Rich Abbot?

[LannaGuy]

I notice the death of the famous Abbot recently has more than $2m in 4 accounts. How can this be?

[IvanLaw]

Probably

.5 mil. In each or similar split

ie

2,000,000 divided by 4 = 500,000

[LannaGuy]

Probably

.5 mil. In each or similar split

ie

2,000,000 divided by 4 = 500,000

hmmmm but you get the point... not exactly 'Renunciation' is it?

[rockyysdt]

Does this help you justify your chosen direction?

Does the Abbots perceived conduct invalidate the 4 noble truths?

[LannaGuy]

Does this help you justify your chosen direction?

Does the Abbots perceived conduct invalidate the 4 noble truths?

are not Abbots an example to us?

do they not live up to scrutiny? as ambassadors for the Sangha?

[rockyysdt]

You miss the point LG.

Anyone can set themselves up to carry a flag.

What is more important is what you do with knowledge of this behavior.

Do you use it to justify your path, or do you see it for what it is?

In other words, would you feel put out if I went about misrepresenting you?

Did the Buddha authorise this Abbot to represent him and his teachings?

Edited June 14, 2015 by rockyysdt

[Pormax]

You think that is bad?

One elderly monk near our local village died recently and not only had over 7 million baht in his bank accounts but over 500,00B

was found in his sleeping quarters.

Not surprising though, when you see even the very poor families giving food and money on a regular basis to the temple which

I would guess amounts to not less than about 20% of their monthly income. This is supposedly to gain merit or bring luck.

Every few days there is a special 'Monk' or 'Temple' day or so my wife calls them, where the temple will receive hundreds of thousands of Baht.

My wife's brother aged 30, decided to become a monk some 6 months ago. He now has more money in the bank then he ever had before and

has more than most members of his family. Plus he now has the latest Galaxy phone and bought himself an expensive laptop!!

He does not however help out his very elderly parents!!

Bearing in mind in the ranking of the local temple he is the junior. How much does the Head Monk make?

[rockyysdt]

Does this mean he is practicing Buddhism or using his position to scam?

Everyone of us is attached to greed and is impure to varying degrees.

Even those stricken by poverty give for impure reasons.

They do it purely and only to receive good luck and a better next life, not because they are compassionate.

Their reasons for giving are selfish.

You could say being ripped off is their kharma (action results in the fruits of action).

Edited June 14, 2015 by rockyysdt

[inzman]

All religions are businesses to generate profit. People that give to such religions are fools, karma at its best. If a man truly has a need to be spiritual, it should be between himself and his God. No mortal man has special powers to be between them.

[rockyysdt]

All religions are businesses to generate profit. People that give to such religions are fools, karma at its best. If a man truly has a need to be spiritual, it should be between himself and his God. No mortal man has special powers to be between them.

This is the biggest problem with Buddhism.

Most have zero understanding of what it is.

They idolise the Buddha and treat him as a God.

They treat Buddhism as a religion.

Buddha was not a God.

The original teachings of the Buddha was a practice which reveals reality.

It has nothing to do with religion.

If you practice awareness, concentration and live ethically you will reduce your expose to bring ripped off.

Edited June 14, 2015 by rockyysdt

[bluesofa]

All religions are businesses to generate profit. People that give to such religions are fools, karma at its best. If a man truly has a need to be spiritual, it should be between himself and his God. No mortal man has special powers to be between them.

This is the biggest problem with Buddhism.

Most have zero understanding of what it is.

They idolise the Buddha and treat him as a God.

They treat Buddhism as a religion.

Buddha was not a God.

The original teachings of the Buddha was a practice which reveals reality.

It has nothing to do with religion.

If you practice awareness, concentration and live ethically you will reduce your expose to bring ripped off.

I do agree with what you've said above.

As an aethist, I do feel the idea of buddhism is a philosphy, not a religion, and such is a really good one. What I don't know at the moment is how to find out more about Buddhism in that context.

From what I've seen in Thai temples here in Thailand, the locals do seem to follow the what should be the religious aspect, but with an awful lot of jiggery-pokery regarding praying for good luck, a good exam grade, blessing their car, etc.

