A Dogs Life in Thailand - Vet Care.

[Ausladyinpatong]

Hi Faz,

This is absolutely appalling and my heart goes out to you and Pepper.

I truly hope that Soi Dog are able to pursue criminal charges against the clinic for this case of serious neglect, I think they will want to as they have been very vocal on the new animal welfare laws which are an improvement but need to be made more specific.

The surgeon may not have been at fault directly but who was supervising the staff who couldn't administer medication to an injured and distressed animal lying in his own urine post op...? If it were really such a problem they should have called you immediately and Pepper cared for at home. I hope they can be held accountable for this for the sake of any animal that comes into their care.

I really feel for you and I hope you keep us updated. I pray for your Pepper's recovery.

[konying]

Yesterday afternoon I confronted the Vet Practice again.

At first they even denied they knew about the problem!!!

Some 60 minutes later they more or less admitted some liability.

It appears the doctor thought staff were giving him anti biotic tablets, but the staff say he growled and tried to bite them.

Not surprising, he's sick, in pain and scared.

So the option was to tie the dogs snout and inject the anti biotic if they couldn't give them by mouth.

Only the doctor was trained to give injections and the staff didn't tell him of the problem.

Complete breakdown in communications!

The outcome, they offered us the costs of the medicines (that weren't used) but charged for, some 600 baht.

I refused the offer point blank.

This morning I telephoned the Consumer Protection Board who said I should complain to the Vet Council.

Vet Council

022500395

[email protected]

My g/f is having one last go at them as I write.

I have asked for a 2,000 baht refund from the 4,350 baht they charged which I think is very reasonable.

You are kind man, i would be demanding full refund less surgery plus all expenses caused by their negligence.

So clearly not only they did not give antibiotic and pain killers, but also did not clean the wound or the cage, hence the problems.

Not surprising at all and surgeon, is liable for everything.

Also call 1111 and see what they would say.

Attack it from all angles to make sure not only it does not happen again, but also for the Vet to take responsibility for his retarded staff.

PS. How is Pepper doing? for the wound, i can suggest easy "solution" which seems to work well,

Nano spray and antiseptic powder., used on my disabled dog and it helped with healing all the wounds. He has spine surgery, both back legs broken and broken jaw.

Also for Pepper, i would start to give Glucosamine to reduce inflammation and pain, with some flexseeds oil.

Edited June 12, 2015 by konying

[meatboy]

Yesterday afternoon I confronted the Vet Practice again.

At first they even denied they knew about the problem!!!

Some 60 minutes later they more or less admitted some liability.

It appears the doctor thought staff were giving him anti biotic tablets, but the staff say he growled and tried to bite them.

Not surprising, he's sick, in pain and scared.

So the option was to tie the dogs snout and inject the anti biotic if they couldn't give them by mouth.

Only the doctor was trained to give injections and the staff didn't tell him of the problem.

Complete breakdown in communications!

The outcome, they offered us the costs of the medicines (that weren't used) but charged for, some 600 baht.

I refused the offer point blank.

This morning I telephoned the Consumer Protection Board who said I should complain to the Vet Council.

Vet Council

022500395

[email protected]

My g/f is having one last go at them as I write.

I have asked for a 2,000 baht refund from the 4,350 baht they charged which I think is very reasonable.

You are kind man, i would be demanding full refund less surgery plus all expenses caused by their negligence.

So clearly not only they did not give antibiotic and pain killers, but also did not clean the wound or the cage, hence the problems.

Not surprising at all and surgeon, is liable for everything.

Also call 1111 and see what they would say.

Attack it from all angles to make sure not only it does not happen again, but also for the Vet to take responsibility for his retarded staff.

PS. How is Pepper doing? for the wound, i can suggest easy "solution" which seems to work well,

Nano spray and antiseptic powder., used on my disabled dog and it helped with healing all the wounds. He has spine surgery, both back legs broken and broken jaw.

Also for Pepper, i would start to give Glucosamine to reduce inflammation and pain, with some flexseeds oil.

keep at um faz you owe it to pepper,who i think of every day,so pep get well soon.

staff fking imbasiles.

taff.love me love my dog.

