK from the sky train station and keep going until you see some escalators on your left. Go up one floor and go straight ahead on the right hand lane and the shop is on the right.

Beware, it is full of temptation!

[phusingpete]

To reach their third floor shop (which is more pleasant than the ground floor outlet), walk into MBK from the sky train station and keep going until you see some escalators on your left. Go up one floor and go straight ahead on the right hand lane and the shop is on the right.

Beware, it is full of temptation!

What would I do without you guy's,thanks again. I am really looking forward to getting my hands on a digital camera. Often after finishing a painting I think I may alter the composition,but not really sure.With the camera I could take a shot of the painting, run it through photoshop,make some alterations then decide if the change is right and if so alter the painting. I hope it's that easy. I got mixed up with the avatar's it's hughden's that's particularly enticing..cheers

[phusingpete]

To reach their third floor shop (which is more pleasant than the ground floor outlet), walk into MBK from the sky train station and keep going until you see some escalators on your left. Go up one floor and go straight ahead on the right hand lane and the shop is on the right.

Beware, it is full of temptation!

What would I do without you guy's,thanks again. I am really looking forward to getting my hands on a digital camera. Often after finishing a painting I think I may alter the composition,but not really sure.With the camera I could take a shot of the painting, run it through photoshop,make some alterations then decide if the change is right and if so alter the painting. I hope it's that easy. I got mixed up with the avatar's it's hughden's that's particularly enticing..cheers

Hi all, have just returned from the uk with my new digital camera a cannon eos 30D,lovely jubbly. After looking around Bangkok and London, on Ebay in the uk finally bought one duty free at Heathrow, not cheap though, had to pay £748, but this had an 18mm-55mm lens and was cheaper than any other price I saw, even body only. So will play with this and if I need to buy a fixed focus lens will do so later. Really enjoying it, masses to learn of course.Unfortunately forgot about the tripod.

[aussman]

hi...will add my 2 cents worth. ive been using a nikon 5400 for a couple of years now and have used it for general photography as well as getting photos of my art work for further enhancement digitally. after using both photoshop and corel paint shop pro X i settled on the latter. simply easier for the novice to use and with similar functions. it also has a function to resolve the parallax problem. while this has been a good combination...i am getting a 30D as well to persue a growing passion for hi-res close-up work..

cheers..happy snapping

[jimbobkk]

pete, congrats on your new purchase. Although I am a devoted Nikon user the 30D is still a great camera. If you are looking for a good tripod I would suggest Benro. They are top quality knockoffs of pro tripods (Gitzo). Since they are made in China the prices are very cheap. You can get a good aluminum tripod and ball head for about 5-6000 baht. Believe me it is the best 6000 baht you'll spend on camera gear. I got mine at AV Camera in Bangrak.

[phusingpete]

pete, congrats on your new purchase. Although I am a devoted Nikon user the 30D is still a great camera. If you are looking for a good tripod I would suggest Benro. They are top quality knockoffs of pro tripods (Gitzo). Since they are made in China the prices are very cheap. You can get a good aluminum tripod and ball head for about 5-6000 baht. Believe me it is the best 6000 baht you'll spend on camera gear. I got mine at AV Camera in Bangrak.

Hi jimbobkk,thanks for the info, I am in Bangkok for a few weeks so will take alook at AV, exactly where are they.....cheers

[hughden]

Congratulations on your new camera, the 30D is great (at least, I love mine!). Sadly the 18-55 kit lens is not that good. Once you have got the hang of the camera, a beter lens will give you noticeably better pictures. The 24-105L is great walk-around lens for the 30D, although it will cost you as much as the camera body...

Have fun!

[Nordlys]

The 24-105L is great walk-around lens for the 30D, although it will cost you as much as the camera body...

I have this lens too and I agree the zoom range makes it a very good versatile, walk-around lens but the distortion and vignetting especially at the wide end is quite substantial that it's easily noticeable just by glancing through the view finder, although this may not be a problem with 1.6X crop factor of 30D. I'd recommend EF24-70mm F2.8L USM if you have your mind set for future upgrade to full-size dSLR or EF-S17-55mm F2.8 IS USM if you'll stay with APS-C size sensor.

[jimbobkk]

Hi jimbobkk,thanks for the info, I am in Bangkok for a few weeks so will take alook at AV, exactly where are they.....cheers

Pete, AV Camera is located on a small side street next to Robinson Bangrak. You can take the BTS to Saphan Thaksin and it is just a short walk. Or take a taxi to the end of Silom Road (riverside towards Oriental Hotel) and turn left. Drive on for a bit and you will see Robinson on your right. When you get to AV ask for Khun Mana. Also, while they usually have Benro in stock it might be a good idea to check before you go. You can post a question on their webboard (avcamera.com) and they'll usually get back to you within a day. Good luck and hope you get many shots while in Thailand.

[astral]

It may be worth waiting until the new year for the new 40D or whatever it will be called.

The EF-S lenses are a problem as they lock you into the smaller format...........

[phusingpete]

Hi jimbobkk,thanks for the info, I am in Bangkok for a few weeks so will take alook at AV, exactly where are they.....cheers

Pete, AV Camera is located on a small side street next to Robinson Bangrak. You can take the BTS to Saphan Thaksin and it is just a short walk. Or take a taxi to the end of Silom Road (riverside towards Oriental Hotel) and turn left. Drive on for a bit and you will see Robinson on your right. When you get to AV ask for Khun Mana. Also, while they usually have Benro in stock it might be a good idea to check before you go. You can post a question on their webboard (avcamera.com) and they'll usually get back to you within a day. Good luck and hope you get many shots while in Thailand.

Hi jimbobkk, many thanks I will check them out...cheers