Netanyahu win dashes prospect for a thaw with Obama

[Linky]

What does it matter if there is an agreement that the U.S. reneges on. There are other countries making the agreement too. So if the U.S. drops it the other countries can continue.

I'm glad there are sensible posters here such as Dexterm to add some sanity.

[Chicog]

It seems that is Obama's goal. lifting the sanctions.

Dexterm. Do you seriously not know the difference between an agreement and a framework? your statement of a deal this week is a flat out bald faced lie and proves that you really don't have a clue of what you're talking about.

What statement is a "flat out bold faced lie" exactly (wow, that's a lot stronger than a simple lie, huh?).

The one in which he said "may"?

As it stands, the only lie in this post is yours.

[thaibeachlovers]

Again, Netanyahu has shown the world his true colours. Being both openly racist and against peace in the Middle East with the words he has said that cannot be refuted. This man is guaranteed to cause more grief for the Israelis and more death for the Palestinians.

...but surely its what the Israeli people want not America!!!

The elections were democratic so what is the US complaining about, after all, democracy is all that counts and a democratically elected majority of Israeli citizens chose Neteyahu to lead the way and represent their wishes and interests!!

The US doesn't have too many friends now and it is losing it's grip somewhat!!

a democratically elected majority of Israeli citizens chose Neteyahu

It wasn't a majority of the population. As with all Israeli governments, the new government will be a coalition.

For probably the only reason I have to like Obama, this has to be it.

I often hear Americans say that Israel is America's best friend and ally but, while I know what America has done for Israel, I fail to understand what Israel has ever done for America except turn most Arabs against it.

Perhaps someone can tell me what Israel has done for the US.

[Scott]

Please stay on topic and refrain from making negative remarks directed at other posters.

[Ulysses G.]

Perhaps someone can tell me what Israel has done for the US.

Incredible Intelligence about the Middle East and a trustworthy ally in an important region with few of them. Lets not forget their incredible and unique contributions to science. The country has more engineers and scientists per capita than any other country in the world, and has more companies quoted on the high-tech NASDAQ stock exchange than any other country outside the United States - more than all of Europe, India, and China combined.

Israelis are at the forefront of medical research into heart transplants, strokes and Hepatitis C. In the last ten years Israeli scientists have won five Noble prizes in the sciences.

Now, lets ask the same question about the Palestinians that Netanyahu is supposed to negotiate with.

Edited March 29, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[Chicog]

Perhaps someone can tell me what Israel has done for the US.

Incredible Intelligence about the Middle East and a trustworthy ally in an important region with few of them. Lets not forget their incredible and unique contributions to science. The country has more engineers and scientists per capita than any other country in the world, and has more companies quoted on the high-tech NASDAQ stock exchange than any other country outside the United States - more than all of Europe, India, and China combined.

Israelis are at the forefront of medical research into heart transplants, strokes and Hepatitis C. In the last ten years Israeli scientists have won five Noble prizes in the sciences.

Now, lets ask the same question about the Palestinians that Netanyahu is supposed to negotiate with.

They're also really good at encryption/decryption, and are behind many of the world's leading firewalls and security products.

And also many of the rumours about the world's leading firewalls and security products having backdoors.

[chuckd]

Perhaps someone can tell me what Israel has done for the US.

Incredible Intelligence about the Middle East and a trustworthy ally in an important region with few of them. Lets not forget their incredible and unique contributions to science. The country has more engineers and scientists per capita than any other country in the world, and has more companies quoted on the high-tech NASDAQ stock exchange than any other country outside the United States - more than all of Europe, India, and China combined.

Israelis are at the forefront of medical research into heart transplants, strokes and Hepatitis C. In the last ten years Israeli scientists have won five Noble prizes in the sciences.

Now, lets ask the same question about the Palestinians that Netanyahu is supposed to negotiate with.

They're also really good at encryption/decryption, and are behind many of the world's leading firewalls and security products.

