Thailand eyeing tighter restrictions on foreign businesses

[WhizBang]

Now a draft law put forward by the Ministry of Commerce would restrict foreign firms from being able to use preferred stock to retain control of their businesses.

"This proposed change would have far-reaching ramifications that would affect thousands of existing firms here, big and small, and would certainly deter future foreign investment," said Marcus Burtenshaw, executive director of real estate consultancy Knight Frank Thailand.

And just 3 days ago;

Special Report: Thailand welcomes all investors

You miss the point. Thailand wants your money... not you.

[Rimbuman]

The current law forbids foreign majority ownership in sectors where Thai businesses are deemed not ready to compete with foreign companies.

Those include accountancy, legal services, architecture, engineering, brokerages, advertising, hotel operations, food and beverages and "other service businesses."

Why can't Thai business compete in these areas?

They can't compete in any area of business which doesn't involve "being able to speak Thai" as its premium selling point. The tragedy of Asia is that their nations still aren't producing the creative and dedicated types that are required to be world class business people. Look to education, face culture and general disinterest for the reasons why and then blame foreigners. This is the Asia of tomorrow.

And this won't change anytime soon.

[jspill]

Wait, I thought visa related changes and crackdowns only happened to visa runners, overstayers, digital pikeys not paying taxes, pesky fake student types... heinous law breakers 'making it hard for the rest of us' law abiding folk with work permits.

555

[micmichd]

Imperialist talk about Fascism? Tell us more, please

[Beetlejuice]

Our move is already planned for the beginning of 2015.

A shame really, since we have a very fast growing and succesful IT-business here. But considering the racist-like and non-caring attitude, we have been facing from the authorities since the very beginning, it is simply not worth it. EVERYTHING is just too difficult and unsecure here. But worst is the racist-like attitude, which I am personally sick of it and which is the reason for our move.

We built a good business and created local jobs, but we are still treated like "shit" most of the times, we come in contact with the authorities. Just doing a work-permit takes more effort and requires more paper than used on a bloody 5-year rocket-scientist degree. This place is going down the drain and they have only themselves and their ignorance (stupidity) to blame for it. The article is a good example of their complete lack of international outlook and understanding of their own current situation.

Luckily, there are many countries nearby who are both grateful and happy, to welcome a company like ours. So not long until they can no longer see us as a problem anymore. "Thailand a developed country by 2025...." Good luck with that! They will for sure need it.

Wrong.

These moves have nothing to do with racist attitudes and non-caring attitudes by the authorities from the beginning. The authorities have been extremely lenient towards long stay foreigners and have turned a blind eye to most of their activities here in the past, but as I have said many times here on Thai visa, the blame falls squarely on those who have and continue to abuse the systems here, therefore having a knock on affect of creating the tightening up of the rules for everyone.

It is all very simple, those who are able to live or work in Thailand long term by abiding the terms and conditions imposed by the Immigration and trade departments have no problems and will not have any prejudices displayed against them. For those who for one reason or another are unable to hack it here have the choices of moving on if they feel will be more appreciated elsewhere as in your case and there are better opportunities for small company operators in other countries.

It would be a smart move on your part transferring your business operation abroad believing that the authorities there will give companies like yours an easier time, but I very much doubt that this would have any economical impact on Thailand at all and in any case, companies claiming to be highly successful in Thailand would somehow manage to get through the bureaucracy even if it mean`t hiring an adminstrative officer to do those tasks for them. But of course this depends on how successful these outfits really are and what are their prospects for the future?

[bangrak]

Our Thai (owned and operated) companies are not competitive in ...(follows a very looong list), let's make them all competitive in one single stroke: let's ban the ('non-Thai') competition!

What next? Thai companies only allowed to buy from other Thai companies? What about export then? Don't need Pharangs either for that one...?

Thailand, the hub of ...? Protectionism? Idiot-ism? ...?

[micmichd]

What do all these -isms stand for? Pray tell stupid farmer me

[micmichd]

I miss one: Farangism.

[quicky]

Best news I have heard in a long time

[bangrak]

So what if the Yingluck government is gone? That doesn't change the fact that these changes have been discussed for over 12 months well before this government, well before the coup, well before the protests and well before the amnesty mess started.

Again...

