German welcome for refugees cools after New Year's Eve chaos

[MobileContent]

Just read the article, and was surprised to read how useless the police were. Not a single arrest.

Also, PC run amok from the politicians.

Actually their were not useless. The Bundespolizei is in charge of railways stations but they are all working on the borders in Bavaria.

I have a very high respect of German Police forces be it immigration, police, federal police etc but it is the politicians that are manipulating the police.

We have a very strong Union for the police in Germany and they have been complaining for the past 6 months already that laws get broken by politicians and the laws are not tough enough.

Example; Two asylum seekers have been arrested for stealing from someone a phone by robbery. In Singapore they will get 2-4 years and possible the cane but in Germany they got 1 week jail and are out again robbing. This <SNIPS> should be send back to their home country after serving a year in jail.

Lax laws is what brings down Germany and Europe in general.

Moroccons and Tunisian do need Asylum and they should be turned back to Greece and back on to one of those rubber boats.

Edited January 9, 2016 by MobileContent

[tribalfusion001]

I've seen messages that Thai girls get from Arabic men from Thai Friendly, Badoo, Skout etc, unpleasant stuff and they think it's ok to send filthy messages to complete strangers. So can be surprised when they act like this in public in Germany and other European countries? Muslim men who think that girls who were short skirts, high heels and make up are all hookers or deluded to think that the girls like being touched up! Kick them all out and close the borders.

[baboon]

I've seen messages that Thai girls get from Arabic men from Thai Friendly, Badoo, Skout etc, unpleasant stuff and they think it's ok to send filthy messages to complete strangers. So can be surprised when they act like this in public in Germany and other European countries? Muslim men who think that girls who were short skirts, high heels and make up are all hookers or deluded to think that the girls like being touched up! Kick them all out and close the borders.

Says a poster whose avatar is a T shirt emblazoned with "Fly Emirates"...?

[tribalfusion001]

I've seen messages that Thai girls get from Arabic men from Thai Friendly, Badoo, Skout etc, unpleasant stuff and they think it's ok to send filthy messages to complete strangers. So can be surprised when they act like this in public in Germany and other European countries? Muslim men who think that girls who were short skirts, high heels and make up are all hookers or deluded to think that the girls like being touched up! Kick them all out and close the borders.

Says a poster whose avatar is a T shirt emblazoned with "Fly Emirates"...?

I'm Arsenal supporter, not an Emirates supporter, I would prefer football shirts without a sponsor on them!

[baboon]

I've seen messages that Thai girls get from Arabic men from Thai Friendly, Badoo, Skout etc, unpleasant stuff and they think it's ok to send filthy messages to complete strangers. So can be surprised when they act like this in public in Germany and other European countries? Muslim men who think that girls who were short skirts, high heels and make up are all hookers or deluded to think that the girls like being touched up! Kick them all out and close the borders.

Says a poster whose avatar is a T shirt emblazoned with "Fly Emirates"...?

I'm Arsenal supporter, not an Emirates supporter, I would prefer football shirts without a sponsor on them!

An Arsenal supporter into the bargain. Strike two...

[tribalfusion001]

I've seen messages that Thai girls get from Arabic men from Thai Friendly, Badoo, Skout etc, unpleasant stuff and they think it's ok to send filthy messages to complete strangers. So can be surprised when they act like this in public in Germany and other European countries? Muslim men who think that girls who were short skirts, high heels and make up are all hookers or deluded to think that the girls like being touched up! Kick them all out and close the borders.

Says a poster whose avatar is a T shirt emblazoned with "Fly Emirates"...?

I'm Arsenal supporter, not an Emirates supporter, I would prefer football shirts without a sponsor on them!

An Arsenal supporter into the bargain. Strike two...

Top of the league!

