Strict 3-Year Limit for Thai Language Study on ED Visa?

[foxontherun]

I've been living in Chiang Mai for nearly 4 years, studying the Thai language on a Non-ED visa the entire time. I am a legit student (part-time), have always attended school, and can read, write, and speak the language, but am very far from fluent. I wish to remain in the country and continue my studies, but there apparently a new limit in place, whereby one will not be granted another Non-ED visa for Thai language studies after 3 years of study. Prior to the spate of new regulations, my school advertised visas for up to 10 years of study.

This was confirmed for me yesterday, when I want to Chiang Mai Immigration for my final 3-month visa extension on my latest Non-ED visa (issued in Vientiane last May, so I planned on leaving the country this May to obtain a new Non-ED visa). The officer didn't say anything specific to me, and gave me the extension, but when I went to my school afterward, the teachers looked at my passport and said that a note had been made in it that this was my last Non-ED visa. Until then, I hadn't known that the 3-year limit rumors I'd been hearing were official and universal (meaning I'd only heard that Vientiane would no longer issue visas for over 3 years of study).

Does anyone have any general information on this issue, or any advice for me? I'm trying to figure out my options. I believe it's theoretically possible to get another 3 years on a Non-ED visa, if I study something other than the Thai language. True? If so, does anyone know of options in Chiang Mai other than Muay Thai training? Another language could be doable, but I don't know of any school in Chiang Mai offering a visa for study of any language other than Thai. Plus, it seems crazy that I can't keep studying that language of the country in which I'm living, but could study another one for which I have no real use. I'm too young for a retirement visa, and don't plan on working, starting a business, or getting married here. I would volunteer somewhere, but getting a visa based on that seems shaky. The Thailand Elite Card 5-year visa could be a last-ditch option, but I'm incredibly wary of it, and it's a very pricey way to go.

[ubonjoe]

I have heard of a 5 year limit on studying Thai but never a 10 year one.

I don't think it would be immigration that sets the maximum you can study one language. The Ministry of Education would be the ones to do that. But since they have raised the number of hours needed to get approval it could be the that you would reach the maximum sooner.

I have never heard of Vientiane setting any rule for a maximum number of non-ed visas.

It could be the note immigration did was meant to say you cannot get another extension of your current ED visa entry because of the new rules limits study to one year now.

[Kitsune]

He's speaking of the official duration of the course

You have several options:

- change school

- change language/subject

- go tourist visa for a while then back as a new student

- change passport

Edited February 18, 2015 by Kitsune

[foxontherun]

I have heard of a 5 year limit on studying Thai but never a 10 year one.

I don't think it would be immigration that sets the maximum you can study one language. The Ministry of Education would be the ones to do that. But since they have raised the number of hours needed to get approval it could be the that you would reach the maximum sooner.

I have never heard of Vientiane setting any rule for a maximum number of non-ed visas.

It could be the note immigration did was meant to say you cannot get another extension of your current ED visa entry because of the new rules limits study to one year now.

It was my school that told me about the 3-year limit in Vientiane. A fairly new development, I think.

He's speaking of the official duration of the course

You have several options:

- change school

- change language/subject

- go tourist visa for a while then back as a new student

- change passport

I will talk to another school, and see whether they think they can do anything for me. I can't seem to find any visa options for studying another language in Chiang Mai. Could I get a tourist visa directly after living here for 4 years on an ED visa? I'm pretty clearly not a tourist, and I thought they had gotten stricter about such things. Finally, could a new passport solve the problem? If any official asks me how long I've been studying here already, I'll have to be honest about it.

Edited February 18, 2015 by foxontherun

[Kitsune]

They limited the length of Thai course to even 18 months now.

You're supposed to be fully proficient in Thai within that time,which is hilarious given that Thai learn English all their life and can hardly string a sentence.

[Kitsune]

I have heard of a 5 year limit on studying Thai but never a 10 year one.

I don't think it would be immigration that sets the maximum you can study one language. The Ministry of Education would be the ones to do that. But since they have raised the number of hours needed to get approval it could be the that you would reach the maximum sooner.

I have never heard of Vientiane setting any rule for a maximum number of non-ed visas.

It could be the note immigration did was meant to say you cannot get another extension of your current ED visa entry because of the new rules limits study to one year now.

It was my school that told me about the 3-year limit in Vientiane. A fairly new development, I think.

He's speaking of the official duration of the course

You have several options:

- change school

- change language/subject

- go tourist visa for a while then back as a new student

- change passport

I will talk to another school, and see whether they think they can do anything for me. I can't seem to find any visa options for studying another language in Chiang Mai. Could I get a tourist visa directly after living here for 4 years on an ED visa? I'm pretty clearly not a tourist, and I thought they had gotten stricter about such things. Finally, could a new passport solve the problem? If any official asks me how long I've been studying here already, I'll have to be honest about it.