Where is your proof??

You are making the claim it is "fact" so the onus of proof rests squarely on your shoulders.

The mere rumor of these restrictions is enough for the Japanese envoy to speak out, the British ambassador to write a blog post, BP to write front page articles for the past 2 weeks ago... surely if Yingluck had been discussing these changes The Nation and others would have been all over it. So find one person, one link other than "whybother" who can confirm your 'facts'. I'll be waiting....

It's getting even beyond red or yellow with you. fanaticism.

____________

Don't know where you were last year, when it was here, where did you keep your head in all that time, it was on the news for weeks, and discussed about everywhere! And a few years earlier already, but then concentrated on all Pharangs in control of real estate and such, and that's still ongoing, on a low fire, for the moment. And about 5 or 6 years ago, there was a person to become high-high-up who also ventilated his personal ideas in a same direction...

You don't need to believe me either though...

[BudRight]

If you cannot handle the local laws then farke off and stop moaning.

Thailand owes you jack.

I guess you won't complain when Thailand looks like Burma in 1980s.

If Thailand owes me nothing, nothing at all, not dignity, rights or a shred of consideration, then really why should I care what happens to it? Let it be nuked. What do I care?

[bangrak]

So what if the Yingluck government is gone? That doesn't change the fact that these changes have been discussed for over 12 months well before this government, well before the coup, well before the protests and well before the amnesty mess started.

Again...

Where is your proof??

You are making the claim it is "fact" so the onus of proof rests squarely on your shoulders.

The mere rumor of these restrictions is enough for the Japanese envoy to speak out, the British ambassador to write a blog post, BP to write front page articles for the past 2 weeks ago... surely if Yingluck had been discussing these changes The Nation and others would have been all over it. So find one person, one link other than "whybother" who can confirm your 'facts'. I'll be waiting....

It's getting even beyond red or yellow with you. fanaticism.

____________

Don't know where you were last year, when it was here, where did you keep your head in all that time, it was on the news for weeks, and discussed about everywhere! And a few years earlier already, but then concentrated on all Pharangs in control of real estate and such, and that's still ongoing, on a low fire, for the moment. And about 5 or 6 years ago, there was a person to become high-high-up who also ventilated his personal ideas in a same direction...

You don't need to believe me either though...

[peptidebomber]

Our move is already planned for the beginning of 2015.

A shame really, since we have a very fast growing and succesful IT-business here. But considering the racist-like and non-caring attitude, we have been facing from the authorities since the very beginning, it is simply not worth it. EVERYTHING is just too difficult and unsecure here. But worst is the racist-like attitude, which I am personally sick of it and which is the reason for our move.

We built a good business and created local jobs, but we are still treated like "shit" most of the times, we come in contact with the authorities. Just doing a work-permit takes more effort and requires more paper than used on a bloody 5-year rocket-scientist degree. This place is going down the drain and they have only themselves and their ignorance (stupidity) to blame for it. The article is a good example of their complete lack of international outlook and understanding of their own current situation.

Luckily, there are many countries nearby who are both grateful and happy, to welcome a company like ours. So not long until they can no longer see us as a problem anymore. "Thailand a developed country by 2025...." Good luck with that! They will for sure need it.

Wrong.

These moves have nothing to do with racist attitudes and non-caring attitudes by the authorities from the beginning. The authorities have been extremely lenient towards long stay foreigners and have turned a blind eye to most of their activities here in the past, but as I have said many times here on Thai visa, the blame falls squarely on those who have and continue to abuse the systems here, therefore having a knock on affect of creating the tightening up of the rules for everyone.

It is all very simple, those who are able to live or work in Thailand long term by abiding the terms and conditions imposed by the Immigration and trade departments have no problems and will not have any prejudices displayed against them. For those who for one reason or another are unable to hack it here have the choices of moving on if they feel will be more appreciated elsewhere as in your case and there are better opportunities for small company operators in other countries.

It would be a smart move on your part transferring your business operation abroad believing that the authorities there will give companies like yours an easier time, but I very much doubt that this would have any economical impact on Thailand at all and in any case, companies claiming to be highly successful in Thailand would somehow manage to get through the bureaucracy even if it mean`t hiring an adminstrative officer to do those tasks for them. But of course this depends on how successful these outfits really are and what are their prospects for the future?