And also many of the rumours about the world's leading firewalls and security products having backdoors.

The question was about the Palestinian's contributions to the US.

Is it your contention that the Palestinians are "really good at encryption/decryption"?

​Rather strange response.

[Chicog]

Perhaps someone can tell me what Israel has done for the US.

Incredible Intelligence about the Middle East and a trustworthy ally in an important region with few of them. Lets not forget their incredible and unique contributions to science. The country has more engineers and scientists per capita than any other country in the world, and has more companies quoted on the high-tech NASDAQ stock exchange than any other country outside the United States - more than all of Europe, India, and China combined.

Israelis are at the forefront of medical research into heart transplants, strokes and Hepatitis C. In the last ten years Israeli scientists have won five Noble prizes in the sciences.

Now, lets ask the same question about the Palestinians that Netanyahu is supposed to negotiate with.

They're also really good at encryption/decryption, and are behind many of the world's leading firewalls and security products.

And also many of the rumours about the world's leading firewalls and security products having backdoors.

The question was about the Palestinian's contributions to the US.

Is it your contention that the Palestinians are "really good at encryption/decryption"?

​Rather strange response.

Chuck, can I suggest you go and look up the word "Also"?

[Jingthing]

The Palestinians have given us ... Pallywood!

[BKKBobby]

The Israelis have given us Hamas

"Our cables reveal that Israel supported Hamas in its infancy, that Hamas was used as an instrument to divide the Palestine Liberation Organization [PLO] and the Palestinian resistance," Assange told the paper.

http://rt.com/news/243445-assange-west-islamists-us/

Edited March 29, 2015 by BKKBobby

[willyumiii]

Again, Netanyahu has shown the world his true colours. Being both openly racist and against peace in the Middle East with the words he has said that cannot be refuted. This man is guaranteed to cause more grief for the Israelis and more death for the Palestinians.

...but surely its what the Israeli people want not America!!!

The elections were democratic so what is the US complaining about, after all, democracy is all that counts and a democratically elected majority of Israeli citizens chose Neteyahu to lead the way and represent their wishes and interests!!

The US doesn't have too many friends now and it is losing it's grip somewhat!!

a democratically elected majority of Israeli citizens chose Neteyahu

It wasn't a majority of the population. As with all Israeli governments, the new government will be a coalition.

For probably the only reason I have to like Obama, this has to be it.

I often hear Americans say that Israel is America's best friend and ally but, while I know what America has done for Israel, I fail to understand what Israel has ever done for America except turn most Arabs against it.

Perhaps someone can tell me what Israel has done for the US.

I am American and do not think Israel is a best friend at all.

Like many Americans I think they are a dangerous, parasitic, burden that puts world peace in great jeopardy.

Don't judge all Americans by what our government does or what you hear on the US corporate news programs.

Very big money in the US influences the government's policy on Israel.

Most Americans are not that "big money".

We just reluctantly pay the taxes and supply the young men to serve in the military.

[Jingthing]

Again, Netanyahu has shown the world his true colours. Being both openly racist and against peace in the Middle East with the words he has said that cannot be refuted. This man is guaranteed to cause more grief for the Israelis and more death for the Palestinians.

...but surely its what the Israeli people want not America!!!

The elections were democratic so what is the US complaining about, after all, democracy is all that counts and a democratically elected majority of Israeli citizens chose Neteyahu to lead the way and represent their wishes and interests!!

The US doesn't have too many friends now and it is losing it's grip somewhat!!

a democratically elected majority of Israeli citizens chose Neteyahu

It wasn't a majority of the population. As with all Israeli governments, the new government will be a coalition.

For probably the only reason I have to like Obama, this has to be it.

I often hear Americans say that Israel is America's best friend and ally but, while I know what America has done for Israel, I fail to understand what Israel has ever done for America except turn most Arabs against it.

Perhaps someone can tell me what Israel has done for the US.

I am American and do not think Israel is a best friend at all.