[Liquorice]

Just an update.

My vet cleaned his ear and side this morning and although they look awful, he is pleased that they are no longer infected but will take another 3/4 weeks to heal. He will review his medication next Wednesday. His paws and testicles are ok now.

I've attached 3 photo's I took this morning after his visit to my vet.

I had a reply from Katherine at Soi Dogs Foundation today.

Hi XXXX,

I was forwarded your email from Petra here at Soi Dog Foundation. I apologize for my delayed response as I've been out of the office.

I looked at the pictures you sent over and agree that the condition of the dog upon leaving the clinic is horrendous. I see that the suture line dehisced, or broke open. This will now need to be managed as an open wound which will take months to heal.

As I mentioned earlier to Petra, in the Western world, this case would be classified as gross negligence and medical malpractice due to the sores and wounds, and subject to litigation in the courts system, as well as brought up before the veterinary board. In Thailand however, I'm not aware of any penalties currently in existence for private veterinary clinics.

Please let me know if I can be of any further existence. You have my sincerest condolences for this poor dog.

Katherine Polak, DVM, MPH, MS, DACVPM

Director of Animal Welfare

[email protected]

Soi Dog Foundation | www.soidog.org

Not looking good for taking any kind of action then!

Edited June 14, 2015 by Faz

[meatboy]

keep improving pepper,surely they are not going to get away with what they have done,most of us know its mai-pen-rai so could it be NAME AND SHAME.

dont think they would want to fight that.

[Liquorice]

I'd love to meatboy, but I have to be careful I don't give them reason to sue me for defamation of character.

Anyway today I've e-mailed a formal complaint to the Veterinary Practitioner Association of Thailand (as advised by Soi Dogs Foundation).

I've also filed a formal complaint at Roi Et Police station against the Clinic. Unfortunately the Police are not familiar with the new Animal Protection Welfare Act, however after listening to me and seeing photographic evidence, he decided to contact the clinic with a view to get the owner down to the Police station and try to reach an amicable settlement.

They refused point blank, stating they have done nothing wrong.

So I've now contact a lawyer with a view to finding out where I stand.

Maybe the newspapers would be interested in the story...........but which one?

This is my Justice for Pepper campaign.

It's not about money, it's the principal, but Thais don't want to lose either face or money, so I guess there is a principal not to admit your at fault in their culture...........stalemate.

It's been a rather busy day

Edited June 15, 2015 by Faz

[Ausladyinpatong]

Wow Faz, I am so happy to hear Pepper is improving. I know it's a long road ahead and a lot of work to look after him and manage his treatment but I am so happy for you that he's looking better.

It's a shame the existing laws don't extend to cover private clinics but hopefully your email to the Veterinary Practitioner Association yields something, I feel it must. At the very least a stern tap on the shoulder from a respected authority might prevent this happening again to another poor animal and their unsuspecting owner.

I think you're right not to name and shame, no point being brought up on charges yourself. Stay safe so you can continue to look after your dog and fight the good fight intelligently, as you are.

May there be "Justice for Pepper" Rock on Faz!

[Liquorice]

Update:

I've employed the services of a Lawyer now. (English speaking)

The new Animal Protection Act only covers cruelty to animals by individuals which are considered to be a criminal act.

In other words the Police arrest and prosecute.

However under the civil laws an organisation can be sued for damages to person or property.

Pepper my dog is considered my property under the law, so this is the way forward.

The law works slightly different to that of the UK which I'm familiar with.

My lawyer first serves them a notice of intention to prosecute and take them to court (that will be on it's way shortly).

The law then dictates that first my lawyer should bring both parties together to negotiate a settlement before court proceedings.

If they refuse (and my lawyer said they would be stupid to do so) then we proceed to court.

He's reviewed the evidence and states they haven't got a leg to stand on.

It's an open and shut case as far as he is concerned.

His costs 2,000 baht which I have to pay upfront.

Apparently those costs can't be reclaimed during the compensation negotiation.

Once they have settled the compensation claim, then we approach them for reimbursement of the lawyers fees.

My lawyer states they cannot refuse to pay me these costs because they have admitted liability by compensating me.