Wow,did you read your post before you hit reply?

To start with, are you comparing overstayers and people who don't care about laws, to people who run a business, comply and abide by all the laws?

Can't hack it? What about those who want to live here, have invested money have a family and want to stay? Just get out you don't belong here?

And no economical impact, my business would lose at least 30 staff, flow on from that would double if we weren't in business, and Im only a medium to small business like millions of others.

But usual the advice, don't like it leave. Don't dare question or speak up, you have no rights here!

[ozyjon]

And so the noose tightens just a little bit more, i say let it happen then if it backfires i'm sure they will just loosen the noose and many will return and then it begins again, i'm packing as i write, have had enough, time to go.

[GAZZPA]

This should of happened a long time ago. All these farangs taking money off hard working Thais!

Thailand has long been the country of innovation and self sustainability! Western nations should be grateful to be allowed to business at all in the Kingdom, they try to learn the Thai's business practices, customer service, law enforcement, in which all fields Thais lead the world.

555

Totally agree and glad you appreciate the situation -

Pertaining to farang owned businesses in Thailand, they do use the hard labours of Thai workers and the Thai systems to benefit themselves. In their home countries, maintenance, tax, the running, bills, wholesale goods prices, services, labour and the work force would cost these companies much, much more. Many are taking out of the country far more than they are putting in and are raking in huge profits way more than they could archive back in Farangland.where the business expenditures are massive and in many cases defeats the object of owning and running businesses in the west, especially the smaller companies.

The Thais are using common sense and trying to ensure that their people also gain a lions share out of the deal from foreign run companies in the Kingdom if granting these companies the advantages of using their resources of cheap labour and access to lower running costs.

The old saying; one can`t have their cake and eat it.

Oh dear, you have no idea what you are talking about.

By the way, where is Farangland?Are all countries outside of Thailand the same to you? Do you think Thailand is the cheapest country on earth to do business in? In other countries where running a business is higher cost it is also the case where the revenue streams are considerably higher,, simple economics... In simple terms for you, in some countries people earn more money then Thailand BUT the cost of living is also significantly higher and it doesn't necessarily mean a better standard of living,,, don't you get that?

I said earlier that ALL countries need foreign investment.. If I take your example,, Toyota are making huge profits here and huge amounts of money are benefiting Japan, and yes money will be going back to Japan, however they are also investing massively in Thailand, employing thousands of people and providing "affordable" cars for the local economy. So yes the Japanese get richer but Thailand does as well... This is the same for all businesses,,

If we take your "xenophobic" attitude should Thailand throw out all foreign companies including Toyota? How about Toshiba, Honda, Yamaha, and what about your 3 biggest grocery chains, Tesco, Big C and 7 Eleven,, should you throw those out as well?

Perhaps you ought to read and understand the economy a little, when you do that go and have a meeting with the clueless people running your country and see if you can all begin to understand the absurdity of your plans.

[GAZZPA]

And so the noose tightens just a little bit more, i say let it happen then if it backfires i'm sure they will just loosen the noose and many will return and then it begins again, i'm packing as i write, have had enough, time to go.

Think I'm right behind you fella,, good luck.

[GAZZPA]

Our move is already planned for the beginning of 2015.

A shame really, since we have a very fast growing and succesful IT-business here. But considering the racist-like and non-caring attitude, we have been facing from the authorities since the very beginning, it is simply not worth it. EVERYTHING is just too difficult and unsecure here. But worst is the racist-like attitude, which I am personally sick of it and which is the reason for our move.

We built a good business and created local jobs, but we are still treated like "shit" most of the times, we come in contact with the authorities. Just doing a work-permit takes more effort and requires more paper than used on a bloody 5-year rocket-scientist degree. This place is going down the drain and they have only themselves and their ignorance (stupidity) to blame for it. The article is a good example of their complete lack of international outlook and understanding of their own current situation.

Luckily, there are many countries nearby who are both grateful and happy, to welcome a company like ours. So not long until they can no longer see us as a problem anymore. "Thailand a developed country by 2025...." Good luck with that! They will for sure need it.

Wrong.

