Tail of missing AirAsia plane discovered in Java Sea

[webfact]

Tail of missing AirAsia plane discovered in Java Sea
ACHMAD IBRAHIM, Associated Press

Source: internet

PANGKALAN BUN, Indonesia (AP) — Divers and an unmanned underwater vehicle spotted the tail of the missing AirAsia plane in the Java Sea on Wednesday, the first confirmed sighting of any major wreckage 11 days after Flight 8501 disappeared with 162 people on board, an official said.

Powerful currents and murky water continue to hinder the operation, but searchers managed to get a photograph of the debris after it was detected by an Indonesian survey ship, National Search and Rescue chief Henry Bambang Soelistyo told reporters. One released image appears to show an upside down "A'' painted on a piece of metal.

The find is particularly important because the all-important cockpit voice and flight data recorders, or black boxes, are located in the aircraft's tail. Smaller pieces of the plane, such as seats and an emergency door, had previously been collected from the surface.

"Today we successfully discovered the part of the plane that became the main aim since yesterday," Soelistyo said. "I can ensure that this is part of the tail with the AirAsia mark on it."

He stressed the top priority remains recovering more bodies along with the black boxes. So far, 40 corpses have been found, including an additional one announced Wednesday, but time is running out.

At two weeks, most corpses will sink, said Anton Castilani, head of the country's disaster identification victim unit, and there are already signs of serious decomposition. Officials are hopeful many of the more than 120 bodies still unaccounted for will be found entombed in the fuselage.

The Airbus A320 went down Dec. 28, halfway through a two-hour flight between Indonesia's second-largest city of Surabaya and Singapore, killing everyone on board. It is not clear what caused the crash, but bad weather is believed to be a contributing factor.

Just before losing contact, the pilot told air traffic control he was approaching threatening clouds, but was denied permission to climb to a higher altitude because of heavy air traffic. No distress signal was issued.

Finding the black boxes will be key to the investigation. They provide essential information including the plane's vertical and horizontal speeds along with engine temperature and final conversations between the captain and co-pilot. The ping-emitting beacons still have about 20 days before their batteries go dead, but high surf had prevented the deployment of ships that drag "ping" locators.

Sonar-equipped ships involved in the massive international hunt have also identified what they believe to be the fuselage of the plane. Several other big chunks have been found though no visual confirmation has been received yet.

The search area for bodies and debris was expanded this week to allow for the strong currents that have been pushing debris around, said Indonesian search and rescue operation coordinator Tatang Zainudin.

In addition to heavy rain and wind, the monsoon weather has turned the Java Sea into a slush bowl.

But in some ways, it is one of the best places to look for a missing plane, especially when compared to the extreme depths of the Indian Ocean where searchers continue to hunt for Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, which disappeared last March with 239 people aboard.

The water at the Indonesia site is shallow, but this is the worst time of the year for a recovery operation to take place due to seasonal rains that have created choppy seas and blinding mud and silt from river runoff.

"Because the Java Sea is such an enclosed basin, and there's not really big currents passing through it, everything just stays there for quite a while and the waves make it so that the sediment doesn't slowly just sink to the bottom," said Erik van Sebille, an oceanographer at the University of New South Wales in Sydney, Australia. "It continuously keeps churning it up."

He said the conditions also make it particularly dangerous for divers because the water is dark and murky, making it easy for them to cut themselves on jagged wreckage or even become snared and trapped. During the dry season, he added, it would likely be easy to see the plane underwater from the sky.


-- (c) Associated Press 2015-01-07

[krisb]

Ok well at least they have the black box now, that's what we all wanna hear.

Never knew the box was located back there, but I suppose it would be the least impacted part of the plane.

[Tywais]

Ok well at least they have the black box now, that's what we all wanna hear.

Never knew the box was located back there, but I suppose it would be the least impacted part of the plane.

[dcutman]

I find it odd there is never mention of these boxes sending out locating signals. Surely if they found the tail section the black boxes would sending out a strong signal.

[tartempion]

Ok well at least they have the black box now, that's what we all wanna hear.

Never knew the box was located back there, but I suppose it would be the least impacted part of the plane.

Who said they found the (orange) black box?

[Pomthai]

Regards the FDR and CVR, are these devices placed in the tail to minimize the risk of destruction based on a nose first impact? Just wondered, since they are recording what goes on in the cockpit and couldn't be further from it. Curious as to the reasoning since a lot more engineering, cabling and interfacing over a relatively long distance is needed I'd have though, where as the avionics and apparently the flight data acquisition unit are up forward.

[Gulfsailor]

Regards the FDR and CVR, are these devices placed in the tail to minimize the risk of destruction based on a nose first impact? Just wondered, since they are recording what goes on in the cockpit and couldn't be further from it. Curious as to the reasoning since a lot more engineering, cabling and interfacing over a relatively long distance is needed I'd have though, where as the avionics and apparently the flight data acquisition unit are up forward.