I think the Clinic thought I was calling their bluff and would roll over and disappear.

Sorry, the 'Justice for Pepper' wagon is already rolling along and picking up speed.

[isanbirder]

Good luck, Faz (and Pepper).

I hope you get an honest judge.

[weka]

Not wishing to be devil's advocate here but this crossed my mind:

You (admirably and understandably) want to ensure that no other animal at that vet gets the same terrible treatment as Pepper

But how will what you're doing ensure that their procedures will improve in say August or September?

Best case scenario, court rules in your favour and you get a refund, maybe some compensation money. Vet gets a scolding from the judge and is a bit out of pocket.

He will most probably, (don't forget where we are) abide by the court ruling, pay you and then what?

Well he'll talk badly about the interfering farang. He'll escape any disciplinary action from any ruling Vet authority. He'll have a story about the time a rich farang took him to court. And it'll be business as usual

There's no indication anything will change. Why should he change? Who will reassess his practices in 3, 6, 12 months time? In the west it would be followed up, but here? They've only taken 2014 years to write legislature covering cruelty to animals

That is the BEST case scenario

The worst (most likely) will be that he never turns up to court or just delays and delays for years.

I'm not being argumentative or disillusioned, it's just that I've been through a quest for justice here and the person I wanted to see behind bars has done all of the above and hasn't seen a cell yet.

Her crime, only premeditated murder.

She organised a shooting of a guy in the back seat of her car while she sat in the front. Total police confessions too. I turned up to about 5 court dates and she didn't ever show up. On each occasion the lawyer (probably in the same tone of voice as yours) remarked "oh she's in big trouble now. If she doesn't show up next time she'll go to jail for contempt. She doesn't have a leg to stand on"

3 years later she's got 2 legs in society totally free while we await the next court date.

Temper your expectations Faz. Decide what you think are really important outcomes and be prepared to modify your actions to meet them.

I totally agree with what you're feeling and that it'd be great for something meaningful to come out but I'm not sure the system here is set up to accommodate the justice that Pepper deserves.

I'm just saying expect several different scenarios from this - best case or nothing happens or it costs you a bit more money, etc.

I really hope it works out well mate and I REALLY hope one day soon you can say a big "Told You so" - I really do hope I'm wrong Faz, if so give it to me with both barrels

It's just that I learnt, via a heinous crime, that this place doesn't care much for justice

Edited June 16, 2015 by weka

[konying]

Not wishing to be devil's advocate here but this crossed my mind:

You (admirably and understandably) want to ensure that no other animal at that vet gets the same terrible treatment as Pepper

But how will what you're doing ensure that their procedures will improve in say August or September?

Best case scenario, court rules in your favour and you get a refund, maybe some compensation money. Vet gets a scolding from the judge and is a bit out of pocket.

He will most probably, (don't forget where we are) abide by the court ruling, pay you and then what?

Well he'll talk badly about the interfering farang. He'll escape any disciplinary action from any ruling Vet authority. He'll have a story about the time a rich farang took him to court. And it'll be business as usual

There's no indication anything will change. Why should he change? Who will reassess his practices in 3, 6, 12 months time? In the west it would be followed up, but here? They've only taken 2014 years to write legislature covering cruelty to animals

That is the BEST case scenario

The worst (most likely) will be that he never turns up to court or just delays and delays for years.

I'm not being argumentative or disillusioned, it's just that I've been through a quest for justice here and the person I wanted to see behind bars has done all of the above and hasn't seen a cell yet.

Her crime, only premeditated murder.

She organised a shooting of a guy in the back seat of her car while she sat in the front. Total police confessions too. I turned up to about 5 court dates and she didn't ever show up. On each occasion the lawyer (probably in the same tone of voice as yours) remarked "oh she's in big trouble now. If she doesn't show up next time she'll go to jail for contempt. She doesn't have a leg to stand on"

3 years later she's got 2 legs in society totally free while we await the next court date.

Temper your expectations Faz. Decide what you think are really important outcomes and be prepared to modify your actions to meet them.

I totally agree with what you're feeling and that it'd be great for something meaningful to come out but I'm not sure the system here is set up to accommodate the justice that Pepper deserves.