Like many Americans I think they are a dangerous, parasitic, burden that puts world peace in great jeopardy.

Don't judge all Americans by what our government does or what you hear on the US corporate news programs.

Very big money in the US influences the government's policy on Israel.

Most Americans are not that "big money".

We just reluctantly pay the taxes and supply the young men to serve in the military.

So let's throw Israel under the bus and threats to world peace from radical Islam, India Pakistan conflict, expansionist dictator Putin, rise of China etc. will magically melt away. Of course your characterization of Israel is inflammatory but you have a right to your POV. Write your congresswoman.

To add actually US polling consistently shows strong support for Israel especially compared to the Palestinians. You can blame big money lobbies on that but it isn't logical. Nobody is forcing people to express those opinions.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Edited March 29, 2015 by Jingthing

[chuckd]

The Israelis have given us Hamas

"Our cables reveal that Israel supported Hamas in its infancy, that Hamas was used as an instrument to divide the Palestine Liberation Organization [PLO] and the Palestinian resistance," Assange told the paper.

http://rt.com/news/243445-assange-west-islamists-us/

Well, it isn't Mother Jones but it is Russia Today.

[BKKBobby]

The Israelis have given us Hamas

"Our cables reveal that Israel supported Hamas in its infancy, that Hamas was used as an instrument to divide the Palestine Liberation Organization [PLO] and the Palestinian resistance," Assange told the paper.

http://rt.com/news/243445-assange-west-islamists-us/

Well, it isn't Mother Jones but it is Russia Today.

Well the quote I cited in the post you replied to is originally from an Argentinian paper and its Julian Assanges words. Hes being punished for being able to find and publish truth. The Swedish intelligence service in cooperation with outside intelligence service(s) made the honey trap that made him seek refuge in a embassy. Now no one cares about what he says because of bogus accusations of sexual abuse. His words have been marginalised, not because of lack of credibility but because hes accused of a sexual crime.

Having "a Hamas" falls into the hands of someone that wants to pursue policies and actions like the reelected Netanyahu.

"Israel helped Hamas, its “worst enemy” in order to divide Palestinians, and so that it can say “but mum, they launched ANOTHER rocket over to our side of the fence. It blew up my favorite patch of dirt. Can I go over there and slaughter all of them now?” and “I killed the women and children in the UN buildings. But MUM, it was self-defense! Stop judging meeeee!” as the world condemns their actions verbally and proceeds to do….. Absolutely nothing about it. Whatever happened to all that promised aid?"

The quote above is an anonymous analysis of Julian Assanges information.

http://anonhq.com/assange-reveals-west-behind-isis-ukraine-crisis-israel-behind-hamas/

Edited March 29, 2015 by BKKBobby

[chuckd]

The Israelis have given us Hamas

"Our cables reveal that Israel supported Hamas in its infancy, that Hamas was used as an instrument to divide the Palestine Liberation Organization [PLO] and the Palestinian resistance," Assange told the paper.

http://rt.com/news/243445-assange-west-islamists-us/

Well, it isn't Mother Jones but it is Russia Today.

Well the quote I cited in the post you replied to is originally from an Argentinian paper and its Julian Assanges words. Hes being punished for being able to find and publish truth. The Swedish intelligence service in cooperation with outside intelligence service(s) made the honey trap that made him seek refuge in a embassy. Now no one cares about what he says because of bogus accusations of sexual abuse. His words have been marginalised, not because of lack of credibility but because hes accused of a sexual crime.

Having "a Hamas" falls into the hands of someone that wants to pursue policies and actions like the reelected Netanyahu.

"Israel helped Hamas, its “worst enemy” in order to divide Palestinians, and so that it can say “but mum, they launched ANOTHER rocket over to our side of the fence. It blew up my favorite patch of dirt. Can I go over there and slaughter all of them now?” and “I killed the women and children in the UN buildings. But MUM, it was self-defense! Stop judging meeeee!” as the world condemns their actions verbally and proceeds to do….. Absolutely nothing about it. Whatever happened to all that promised aid?"