These moves have nothing to do with racist attitudes and non-caring attitudes by the authorities from the beginning. The authorities have been extremely lenient towards long stay foreigners and have turned a blind eye to most of their activities here in the past, but as I have said many times here on Thai visa, the blame falls squarely on those who have and continue to abuse the systems here, therefore having a knock on affect of creating the tightening up of the rules for everyone.

It is all very simple, those who are able to live or work in Thailand long term by abiding the terms and conditions imposed by the Immigration and trade departments have no problems and will not have any prejudices displayed against them. For those who for one reason or another are unable to hack it here have the choices of moving on if they feel will be more appreciated elsewhere as in your case and there are better opportunities for small company operators in other countries.

It would be a smart move on your part transferring your business operation abroad believing that the authorities there will give companies like yours an easier time, but I very much doubt that this would have any economical impact on Thailand at all and in any case, companies claiming to be highly successful in Thailand would somehow manage to get through the bureaucracy even if it mean`t hiring an adminstrative officer to do those tasks for them. But of course this depends on how successful these outfits really are and what are their prospects for the future?

Wow,did you read your post before you hit reply?

To start with, are you comparing overstayers and people who don't care about laws, to people who run a business, comply and abide by all the laws?

Can't hack it? What about those who want to live here, have invested money have a family and want to stay? Just get out you don't belong here?

And no economical impact, my business would lose at least 30 staff, flow on from that would double if we weren't in business, and Im only a medium to small business like millions of others.

But usual the advice, don't like it leave. Don't dare question or speak up, you have no rights here!

You cannot shake this attitude and lack of understanding, don't even bother trying. This will be the countries undoing for sure but you can't get the xenophobia out of this country and it will choke them in the end.

Good luck in whatever you do, like many other people I am looking to take my "farang" money, experience, business, exports and jobs somewhere else.

[Bakeman]

If foreign companies and investors were to pull out of Thailand this wonderful country would go backwards 100 plus years.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/778055-thailands-board-of-investment-boi-admits-that-foreign-investment-is-declining/

Edited November 20, 2014 by Bakeman

[GAZZPA]

It was announced during Yingluck's tenure.

Huh?!???

Proof please?

Last week the Japanese envoy warned of an exodus after I quote being 'shocked at the revelation', British ambassador Mark Kent took the time to write a blog post. In 2007 United States ambassador to Thailand Ralph Boyce spoke out : http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2007/04/01/national/national_30030797.php So if this was "announced" during Yingluck's tenure, or discussed seriously, surely you have news articles, or is this one of the secret secret evil plans only yellows know about?

UNBELIEVABLE. get your head out of the sand.

Get MY head out of the sand?

I have been at various meetings of the one of the JFCCT committees and it has been discussed regularly for well over 12 months.

Do a google search on JFCCT Foreign Dominance regulations. You will see there are minutes and press releases even as early as Jan 2013 talking about the these changes to the foreign business act. Most of the talk then was about the 3G licences, particularly relating to DTAC, but it was discussed then that there was no reason the proposed changes wouldn't affect SME's as well as the big companies.

My point is, this isn't something that the current government has suddenly thought up. It's been an issue for a number of years and there was discussion of it being implemented 12-18 months ago.

Well it certainly was not as public as now. Anyway, makes no difference a stupid idea 18 months ago is still a stupid idea today.

[GAZZPA]

sounds to me like they are saying they want zero foreign controlled businesses now (unless meet BOI conditions)

however foreigners are welcome to invest in thai controlled businesses

all thai companies currently controlled by foreigners both big and small will have to relinquish control to their majority thai partners

have i got this right?

pretty much right, yes..

[Chris Lawrence]

That's what you get from a puppet whose master orchestrated a change. Now the master elite are taking full advantage to shore up their interests.

Which puppet master? The one in charge more than 12 months ago when this was being discussed?

To be fair it was put forward by the 2006 economic team appointed by the Coup leaders. This followed a distratous showing with the slow flow of funds for the Government. The attempt to change the rules fell through.

So its been on the table even before 12 months ago.

But what you need to ask is why, Whybother?

Why does this Government need to put a protectionist policy in place, when the talk is about growing with the world community.

Now forigen banks have been waiting for an answer to opening up in Thailand since before the Coup? I believe that application was with the previous Government.