I'm just saying expect several different scenarios from this - best case or nothing happens or it costs you a bit more money, etc.

I really hope it works out well mate and I REALLY hope one day soon you can say a big "Told You so" - I really do hope I'm wrong Faz, if so give it to me with both barrels

It's just that I learnt, via a heinous crime, that this place doesn't care much for justice

Its much more simple than you think.

When owner has to pay compensation, he will either fire all the old staff and take money out of their salary or will pay more attention NOT to be sued again.

Of course owner may learn nothing from it and continue down the same path, but at least the owner would be out of pocket and OP would not be

[Liquorice]

@weka.

2 things I've learned in Thailand.

1. The law isn't as black and white as it is in western Countries and justice isn't always served.

2. Don't make any financial commitment your not prepared to lose and walk away from.

Unfortunately Pepper can't speak. He can cry and whimper to tell me of his pain and discomfort.

I don't have any expectations. If I recover my costs that will be more than I expect.

The main reason for my action is to let this Clinic know that they cannot neglect the welfare of an animal in their care.

A review of their internal care procedure is a condition of any settlement.

Of course I have no guarantee that they will do this.

But to quote a phrase. "Evil men only succeed, because good men do nothing".

If I achieve nothing, at least I have the piece of mind that I tried on behalf of Pepper.

[meatboy]

i will second the above. ALL IN FAVOUR

[weka]

@weka.

2 things I've learned in Thailand.

1. The law isn't as black and white as it is in western Countries and justice isn't always served.

2. Don't make any financial commitment your not prepared to lose and walk away from.

Unfortunately Pepper can't speak. He can cry and whimper to tell me of his pain and discomfort.

I don't have any expectations. If I recover my costs that will be more than I expect.

The main reason for my action is to let this Clinic know that they cannot neglect the welfare of an animal in their care.

A review of their internal care procedure is a condition of any settlement.

Of course I have no guarantee that they will do this.

But to quote a phrase. "Evil men only succeed, because good men do nothing".

If I achieve nothing, at least I have the piece of mind that I tried on behalf of Pepper.

Good Faz and fair enough.

I didn't intend my post to be discouraging just intended to point out the need to manage expectations.

I see you have it under control. Truly I wish you good luck and hope it works out the way we all want.

Most importantly I assume Pepper is getting better

[weka]

Not wishing to be devil's advocate here but this crossed my mind:

You (admirably and understandably) want to ensure that no other animal at that vet gets the same terrible treatment as Pepper

But how will what you're doing ensure that their procedures will improve in say August or September?

Best case scenario, court rules in your favour and you get a refund, maybe some compensation money. Vet gets a scolding from the judge and is a bit out of pocket.

He will most probably, (don't forget where we are) abide by the court ruling, pay you and then what?

Well he'll talk badly about the interfering farang. He'll escape any disciplinary action from any ruling Vet authority. He'll have a story about the time a rich farang took him to court. And it'll be business as usual

There's no indication anything will change. Why should he change? Who will reassess his practices in 3, 6, 12 months time? In the west it would be followed up, but here? They've only taken 2014 years to write legislature covering cruelty to animals

That is the BEST case scenario

The worst (most likely) will be that he never turns up to court or just delays and delays for years.

I'm not being argumentative or disillusioned, it's just that I've been through a quest for justice here and the person I wanted to see behind bars has done all of the above and hasn't seen a cell yet.

Her crime, only premeditated murder.

She organised a shooting of a guy in the back seat of her car while she sat in the front. Total police confessions too. I turned up to about 5 court dates and she didn't ever show up. On each occasion the lawyer (probably in the same tone of voice as yours) remarked "oh she's in big trouble now. If she doesn't show up next time she'll go to jail for contempt. She doesn't have a leg to stand on"

3 years later she's got 2 legs in society totally free while we await the next court date.

Temper your expectations Faz. Decide what you think are really important outcomes and be prepared to modify your actions to meet them.

I totally agree with what you're feeling and that it'd be great for something meaningful to come out but I'm not sure the system here is set up to accommodate the justice that Pepper deserves.