[Usernames]

And we can thank Merkel for housing the Paris police station attacker in one of her "asylum seeker" shelters, too. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/12091489/German-asylum-seeker-shelter-which-housed-Paris-police-station-attacker-raided.html

[katana]

Ironic that today (Saturday) many hundreds of German police broke up PEGIDA's demo in Cologne against the New Year's Eve assaults, but they couldn't manage to protect German women there on New Year's Eve.

Edited January 10, 2016 by katana

[katana]

Interesting article on the refuge crisis in Europe:

https://www.rt.com/op-edge/328378-europe-demoralized-invaded-violated/

[Usernames]

Ironic that today (Saturday) many hundreds of German police broke up PEGIDA's demo in Cologne against the New Year's Eve assaults, but they couldn't manage to protect German women there on New Year's Eve.

This very state of affairs was predicted over 40 years ago in Camp of the Saints, where the author described European governments turning their police and military against their own people in order to allow a massive horde of Third Worlders to march in and take everything they wanted. BTW, I notice that the communist counter demonstration was untouched by police. Germany is now a communist dictatorship with a rigorous system of censorship (regulating FB, twitter, online comments) and police state provisions (prosecution for "hate" speech) to enforce Merkel's one person totalitarian rule. West Germany did not absorb East Germany. The East German communists took over the West German state.

[Gutenberg]

We have a very strong Union for the police in Germany and they have been complaining for the past 6 months already that laws get broken by politicians and the laws are not tough enough.

Example; Two asylum seekers have been arrested for stealing from someone a phone by robbery. In Singapore they will get 2-4 years and possible the cane but in Germany they got 1 week jail and are out again robbing. This <SNIPS> should be send back to their home country after serving a year in jail.

Lax laws is what brings down Germany and Europe in general.

I don't feel that the German/EU laws are to lax. There are high sentences and fines for all kind of minor crimes. For stealing you get a criminal record, then you get a fine, then probation and then you end in jail. This is how it works and it works really good.

Send a guy who stole a phone to prison for years, who pays the $100.000 for that? Of course the tax payer. And while we are at that, how many years the super market cashier lady should get for stealing those 1,20 EUR from returnable bottles? Maybe we should cut her hands off, just to give the sharia law in Singapore some credit.

There is no need to install a police state because of poor people stealing, but Germany is already implementing massive anti citizen laws.

The only problem Germany has with laws is that only Germans without a migrant/"refugee" background get the full wrath of German law applied.

Example:

If you are a migrant and you hit someone fatally on the head, you will get 3 years.

If you are a German and you hit someone fatally on the head, you will get at least 10 years.

At the end, it is not nice to compare Germany law system with sharia law in Singapore!

Edited January 10, 2016 by Gutenberg

[lovinglife]

This will get a hell of a lot worse before it can get better.

Liberals are hell bent on pursuing their ideals even when the evidence is against it, ordinary people are far wiser than most politicians when it comes to social issues of this kind.

I don't think "liberals" are in favor of mass migration from uncivilized war-torn areas. And in case you didn't know, radical Islam is totally opposed to western liberal ideas of individual freedom.

Sound like you are American and your interpretation of the word 'liberal' is very different to mine, probably the equivalent of 'centre-right' in the UK. Imagine the damage someone like Corbyn could do?

[thaibeachlovers]

Seen in the newspaper. Merkel has actually muttered something along the lines of "I was wrong, and let's deport any of them that does something bad".

It took the truth about the numbers of "asylum seekers" among the thugs to force her hand though.

[Saradoc1972]

We have a very strong Union for the police in Germany and they have been complaining for the past 6 months already that laws get broken by politicians and the laws are not tough enough.

Example; Two asylum seekers have been arrested for stealing from someone a phone by robbery. In Singapore they will get 2-4 years and possible the cane but in Germany they got 1 week jail and are out again robbing. This <SNIPS> should be send back to their home country after serving a year in jail.

Lax laws is what brings down Germany and Europe in general.

I don't feel that the German/EU laws are to lax. There are high sentences and fines for all kind of minor crimes. For stealing you get a criminal record, then you get a fine, then probation and then you end in jail. This is how it works and it works really good.

