Sweden: masked men threaten to attack migrant children

[i claudius]

Masked men threaten to attack migrant children - there is nothing unclear about that headline to me. It means that masked men threated to attack migrant children.

Whether these children are 5 or 15, the article doesn't say, but either way, masked men attacking children reminds me of Nazi tactics.

Masked man threatening to attack migrant children - that's one of the most disturbing headlines I have read in a while. And you talk about "justice" returning to Sweden? You should be ashamed of yourself.

Children, mainly six feet tall with beards, or heavy stubble. I've seen plenty of videos of them and would not describe them as children. Media lies flowing thick and fast. Good to finally see some notion of justice returning to Sweden.

Yes the headline is an alarming one for sure but you need to look deeper into this. These kids are mainly young men.

Now let me think

Nazi tactics

, looting and burning shops owned by Jews attacking Jews who were just living in Germany and going about their daily business, painting nazi swastikas on their doors and making them wear the star of David on their sleeves

Masked men attacking "children"

who grope girls between their legs , slap their faces if the protest ,attack security guards , steal and sleep rough in the stations .

So you think both these sorts of people are the same? interesting .

bet you read the Guardian .

Edited February 2, 2016 by i claudius

[thaibeachlovers]

I do not always believe headlines, but if the media reports that "masked men" threaten to attack children (and see that many TV readers applaud it) if feel rather nauseated.

Please guide me to a source showing that the "children" are "youth", explain why the headline doesn't use the word youth, and explain to me why it makes any difference whether masked men threaten to attack children or "youth".

Masked man threatening to attack migrant children - that's one of the most disturbing headlines I have read in a while. And you talk about "justice" returning to Sweden? You should be ashamed of yourself.

Children, mainly six feet tall with beards, or heavy stubble. I've seen plenty of videos of them and would not describe them as children. Media lies flowing thick and fast. Good to finally see some notion of justice returning to Sweden.

Do you always believe news headlines and what the media say?

Do some research and the "children" suddenly become "youths" - and not even young small youths at that.

I can't give a source, but it is well known that the western media is full of loony lefties trying to encourage unlimited immigration of all the world's troubled peoples to the west. It is also well known that the media use distortions that support their agenda. Therefore, it is not unreasonable to believe that if they can try and sway public opinion by calling youths children, they will do so.

If anyone takes everything written by the media as the truth, I have a bridge to sell you.

[7by7]

I see that the usual hate, ignorance and prejudice is being posted by the usual people.

A minority of migrants/refugees/asylum seekers (choose your preferred adjective) in Europe are criminals; a minority have assaulted women in their host country.

Therefore it is, according to many of TVF's members, perfectly acceptable for gangs of masked men to threaten violence, even commit violence, against all of them!

I wonder what their reaction would be to gangs of masked Thais threatening Westerners in Thailand because some Western tourists are criminals and some assault women; some are even paedophiles.

Support for the gangs? Doubt it; more likely to be outrage that they are being lumped in with the minority who are criminals.

There is also the usual dragging up of Islamic conquests in the past; whilst ignoring the historical facts that Western European Christian countries conquered far more territory and enslaved far more people than Muslim powers ever did.

Then we have the tired old excuse that many Muslim countries don't observe human rights (forgetting that many do) so we should ignore the human rights of these migrants. An argument coming from those trying to convince us that we are better than Islam!

How is acting barbarously towards others, even if we consider them to be barbarous, proving anything except that we are barbarians too?

[thaibeachlovers]

I see that the usual hate, ignorance and prejudice is being posted by the usual people.

A minority of migrants/refugees/asylum seekers (choose your preferred adjective) in Europe are criminals; a minority have assaulted women in their host country.

Therefore it is, according to many of TVF's members, perfectly acceptable for gangs of masked men to threaten violence, even commit violence, against all of them!

I wonder what their reaction would be to gangs of masked Thais threatening Westerners in Thailand because some Western tourists are criminals and some assault women; some are even paedophiles.

Support for the gangs? Doubt it; more likely to be outrage that they are being lumped in with the minority who are criminals.

There is also the usual dragging up of Islamic conquests in the past; whilst ignoring the historical facts that Western European Christian countries conquered far more territory and enslaved far more people than Muslim powers ever did.