It must be because most crashes go nose first and tail is least damaged and surely gets a lot less G's upon impact. Thinking about that, they should fit the cockpit back there as well! All avionics, recorders and even the pilots in one safe place. You could then even fit the tail with a parachute. If things get really bad, separate the tail and let it go down on the chute. As a passenger sitting up front I don't think I would fly them though...

[DonTanSmokehouse]

Regards the FDR and CVR, are these devices placed in the tail to minimize the risk of destruction based on a nose first impact? Just wondered, since they are recording what goes on in the cockpit and couldn't be further from it. Curious as to the reasoning since a lot more engineering, cabling and interfacing over a relatively long distance is needed I'd have though, where as the avionics and apparently the flight data acquisition unit are up forward.

What about there are more blackboxes than 1on several locations

[Coaster11]

Yep,they rarely back into mountains etc

[canman]

Regards the FDR and CVR, are these devices placed in the tail to minimize the risk of destruction based on a nose first impact? Just wondered, since they are recording what goes on in the cockpit and couldn't be further from it. Curious as to the reasoning since a lot more engineering, cabling and interfacing over a relatively long distance is needed I'd have though, where as the avionics and apparently the flight data acquisition unit are up forward.

No really. Have a look at post 3, the data acquisiton unit is forward, all that is need is a com link and power to the box.

[flyingspike]

The G forces at the back where the CVR and FDRs are located would be the same unless it breaks off and gets slowed down by aerodynamic drag. Occasionally the "pingers" break despite being designed not to. It surprises me that there isn't a similar aircraft electronic locator beacon to those on boats that dislodge and activate in a capsize.

[sprq]

Missing? it hasn't been missing for many days. "Crashed airliner" would be a more sensible phrase.

[canman]

I find it odd there is never mention of these boxes sending out locating signals. Surely if they found the tail section the black boxes would sending out a strong signal.

Have a look at post 3. The pics of the recorders show a small cylinder with supports at each end, this is a water activated pinger. With quite simple equipment you can located the signal from the pinger.

[Loles]

Very good job and the weather is still rough there.

[krisb]

Ok well at least they have the black box now, that's what we all wanna hear.

Never knew the box was located back there, but I suppose it would be the least impacted part of the plane.

Who said they found the (orange) black box?

Thats what the article is leading us to believe.

I think from finding the piece of the aircraft that contains it, its only a matter of a couple days till its officialy announced.

[jakhoeblal]

Sometimes I wonder in which century we live...

Why are we always looking for a stupid Black Box (FDR & CVR) when an airplane got into some problem.

These FDR and CVR is technology of 1940's. Some of them are even based on a tape recorder!!

But yes, they are 'waterproof' and can resist a heat of 1000 Celcius. But what the heck, if we can stream in real time all data to the ground?

Currently we can and use live streaming of voice and video using TCP/IP (Internet). So, when we stream data (voice and video) in real time to a server somewhere on the ground, we are able to know exactly, what is happening in an airplane and what has happened when the airplane is gone / lost.

We deliver this kind of technology for an Air Force (cannot mention which country at this time...). Our technology makes Aircraft tracking and tracing possible in real time together with streaming of real time data to servers on the ground. Interested? Check www.sme-erp-it-consulting.com

[rebelplatoon]

Maybe some clarity now in this, one of so many, crashes of the last year.

[dcutman]

I find it odd there is never mention of these boxes sending out locating signals. Surely if they found the tail section the black boxes would sending out a strong signal.

Have a look at post 3. The pics of the recorders show a small cylinder with supports at each end, this is a water activated pinger. With quite simple equipment you can located the signal from the pinger.

I understand how how they work. My point was, all the articles about this crash and said having located the plane, but there never a mention of locating or identifying the plane by its emergency locator transmitter. Is this thing not pinging away at the crash location? As far as I am aware they found this wreckage using sonar.

Edited January 7, 2015 by dcutman

[bra]

It depends what they mean by "tail". The tail of an aircraft consists of 2 major components - a vertical fin (which also contains the rudder) and the horizontal stabiliser or tail plane ( looks like a small wing) which contains the elevators (deflect the airflow which in turn raises or lowers the nose of the aircraft). The leading edge of the tail plane can also be moved to assist in trimming the aircraft.

Its hard to tell in the photos but it looks like the fin has been found (that's where the "A" is painted). The "black boxes" are not located there but where the tail joins the fuselage - see the diagram in a previous post. This location is subject to less impact forces than in the nose (for example) although damage can occur depending on the nature of the impact. Yes they do have transmitters to assist in their location, but these wont work if the boxes are deep in the mud.

Obviously the boxes have be located to determine what happened to the aircraft. I hope this happens soon, however the environment for the divers is bad, with almost no visibility and the potential for injury and entrapment. I salute their courage.

[siam2007]

after many days I am still shocked about the crash as I found out I have been on board of this specific aircraft two times in the past, on CGK-BKK / DMK-CGK flights respectively...... may those poor unfortunate souls all rest in peace

[ALLSEEINGEYE]

Ok well at least they have the black box now, that's what we all wanna hear.