I'm just saying expect several different scenarios from this - best case or nothing happens or it costs you a bit more money, etc.

I really hope it works out well mate and I REALLY hope one day soon you can say a big "Told You so" - I really do hope I'm wrong Faz, if so give it to me with both barrels

It's just that I learnt, via a heinous crime, that this place doesn't care much for justice

Its much more simple than you think.

When owner has to pay compensation, he will either fire all the old staff and take money out of their salary or will pay more attention NOT to be sued again.

Of course owner may learn nothing from it and continue down the same path, but at least the owner would be out of pocket and OP would not be

No mate, there is no indication that the owner will do any of what you mention.

Sure someone with professional integrity and a few morals may take remedial action but it's been readily established that this owner possesses none of those qualities. If he did he would have already remedied the issue. His obstinacy in front of the allegations suggests to me that this is now a battle between him and a complaining farang (yes of course that's wrong but what other indications does his dismissive behaviour suggest?).

Put another way, if I was "onside" with vet owner (i.e. he was family or some such), then conceiving a plan to delay, or get off these lawyer led charges would not be too difficult.

The face at stake here is far more valuable than the money.

All my opinions (rather jaded and resigned I'll admit) here though folks and like I say I hope I'm wrong

[Liquorice]

@weka.

2 things I've learned in Thailand.

1. The law isn't as black and white as it is in western Countries and justice isn't always served.

2. Don't make any financial commitment your not prepared to lose and walk away from.

Unfortunately Pepper can't speak. He can cry and whimper to tell me of his pain and discomfort.

I don't have any expectations. If I recover my costs that will be more than I expect.

The main reason for my action is to let this Clinic know that they cannot neglect the welfare of an animal in their care.

A review of their internal care procedure is a condition of any settlement.

Of course I have no guarantee that they will do this.

But to quote a phrase. "Evil men only succeed, because good men do nothing".

If I achieve nothing, at least I have the piece of mind that I tried on behalf of Pepper.

Good Faz and fair enough.

I didn't intend my post to be discouraging just intended to point out the need to manage expectations.

I see you have it under control. Truly I wish you good luck and hope it works out the way we all want.

Most importantly I assume Pepper is getting better

Certainly didn't take your post as being discouraging, just being realistic about the justice system in Thailand.

If the system fails me through the legal channels as in Plan A, then I have a Plan B to fall back on as retribution.

My girlfriend is worried they might try to balance the situation by making false accusations against me, or even worse.

I'm not worried about that, they can try to intimidate me as much as they want.

For the sum I'm reclaiming, it's hardly worth them hiring someone to pursued me otherwise, which is her concern.

It would be easier for me to let this one fly over my head and chalk it down to experience, but I'm digging my heels in.

I think we all have a tolerance threshold, but they've crossed that line in my case.

I'm very angry and seeing red!

Pepper is making slow progress. My vet just issued me with another 5 days supply of medication.

There are areas of dead tissue that has yet to come away on his side. It's a very aggressive infection that is attacking his tissue and can be quite resilient to many forms of anti biotic. My vet is more or less certain that it started with an ear infection and as he lay in his cage the puss from his ear dripped onto his side and floor, infecting other areas.

If he worsens, my vet will take culture samples to send to the lab in Khon Kaen for tests.

This isn't over by a long way yet and it's going to be weeks before he is back to normal.

I've attached another photo taken this morning after returning from the Vet.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Faz

[weka]

Good on you Faz, I now understand a bit more of the situation.

All the best mate - to you and Pepper (poor little fella)

[konying]

Not wishing to be devil's advocate here but this crossed my mind:

You (admirably and understandably) want to ensure that no other animal at that vet gets the same terrible treatment as Pepper

But how will what you're doing ensure that their procedures will improve in say August or September?

Best case scenario, court rules in your favour and you get a refund, maybe some compensation money. Vet gets a scolding from the judge and is a bit out of pocket.

He will most probably, (don't forget where we are) abide by the court ruling, pay you and then what?