Then we have the tired old excuse that many Muslim countries don't observe human rights (forgetting that many do) so we should ignore the human rights of these migrants. An argument coming from those trying to convince us that we are better than Islam!

How is acting barbarously towards others, even if we consider them to be barbarous, proving anything except that we are barbarians too?

You ignore the fact that many of them should never have been allowed to enter Europe in the first place, given that they are not refugees, and also, what do you expect if one's government allows such alien people's to roam around willy nilly.

It is only human nature to repel the invader, always has been.

It is worth noting that Australia does not have such scenes, given that illegals never reach Australia's shores and they only take as many refugees as can be handled properly.

[7by7]

Geography not your strong point?

Australia is much further away and more difficult to reach from Syria and the other war zones than is Europe!

Australia took in far more Vietnamese boat people than European countries. It's closer!

I am not denying that there is a crisis, never have. Measures need to be taken to sort the wheat from the chaff; to offer protection to those who genuinely deserve and need it and to return home those that don't.

That is what a civilised group of nations would do; just as we did at the end of WWII, and before.

Attacking all migrants because some of them are criminals; attacking all migrants because they follow a different religion: pure xenophobia and hate.

[Happy Grumpy]

Some people will blame the victims.

If they weren't there, it wouldn't have happened!

[Scott]

Unaccompanied minor children, even if they are in their late teens should not be allowed to be out and about without a guardian. Since they are unaccompanied, that would be the caregivers at the facilities that should be supervising them. They aren't prisoners, but they are still technically children and need to be following the same rules and regulations as any juvenile in a care facility.

In addition to being under age, they are in a culture that is alien to them and some have probably been traumatized by the war zones they have been living in and the journey to Europe.

It's best to deal with these young people quickly and efficiently. If these loosely constructed gangs are a problem now, just wait until they get really hardened.

[Steely Dan]

Despite the best efforts of some to downplay the bad behavior of migrants to Sweden the populace does have a breaking point. Of course there are and will always be a small number of out and out racists whose behavior is shaped by their racism alone. Over and above this people in general are losing patience with the numbers and behavior of migrants. The vigilantism on display now is in my view not solely due to the far right, but a symptom that large sections of the population have had enough. The tipping point is very close if not already here.

http://www.thomaswictor.com/xenophobia-or-realism-i-know-what-i-think/

[thaibeachlovers]

Geography not your strong point?

Australia is much further away and more difficult to reach from Syria and the other war zones than is Europe!

Australia took in far more Vietnamese boat people than European countries. It's closer!

I am not denying that there is a crisis, never have. Measures need to be taken to sort the wheat from the chaff; to offer protection to those who genuinely deserve and need it and to return home those that don't.

That is what a civilised group of nations would do; just as we did at the end of WWII, and before.

Attacking all migrants because some of them are criminals; attacking all migrants because they follow a different religion: pure xenophobia and hate.

Nothing to do with Oz being far away ( Christmas Island isn't far from Indonesia where the illegal boat people leave from ) from Europe, and all to do with the policy of depositing illegal boat people offshore. It has stopped most ( ?all ) of the boat people, which was it's intention.

Had the Euro coast guard returned all those it rescues on the sea to where they came from, the flood would become a trickle. The media will never tell the facts, but I would guess that the vast majority are illegal economic migrants rather than genuine refugees. I say that because a genuine refugee wouldn't have the funds to pay the traffickers, and would be forced to remain in the first safe country they came to.

[Scott]

Refugees are not determined by the amount of money that they have, but economic migrants often are.

They are not mutually exclusive.

[simple1]

Geography not your strong point?

Australia is much further away and more difficult to reach from Syria and the other war zones than is Europe!

Australia took in far more Vietnamese boat people than European countries. It's closer!

I am not denying that there is a crisis, never have. Measures need to be taken to sort the wheat from the chaff; to offer protection to those who genuinely deserve and need it and to return home those that don't.

That is what a civilised group of nations would do; just as we did at the end of WWII, and before.

Attacking all migrants because some of them are criminals; attacking all migrants because they follow a different religion: pure xenophobia and hate.