There don't seem to be many temples which soley follow Buddhist practices. Wat Pah Nanachat in Ubon looks like it has a more genuine approach, although I'm open to correction on that.

When I lived in the UK in a previous life (figuratively speaking), I used to go the the Forest Hermitage in Warwickshire, a branch of Wat Nong Pah Pong also in Ubon. The abbott there (an English guy) was quite hard on the Thais regarding requests for lucky charms, or which day would be lucky to open a new restaurant. I had a few chats with him about that aspect of Buddhism.

[SoiBiker]

Brother of Russ?

[bluesofa]

Brother of Russ?

Hi, was that regarding my post? If it was, what is the relevance?

[rockyysdt]

If you have a spare 10 days, I recommend attending the International Retreat at Wat Suan Mokkh near Surat Thani.

Each retreat begins on the 1st of the month with a 10 day duration.

Instructions are in English and focus is on practice and Awakening in this life.

There is no focus on amulets, good luck, spirits, past lives, better next lives, or anything considered religious.

You will learn and practice Mindfulness, and Concentration with special attention to the Buddha's Anapanasiti system.

Vegetarian food is supplied, you will have your own room, with a wooden pillow to sleep on, you will surrender your phone, pc, watch, and radio and you will agree to silence.

A great intro for those who have many gaps missing in their understanding of Buddhism.

You mentioned atheism.

This along with many things in our lives, is an attachment.

Attachments make us rigid and inflexible.

Much better to observe without attachment.

I'm not advocating any particular position.

Practicing Awareness and Concentration is about letting go rather than adding or holding onto.

Edited July 28, 2015 by rockyysdt

[jacky54]

I no longer give to any monks or make donations at any wat. Most of them have constant building projects on the go while their monks strut around with the latest Samsung phone, only the armani suits are missing. Even at the local forest temple they are always on the build and you can see them in corners on their phones as soon as eating ends

Edited July 28, 2015 by jacky54

[bluesofa]

If you have a spare 10 days, I recommend attending the International Retreat at Wat Suan Mokkh near Surat Thani.

Each retreat begins on the 1st of the month with a 10 day duration.

Instructions are in English and focus is on practice and Awakening in this life.

There is no focus on amulets, good luck, spirits, past lives, better next lives, or anything considered religious.

You will learn and practice Mindfulness, and Concentration with special attention to the Buddha's Anapanasiti system.

Vegetarian food is supplied, you will have your own room, with a wooden pillow to sleep on, you will surrender your phone, pc, watch, and radio and you will agree to silence.

A great intro for those who have many gaps missing in their understanding of Buddhism.

You mentioned atheism.

This along with many things in our lives, is an attachment.

Attachments make us rigid and inflexible.

Much better to observe without attachment.

I'm not advocating any particular position.

Practicing Awareness and Concentration is about letting go rather than adding or holding onto.

Thanks for posting the above. I've had a look at the website and will give it some thought, but not committing myself yet.

Interesting comment about aethism making us rigid and inflexible. I take your point.

[jacky54]

A few too many rules and restrictions I think, bordering on the extreme

no killing (this includes mosquitoes, centipedes, spiders, and scorpions, all of which you may encounter)

[rockyysdt]

A few too many rules and restrictions I think, bordering on the extreme

no killing (this includes mosquitoes, centipedes, spiders, and scorpions, all of which you may encounter)

It needn't be a deal breaker.

For example, why would you want to kill the centipedes, spiders, & scorpions?

Part of ones daily practice is to be Mindful.

This includes walking mindfully and observing where you step.

Mindfulness includes observing ones environment, as well as ones breath, body, thoughts, & feelings.

If the centipedes, spiders, & scorpions are in the way or of concern the instruction is to carefully capture them in one of the readily available plastic bowls and release them back into nature, away from the dormitory or other buildings.

Mosquitoes can be troublesome, but one can easily deal with these without resorting to killing.

Applying Deet is a good line of defence.