Well he'll talk badly about the interfering farang. He'll escape any disciplinary action from any ruling Vet authority. He'll have a story about the time a rich farang took him to court. And it'll be business as usual

There's no indication anything will change. Why should he change? Who will reassess his practices in 3, 6, 12 months time? In the west it would be followed up, but here? They've only taken 2014 years to write legislature covering cruelty to animals

That is the BEST case scenario

The worst (most likely) will be that he never turns up to court or just delays and delays for years.

I'm not being argumentative or disillusioned, it's just that I've been through a quest for justice here and the person I wanted to see behind bars has done all of the above and hasn't seen a cell yet.

Her crime, only premeditated murder.

She organised a shooting of a guy in the back seat of her car while she sat in the front. Total police confessions too. I turned up to about 5 court dates and she didn't ever show up. On each occasion the lawyer (probably in the same tone of voice as yours) remarked "oh she's in big trouble now. If she doesn't show up next time she'll go to jail for contempt. She doesn't have a leg to stand on"

3 years later she's got 2 legs in society totally free while we await the next court date.

Temper your expectations Faz. Decide what you think are really important outcomes and be prepared to modify your actions to meet them.

I totally agree with what you're feeling and that it'd be great for something meaningful to come out but I'm not sure the system here is set up to accommodate the justice that Pepper deserves.

I'm just saying expect several different scenarios from this - best case or nothing happens or it costs you a bit more money, etc.

I really hope it works out well mate and I REALLY hope one day soon you can say a big "Told You so" - I really do hope I'm wrong Faz, if so give it to me with both barrels

It's just that I learnt, via a heinous crime, that this place doesn't care much for justice

Its much more simple than you think.

When owner has to pay compensation, he will either fire all the old staff and take money out of their salary or will pay more attention NOT to be sued again.

Of course owner may learn nothing from it and continue down the same path, but at least the owner would be out of pocket and OP would not be

No mate, there is no indication that the owner will do any of what you mention.

Sure someone with professional integrity and a few morals may take remedial action but it's been readily established that this owner possesses none of those qualities. If he did he would have already remedied the issue. His obstinacy in front of the allegations suggests to me that this is now a battle between him and a complaining farang (yes of course that's wrong but what other indications does his dismissive behaviour suggest?).

Put another way, if I was "onside" with vet owner (i.e. he was family or some such), then conceiving a plan to delay, or get off these lawyer led charges would not be too difficult.

The face at stake here is far more valuable than the money.

All my opinions (rather jaded and resigned I'll admit) here though folks and like I say I hope I'm wrong

There is no indication based on what? your expert opinion?

And then you go on with drivel about integrity and morals.

Try first visiting Thailand before posting nonsese

[weka]

Not wishing to be devil's advocate here but this crossed my mind:

You (admirably and understandably) want to ensure that no other animal at that vet gets the same terrible treatment as Pepper

But how will what you're doing ensure that their procedures will improve in say August or September?

Best case scenario, court rules in your favour and you get a refund, maybe some compensation money. Vet gets a scolding from the judge and is a bit out of pocket.

He will most probably, (don't forget where we are) abide by the court ruling, pay you and then what?

Well he'll talk badly about the interfering farang. He'll escape any disciplinary action from any ruling Vet authority. He'll have a story about the time a rich farang took him to court. And it'll be business as usual

There's no indication anything will change. Why should he change? Who will reassess his practices in 3, 6, 12 months time? In the west it would be followed up, but here? They've only taken 2014 years to write legislature covering cruelty to animals

That is the BEST case scenario

The worst (most likely) will be that he never turns up to court or just delays and delays for years.

I'm not being argumentative or disillusioned, it's just that I've been through a quest for justice here and the person I wanted to see behind bars has done all of the above and hasn't seen a cell yet.

Her crime, only premeditated murder.

She organised a shooting of a guy in the back seat of her car while she sat in the front. Total police confessions too. I turned up to about 5 court dates and she didn't ever show up. On each occasion the lawyer (probably in the same tone of voice as yours) remarked "oh she's in big trouble now. If she doesn't show up next time she'll go to jail for contempt. She doesn't have a leg to stand on"

3 years later she's got 2 legs in society totally free while we await the next court date.

Temper your expectations Faz. Decide what you think are really important outcomes and be prepared to modify your actions to meet them.