Nothing to do with Oz being far away ( Christmas Island isn't far from Indonesia where the illegal boat people leave from ) from Europe, and all to do with the policy of depositing illegal boat people offshore. It has stopped most ( ?all ) of the boat people, which was it's intention.

Had the Euro coast guard returned all those it rescues on the sea to where they came from, the flood would become a trickle. The media will never tell the facts, but I would guess that the vast majority are illegal economic migrants rather than genuine refugees. I say that because a genuine refugee wouldn't have the funds to pay the traffickers, and would be forced to remain in the first safe country they came to.

Only a relatively small number of instances did Oz government 'turn around the boats' by ensuring the vessels safe return by Oz government, transferring then to sea going lifeboats etc that required, albeit resentful, acceptance of the Indo government. The policy which proved to be effective was refusal to accept any refugees arriving by sea permission to reside in Oz even if they were proven to be positively vetted. Roughly 75% of refugees in Oz offshore detention are now deemed to be genuine refugees.

The volume of small boats / dinghies departing Turkey is huge and would assume in most instances they would be unsafe to 'turn around'. 'Vessels' departing from Libya could not be 'turned around' as currently there is not a viable national government to process returnees.

It has recently been reported the number of asylum seekers in EU countries being assessed as economic refugees has increased from 40% to 60%, I understand the majority of economic refugees originate from Balkan countries.

I'm fairly certain you would have read Scott's posts who has actual hands on experience. On a number of occasions Scott has outlined genuine asylum seekers utilising the services of human traffickers, often sell their assets. It has been identified that refugees in countries such as Turkey departed as they were close to running out of cash to support themselves, the vast majority do not have access to UNHCR camps and have to pay rent, subsidise their food costs and so on. It was only last month that Turkey passed legislation that refugees would be permitted to work. From 2012 Turkey has expended at least US$5 billion in hosting refugees on it's territory and has yet to receive the promised additional funding and resources promised by governments; same scenario applies to Lebanon & other countries with very large refugee populations.

Edited February 2, 2016 by simple1

[Steely Dan]

Here is a translation of the flyer the supposed 'far right' handed out, also of note there were no police reports of anyone being attacked. As Orwell wrote, slavery is freedom, ignorance is strength.

https://acidmuncher.wordpress.com/2016/02/02/no-nazis-didnt-set-out-to-attack-children/

[i claudius]

Geography not your strong point?

Australia is much further away and more difficult to reach from Syria and the other war zones than is Europe!

Australia took in far more Vietnamese boat people than European countries. It's closer!

I am not denying that there is a crisis, never have. Measures need to be taken to sort the wheat from the chaff; to offer protection to those who genuinely deserve and need it and to return home those that don't.

That is what a civilised group of nations would do; just as we did at the end of WWII, and before.

Attacking all migrants because some of them are criminals; attacking all migrants because they follow a different religion: pure xenophobia and hate.

If they are in Germany they have crossed many safe countrys , they are now economic migrants , they should be returned back to the first safe country next door to theirs .

[7by7]

So, in your opinion, refugees should be returned to the closest safe country to where they came from; and if it's safe to the country they originally came from.

Do you apply that to all refugees; or just those of a certain religion and/or ethnicity?

To be consistent, and avoid accusations of prejudice at best, racism at worst, you must apply it to all refugees. Regardless of where they came from, their religion and their ethnicity.

So you must also believe that the European Jewish refugees and their descendants living in Israel should be returned to the countries they originally came from; or if that's not safe the nearest country to that.

But I bet that you don't.

[arjunadawn]

Refugees and migrants are not the same thing. One more example of the degradation of language for political expediency.

For years many have noted the decay of Sweden specifically. For years people have commented on the insane policies of self loathing that was replacing the host population with another, preying on the host's natural inclination to assist those in need. For years people have observed the media evidencing a bias that was so comprehensive and synchronous that suggested the media itself was colluding with the State. We now know all of these things are correct.

As stated previously, the problems related to this massive national grand theft will manifest in the State obfuscating the threat but worse, attacking those that protest their own rape and dissolution. This OP is but one of numerous examples evident every day now.

[nontabury]

Why is it when the far left PC brigade loose the argument, they resort to name calling. Bigots,racist,ignorant and prejudice etc ?

