Lease on a new house

[sevinnow]

Within the next 3 months I intend to build a new house on Land registered to my thai gf in Issan.  

My question is can I have a lease agreement/contract for 30 years signed and sealed before the house is started?  My main concern is the house has not been given an address, hense not yet built, but could a lawyer complete those details after a contract has been signed by my gf and myself. :cool:

[pidster]

Don't really understand the question, why should you need a lease. If the land is owned by your gf then that's it there should not be any need for a lease on the land.

Regarding getting the house numbered that is achieved once the plans have been submitted for approval.

If you are trying to protect your interest (investment) in the house my understanding is that this is difficult to do. If the land is already registered in your gf's name I would be very surprised if she wanted change that situation.

A bit more background would be useful and I will try to provide any input I can, I have looked into this subject in some detail over the past few months.

[Liberator]

You can have a 30 year lease for the land (and 2 more already signed to give you a total of 90 years). You can also register the HOUSE in your name. Foreigners cannot own land, but they CAN OWN A HOUSE. You must register the house shortly before it is completed - not when you get the plans approved (only needed if house is bigger than 100 sq meters and has 2 floors or something like that) You can also include a clause in the land lease that means your girlfriend has to buy the house from you if she wants to sell the land, and that she can only sell it with your agreement.

That's about as much protection you can get, but it's pretty secure.

Chock dee

Liberator

[caughtintheact]

From my experience in property development, if the property is not in a Moo Baan, there's (at least) one other step you should take, and that is to get the local branch of the Land Department to resurvey the land to make sure that there is no encroachment on neighboring property.  I have a friend in the land department that bought property in his wife's home town, and then discovered that the initial survey was incorrect.  Encroachment can get expensive, as you have to settle with each neighbor on whose land you encroach, and this can get expensive.  Better to resurvey before you commit to the property and get a copy of the new official survey.  If the property is in a registered Moo Baan housing project, there are usually no problems of this sort.

[sevinnow]

Thanks for the imput.

Firstly I am not sure what a "Moo Baan" is although I have official papers from the Land Department stating that the land has been transfered from her father's name to her name (had this translated by a thai friend) and the papers are correctly stamped showing the size and area of the land in the village.

I want to protect my investment in a sensible way in case we are another statistic in the Thai/Farang stories.   My g/f fully agrees and has no problem with this arrangement.

My belief was I could have a lease signed in my name for 30 years plus and the land and house would remain in my g/f name.....not allowing her to sell or kick me out without my written consent and also if the laws change in Thailand and farangs can own land then I could have a clause in the lease transfering it to me if I wish.    Am I wrong?

[caughtintheact]

A Moo Baan is a village, a settlement or a housing project. The property developer is responsible for the surveys of the land.  

If the house was built on a piece of land that the father owned, it could be in a housing project, but could also be a piece of land that has not been surveyed since the land was purchased (and may never have been properly surveyed). The transfer papers are merely that, transfer of title, but that does not mean that the land has been properly surveyed.  If you have no neighbors on adjoining plots of land, you are OK for the time being, but if you are building in an area surrounded by neighbors, get a new survey.

I see no reason why you can't have the place leased to you by your girlfriend  - in effect it is alsmost like a pre-nuptial contract - but you should consult a good lawyer to get a factual reply rather than depending on the bits and pieces in this forum, because you ae talking about a legal contract of some type.  

No I'm not a lawyer.

[Morgan]

If as you say the land is in a village and if you and your girlfriend split up. You intend to stay living in the house all i can say is good luck. The wife and i have a house just outside a village in Isan.Of the two villages next to it 90% of people in one are related to her father. The other village 90% of people are related to her mother,thats with out friends and people they employ for the rice harvest. The only way i could stay in our house if anything happned to my wife is if the family wanted me to. As for selling i think you would have problems there to. IMHO this idea of a lease will work in Pattaya-Bangkok but not in a Isan village. If the split upsets the family i cant see you lasting a month in the village IMHO. Im not saying dont build the house,just dont put all your  faith in a lease there are other factors to consider.

Cheers Morgan.

[tracer]

agree with Morgan, no way you can prevent her kicking you out in a small village. I mean you make problem, you fall down the stairs with or without help and all they will say is drunk farang even if someone pushed you... Thais never fight alone

(afterall they might get hurt) so if you get a fight you got the fight with the whole  familly=village.

You can protect your property, but NOT that you can live there. Secondly do you WANT to live in ISAN. All year drunken sods (oops familly) walking in and expecting you to buy their beer...

Thirdly, you can rent 30 and 30 years, but I donot think it prevents her selling it, but anyway its the wrong way to do it.

You cannot enforce the second 30 years...

Your best protection if you really like that girl is to get a few kiddies, as after that her first priority is kids, number 2 parents, number 3 herself and you last. At the present familly will be number one and its essential to boot them out of that position unless you like getting cleaned out by permanently lazy and drunken Thai males...

[sevinnow]

Thanks for your imput guys.

Thinking about what tracer said maybe I should build a bungalow so the "Stairs" is something less to worry about!

But seriously I hear what you all say and to ignore the advice is to bury my head in the sand,something I am unaccustomed to do.     The land was previously lived on by her parants untill they moved for electricity reasons and her sister has a new house by an elderly farang when father decieded to sahre the land with the daughters, so the land suryey should be ok.

I think the answer lies in the "have kids" part, something we definatley wanted to do anyway so that's not a problem.

If anyone can think of a better way please tell me.

Thanks again :cool:

[Buccaneer]

agree with Morgan, no way you can prevent her kicking you out in a small village. I mean you make problem, you fall down the stairs with or without help and all they will say is drunk farang even if someone pushed you... Thais never fight alone

(afterall they might get hurt) so if you get a fight you got the fight with the whole  familly=village.

You can protect your property, but NOT that you can live there. Secondly do you WANT to live in ISAN. All year drunken sods (oops familly) walking in and expecting you to buy their beer...

Thirdly, you can rent 30 and 30 years, but I donot think it prevents her selling it, but anyway its the wrong way to do it.

You cannot enforce the second 30 years...

Your best protection if you really like that girl is to get a few kiddies, as after that her first priority is kids, number 2 parents, number 3 herself and you last. At the present familly will be number one and its essential to boot them out of that position unless you like getting cleaned out by permanently lazy and drunken Thai males...

Having been married (hapily, but lost afew bobs to free loaders) I can say that you are a great observer. The nation forum has a topic on dual pricing that you may want to read and respond to

Cheers

mar

[neenthewiser]

Your best protection if you really like that girl is to get a few kiddies, as after that her first priority is kids, number 2 parents, number 3 herself and you last. At the present familly will be number one and its essential to boot them out of that position unless you like getting cleaned out by permanently lazy and drunken Thai males...</font>

As succinct an encapsulation of Thai reality as you are likely to find anywhere. Well done Tracer.

[lovecam]

Morgan

You have just made the best comment ever on this forum. All of these people worrying about leases in villages up in the north.

They should think and realise that if they ever have a problem then yes, they may have the right of the lease, however i am sure they would leave and run a mile if the heavy mob come in and threatened them or worse still if anything was planted in their house one day

Great post Morgan