So what are they trying to do? Get more joint ventures with control of JV's by Thai's?

Why has this policy reared its head again?

Whybother, not sure if you are trying to stick up for someone, trying to prove some type of knowledge on the subject, or your not really sure? I see you have only been on this board since 2010, so I am not sure if your knowledge goes past this time by way of your comment?

[pjthefey]

This certainly changes my plans for the next few years.... Better to visit thailand when the baht tanks while earning money in a country that appreciates the investors.

[rijit]

This should of happened a long time ago. All these farangs taking money off hard working Thais!

Thailand has long been the country of innovation and self sustainability! Western nations should be grateful to be allowed to business at all in the Kingdom, they try to learn the Thai's business practices, customer service, law enforcement, in which all fields Thais lead the world.

555

[DLock]

It's pretty clear that Thailand does not want foreign investment....or should I say, does not want foreigners to control their investment.

Pretty simple. Don't invest money in Thailand. Don't create jobs. Don't pay tax. Don't lease buildings. Don't buy property (in company names).

Enjoy Thailand, but come here to have fun and go elsewhere to make money.

I stopped investing here several years ago. Just not worth the hassle, risk, restrictions and I could not easily get profits out.

Now Thailand is just one of 3 places I spend time. Will me or my money be missed? Not at all....but if 10,000 other people think the same way...hell yes.

Thailand has lost it's way and the people who are charged with leading the country to prosperity are clueless.

[Timwin]

It is all very simple, those who are able to live or work in Thailand long term by abiding the terms and conditions imposed by the Immigration and trade departments have no problems and will not have any prejudices displayed against them. For those who for one reason or another are unable to hack it here have the choices of moving on if they feel will be more appreciated elsewhere as in your case and there are better opportunities for small company operators in other countries.

You law&order guys are funny, assuming Thailand is somehow a corruption free utopia. Always the same excuse to explain away any idiotic laws is the "if the farangs only had obeyed the laws and jumped as high they required us to do!".

It is just a comfy mental pillow to hide against the ugly reality. That farangs are less and less welcomed in Thailand.

Edited November 20, 2014 by Timwin

[quandow]

Just when I think their hubris has reached its limit, SURPRISE!!! The only up side I see is that it will tank their economy even further, keeping the girls all the more affordable and our foreign money all the more valuable. Sad logic on my part, I'm actually a little ashamed. Think I'll get a soapie to get over it.

[whybother]

So what if the Yingluck government is gone? That doesn't change the fact that these changes have been discussed for over 12 months well before this government, well before the coup, well before the protests and well before the amnesty mess started.

Again...

Where is your proof??

You are making the claim it is "fact" so the onus of proof rests squarely on your shoulders.

The mere rumor of these restrictions is enough for the Japanese envoy to speak out, the British ambassador to write a blog post, BP to write front page articles for the past 2 weeks ago... surely if Yingluck had been discussing these changes The Nation and others would have been all over it. So find one person, one link other than "whybother" who can confirm your 'facts'. I'll be waiting....

It's getting even beyond red or yellow with you. fanaticism.

____________

Get your head out the sand and read my previous reply to you.

[Thai at Heart]

It is all very simple, those who are able to live or work in Thailand long term by abiding the terms and conditions imposed by the Immigration and trade departments have no problems and will not have any prejudices displayed against them. For those who for one reason or another are unable to hack it here have the choices of moving on if they feel will be more appreciated elsewhere as in your case and there are better opportunities for small company operators in other countries.

You law&order guys are funny, assuming Thailand is somehow a corruption free utopia. Always the same excuse to explain away any idiotic laws is the "if the farangs only had obeyed the laws and jumped as high they required us to do!".

It is just a comfy mental pillow to hide against the ugly reality. That farangs are less and less welcomed in Thailand.

Sadly, this is pretty much true when it comes to business. I mean just look, they are trying to attract Chinese money to build the railways. The spin offs in investment could be massive.

Why dissuade it in any way? This really is a case of all or nothing. Investment decisions will not likely be replaced by others coming later.

Change the law and oncr Thailand is off the map, its off the map.

[Beetlejuice]

Our move is already planned for the beginning of 2015.