It's these same people who cause part of the problem,as they're not prepared to acknowledge that there is in fact a problem. PC dictates that it's better to pretends everything is OK,especially if it does't effect them directly.

Edited February 3, 2016 by nontabury

[simple1]

So, in your opinion, refugees should be returned to the closest safe country to where they came from; and if it's safe to the country they originally came from.

Do you apply that to all refugees; or just those of a certain religion and/or ethnicity?

To be consistent, and avoid accusations of prejudice at best, racism at worst, you must apply it to all refugees. Regardless of where they came from, their religion and their ethnicity.

So you must also believe that the European Jewish refugees and their descendants living in Israel should be returned to the countries they originally came from; or if that's not safe the nearest country to that.

But I bet that you don't.

The current list of safe countries by Germany is in the URL below, to which Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia were recently added. To blame asylum seekers for transiting through safe EU countries is really nonsense as it is legally permitted under EU legislation. As we have seen some EU countries have recently updated their local laws to address this issue. Again blaming refugees entering EU from bordering countries is just that 'a blame game'; it is the failure of relevant countries to enforce laws or failure to comply to the Dublin Treaties.

http://www.dw.com/en/germany-shuts-out-refugees-with-safe-states-list/a-18615010

[DM07]

Any attack by any masked men on anyone is despicable!

But for sure, TVF's finest will find a way to justify all kinds of violence against "Muslim- Jihadists" or simple "economic- refugees", taking away "work, living space" or "women" from them!

It's a truly sad affair!

What is really sad is the environment created by pc politicians and neutered police that allows thousands of illegal immigrants to break laws whilst being looked after by the state.

There wouldn't be masked men attacking people if the laws were enforced in the first place.

What is really sad, is the climate of WAR in places, where these people come from and that is often fought in "our" interests!

What is really sad, that all and every excuse will be found by the uber- right, to justify all acts of violence against refugees!

"There wouldn't be masked men attacking people if the laws were enforced in the first place."

Seriously?

Vigilante justice?

That is what you are justifying?

THAT is REALLY sad!

Do you have comprehension or reading difficulties?

If the laws were enforced properly, illegal immigrants wouldn't have been allowed to swamp the genuine refugees and trek unregistered through Europe. Migrants, whether refugees or illegal economic migrants are subject to the law of the country they are in. Not their law, Sharia law, their cultural norms or above the laws.

Softly softly biased policing inevitable creates problems from those who associate themselves with the victims or feel they are witnessing a multi-tier legal system with one law for some and a different one for others.

It just shows how out of touch some pc politicians are in believing they can apply the law to suit political agendas, and instruct the police not to reveal pertinent information. These ill behaved illegal immigrants flooding into Europe and acting outside the law, with apparent impunity, are likely to be the last straw.

If they went to a rich Arab country and acted like that, guess what would happen?

No, I comprehend and read quiet fine!

But maybe you have problems?!

So YOU decide which laws are enforced "properly" and if they (in your opinion) are not enforced properly, it is okay, for the "average man" to take matters in their won hand!

Is that what you are saying?

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies removed.

The topic is about attacks on migrant children.

Stay on topic. Continued gratuitous trolling will result in suspension.

[GeorgesAbitbol]

Children, mainly six feet tall with beards, or heavy stubble. I've seen plenty of videos of them and would not describe them as children. Media lies flowing thick and fast. Good to finally see some notion of justice returning to Sweden.

In civilized countries the people rely on justice and do not take the law in their own hand.

You re probably the same who is upset when Daesh kill christian chidlren, right?

[Richard W]

So you must also believe that the European Jewish refugees and their descendants living in Israel should be returned to the countries they originally came from; or if that's not safe the nearest country to that.

They think they've returned to the land they originally came from!

[Steely Dan]

Sweden has reached a tipping point, outside the bubble of the MSM the social media is flooded with Swedes finally daring to vent their true feelings.

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/7363/sweden-death-by-immigration

The atmosphere on social media is now almost revolutionary. People are posting videos of themselves accusing the government of murder, of filling Sweden with violent people and completely ignoring Swedes.