Never knew the box was located back there, but I suppose it would be the least impacted part of the plane.

Yes you don't hear about too many planes backing into a mountain.

[ALLSEEINGEYE]

Sometimes I wonder in which century we live...

Why are we always looking for a stupid Black Box (FDR & CVR) when an airplane got into some problem.

These FDR and CVR is technology of 1940's. Some of them are even based on a tape recorder!!

But yes, they are 'waterproof' and can resist a heat of 1000 Celcius. But what the heck, if we can stream in real time all data to the ground?

Currently we can and use live streaming of voice and video using TCP/IP (Internet). So, when we stream data (voice and video) in real time to a server somewhere on the ground, we are able to know exactly, what is happening in an airplane and what has happened when the airplane is gone / lost.

We deliver this kind of technology for an Air Force (cannot mention which country at this time...). Our technology makes Aircraft tracking and tracing possible in real time together with streaming of real time data to servers on the ground. Interested? Check www.sme-erp-it-consulting.com

Why not stream it to the cloud? The plane is already so close to them.

[Pomthai]

^^ This. Cloud service is the obious answer.

[MaxYakov]

Regards the FDR and CVR, are these devices placed in the tail to minimize the risk of destruction based on a nose first impact? Just wondered, since they are recording what goes on in the cockpit and couldn't be further from it. Curious as to the reasoning since a lot more engineering, cabling and interfacing over a relatively long distance is needed I'd have though, where as the avionics and apparently the flight data acquisition unit are up forward.

Google is your friend: Flight Recorder - Wiki. The miracles of electricity and "hookup wire" (pardon the expression) allow them to place the recorders anywhere within the aircraft. I'm mystified that people still call them "black boxes", political correctness and all. I guess the referenced color is all-too-often symbolic of the occasion.

Edited January 7, 2015 by MaxYakov

[DekDaeng]

Sometimes I wonder in which century we live...!!!

But what the heck, if we can stream in real time all data to the ground?

But just yesterday they announced that all planes must call mummy every 15 minutes. This is so they will know exactly where the planes are at all times !!!! ;-((((

Well, exactly, within ¼ x 1,000 km/hr = 250 km radius - ;-(

I wonder why they bother?

[BobTH]

Ok well at least they have the black box now, that's what we all wanna hear.

Never knew the box was located back there, but I suppose it would be the least impacted part of the plane.

I agree that it is good that they found it but I can guarantee that if I were a pilot the tail would be the first to hit on impact, save my ass first.

[Soutpeel]

Sometimes I wonder in which century we live...

Why are we always looking for a stupid Black Box (FDR & CVR) when an airplane got into some problem.

These FDR and CVR is technology of 1940's. Some of them are even based on a tape recorder!!

But yes, they are 'waterproof' and can resist a heat of 1000 Celcius. But what the heck, if we can stream in real time all data to the ground?

Currently we can and use live streaming of voice and video using TCP/IP (Internet). So, when we stream data (voice and video) in real time to a server somewhere on the ground, we are able to know exactly, what is happening in an airplane and what has happened when the airplane is gone / lost.

We deliver this kind of technology for an Air Force (cannot mention which country at this time...). Our technology makes Aircraft tracking and tracing possible in real time together with streaming of real time data to servers on the ground. Interested? Check www.sme-erp-it-consulting.com

Its all to do with cost, the US has massive military budgets, no need for cloak and dagger stuff, dear boy, and the technology has been around for a while so hardly James bond stuff

The only way this will happen commercially is when the various DCA's in countries start masking this technology mandatory on aircraft

[Basil B]

Sometimes I wonder in which century we live...

Why are we always looking for a stupid Black Box (FDR & CVR) when an airplane got into some problem.

These FDR and CVR is technology of 1940's. Some of them are even based on a tape recorder!!

But yes, they are 'waterproof' and can resist a heat of 1000 Celcius. But what the heck, if we can stream in real time all data to the ground?

Currently we can and use live streaming of voice and video using TCP/IP (Internet). So, when we stream data (voice and video) in real time to a server somewhere on the ground, we are able to know exactly, what is happening in an airplane and what has happened when the airplane is gone / lost.

We deliver this kind of technology for an Air Force (cannot mention which country at this time...). Our technology makes Aircraft tracking and tracing possible in real time together with streaming of real time data to servers on the ground. Interested? Check www.sme-erp-it-consulting.com

Why not stream it to the cloud? The plane is already so close to them.

I think your quote makes as much seance as the one you are quoting...

We are a long way from streaming continuous high speed data from jet aeroplanes from anywhere in the world, reliably.

Edited January 7, 2015 by Basil B

[BudRight]

What a sad tail.

[F4UCorsair]

No mention of other major components, fuselage and wings, so if the tail section is remote from them, it indicates an in flight breakup.

The FDR & CVR are located in the top section of the fuselage where the fin is fixed, so finding just the fin doesn't mean those components have been found. It's likely, however, that the entire tail section was wrenched off forward of the fin, in which case they may be in the located wreckage.

Edited January 7, 2015 by F4UCorsair