Send a guy who stole a phone to prison for years, who pays the $100.000 for that? Of course the tax payer. And while we are at that, how many years the super market cashier lady should get for stealing those 1,20 EUR from returnable bottles? Maybe we should cut her hands off, just to give the sharia law in Singapore some credit.

There is no need to install a police state because of poor people stealing, but Germany is already implementing massive anti citizen laws.

The only problem Germany has with laws is that only Germans without a migrant/"refugee" background get the full wrath of German law applied.

Example:

If you are a migrant and you hit someone fatally on the head, you will get 3 years.

If you are a German and you hit someone fatally on the head, you will get at least 10 years.

At the end, it is not nice to compare Germany law system with sharia law in Singapore!

Pray tell on what distant planet or in which alternate reality your personal Germany and Singapore are??

Singapore is not a Muslim state, Islam is religion no. 4 there, and the Sharia courts they have can only adjudicate family matters.

Maybe their rather draconian criminal law misled you here, but it's not Sharia and they don't do mutilations.

About the situation in Germany I can speak as a lawyer, worked 3 months for prosecution and another 3 month for police in Wuppertal when serving my articles.

Firstly, the lady who misappropriated the coupons for returnable bottles never was prosecuted, would have been a straight §153 StPO, i.e. negligible mens rea,

this matter went to a labour court and she was exonerated as she had been working in that supermarket for over 25y with no misgivings.

Secondly, prison in Germany costs between 1.500 and 2.000 Euro per months, depending on the Land, obviously short term prisoners are more costly as they

are difficult to be put to work, work for convicts is rather scarce (about 1/3 quota). So your 100k per year are way off.

Thirdly, with a view to theft a culprit may actually go scot-free on his first offense, particularly if the value of whatever he stole was under 50 Euro. The southern

states are much more strict here, but unless the theft was about the crown jewels or Merkel's cell-phone there is a good chance for a §153 StPO or maybe a fine

of a couple hundred Euros under §153a StPO on the first occurrence. NO criminal record, no nothing.

A first conviction for theft will usually be well below the 90 day (i.e. pay 90 days' worth of your net income) threshold, criminal conviction only visible if you apply for

a post as a civil servant, not for usual employers. Next conviction will not be much higher. Third conviction will usually still be a fine. Next two convictions will be

suspended sentences. Or something like that.

So that is is one true thing in your post, to get an actual prison sentence for theft in Germany, you'd have to get convicted at least 5 times, unless it was s.th.

extraordinary. Juvenile court works a little different but along the same lines.

There will not be a rebate for migrants as such, could happen in extraordinary circumstances, but not to the extend you are supposing.

Lastly, there is no EU criminal law as such. For a very limited number of cases there is EU legislation that member states have to enact criminal legislation

within their own discretion and system, I think youth pornography was the first case. Otherwise direct effectiveness of EU regulations might actually get somebody

tried under national laws off the hook, can't remember the case, was back in the 90ies.

[Gutenberg]

We have a very strong Union for the police in Germany and they have been complaining for the past 6 months already that laws get broken by politicians and the laws are not tough enough.

Example; Two asylum seekers have been arrested for stealing from someone a phone by robbery. In Singapore they will get 2-4 years and possible the cane but in Germany they got 1 week jail and are out again robbing. This <SNIPS> should be send back to their home country after serving a year in jail.

Lax laws is what brings down Germany and Europe in general.

I don't feel that the German/EU laws are to lax. There are high sentences and fines for all kind of minor crimes. For stealing you get a criminal record, then you get a fine, then probation and then you end in jail. This is how it works and it works really good.

Send a guy who stole a phone to prison for years, who pays the $100.000 for that? Of course the tax payer. And while we are at that, how many years the super market cashier lady should get for stealing those 1,20 EUR from returnable bottles? Maybe we should cut her hands off, just to give the sharia law in Singapore some credit.

There is no need to install a police state because of poor people stealing, but Germany is already implementing massive anti citizen laws.