I totally agree with what you're feeling and that it'd be great for something meaningful to come out but I'm not sure the system here is set up to accommodate the justice that Pepper deserves.

I'm just saying expect several different scenarios from this - best case or nothing happens or it costs you a bit more money, etc.

I really hope it works out well mate and I REALLY hope one day soon you can say a big "Told You so" - I really do hope I'm wrong Faz, if so give it to me with both barrels

It's just that I learnt, via a heinous crime, that this place doesn't care much for justice

Its much more simple than you think.

When owner has to pay compensation, he will either fire all the old staff and take money out of their salary or will pay more attention NOT to be sued again.

Of course owner may learn nothing from it and continue down the same path, but at least the owner would be out of pocket and OP would not be

No mate, there is no indication that the owner will do any of what you mention.

Sure someone with professional integrity and a few morals may take remedial action but it's been readily established that this owner possesses none of those qualities. If he did he would have already remedied the issue. His obstinacy in front of the allegations suggests to me that this is now a battle between him and a complaining farang (yes of course that's wrong but what other indications does his dismissive behaviour suggest?).

Put another way, if I was "onside" with vet owner (i.e. he was family or some such), then conceiving a plan to delay, or get off these lawyer led charges would not be too difficult.

The face at stake here is far more valuable than the money.

All my opinions (rather jaded and resigned I'll admit) here though folks and like I say I hope I'm wrong

There is no indication based on what? your expert opinion?

And then you go on with drivel about integrity and morals.

Try first visiting Thailand before posting nonsese

Steady on chief, this was a reasonable discussion before you got all bolshy

You asserted "he will either fire all the old staff and take money out of their salary or will pay more attention NOT to be sued again."

There can be no evidence he WILL do these things. My opinion is as worthless as yours but my statement there is no evidence he WILL do these things is correct. Actually sacking the staff and taking money from them is a highly unlikely course of action for him to take as he would be extremely vulnerable to Labour Laws - possibly the strongest court in the land.

This whole case is about integrity and morals. The vet exhibited malpractice and refused to acknowledge that. Lack of professional integrity and the morals to apologise and remedy.

I fear this point will be further reinforced when court action achieves nil - (my opinion), so it WILL be ALL ABOUT morals and integrity

As for your assertion that I don't live in Thailand. Why would you say that? Does that increase the value of your opinion? Why don't you just say that I don't know as much as you, or would that be opinionated drivel?

It IS NOT much more simple than I think.

Edited June 18, 2015 by weka

[Liquorice]

Can I just add that the advice from 2 Lawyers, one of which I have employed, is that this case is highly unlikely to ever reach Court.

It would not be in the interest of the Clinic to make it a more public issue and the evidence against them is unquestionable.

The advice from both Lawyers is that they will settle before going to a Court hearing...........unless they are extremely stupid!

But as this is Thailand, who knows.

I'm prepared to take this all the way to Court if need be.

[konying]

Can I just add that the advice from 2 Lawyers, one of which I have employed, is that this case is highly unlikely to ever reach Court.

It would not be in the interest of the Clinic to make it a more public issue and the evidence against them is unquestionable.

The advice from both Lawyers is that they will settle before going to a Court hearing...........unless they are extremely stupid!

But as this is Thailand, who knows.

I'm prepared to take this all the way to Court if need be.

Lawyers are correct. It will cost them more to go to court than to settle.

[meatboy]

Can I just add that the advice from 2 Lawyers, one of which I have employed, is that this case is highly unlikely to ever reach Court.

It would not be in the interest of the Clinic to make it a more public issue and the evidence against them is unquestionable.

The advice from both Lawyers is that they will settle before going to a Court hearing...........unless they are extremely stupid!

But as this is Thailand, who knows.

I'm prepared to take this all the way to Court if need be.

i am with you on this faz,its not the money but satisfaction for pepper and yourself,and getting them to admit the pain and suffering to pepper and you that they were responsible for.

now if they did settle out of court and your satisfied.get your lawyer to tell them that you will give the settlement to say,soi dog foundation as a good will,and not to forget pepper and all like him are part of the family and therefore should expect the same treatment as human beings.

that is what we pay for and EXPECT.

giving any settlement away would give me great satisfaction and hopefully give the vet a pain in the gut.

meatboy love me love my dog.