Mosquitoes dislike the odor of Deet intensely and will keep away.

Protection can be augmented with an insect head net, thick socks, and a Sarong to drape over the shoulders, neck & arms.

Abstaining from killing is one of the five precepts.

The precepts aren't obligatory or mandatory, but training rules that people undertake voluntarily to assist in the progress of practice.

Are you averse to such restrictions?

Edited July 28, 2015 by rockyysdt

[VincentRJ]

A few too many rules and restrictions I think, bordering on the extreme

no killing (this includes mosquitoes, centipedes, spiders, and scorpions, all of which you may encounter)

If the centipedes, spiders, & scorpions are in the way or of concern the instruction is to carefully capture them in one of the readily available plastic bowls and release them back into nature, away from the dormitory or other buildings.

Mosquitoes can be troublesome, but one can easily deal with these without resorting to killing.

Applying Deet is a good line of defence.

Mosquitoes dislike the odor of Deet intensely and will keep away.

Hi Rocky,

The trouble with rules is that they were always originally devised in relation to a specific context or set of circumstances, and as we all know from Buddhist principles, everything is in a continuous process of change.

Refraining from killing creatures that present no potential harm to oneself, is fine. However, in Australia we have some deadly poisonous spiders, such as the Sydney Funnel-Web and the less poisonous Red-back.

I'm not sure I would feel guilty about treading on one of those if I encountered one in my bedroom.

As regards Deet, that's a poisonous insecticide which will kill mosquitoes. Here's some info on Deet.

"Most insect repellants out there are loaded with toxic chemicals, including the pesticide DEET, which is so poisonous that even the Environmental Protection Agency says you should wash it off your skin when you return indoors, avoid breathing it in and not spray it directly on your face. Think about it--if this chemical can kill mosquitoes, it can likely do some harm to other life forms too.

The good news is that there are natural alternatives out there that can keep mosquitoes away while keeping you safe. My favorite is neem-based Outdoor Botanical Gel. It's made from an organic blend of neem leaf extract, aloe vera base (to soothe bites you already have!), neem oil, citronella oil and geraniol so it's actually good for your skin--and, unlike DEET, it's safe for the whole family--even infants and children. You may also be able to find other varieties in health food stores, but be sure to read the label to be sure they’re truly chemical-free."

I guess as always, one should try to use some common sense and rationality and not blindly and unquestionably follow all rules.

[LannaGuy]

A few too many rules and restrictions I think, bordering on the extreme

no killing (this includes mosquitoes, centipedes, spiders, and scorpions, all of which you may encounter)

If the centipedes, spiders, & scorpions are in the way or of concern the instruction is to carefully capture them in one of the readily available plastic bowls and release them back into nature, away from the dormitory or other buildings.

Mosquitoes can be troublesome, but one can easily deal with these without resorting to killing.

Applying Deet is a good line of defence.

Mosquitoes dislike the odor of Deet intensely and will keep away.

Hi Rocky,

The trouble with rules is that they were always originally devised in relation to a specific context or set of circumstances, and as we all know from Buddhist principles, everything is in a continuous process of change.

Refraining from killing creatures that present no potential harm to oneself, is fine. However, in Australia we have some deadly poisonous spiders, such as the Sydney Funnel-Web and the less poisonous Red-back.

I'm not sure I would feel guilty about treading on one of those if I encountered one in my bedroom.

As regards Deet, that's a poisonous insecticide which will kill mosquitoes. Here's some info on Deet.

"Most insect repellants out there are loaded with toxic chemicals, including the pesticide DEET, which is so poisonous that even the Environmental Protection Agency says you should wash it off your skin when you return indoors, avoid breathing it in and not spray it directly on your face. Think about it--if this chemical can kill mosquitoes, it can likely do some harm to other life forms too.

The good news is that there are natural alternatives out there that can keep mosquitoes away while keeping you safe. My favorite is neem-based Outdoor Botanical Gel. It's made from an organic blend of neem leaf extract, aloe vera base (to soothe bites you already have!), neem oil, citronella oil and geraniol so it's actually good for your skin--and, unlike DEET, it's safe for the whole family--even infants and children. You may also be able to find other varieties in health food stores, but be sure to read the label to be sure they’re truly chemical-free."