Edited February 4, 2016 by Steely Dan

[arjunadawn]

Sweden has reached a tipping point, outside the bubble of the MSM the social media is flooded with Swedes finally daring to vent their true feelings.

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/7363/sweden-death-by-immigration

The atmosphere on social media is now almost revolutionary. People are posting videos of themselves accusing the government of murder, of filling Sweden with violent people and completely ignoring Swedes.

Malcolm Gladwell in "The Tipping Point" demonstrated the unassailable proofs that memes, fads, thoughts, and even hysteria in populations reaches a certain specific gravity from which the underlying presumptions takes on a weight greater than its parts (my take on his point). As stated before by you and others, we will begin to see Sweden and other EU countries taking matters into their own hands because of an absence of constructive narrative from the government. In fact, as predicted, the State will respond to the problem by attacking those who object to their own abuse. And this will cycle into a separate reality with the State firmly opposed to its own citizens and they opposed to the State using migrants to injure their country. Watch!

[7by7]

Why is it when the far left PC brigade loose the argument, they resort to name calling. Bigots,racist,ignorant and prejudice etc ?

It's these same people who cause part of the problem,as they're not prepared to acknowledge that there is in fact a problem. PC dictates that it's better to pretends everything is OK,especially if it does't effect them directly.

As far as I am aware, no one here, whatever their politics, has ever denied that there is a problem.

But those of us who acknowledge that not all these people are economic migrants but many (most probably) are genuine refugees and also acknowledge that many (probably most) are not thieves, rapists etc. are constantly being described in the manner above; and very often labelled as apologists for criminals and even apologists for terrorists!

Usually by the same people who deny that the vast majority of these wretched people are actually not in Europe at all; but in neighbouring Middle East or North African countries.

Resorting to such tactics is the real indicator of someone who cannot support their argument.

[7by7]

So you must also believe that the European Jewish refugees and their descendants living in Israel should be returned to the countries they originally came from; or if that's not safe the nearest country to that.

They think they've returned to the land they originally came from!

Really?

They were returning to the land their ancestors may have migrated from 100s of years previously; not all, very few in fact, European Jews have 100% Semitic blood.

And, ajarnadawn, they did so for a better life, not because they were still not safe in Europe. How does that make them different from the refugees in the current crisis?

I suspect it's simply a matter of religion in your case.

[Rimmer]

Off topic post and link removed, the topic is about:

Sweden: masked men threaten to attack migrant children

[Steely Dan]

Back on topic (which isn't Jewish genetics), here is an English translation of the statements made by those threatening to attack the alleged children. Makes a very interesting read, they come over very much as the average man in the street who has just had enough of the ruin leftist politicians have caused. Incidentally by the EU's own admission 60% are not refugees and a poll of the refugees found 13% admitted to sympathizing with ISIS, I expect the number to be much higher among the economic migrants.

https://acidmuncher.wordpress.com/2016/02/02/no-nazis-didnt-set-out-to-attack-children/

[thaibeachlovers]

Geography not your strong point?

Australia is much further away and more difficult to reach from Syria and the other war zones than is Europe!

Australia took in far more Vietnamese boat people than European countries. It's closer!

I am not denying that there is a crisis, never have. Measures need to be taken to sort the wheat from the chaff; to offer protection to those who genuinely deserve and need it and to return home those that don't.

That is what a civilised group of nations would do; just as we did at the end of WWII, and before.

Attacking all migrants because some of them are criminals; attacking all migrants because they follow a different religion: pure xenophobia and hate.

Nothing to do with Oz being far away ( Christmas Island isn't far from Indonesia where the illegal boat people leave from ) from Europe, and all to do with the policy of depositing illegal boat people offshore. It has stopped most ( ?all ) of the boat people, which was it's intention.

Had the Euro coast guard returned all those it rescues on the sea to where they came from, the flood would become a trickle. The media will never tell the facts, but I would guess that the vast majority are illegal economic migrants rather than genuine refugees. I say that because a genuine refugee wouldn't have the funds to pay the traffickers, and would be forced to remain in the first safe country they came to.

Only a relatively small number of instances did Oz government 'turn around the boats' by ensuring the vessels safe return by Oz government, transferring then to sea going lifeboats etc that required, albeit resentful, acceptance of the Indo government. The policy which proved to be effective was refusal to accept any refugees arriving by sea permission to reside in Oz even if they were proven to be positively vetted. Roughly 75% of refugees in Oz offshore detention are now deemed to be genuine refugees.