The quote above is an anonymous analysis of Julian Assanges information.

http://anonhq.com/assange-reveals-west-behind-isis-ukraine-crisis-israel-behind-hamas/

My suggestion, Bobby.

When you find yourself in a hole, it is time to put your shovel down and stop digging.

Just trying to be helpful.

[BKKBobby]

The Israelis have given us Hamas

"Our cables reveal that Israel supported Hamas in its infancy, that Hamas was used as an instrument to divide the Palestine Liberation Organization [PLO] and the Palestinian resistance," Assange told the paper.

http://rt.com/news/243445-assange-west-islamists-us/

Well, it isn't Mother Jones but it is Russia Today.

Well the quote I cited in the post you replied to is originally from an Argentinian paper and its Julian Assanges words. Hes being punished for being able to find and publish truth. The Swedish intelligence service in cooperation with outside intelligence service(s) made the honey trap that made him seek refuge in a embassy. Now no one cares about what he says because of bogus accusations of sexual abuse. His words have been marginalised, not because of lack of credibility but because hes accused of a sexual crime.

Having "a Hamas" falls into the hands of someone that wants to pursue policies and actions like the reelected Netanyahu.

"Israel helped Hamas, its “worst enemy” in order to divide Palestinians, and so that it can say “but mum, they launched ANOTHER rocket over to our side of the fence. It blew up my favorite patch of dirt. Can I go over there and slaughter all of them now?” and “I killed the women and children in the UN buildings. But MUM, it was self-defense! Stop judging meeeee!” as the world condemns their actions verbally and proceeds to do….. Absolutely nothing about it. Whatever happened to all that promised aid?"

The quote above is an anonymous analysis of Julian Assanges information.

http://anonhq.com/assange-reveals-west-behind-isis-ukraine-crisis-israel-behind-hamas/

My suggestion, Bobby.

When you find yourself in a hole, it is time to put your shovel down and stop digging.

Just trying to be helpful.

Its Julian Assangea words quoted in RT.

Doesnt matter if it was published in RT or Sukhumvit Scene.

Removing focus from Julian Assanges words by focusing on where it was published?

Edited March 29, 2015 by BKKBobby

[ScarpoFongness4U]

It is about time the US had an administration that will stand up to the Israelis.

The US has given them unquestioning support since the land was given to them.

They have been free to commit any atrocities they please and with US support have gotten away with it.

Without US support, there would be no Israel.

Again..it's about time they were reeled in.g

Kudos to the Obama administration!

Sadly, your analysis is false

Support came begrudgingly after the 73 war

Facts matter

[ScarpoFongness4U]

The Israelis have given us Hamas

"Our cables reveal that Israel supported Hamas in its infancy, that Hamas was used as an instrument to divide the Palestine Liberation Organization [PLO] and the Palestinian resistance," Assange told the paper.

http://rt.com/news/243445-assange-west-islamists-us/

Well, it isn't Mother Jones but it is Russia Today.

Well the quote I cited in the post you replied to is originally from an Argentinian paper and its Julian Assanges words. Hes being punished for being able to find and publish truth. The Swedish intelligence service in cooperation with outside intelligence service(s) made the honey trap that made him seek refuge in a embassy. Now no one cares about what he says because of bogus accusations of sexual abuse. His words have been marginalised, not because of lack of credibility but because hes accused of a sexual crime.

Having "a Hamas" falls into the hands of someone that wants to pursue policies and actions like the reelected Netanyahu.

"Israel helped Hamas, its worst enemy in order to divide Palestinians, and so that it can say but mum, they launched ANOTHER rocket over to our side of the fence. It blew up my favorite patch of dirt. Can I go over there and slaughter all of them now? and I killed the women and children in the UN buildings. But MUM, it was self-defense! Stop judging meeeee! as the world condemns their actions verbally and proceeds to do.. Absolutely nothing about it. Whatever happened to all that promised aid?"