I guess as always, one should try to use some common sense and rationality and not blindly and unquestionably follow all rules.

Refraining from killing creatures that present no potential harm to oneself

indeed INCLUDING killing 'by proxy' i.e. be a vegetarian

[rockyysdt]

The trouble with rules is that they were always originally devised in relation to a specific context or set of circumstances, and as we all know from Buddhist principles, everything is in a continuous process of change.

Refraining from killing creatures that present no potential harm to oneself, is fine. However, in Australia we have some deadly poisonous spiders, such as the Sydney Funnel-Web and the less poisonous Red-back.

I'm not sure I would feel guilty about treading on one of those if I encountered one in my bedroom.

As regards Deet, that's a poisonous insecticide which will kill mosquitoes. Here's some info on Deet.

"Most insect repellants out there are loaded with toxic chemicals, including the pesticide DEET, which is so poisonous that even the Environmental Protection Agency says you should wash it off your skin when you return indoors, avoid breathing it in and not spray it directly on your face. Think about it--if this chemical can kill mosquitoes, it can likely do some harm to other life forms too.

The good news is that there are natural alternatives out there that can keep mosquitoes away while keeping you safe. My favorite is neem-based Outdoor Botanical Gel. It's made from an organic blend of neem leaf extract, aloe vera base (to soothe bites you already have!), neem oil, citronella oil and geraniol so it's actually good for your skin--and, unlike DEET, it's safe for the whole family--even infants and children. You may also be able to find other varieties in health food stores, but be sure to read the label to be sure they’re truly chemical-free."

I guess as always, one should try to use some common sense and rationality and not blindly and unquestionably follow all rules.

It depends on your source V.

My source quotes Deet as a repellent not a poison.

Even if a poison, if mosquitoes intensely dislike its odor, how can they come in contact with it to be poisoned?

The information source you've highlighted sounds very much like an advertisement for Outdoor Botanical Gel.

An ABC article I read about 2 months ago reported on testing which concluded preparations such as citronella are next to useless in repelling mosquitoes.

My personal experience supports this.

They indicated that occasional exposure to DEET was safe and for adults and extremely effective in its repellent role.

Quote:

Mosquito expert Dr Cameron Webb from the University of Sydney says despite the huge range of repellents on the market, there is only a handful of active ingredients to choose between, such as DEET and Icaridin.

"They've been shown time and time again not only to be safe for human beings but to deter mosquitoes," Dr Webb told 105.7 Mornings.

Edited July 29, 2015 by rockyysdt

[VincentRJ]

The trouble with rules is that they were always originally devised in relation to a specific context or set of circumstances, and as we all know from Buddhist principles, everything is in a continuous process of change.

Refraining from killing creatures that present no potential harm to oneself, is fine. However, in Australia we have some deadly poisonous spiders, such as the Sydney Funnel-Web and the less poisonous Red-back.

I'm not sure I would feel guilty about treading on one of those if I encountered one in my bedroom.

As regards Deet, that's a poisonous insecticide which will kill mosquitoes. Here's some info on Deet.

"Most insect repellants out there are loaded with toxic chemicals, including the pesticide DEET, which is so poisonous that even the Environmental Protection Agency says you should wash it off your skin when you return indoors, avoid breathing it in and not spray it directly on your face. Think about it--if this chemical can kill mosquitoes, it can likely do some harm to other life forms too.

The good news is that there are natural alternatives out there that can keep mosquitoes away while keeping you safe. My favorite is neem-based Outdoor Botanical Gel. It's made from an organic blend of neem leaf extract, aloe vera base (to soothe bites you already have!), neem oil, citronella oil and geraniol so it's actually good for your skin--and, unlike DEET, it's safe for the whole family--even infants and children. You may also be able to find other varieties in health food stores, but be sure to read the label to be sure they’re truly chemical-free."

I guess as always, one should try to use some common sense and rationality and not blindly and unquestionably follow all rules.