The volume of small boats / dinghies departing Turkey is huge and would assume in most instances they would be unsafe to 'turn around'. 'Vessels' departing from Libya could not be 'turned around' as currently there is not a viable national government to process returnees.

It has recently been reported the number of asylum seekers in EU countries being assessed as economic refugees has increased from 40% to 60%, I understand the majority of economic refugees originate from Balkan countries.

I'm fairly certain you would have read Scott's posts who has actual hands on experience. On a number of occasions Scott has outlined genuine asylum seekers utilising the services of human traffickers, often sell their assets. It has been identified that refugees in countries such as Turkey departed as they were close to running out of cash to support themselves, the vast majority do not have access to UNHCR camps and have to pay rent, subsidise their food costs and so on. It was only last month that Turkey passed legislation that refugees would be permitted to work. From 2012 Turkey has expended at least US$5 billion in hosting refugees on it's territory and has yet to receive the promised additional funding and resources promised by governments; same scenario applies to Lebanon & other countries with very large refugee populations.

I'm not saying there wouldn't be some bad outcomes, but allowing the boats to continue only ensures even more will drown. If Euro adopted a policy of immediately returning any survivors to the country they left from it wouldn't be long before the boats stopped. They only come because they know there is a chance they will reach Euro and be allowed to stay. No chance at all and what would be the point of trying?

[simple1]

Geography not your strong point?

Australia is much further away and more difficult to reach from Syria and the other war zones than is Europe!

Australia took in far more Vietnamese boat people than European countries. It's closer!

I am not denying that there is a crisis, never have. Measures need to be taken to sort the wheat from the chaff; to offer protection to those who genuinely deserve and need it and to return home those that don't.

That is what a civilised group of nations would do; just as we did at the end of WWII, and before.

Attacking all migrants because some of them are criminals; attacking all migrants because they follow a different religion: pure xenophobia and hate.

Nothing to do with Oz being far away ( Christmas Island isn't far from Indonesia where the illegal boat people leave from ) from Europe, and all to do with the policy of depositing illegal boat people offshore. It has stopped most ( ?all ) of the boat people, which was it's intention.

Had the Euro coast guard returned all those it rescues on the sea to where they came from, the flood would become a trickle. The media will never tell the facts, but I would guess that the vast majority are illegal economic migrants rather than genuine refugees. I say that because a genuine refugee wouldn't have the funds to pay the traffickers, and would be forced to remain in the first safe country they came to.

Only a relatively small number of instances did Oz government 'turn around the boats' by ensuring the vessels safe return by Oz government, transferring then to sea going lifeboats etc that required, albeit resentful, acceptance of the Indo government. The policy which proved to be effective was refusal to accept any refugees arriving by sea permission to reside in Oz even if they were proven to be positively vetted. Roughly 75% of refugees in Oz offshore detention are now deemed to be genuine refugees.

The volume of small boats / dinghies departing Turkey is huge and would assume in most instances they would be unsafe to 'turn around'. 'Vessels' departing from Libya could not be 'turned around' as currently there is not a viable national government to process returnees.

It has recently been reported the number of asylum seekers in EU countries being assessed as economic refugees has increased from 40% to 60%, I understand the majority of economic refugees originate from Balkan countries.

I'm fairly certain you would have read Scott's posts who has actual hands on experience. On a number of occasions Scott has outlined genuine asylum seekers utilising the services of human traffickers, often sell their assets. It has been identified that refugees in countries such as Turkey departed as they were close to running out of cash to support themselves, the vast majority do not have access to UNHCR camps and have to pay rent, subsidise their food costs and so on. It was only last month that Turkey passed legislation that refugees would be permitted to work. From 2012 Turkey has expended at least US$5 billion in hosting refugees on it's territory and has yet to receive the promised additional funding and resources promised by governments; same scenario applies to Lebanon & other countries with very large refugee populations.