The quote above is an anonymous analysis of Julian Assanges information.

http://anonhq.com/assange-reveals-west-behind-isis-ukraine-crisis-israel-behind-hamas/

Hama's was not created by Israel but Ariel Sharon believed they would govern their people unlike the PLO so they were assisted in that

Sadly z they two faced the world and created a military wing

Too bad for the people of Gaza as they were given farms factories and greenhouses to feed their people and instead went aggressive against civilians

The re is not going to be two states for two people'

They will go back to Jordan and Egypt or they will be cannon fodder like the rest of their shaheed brethren in Hezbollah and Isis

[Scott]

An off-topic post has been removed. Please stay on topic.

[dexterm]

(thread full sorry)

SF4 wrote,

There is not going to be two states for two people'.They will go back to Jordan and Egypt

Problem is 2.5 million West Bank Palestinians don't have Jordanian passports, and their homes are on Israel's side of the Jordan River under Israeli occupation for almost 50 years.

So how do you and Netanyahu propose to make them disappear?

Europe was preoccupied recovering from World War II in 1948, when the first wave of Israeli ethnic cleansing took place. In 1967 many folks had hardly got their first color TV when the 2nd wave occurred.

But in 2015, if Facebook were a country with 1.35 billion users last year, it is just about to become the largest in the world.

The whole world is watching Israel this time, and they will not get away with ethnically cleansing Palestinians a 3rd time. Not without huge repercussions. Even Obama would not allow that and certainly the EU, Israel's biggest trading partner, would impose sanctions.That's not much of a business plan for Israel's future.

When austerity strikes, many Israelis do happen to have 2nd passports and will run for the exits for a better life elsewhere...can't blame them. End of Zionist dream not far away.

Why not just face reality? The colonialist game is up. If Israel wants to preserve its democracy and its Jewish character it must opt for a just peace agreement in a two state solution, supported by Obama administration and Europe.

Or it could focus on its exclusive Jewishness and sacrifice its democracy, becoming more isolated than ever internationally.

Edited March 30, 2015 by dexterm

[ScarpoFongness4U]

The whole world is watching what matters to them surely not Israel or anything taking place in the slums of Gaza or Hebron

With the advent of fox news, the PLO propaganda machine led by hanan ashwari and seek ekrat, died a fast fact filled death

Jordan is the Palestinian state.

Lastly,

The British were not so preoccupied after ww2 that their soldiers and high command were rounding up Palestine's Jewish freedom fighters and disarming them and hanging them publicly in attempt to weaken their resolve prior to the Arab armies planned invasion

The Jewish state will never forget the crimes of the British and

Those same British are the ones decrying the still standing Jewish state and the same state who kicked the British out.

Sorry Brits who are not Jew haters

[Ulysses G.]

It is about time the US had an administration that will stand up to the Israelis.

The US has given them unquestioning support since the land was given to them.

They have been free to commit any atrocities they please and with US support have gotten away with it.

Without US support, there would be no Israel.

Again..it's about time they were reeled in.g

Kudos to the Obama administration!

Sadly, your analysis is false

Support came begrudgingly after the 73 war

Facts matter

CORRECT. The American government did not give Israel a lot of help until they won the 67 war so convincingly on their own. After that, they were deigned worthy allies. Anyone who gives the USA much credit for the existence of Israel needs to go read a few history books for a change. The USSR was much more helpful in the beginning.

[dexterm]

SF4 wrote,

Jordan is the Palestinian state.

I am just curious as to the logistics of how Netanyahu is going to make that happen.

If 2.5 million Palestinians refuse to leave their homes that have been in their families for centuries, will they be herded into trucks to tent cities on the Jordanian border, to make room for Jewish immigrants from Milwaukee, Melbourne and Manchester?

I am sure Obama and even Hilary would not approve of that. World opinion and the EU certainly wouldn't.

