Most-wanted German Nazi Sommer 'unfit for trial'

[webfact]

Germany shelves investigation of man in wartime massacre

BERLIN (AP) — German prosecutors say they've shelved their investigation of a 93-year-old former SS officer suspected of being part of a wartime massacre of civilians in Italy because he's no longer fit to stand trial.

Hamburg prosecutors said Thursday that there was a "high probability" that Gerhard Sommer could have been charged with involvement in 342 murders for participating in the Aug. 12, 1944 slaughter in Sant' Anna di Stazzema, but that he was suffering from dementia and couldn't follow a trial.

Sommer and others had already been found guilty in 2005 by an Italian military court and sentenced to life in prison in absentia.

But he was never extradited because he would have had to consent to it under German law. Hamburg opened its own investigation last year.


-- (c) Associated Press 2015-05-29

[ezzra]

Did he ever gave the benefit of being ' unfit ' before sending people to death under his

supervision? I doubt it very much... oh how civil can a German be when they want to.....

[Sydebolle]

It's time to wrap up that nasty part of German history.
There is no "unfitness" for war criminals; his victims were also not asked if they were fit for torture and extinction.

On the other hand it is time to look forward. Once the last murderer has met his creator we should keep this period of history alive in museums and school books. Likewise also stop blaming the Germans for this terrible genocide as the Germans living today were not in a decision-making or understanding-what-happens-around-them age yet.

Most nations have bloody pasts; the Brits did a splendid job conquering the world which is written up nicer than reality in their history books. Ditto the French. The Americans can run Guantanamo bay, the whole world knows it and nobody brings those detainees (as they officially are called) to justice despite being there for many years.

It also means, that our Jewish friends should look forward and stop their bashing on Germans; keeping a guilty conscience alive is of no use either. After all, the official Israel has a nice, proven track of records as far as hostility (West Bank, Gaza come to mind) is concerned.

Take the man to trial, if found guilty then lock him up and throw away the key.

[Pakboong]

It's time to wrap up that nasty part of German history.

There is no "unfitness" for war criminals; his victims were also not asked if they were fit for torture and extinction.

On the other hand it is time to look forward. Once the last murderer has met his creator we should keep this period of history alive in museums and school books. Likewise also stop blaming the Germans for this terrible genocide as the Germans living today were not in a decision-making or understanding-what-happens-around-them age yet.

Most nations have bloody pasts; the Brits did a splendid job conquering the world which is written up nicer than reality in their history books. Ditto the French. The Americans can run Guantanamo bay, the whole world knows it and nobody brings those detainees (as they officially are called) to justice despite being there for many years.

It also means, that our Jewish friends should look forward and stop their bashing on Germans; keeping a guilty conscience alive is of no use either. After all, the official Israel has a nice, proven track of records as far as hostility (West Bank, Gaza come to mind) is concerned.

Take the man to trial, if found guilty then lock him up and throw away the key.

I'm pretty sure those killed were Italians.

[micmichd]

Many survivors of the Holocaust can't sleep at night as long as they are not sure that things like this (industrially organized genocide) will never happen again. This Nazi should be taken to court in Israel.

[oldsailor35]

This is wrong, the nazi swine should be persued until the very second that he takes his last breath.

[thousandpercent]

Did he ever gave the benefit of being ' unfit ' before sending people to death under his

supervision? I doubt it very much... oh how civil can a German be when they want to.....

How do you know he sent anyone to death? Don't you think he should be allowed to put forth a defense before you decide?

[oldsailor35]

I guess that the German powers that be just want it to all go quietly away. Quite cowardly in my opinion.

[thousandpercent]

There is no "unfitness" for war criminals;

Take the man to trial, if found guilty then lock him up and throw away the key.

How would you conduct a trial of a defendant who can't put forth a defense? And if you did, why would you rely on the result of an unfair trial? You sound like a Nazi.

[oldsailor35]

Did he ever gave the benefit of being ' unfit ' before sending people to death under his

supervision? I doubt it very much... oh how civil can a German be when they want to.....

How do you know he sent anyone to death? Don't you think he should be allowed to put forth a defense before you decide?

Do you mean to say that he is not capable of saying "I was just acting on orders" which is what has been often said in the past.

[thousandpercent]

I guess that the German powers that be just want it to all go quietly away. Quite cowardly in my opinion.

Do you really think it's "cowardly" to conduct fair trials in which defendants are able to put forth a defense? Congratulations, you're a Nazi.

[micmichd]

(Possible) war crimes from Israel against Palestine don't make German Nazis innocent.

I might personally disagree with Israel on Palestine, but that's not the topic here.

Edited May 29, 2015 by micmichd

[uptheos]

The guy was found guilty in absentia and sentenced to life in Italy.

Send him there to do the time.

Have to consent to extradition under German law, I've never heard of anything so stupid!!

[JockPieandBeans]

The guy is 93. He is probably not fit to stand, let alone stand trial.

Give him a week old prawn sandwich for his lunch.