I'm not saying there wouldn't be some bad outcomes, but allowing the boats to continue only ensures even more will drown. If Euro adopted a policy of immediately returning any survivors to the country they left from it wouldn't be long before the boats stopped. They only come because they know there is a chance they will reach Euro and be allowed to stay. No chance at all and what would be the point of trying?

It has cost the Oz govt roughly A$1 billion in 2014 / 2015 just for the Manus Island & Nauru detention facilities to house around 3,000 asylum seekers, even though approx 75% have been positively vetted.

I do not support the unregulated flow of refugees / asylum seekers into the EU. However, Turkey is now hosting approx 2.5 million refugees yet get relatively peanuts to assist them by EU governments; tell me why currently Turkey should be obligated to accept returnees? Greece is in effect a half way house for refugees aiming to enter the EU, again Greece has received very minimal support from EU governments by way of funding / resources for hosting and processing refugees. My POV it's very much the extremely poor level of response by EU governments and others that has led to the current chaos and unfair to blame the host countries

[jaidam]

Nothing to do with Oz being far away ( Christmas Island isn't far from Indonesia where the illegal boat people leave from ) from Europe, and all to do with the policy of depositing illegal boat people offshore. It has stopped most ( ?all ) of the boat people, which was it's intention.

Had the Euro coast guard returned all those it rescues on the sea to where they came from, the flood would become a trickle. The media will never tell the facts, but I would guess that the vast majority are illegal economic migrants rather than genuine refugees. I say that because a genuine refugee wouldn't have the funds to pay the traffickers, and would be forced to remain in the first safe country they came to.

Only a relatively small number of instances did Oz government 'turn around the boats' by ensuring the vessels safe return by Oz government, transferring then to sea going lifeboats etc that required, albeit resentful, acceptance of the Indo government. The policy which proved to be effective was refusal to accept any refugees arriving by sea permission to reside in Oz even if they were proven to be positively vetted. Roughly 75% of refugees in Oz offshore detention are now deemed to be genuine refugees.

The volume of small boats / dinghies departing Turkey is huge and would assume in most instances they would be unsafe to 'turn around'. 'Vessels' departing from Libya could not be 'turned around' as currently there is not a viable national government to process returnees.

It has recently been reported the number of asylum seekers in EU countries being assessed as economic refugees has increased from 40% to 60%, I understand the majority of economic refugees originate from Balkan countries.

I'm fairly certain you would have read Scott's posts who has actual hands on experience. On a number of occasions Scott has outlined genuine asylum seekers utilising the services of human traffickers, often sell their assets. It has been identified that refugees in countries such as Turkey departed as they were close to running out of cash to support themselves, the vast majority do not have access to UNHCR camps and have to pay rent, subsidise their food costs and so on. It was only last month that Turkey passed legislation that refugees would be permitted to work. From 2012 Turkey has expended at least US$5 billion in hosting refugees on it's territory and has yet to receive the promised additional funding and resources promised by governments; same scenario applies to Lebanon & other countries with very large refugee populations.

I'm not saying there wouldn't be some bad outcomes, but allowing the boats to continue only ensures even more will drown. If Euro adopted a policy of immediately returning any survivors to the country they left from it wouldn't be long before the boats stopped. They only come because they know there is a chance they will reach Euro and be allowed to stay. No chance at all and what would be the point of trying?

It has cost the Oz govt roughly A$1 billion in 2014 / 2015 just for the Manus Island & Nauru detention facilities to house around 3,000 asylum seekers, even though approx 75% have been positively vetted.

I do not support the unregulated flow of refugees / asylum seekers into the EU. However, Turkey is now hosting approx 2.5 million refugees yet get relatively peanuts to assist them by EU governments; tell me why currently Turkey should be obligated to accept returnees? Greece is in effect a half way house for refugees aiming to enter the EU, again Greece has received very minimal support from EU governments by way of funding / resources for hosting and processing refugees. My POV it's very much the extremely poor level of response by EU governments and others that has led to the current chaos and unfair to blame the host countries

Last time I checked Turkey was a strict islamic country. They can absorb millions of other religious fanatics without breaking a sweat. To simplify, think of the outcome of putting 2 tigers in an enclosure that already holds a dozen tigers. Compare that to the effect of putting the two tigers into the penguin enclosure. Insignificance versus pure carnage.