Edited March 30, 2015 by dexterm

[ScarpoFongness4U]

SF4 wrote,

Jordan is the Palestinian state.

I am just curious as to the logistics of how Netanyahu is going to make that happen.

If 2.5 million Palestinians refuse to leave their homes that have been in their families for centuries, will they be herded into trucks to tent cities on the Jordanian border, to make room for Jewish immigrants from Milwaukee, Melbourne and Manchester?

I am sure Obama and even Hilary would not approve of that. World opinion and the EU certainly wouldn't.

You see, therein lies your problem

You can state all day long that there were a million displaced Palestinian people who lived there for centuries, but that is false, they did not live there for centuries,

The only steady claim to be made there is of the Jews And Bedouins

The gazans are Egypt formerly occupied by, surprise Egypt

And the ones in Judea are jordanian and Iraqi and Saudi who were living in the frontier

Do some homework before listing talking points without substance, you will then have an actual argument based on facts

Even Arafat wasn't born there

[Ulysses G.]

Most of the "Palestinians" emigrated to the area just about the time that most of the Jews from Europe did, but Jews were living there for 3,000 years non-stop.

[dexterm]

I disagree completely with your false narrative of the history of Palestine. We have been there many times before. I encourage members to read the truth at http://www.palestineremembered.com/

Let's be realistic. You certainly don't convince me with your fantasy history, so there is much less chance that 2.5 million Palestinians will be persuaded by your interpretation of history sufficiently enough to willingly step into a truck to a tent city on the Jordanian border. They know the truth.

No-one has answered the logistical part of this yet.

How do you or Netanyahu propose to make them move, or persuade Obama, the EU and world opinion to support Netanyahu in his 3rd wave of ethnic cleansing? The world won't tolerate it.

Edited March 30, 2015 by dexterm

[snarky66]

Their real name is "Philistines"

It's biblical.

[dexterm]

Their real name is "Philistines"

It's biblical.

Correct!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philistines

"According to Joshua 13:3 and 1 Samuel 6:17, the land of the Philistines (or Allophyloi), called Philistia, was a Pentapolis in south-western Levant comprised the five city-states of Gaza, Ashkelon, Ashdod, Ekron, and Gath, from Wadi Gaza in the south to the Yarqon River in the north, but with no fixed border to the east."

So Philistine (Palestine) extended from Gaza in the south to the Yargon River which is just north of Ben Gurion airport in Tel Aviv with no fixed border to the east.

A very useful reference. Thank you.

It's about time the Obama administration supported the Palestinians in their claim for their ancestral biblical lands.

Edited March 30, 2015 by dexterm

[ScarpoFongness4U]

There were no philistines in Gaza for the last 2800 years

The Romans named Israel Palestine, on their way to the trash heap of history just to be spiteful because the Jews defeated their entire legion, and they had to bring in another legion from Assyria

There are no Philistines and by the way, the Palestinians were what the British called the Jews that lived there before the 1947 partition.

The Arabs there were cakked, guess what, Arabs

[Ulysses G.]

I disagree completely with your false narrative of the history of Palestine.

Yes. We know that you claim that the main-stream history books are "false" and prefer to promote hateful websites with fabricated history. You have claimed many times that the Palestinians did not start Israel's War of Independence in 1948, but every reliable source says you are full of it. .

The Arab-Israeli War of 1948 broke out when five Arab nations invaded territory in the former Palestinian mandate immediately following the announcement of the independence of the state of Israel on May 14, 1948. https://history.state.gov/milestones/1945-1952/arab-israeli-war

Time for you to read a credible account in a format just perfect for you:

http://books.google.co.th/books?id=ft-BgQpMvmUC&pg=PA162&lpg=PA162&dq=Jamal+Husseini++told+the+Security+Council:+#v=onepage&q=Jamal%20Husseini%20%20told%20the%20Security%20Council%3A&f=false

Edited March 30, 2015 by Ulysses G.