The only problem Germany has with laws is that only Germans without a migrant/"refugee" background get the full wrath of German law applied.

Example:

If you are a migrant and you hit someone fatally on the head, you will get 3 years.

If you are a German and you hit someone fatally on the head, you will get at least 10 years.

At the end, it is not nice to compare Germany law system with sharia law in Singapore!

Pray tell on what distant planet or in which alternate reality your personal Germany and Singapore are??

Singapore is not a Muslim state, Islam is religion no. 4 there, and the Sharia courts they have can only adjudicate family matters.

Maybe their rather draconian criminal law misled you here, but it's not Sharia and they don't do mutilations.

About the situation in Germany I can speak as a lawyer, worked 3 months for prosecution and another 3 month for police in Wuppertal when serving my articles.

Firstly, the lady who misappropriated the coupons for returnable bottles never was prosecuted, would have been a straight §153 StPO, i.e. negligible mens rea,

this matter went to a labour court and she was exonerated as she had been working in that supermarket for over 25y with no misgivings.

Secondly, prison in Germany costs between 1.500 and 2.000 Euro per months, depending on the Land, obviously short term prisoners are more costly as they

are difficult to be put to work, work for convicts is rather scarce (about 1/3 quota). So your 100k per year are way off.

Thirdly, with a view to theft a culprit may actually go scot-free on his first offense, particularly if the value of whatever he stole was under 50 Euro. The southern

states are much more strict here, but unless the theft was about the crown jewels or Merkel's cell-phone there is a good chance for a §153 StPO or maybe a fine

of a couple hundred Euros under §153a StPO on the first occurrence. NO criminal record, no nothing.

A first conviction for theft will usually be well below the 90 day (i.e. pay 90 days' worth of your net income) threshold, criminal conviction only visible if you apply for

a post as a civil servant, not for usual employers. Next conviction will not be much higher. Third conviction will usually still be a fine. Next two convictions will be

suspended sentences. Or something like that.

So that is is one true thing in your post, to get an actual prison sentence for theft in Germany, you'd have to get convicted at least 5 times, unless it was s.th.

extraordinary. Juvenile court works a little different but along the same lines.

There will not be a rebate for migrants as such, could happen in extraordinary circumstances, but not to the extend you are supposing.

Lastly, there is no EU criminal law as such. For a very limited number of cases there is EU legislation that member states have to enact criminal legislation

within their own discretion and system, I think youth pornography was the first case. Otherwise direct effectiveness of EU regulations might actually get somebody

tried under national laws off the hook, can't remember the case, was back in the 90ies.

The easiest way to detect a Muslim country is to check the flag. Ok, let's go Singapore,

Btw, I think the 5 Turks who killed the Thai Johnny K. in Germany and got around 1-2 years in prison are really happy to be Germans with Turk immigration background instead of plain Germans.

[Gutenberg]

Firstly, the lady who misappropriated the coupons for returnable bottles never was prosecuted, would have been a straight §153 StPO, i.e. negligible mens rea,

this matter went to a labour court and she was exonerated as she had been working in that supermarket for over 25y with no misgivings.

Secondly, prison in Germany costs between 1.500 and 2.000 Euro per months, depending on the Land, obviously short term prisoners are more costly as they

are difficult to be put to work, work for convicts is rather scarce (about 1/3 quota). So your 100k per year are way off.

Not sure why you need to start your enumerations, I was mocking the statement that German laws are too lax and in the case of stricter laws, where would the German nation be headed? Imprison citizen who cash-in returnable bottles from someone else? Cut their hands off? Rhetoric, do you see it?

About your "1500 - 2000" EUR numbers, well, as an ex-prosecutor you should know that before a prison term, there is always much more happening, e.g. judges, lawyers, prosecutors involved, court hearings, paper battles, etc. How much would it cost to criminalize all those returnable bottles thefts if they would be imprisoned for years?