That will probably take care of it, and save a fortune in the process.

[Pakboong]

Before we end up with a 10 page thread about the holocaust, this was a murder of 300+ Italian partisans in late 1944. Some of them could have been Jews but that was not the issue.

The man is alleged to have been involved in a massacre in northern Italy on Aug. 12, 1944. SS troops on anti-partisan operations surrounded the village of Sant’Anna di Stazzema in Tuscany and killed hundreds of people, including many women and children.

[snowgard]

"Under his supervision" - What does this mean? In 1944 this man was 22 years old. 100% him was supervised from his Major, Captain or whatever. What would have happened if he had refused the command of his higher officers?

They had killed him, too!!!

I found it stupid to bring now all the small underlings to court and the real bastards had a good life and died already in the past years.

[micmichd]

Sorry, I didn't know that.

Then Italy would be the right place for him. He can beg for pardon there.

[JockPieandBeans]

Before we end up with a 10 page thread about the holocaust, this was a murder of 300+ Italian partisans in late 1944. Some of them could have been Jews but that was not the issue.

The man is alleged to have been involved in a massacre in northern Italy on Aug. 12, 1944. SS troops on anti-partisan operations surrounded the village of Sant’Anna di Stazzema in Tuscany and killed hundreds of people, including many women and children.

Agree 100%.

He is alleged to have been involved in a massacre 70 years ago. It was WW2, there was many, many atrocities carried out. Right or wrong, that is what happens in wars.

Forget 70 years ago. Get after those that are committing atrocities today.

[happy Joe]

The victimhood competition is ridiculous and why speak of Gaza about a Nazi torturer?

I think we should forget all indulgence toward mass criminals, not only by the spirit of justice but also send the message to current barbaric that there will be no forgiveness.

[micmichd]

Who forced him to make career in a Nazi military organization?

[micmichd]

Every German had to read Hitler's "Mein Kampf" at this time, so every German should have been aware of what would happen.

Who forced him to make career in a Nazi military organization?

[JockPieandBeans]

Who forced him to make career in a Nazi military organization?

When your options are join or die.

What option would you take ? Taking into account that this was WW2. There was no namby-pamby PC / Human rights Brigade.

I guess you would have accepted getting your brains splattered where you stood.

[Lupatria]

Did he ever gave the benefit of being ' unfit ' before sending people to death under his

supervision? I doubt it very much... oh how civil can a German be when they want to.....

As much as I agree with the first part of your post.

Would you and the rest of the world accept if Germany execute a 93 year old, even so he deserve it?

Edited May 29, 2015 by Lupatria

[Tchooptip]

Did he ever gave the benefit of being ' unfit ' before sending people to death under his

supervision? I doubt it very much... oh how civil can a German be when they want to.....

How do you know he sent anyone to death? Don't you think he should be allowed to put forth a defense before you decide?

Sommer and others had already been found guilty in 2005 by an Italian military court and sentenced to life in prison in absentia.

[Scott]

Off-topic post removed.

[micmichd]

Now that he's so old I would probably accept a pardon if he shows empathy with his victims.

In Nazi Germany, everybody had to join the army, but not everybody had to make career as an officer.

I would check the conscience of people who want to join the army, and only allow those to join who are mentally capable to *resist* to authority. Only those can make a willful decision whether they want to obey to commands or not. Those who are not able to resist to authority might get driven by quasi-religious mania or are simply to stupid to understand the choice.

The US Army had their experiences with those GIs who changed sides during the Vietnam war, and those GIs had good reasons to do so.

Sorry for the veterans, I don't want to insult them.

But the times when you worship an abstract idea (like the 'Free West') higher than life should be over. Guess quite a few GIs have understood this in SEA, and maybe some learned from their Thai girlfriends. That they are actually all part of an international working class.

[Baerboxer]

Did he ever gave the benefit of being ' unfit ' before sending people to death under his

supervision? I doubt it very much... oh how civil can a German be when they want to.....

How do you know he sent anyone to death? Don't you think he should be allowed to put forth a defense before you decide?

"Sommer and others had already been found guilty in 2005 by an Italian military court and sentenced to life in prison in absentia."

Did you miss reading that bit? Or is it a comprehension problem?

[2alex4alex]

Before we end up with a 10 page thread about the holocaust, this was a murder of 300+ Italian partisans in late 1944. Some of them could have been Jews but that was not the issue.

The man is alleged to have been involved in a massacre in northern Italy on Aug. 12, 1944. SS troops on anti-partisan operations surrounded the village of Sant’Anna di Stazzema in Tuscany and killed hundreds of people, including many women and children.

Who remember about Italian partisans? According to modern mass media it was only Jews who was killed in that terrible war.

[micmichd]

The Holocaust was the climax of it all, an industrially organized genocide.

Besides that, the Nazis exterminated all kinds of minorities that were in their way, even in hospitals and by medical experiments.

They also killed women and children, and that's a war crime. No excuse.

Edited May 29, 2015 by micmichd

[NickJ]

two week old prawn sandwitch then.