It depends on your source V.

My source quotes Deet as a repellent not a poison.

Even if a poison, if mosquitoes intensely dislike its odor, how can they come in contact with it to be poisoned?

The information source you've highlighted sounds very much like an advertisement for Outdoor Botanical Gel.

An ABC article I read about 2 months ago reported on testing which concluded preparations such as citronella are next to useless in repelling mosquitoes.

My personal experience supports this.

They indicated that occasional exposure to DEET was safe and for adults and extremely effective in its repellent role.

Quote:

Mosquito expert Dr Cameron Webb from the University of Sydney says despite the huge range of repellents on the market, there is only a handful of active ingredients to choose between, such as DEET and Icaridin.

"They've been shown time and time again not only to be safe for human beings but to deter mosquitoes," Dr Webb told 105.7 Mornings.

You might be right, Rocky. Perhaps it doesn't actually kill mosquitoes.

Following are some recommendations on the use of Deet from the United States Environmental Protection Agency, which I suppose one can trust. Yet more rules!

Read and follow all directions and precautions on this product label.

Do not apply over cuts, wounds, or irritated skin.

Do not apply to hands or near eyes and mouth of young children.

Do not allow young children to apply this product.

Use just enough repellent to cover exposed skin and/or clothing.

Do not use under clothing.

Avoid over-application of this product.

After returning indoors, wash treated skin with soap and water.

Wash treated clothing before wearing it again.

Use of this product may cause skin reactions in rare cases.

[VincentRJ]

A few too many rules and restrictions I think, bordering on the extreme

no killing (this includes mosquitoes, centipedes, spiders, and scorpions, all of which you may encounter)

Refraining from killing creatures that present no potential harm to oneself, is fine.

indeed INCLUDING killing 'by proxy' i.e. be a vegetarian

Once again, rationality and common sense should prevail. I will not follow any rules which I have reason to believe might affect my health and shorten my life. Pure vegetarianism, ie. veganism, or refraining from eating any animal product at all, including fish and chicken eggs, could result in serious deficiencies of certain essential vitamins and minerals, such as Vitamin B12 in particular.

The longer one lives and the healthier one is, the greater the opportunity to achieve enlightenment.

[LannaGuy]

Once again, rationality and common sense should prevail. I will not follow any rules which I have reason to believe might affect my health and shorten my life. Pure vegetarianism, ie. veganism, or refraining from eating any animal product at all, including fish and chicken eggs, could result in serious deficiencies of certain essential vitamins and minerals, such as Vitamin B12 in particular.

The longer one lives and the healthier one is, the greater the opportunity to achieve enlightenment.

convenient

I have been a veggie for 40 years - doesn't have to be vegan (I eat eggs) but if it kills it ain't 'Buddhist" and Thais love killing animals to eat

[rockyysdt]

Once again, rationality and common sense should prevail. I will not follow any rules which I have reason to believe might affect my health and shorten my life. Pure vegetarianism, ie. veganism, or refraining from eating any animal product at all, including fish and chicken eggs, could result in serious deficiencies of certain essential vitamins and minerals, such as Vitamin B12 in particular.

The longer one lives and the healthier one is, the greater the opportunity to achieve enlightenment.

convenient

I have been a veggie for 40 years - doesn't have to be vegan (I eat eggs) but if it kills it ain't 'Buddhist" and Thais love killing animals to eat

Eggs are a great source of iron and protein.

It is a myth that they are bad for your cholesterol.

They contain little saturated fat and zero trans fat, and have good amounts of Omega 3 fats.

Just avoid frying them.

I prepared poached eggs today.

Almost like soft boiled eggs, only you get to see their state, ensuring they're not over cooked.

[VincentRJ]

Once again, rationality and common sense should prevail. I will not follow any rules which I have reason to believe might affect my health and shorten my life. Pure vegetarianism, ie. veganism, or refraining from eating any animal product at all, including fish and chicken eggs, could result in serious deficiencies of certain essential vitamins and minerals, such as Vitamin B12 in particular.