[Saradoc1972]

The easiest way to detect a Muslim country is to check the flag. Ok, let's go Singapore,

Btw, I think the 5 Turks who killed the Thai Johnny K. in Germany and got around 1-2 years in prison are really happy to be Germans with Turk immigration background instead of plain Germans.

Fails with Singapore. Crescent was adopted because the Muslim minority wished for it to be included. Look it up here. All that work uploading that flag and no point to it.

The SIX German-Turks got unconditional custodial sentences between 2y 3 months and 2y 8months for aggravated assault, partially in juvenile court where things work somewhat different,

it was held they had not wanted to kill that German-Thai or saw that coming. You might be referring to the time they actually served before going to open prison, which means they were

actually working, for a start and probably for the first time in their lives. The main culprit got 4.5 years in normal court.

As things are, I cannot argue with you here. That leader had already 3 convictions, minimum penalty is 3 years, the judges assumed a mitigation because press had reported

on the 6 as "murderers". Should not have played a role, to my mind. And should have been closer to 9 years (3+15 maximum/2). Would have been in the UK, so much is for sure.

That migration background does not count for anything as such. With German.Turks there is a relatively high chance they had difficult childhoods and violence in the family

and were "educated" to be Muslim-supermen. That might be counted as mitigating factors, but just the same way as with bio-Germans. There was actually one juvenile court

judge who in a book bemoaned the way German criminal justice worked in general with mitigations of all sorts, especially in Berlin, which is somewhat notorious. Here.

Well, strange way of arguing on your part here, it seemed you were regarding the sentences in German criminal law as adequate. In fact they are a joke, and along with

conditions in German prisons are unlikely to deter some underclass have-nots from Arabian hell-holes of countries. To lose the right to asylum you'd have to be convicted

to 3 years unconditionally, as things are, and that is hard to come by in Germany, especially for young offenders.

Btw. that's what politicians are discussing about after NYE, like should they get deported after a 1y custodial sentence or even after 1y conditional sentence. Some hot-shot

was suggesting that a 90 day conviction or a second non-custodial sentence should suffice, Well, deport them where-to? Things in Germany are a bloody mess and no end in sight.

[Saradoc1972]

Not sure why you need to start your enumerations, I was mocking the statement that German laws are too lax and in the case of stricter laws, where would the German nation be headed? Imprison citizen who cash-in returnable bottles from someone else? Cut their hands off? Rhetoric, do you see it?

About your "1500 - 2000" EUR numbers, well, as an ex-prosecutor you should know that before a prison term, there is always much more happening, e.g. judges, lawyers, prosecutors involved, court hearings, paper battles, etc. How much would it cost to criminalize all those returnable bottles thefts if they would be imprisoned for years?

OK, got you now. Thought there was s.th. odd.

But let's just forget about the bottles, that was not about criminal law (and should not be), rather an important labour law case.

The costs for imprisonment I was quoting exclude those numbers, but they are still nowhere in the region. On that note, Norway apparently

decided last year to just not prosecute criminal foreigners from non-western countries any more, but just deport them to save on those costs

deciding there wouldn't be a return on input as there would be no need to re-socialize someone in prison who would be deported anyway.

Might be a way.

[Yahooka]

Any normal,hard working citizen of Germany or the rest Europe who welcomed this invasion who in the end will lead to the destruction of the

welfare state has serious mental deficencies or is just blindly naive.Just as insane as a farmer would be if he welcomed a swarm of locuses to his crop !

[mopar71]

Any normal,hard working citizen of Germany or the rest Europe who welcomed this invasion who in the end will lead to the destruction of the

welfare state has serious mental deficencies or is just blindly naive.Just as insane as a farmer would be if he welcomed a swarm of locuses to his crop !

They also share in the blame for any deaths, rapes, assaults and various other crimes committed.

[katana]

Sixteen year-old German girl talks about her heartfelt fears regarding Muslim immigration and the destruction of her own country (Engl. subs).

Edited January 23, 2016 by katana