A shame really, since we have a very fast growing and succesful IT-business here. But considering the racist-like and non-caring attitude, we have been facing from the authorities since the very beginning, it is simply not worth it. EVERYTHING is just too difficult and unsecure here. But worst is the racist-like attitude, which I am personally sick of it and which is the reason for our move.

We built a good business and created local jobs, but we are still treated like "shit" most of the times, we come in contact with the authorities. Just doing a work-permit takes more effort and requires more paper than used on a bloody 5-year rocket-scientist degree. This place is going down the drain and they have only themselves and their ignorance (stupidity) to blame for it. The article is a good example of their complete lack of international outlook and understanding of their own current situation.

Luckily, there are many countries nearby who are both grateful and happy, to welcome a company like ours. So not long until they can no longer see us as a problem anymore. "Thailand a developed country by 2025...." Good luck with that! They will for sure need it.

Wrong.

These moves have nothing to do with racist attitudes and non-caring attitudes by the authorities from the beginning. The authorities have been extremely lenient towards long stay foreigners and have turned a blind eye to most of their activities here in the past, but as I have said many times here on Thai visa, the blame falls squarely on those who have and continue to abuse the systems here, therefore having a knock on affect of creating the tightening up of the rules for everyone.

It is all very simple, those who are able to live or work in Thailand long term by abiding the terms and conditions imposed by the Immigration and trade departments have no problems and will not have any prejudices displayed against them. For those who for one reason or another are unable to hack it here have the choices of moving on if they feel will be more appreciated elsewhere as in your case and there are better opportunities for small company operators in other countries.

It would be a smart move on your part transferring your business operation abroad believing that the authorities there will give companies like yours an easier time, but I very much doubt that this would have any economical impact on Thailand at all and in any case, companies claiming to be highly successful in Thailand would somehow manage to get through the bureaucracy even if it mean`t hiring an adminstrative officer to do those tasks for them. But of course this depends on how successful these outfits really are and what are their prospects for the future?

Wow,did you read your post before you hit reply?

To start with, are you comparing overstayers and people who don't care about laws, to people who run a business, comply and abide by all the laws?

Can't hack it? What about those who want to live here, have invested money have a family and want to stay? Just get out you don't belong here?

And no economical impact, my business would lose at least 30 staff, flow on from that would double if we weren't in business, and Im only a medium to small business like millions of others.

But usual the advice, don't like it leave. Don't dare question or speak up, you have no rights here!

I suggest that you read my post again.

I am meaning the behind the scenes farang business owners using Thais to front their businesses, such as the farang discrete business owners working online, running farms without work permits, bars, massage parlours and you name it, they`re into it that the authorities are well aware of and this has brought down more tightening up of the rules and added restrictions.

Farangs that are share holders and running legitimate businesses in Thailand should have no problems and as I said; those who are unable to function here by working strictly by the rules may find easier and better opportunities in other countries or preferably their home countries where they will not be hindered by limitations and their activities not scrutinised by the authorities.

[whybother]

That's what you get from a puppet whose master orchestrated a change. Now the master elite are taking full advantage to shore up their interests.

Which puppet master? The one in charge more than 12 months ago when this was being discussed?

To be fair it was put forward by the 2006 economic team appointed by the Coup leaders. This followed a distratous showing with the slow flow of funds for the Government. The attempt to change the rules fell through.

So its been on the table even before 12 months ago.

But what you need to ask is why, Whybother?

Why does this Government need to put a protectionist policy in place, when the talk is about growing with the world community.

Now forigen banks have been waiting for an answer to opening up in Thailand since before the Coup? I believe that application was with the previous Government.

So what are they trying to do? Get more joint ventures with control of JV's by Thai's?

Why has this policy reared its head again?

Whybother, not sure if you are trying to stick up for someone, trying to prove some type of knowledge on the subject, or your not really sure? I see you have only been on this board since 2010, so I am not sure if your knowledge goes past this time by way of your comment?

My point is, as I said a number of times, this isn't something that this government has suddenly come up with.

As you point out this has been discussed for a number of years.

The previous government were also discussing it, to the extent that JFCCT committees were making submissions to the government and making press releases commenting on it. The changes the previous government were proposing was related to "foreign dominance", not just relating to the company itself but also to influence of major customers or suppliers.