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

[foxontherun]

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

I completely agree with you, and would only do that if another ED visa were not an option. Thanks for all of the helpful replies.

[ubonjoe]

He's speaking of the official duration of the course

You have several options:

- change school

- change language/subject

- go tourist visa for a while then back as a new student

- change passport

How do you know what the stamp said.

The school "said that a note had been made in it that this was my last Non-ED visa." It could well mean last extension.

[ubonjoe]

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

How do you think they could "crack down" on tourist visas without effecting tourists coming here on regular holidays.

It is not going to happen.

[pacificsea]

I hope not I'm enrolled full time student at KBU

4 year degree program

[Stjohnm]

I used an excellent visa agent when I lived in LOS, He always advocated changing your passport,& do it in your country of citizenship if possible especially if your old one had a few TR visas in it. After many discussions with him & the Staff or the RTE in London & Singapore the ultimate rule is to change your visa type or stay out of the country for 3 months. If he's still in Business then you'll find his office in the PB Tower, soi Pridi 71 ask for Khun Philip

[bbi1]

I hope not I'm enrolled full time student at KBU

4 year degree program

Maybe they will give you your degree in 3 years of study! Lucky you lol

[ubonjoe]

I hope not I'm enrolled full time student at KBU

4 year degree program

No problem for you. You still get one year extension because it is in formal school category.

The discussion is about language schools that are non formal schools.

[bbi1]

He's speaking of the official duration of the course

You have several options:

- change school

- change language/subject

- go tourist visa for a while then back as a new student

- change passport

So you could do 3 years Thai ED visa, one double entry tourist, then 3 years Thai ED visa, etc. on a continuous cycle for 20-25 years until you're old enough for a retirement visa?

[AnotherOneAmerican]

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

How do you think they could "crack down" on tourist visas without effecting tourists coming here on regular holidays.

It is not going to happen.

Limit entry to 4 weeks in any 1 year would seem the obvious route.

[ubonjoe]

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

How do you think they could "crack down" on tourist visas without effecting tourists coming here on regular holidays.

It is not going to happen.

Limit entry to 4 weeks in any 1 year would seem the obvious route.

So you would propose that a tourist visa entry that is now 60 days be reduced to 4 weeks and one of them a year is allowed. And you do not think that would reduce tourism.

Or are you confusing visa exempt entries with a tourist visa. Even a 4 week restriction on those would effect tourism.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

How do you think they could "crack down" on tourist visas without effecting tourists coming here on regular holidays.

It is not going to happen.

Limit entry to 4 weeks in any 1 year would seem the obvious route.

So you would propose that a tourist visa entry that is now 60 days be reduced to 4 weeks and one of them a year is allowed. And you do not think that would reduce tourism.

Or are you confusing visa exempt entries with a tourist visa. Even a 4 week restriction on those would effect tourism.

Legit tourists don't have long holidays in Thailand.

[paz]

Legit tourists don't have long holidays in Thailand.

No? Because you said so ?

Or it is like when you claimed that legit married couples always have children ?

[ubonjoe]

Limit entry to 4 weeks in any 1 year would seem the obvious route.

So you would propose that a tourist visa entry that is now 60 days be reduced to 4 weeks and one of them a year is allowed. And you do not think that would reduce tourism.

Or are you confusing visa exempt entries with a tourist visa. Even a 4 week restriction on those would effect tourism.

Legit tourists don't have long holidays in Thailand.

I think that you might well be surprised how many tourist are able to have long holidays. Some people get 6 weeks of vacation a year.

What about the well to do. Retirees with money to spend and spend the cold month here, Etc, Etc, and Etc.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Limit entry to 4 weeks in any 1 year would seem the obvious route.

So you would propose that a tourist visa entry that is now 60 days be reduced to 4 weeks and one of them a year is allowed. And you do not think that would reduce tourism.

Or are you confusing visa exempt entries with a tourist visa. Even a 4 week restriction on those would effect tourism.

Legit tourists don't have long holidays in Thailand.

I think that you might well be surprised how many tourist are able to have long holidays. Some people get 6 weeks of vacation a year.

What about the well to do. Retirees with money to spend and spend the cold month here, Etc, Etc, and Etc.

Exactly what I said, those retirees aren't really tourists, etc., etc.

[bbi1]

Exactly what I said, those retirees aren't really tourists, etc., etc.

So we shouldn't have retirees in Thailand then?

[itsuptome]

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

How do you think they could "crack down" on tourist visas without effecting tourists coming here on regular holidays.

It is not going to happen.

Perhaps they might limit the issuance of back-to-back double entry tourist visas from Vientiane, since this seems to be where they're easiest to get.

Or they might start scrutinizing repeat tourist visa history more carefully at all embassies/consulates in the region. Thailand is unusual in the way that each consulate seems to ignore the applicant's visa history when the visas came from a different consulate.