The longer one lives and the healthier one is, the greater the opportunity to achieve enlightenment.

convenient

I have been a veggie for 40 years - doesn't have to be vegan (I eat eggs) but if it kills it ain't 'Buddhist" and Thais love killing animals to eat

Eggs are a great source of iron and protein.

It is a myth that they are bad for your cholesterol.

They contain little saturated fat and zero trans fat, and have good amounts of Omega 3 fats.

Just avoid frying them.

I prepared poached eggs today.

Almost like soft boiled eggs, only you get to see their state, ensuring they're not over cooked.

If I intended to become a vegetarian, I think I would definitely continue to eat eggs. However, if one wishes to put a fine point on it, I can see some minor issues that would appear to be in conflict with the generally accepted Buddhist view that life begins at conception and that abortion and/or the deliberate destruction of life should be rejected.

For example, if the egg is from a free-range farm, it could have been fertilized by a rooster and would have had the potential to develop into a baby chick if the hen had been allowed to sit on the egg.

Preventing the chicken from incubating the egg, will result in the death of the embryo after a few weeks, which is equivalent to an abortion.

If the egg is a caged egg, it's unlikely to have ever been fertilized, in which case there's no issue of abortion, but there is an issue of cruelty resulting from the terrible conditions in the caged environment.

Either way, from a strict Buddhist perspective there could be an ethical problem in eating eggs. But don't worry about it. I'm sure you will be forgiven for such minor infringements.

Nevertheless, the ideal situation for a Buddhist would be to eat only eggs that he was sure had originated from a free-range farm that had excluded all roosters; a farm in which only hens are allowed, like a monastery for Bhikkhunis only.

[LannaGuy]

Once again, rationality and common sense should prevail. I will not follow any rules which I have reason to believe might affect my health and shorten my life. Pure vegetarianism, ie. veganism, or refraining from eating any animal product at all, including fish and chicken eggs, could result in serious deficiencies of certain essential vitamins and minerals, such as Vitamin B12 in particular.

The longer one lives and the healthier one is, the greater the opportunity to achieve enlightenment.

convenient

I have been a veggie for 40 years - doesn't have to be vegan (I eat eggs) but if it kills it ain't 'Buddhist" and Thais love killing animals to eat

Eggs are a great source of iron and protein.

It is a myth that they are bad for your cholesterol.

They contain little saturated fat and zero trans fat, and have good amounts of Omega 3 fats.

Just avoid frying them.

I prepared poached eggs today.

Almost like soft boiled eggs, only you get to see their state, ensuring they're not over cooked.

If I intended to become a vegetarian, I think I would definitely continue to eat eggs. However, if one wishes to put a fine point on it, I can see some minor issues that would appear to be in conflict with the generally accepted Buddhist view that life begins at conception and that abortion and/or the deliberate destruction of life should be rejected.

For example, if the egg is from a free-range farm, it could have been fertilized by a rooster and would have had the potential to develop into a baby chick if the hen had been allowed to sit on the egg.

Preventing the chicken from incubating the egg, will result in the death of the embryo after a few weeks, which is equivalent to an abortion.

If the egg is a caged egg, it's unlikely to have ever been fertilized, in which case there's no issue of abortion, but there is an issue of cruelty resulting from the terrible conditions in the caged environment.

Either way, from a strict Buddhist perspective there could be an ethical problem in eating eggs. But don't worry about it. I'm sure you will be forgiven for such minor infringements.

Nevertheless, the ideal situation for a Buddhist would be to eat only eggs that he was sure had originated from a free-range farm that had excluded all roosters; a farm in which only hens are allowed, like a monastery for Bhikkhunis only.

well... I thank you brother... but I would like to postulate that I know not of the origin of the 'egg' and only buy free range as a rule no roosters there! as for conception I would argue that point as I am a 'Theosophical Buddhist' i would argue that the Soul enters the physical at a much later stage... but we digress...

...on the principal that 'half a egg is better than none' my transgressions, in this regard, are minor. My point was that Thais, in the general, are convenient with the truth that they kill by proxy... and that is a sin