[Liquorice]

I agree with your sentiments meatboy.

I'm pleased with the hip operation, they can keep the costs associated with that, which amounts to around 3,500 baht.

With ongoing Vet treatment and legal fees the costs above the hip operation currently stand at about 4,500 which is the figure I intend to reclaim, and likely to rise before it's finished.

The good news is that Pepper isn't in pain anymore, just some discomfort and a long healing process.

We regard a dog as a family member, but unfortunately many Thais don't.

100 baht for an injection and 200 baht to dispose of the body........get another dog, cheaper, less hassle, when things go wrong.

My next door neighbour is on his 4th dog in 15 months. When I asked what happened, he said dogs get sick.

This Buddha philosophy on the value of life is limited to the value of money, in my opinion.

Soi Dog Foundation have been very supportive of my actions and given me some good advice. It is my intention to donate any settlement to their organisation as thanks. The principal aim is to make this Veterinary Clinic understand that they have a duty of care to the animals they treat and they are not just pieces of disposable meat, and to review their aftercare of animals left in there charge and accept responsibility.

That may be a bridge to far, but hopefully it will make them think twice in the future.

[weka]

Hey Faz

How is Pepper doing?

With my dogs when they get crook or injured there is usually a day when they perk right up start to become their normal selves again. Waggy tails, moving around better etc

Is Pepper close to or out of the woods yet? so to speak

[Liquorice]

Thanks for your concerns.

His ear and side are beginning to grow new tissue now the infection has cleared up.

He's certainly becoming a bit more mobile now, but he'll always have a limp as expected.

My only concern is his lack of appetite.

Some days he won't touch a thing. The Vet gave him some tablets to increase his appetite and those worked while he was taking them, but since then he appears to have lost his appetite again.

He even turns his nose up at favourites, like milk and chocolate.

The Vet can't find anything wrong with him, I suppose he's just having his up and down days.

My lawyer is having problems contacting the owner, who is being evasive.

Hoping for something to happen this week on the legal issues.

[Patsycat]

Perhaps not name and shame the Clinic here on the open forum. but perhaps by pm to members here who may use the same vets. I have had, in the past in Europe, people telling me that sort of stuff about vets. And most of them were telling the truth. Luckily with a very sick cat i went elsewhere. And she survived.

Put the sod out of business discretely.

Paws crossed for Pepper to be back to his old self soon.

[Liquorice]

Thanks for your concern Patsycat, however I wouldn't know who lives in Roi Et on this forum.

However we do have a monthly Newsletter that is produced for local expats.

I'm going to do an article for this months issue to name and shame this Clinic.

Pepper is improving day by day, but a slow process.

He's off all medication now, just the bodies self healing process

I've been chasing up the lawyer, but he hasn't been in his office for a few days.

[isanbirder]

Thanks for your concern Patsycat, however I wouldn't know who lives in Roi Et on this forum.

However we do have a monthly Newsletter that is produced for local expats.

I'm going to do an article for this months issue to name and shame this Clinic.

Pepper is improving day by day, but a slow process.

He's off all medication now, just the bodies self healing process

I've been chasing up the lawyer, but he hasn't been in his office for a few days.

Don't publish the name, Faz. Even in a local newsletter, you could be sued, and you would probably lose.

Maybe, "If you want to know which clinic, please contact me." And even that I would check with the lawyer first.

[Liquorice]

Thanks isanbirder, however I found out that you cannot be sued for slander (verbal) or libel (written) if the facts are true.

It's only false statements that make you liable by law.

The onus would therefore be on the Clinic to prove Pepper was discharged in good health, my witnesses are lying, and the photographic evidence is false.

I somehow doubt they would want to go down that route which would publicise the facts even more.

He told us he was only the Doctor, not the owner, another false statement as we found out.

He's an arrogant, lying and evasive f***er, but I have all the time in the world and his day of reckoning will come, one way or another.

[isanbirder]

Technically you're right, Faz, but in front of a Thai judge? Be careful!