In both cases tourists on "regular holidays" would not be impacted much, as they can usually get a double or triple entry in their home country quite easily, but the impact on people staying in Thailand long-term would be significant.

I don't have any information that any of this is going to happen, but we probably have a few more years of the junta's law and order campaign ahead of us, and if the government's view is that tourist visas are inappropriate for a long-term stay, it's reasonable to speculate that they might get around to this issue at some point.

[itsuptome]

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

How do you think they could "crack down" on tourist visas without effecting tourists coming here on regular holidays.

It is not going to happen.

Limit entry to 4 weeks in any 1 year would seem the obvious route.

Presumably with a comment like this you have no experience or familiarity with any immigration bureaucracy in the world.

Here's the actual "obvious route." A common approach many countries take is that you can spend up to 6 months a year in country on tourist/visitor visas, after that you're unlikely to get another one without a pretty high bar of proof regarding your holiday activities.

Different countries vary in exact implementation (6 months consecutive? per calendar year, or per 12 month period?) but all variants are pretty effective in encouraging tourism while discouraging long-term residents.

Only 4 weeks in a year is just silly, you meet tons of genuine tourists in Thailand who would be excluded by this. It's so weird how this forum (or maybe Thailand in general? because I see it elsewhere too) is a magnet for farang who adore draconian government actions that would make perfect sense in North Korea.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Only 4 weeks in a year is just silly, you meet tons of genuine tourists in Thailand who would be excluded by this. It's so weird how this forum (or maybe Thailand in general? because I see it elsewhere too) is a magnet for farang who adore draconian government actions that would make perfect sense in North Korea.

I'm not white, and I'm not a foreigner.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Exactly what I said, those retirees aren't really tourists, etc., etc.

So we shouldn't have retirees in Thailand then?

Not on tourist VISAs.

[itsuptome]

He's speaking of the official duration of the course

You have several options:

- change school

- change language/subject

- go tourist visa for a while then back as a new student

- change passport

So you could do 3 years Thai ED visa, one double entry tourist, then 3 years Thai ED visa, etc. on a continuous cycle for 20-25 years until you're old enough for a retirement visa?

Well, the practical answer is that in Thailand you can do pretty much whatever you want. If you wanted to study Thai for 20 years and change schools every 3 years, you might very well get away with it, right? You could do this with any mix of tourist and ED visas.

But in most countries the answer would be something like this: eventually an IO notices that your behavior doesn't really look like the behavior of a genuine student. How many people are unemployed students or tourists or both for 20 years? Unless your visa application contains substantial evidence which allays this suspicion, they refuse your application and until some sort of cooldown period has elapsed, you're unlikely to be granted another student or tourist visa.

The point is the IOs evaluating visa applications typically have considerable discretion over the outcome. Who knows if this will happen in Thailand but that's really how most of the world works.

IMO Thailand is undergoing a very obvious transition from "poor country" visa policies (think Cambodia) to "rich country" policies (think whatever country you come from, or even most of the middle income countries). How far that will go and how long it will take is anyone's guess, and will probably be roughly correlated to how much richer Thailand gets.

[paz]

Not on tourist VISAs.

Again.. your opinion only. fortunately has 0% relevance.

[wowfactor10]

I been hearing the same things,

Due too all the hassle and restrictions plenty of farang students have stopped with their ED visa courses..

This type of visa is not so popular nowadays as it was 5 years ago...

If Thailand likes to get more tourists and long staying tourists under 50 years of age then its good idea to offer them an easy product such as year visa without border runs and or without a forced language study..

Without it it will chase out farangs who spend their money in Thailand monthly.They will go back home country or select another country with friendlier visa procedures

[ColdSingha]

lots of people are dropping ED visa for tourist now.

Personally I would not. Tourist visa is the only one they have not crackdown upon yet, and it could be coming soon, right when everyone is turning away from EdVisa and reverting to tourist

How do you think they could "crack down" on tourist visas without effecting tourists coming here on regular holidays.

It is not going to happen.

Limit entry to 4 weeks in any 1 year would seem the obvious route.

So you would propose that a tourist visa entry that is now 60 days be reduced to 4 weeks and one of them a year is allowed. And you do not think that would reduce tourism.

Or are you confusing visa exempt entries with a tourist visa. Even a 4 week restriction on those would effect tourism.

Legit tourists don't have long holidays in Thailand.

what do you class the half/halfers* as then?

*work in home country for the summer (builders/traders/self employed/etc) and relax on the beach for the winter. i've met loads of these folks on my travels

[2fishin2]

If you are going to school part time then you shouldnt get a education visa. Those visas should be reserved for serious students. People get engineering, law and many other degrees in 4 years. Education is just that learning. Part time students, not learning. And learning languages on a part time basis just so you can remain in a country is lame.