Retirement Or Teaching

[wapipatjohn]

I have already posted this as a reply to village life, but felt it had a place in the teaching forum.

I used to live in a village near Kumpawapi full time, in fact I was the only Falang to live here despite 5 other Thai Falang marriages and one gay couple. I have been told that the other Falangs all stayed in hotels because they couldn’t handle the dirt/dust, flies, no hot water etc.

I didn’t mind all that, my problem was the boredom.

I got up with the family around 6 am had a cup of coffee, then sat around for a couple of hours then had breakfast at a more civilised hour.

If my dodgy internet connection was working I would check emails and surf the net until lunchtime.

I would then have a light lunch and return to the computer with a beer, I made it a rule of mine never to drink before noon !

The highlight of my day was to go shopping with my wife in Kumpawapi or Udon Thani.

During the day my wife did all the things Thai women do, a few chores, and a lot of eating, sleeping and of course non stop gossip !

I would go to bed around 8 pm.

Next day I got up with the family around 6 am had a cup of coffee……etc, etc, etc,

.

BORED !! I was!

Because I had always led an active life, I found I was not ready to curl up and die just yet, ( Retire !! )

So last January I decided to go on a teacher training course down in Ban Phe. My wife was horrified when she found out that it cost nearly 70,000 Baht. She did everything she possibly could to try to stop me, even after I qualified she was telling me to stop being silly.

But I am now an English teacher in a fairly large school 3 hours south of my wife’s village.

A house is supplied with the job, and my wife and our 2 year old daughter live with me most of the time.

I teach 1,200 students a week from the age of 13 to 18, and now there are not enough hours in the day for me. My wife gives me very little support despite being told that I am a good teacher ( something she doesn’t want to hear as she was sure I would

“ Crash and Burn” when I started teaching ). I know I am not a good teacher yet, but one day I will be, as I get on well with the kids and my fellow teachers ( they think I am a crazy Falang teacher ).

I only drink at weekends now ( and then not to excess ) and I now live in a small town population approximately 12,000. I am the only Falang living here, and there are no western amenities, just a couple of Thai Karaoke bars just outside of town. We haven’t even got a 7/11 here, so I now have to go shopping at Tesco’s in a nearby large town 30 kilometres away.

I decided on Teaching after I visited some friends in Pattaya . where I felt embarrassed to be a westerner. I looked at all the brain dead, western morons there, most of whom have never seen Thailand,

( Pattaya is Pattaya and is not representative of Thailand !!) and felt that there was more to life than Sun, Sex and Beer,

I didn’t like the way the western males treated Thai people especially the women there.

Most of us who live here know that Thai women do not work bar because they like it, (one once told me that,”it was a dirty job but the money was good”) most have young children they have to support, and nearly all their money is sent home to their families. Most of the Pattaya type males show no respect or understanding for these Ladies. Of course there are some Thai women who enjoy the lifestyle, but I am sure not many.

So if like me any of you are not ready for the scrap heap just yet, and can’t face endless days of dull boring routine inactivity, try going on a teacher training course, age is not a problem. Once qualified you could even teach privately in your own village, it doesn’t have to be a full time job and it will give you the chance to have something to aim for in life, instead of just filling the days until you eventually die.

My only regret is that I didn’t find out about teaching years ago. I really enjoy the work, and the Thai kids are great, they are very respectful to everyone, unlike Western Kids !!

When I lived in a village I was 58 going on 70. Now I am teaching I am 58 going on 30 !!

Edited October 22, 2006 by wapipatjohn

[Loaded]

I've seen the same as you: western guys convinced they're enjoying their 'retirement' because they have no work to do but slowly slipping into a day that revolves around alcohol because of their lack of mental stimulation. Good for you wapipatjohn and good luck with your new career.

[tango]

Glad to see you enjoy your teaching job. I too want to return to teaching, having taught for over 14 years here in Thailand, all with work permits and Non-Imm visas. I converted to a retirement visa 2 years ago, and while busy each day physically I do miss the intelectual stimulation of contributing as a teacher.

Has anyone, having already converted to a Non-Imm retirement visa where no work, even that of volunteering is permitted; converted back to a standard Non-Imm B visa to work again? What is the procedure please, or am I destined to remain 'retired'? Regards...tango

[PeaceBlondie]

Glad to see you enjoy your teaching job. I too want to return to teaching, having taught for over 14 years here in Thailand, all with work permits and Non-Imm visas. I converted to a retirement visa 2 years ago, and while busy each day physically I do miss the intelectual stimulation of contributing as a teacher.

Has anyone, having already converted to a Non-Imm retirement visa where no work, even that of volunteering is permitted; converted back to a standard Non-Imm B visa to work again? What is the procedure please, or am I destined to remain 'retired'? Regards...tango

I'm in a similar position, and recently asked those basic questions to Sunbelt Asia. He replied that it is possible to stay on your O retirement visa and get a work permit. I believe Sunbelt that it's possible, but I don't know how easily you could convince a school, and a local MoE office, to get the WP for you.

The consensus is that even volunteer work technically requires a work permit.

Good luck.

[Ijustwannateach]

Good on you, Wapipatjohn- I'd noticed that my retired friends tended to go a bit dotty if they didn't find something to do, and good for you for noticing and taking care of yourself!

[migrant]

That's great that it is working out for you!! I hope to do something similar.

Did you get a work permit? That seems to be difficult.

[bgood]

Glad to see you enjoy your teaching job. I too want to return to teaching, having taught for over 14 years here in Thailand, all with work permits and Non-Imm visas. I converted to a retirement visa 2 years ago, and while busy each day physically I do miss the intelectual stimulation of contributing as a teacher.

Has anyone, having already converted to a Non-Imm retirement visa where no work, even that of volunteering is permitted; converted back to a standard Non-Imm B visa to work again? What is the procedure please, or am I destined to remain 'retired'? Regards...tango

Yes 'tango', it's possible. I've retired 3 times here. I've been here 10 years and comming up to 7 years of teaching here.

In the past my retirement visa has been converted back to non imm 'b' but the school that I most recently started at couldn't handle the 'not permitted to work' on my retirement visa. They insisted that I leave the country, thus cancelling my retirement visa, and return with a new non imm 'b'.

It shouldn't be necessary to leave the country, just depends on the confidence of the school staff processing the paperwork for you and their relationship with the immigration department. I left, got a new visa and I'm now locked into a 2 year contract.

I must confess that some days I ask myself 'WHY?'

'Sun, Sex and Beer' wasn't such a bad life!!!!!!

[TeflTommy]

The older "would be" teachers who I have come across seem to get burnt out pretty quickly and can't seem to handle the Thai school system. They tend to end up bitter and resentful. I would not recommend a 55+ person to teach in schools. Either a Uni or do corporate work or I would say don't bother.

[PeaceBlondie]

Of course, there are some exceptions, such as green-suited boys who never grow up............

[TeflTommy]

Of course, there are some exceptions, such as green-suited boys who never grow up............

Yes there are always exceptions but I personally would be very wary of any 55+ teachers coming to Thailand wanting to teach children when there are more suitable teaching opportunities available for them and I would also question their motivation for doing so. But hey that's just my personal opinion.

I do know a great 58 year old teacher but he has been working here for many many years and has a wife and kids. You see there are exceptions

[paulfr]

Well I am past 58 and teaching here in a large private high school and enjoying it very much.

I had a retirement extension to my Non Imm O but had to convert to Thai Wife in order to be permitted to work or get a WP. Never had to leave the country. The school admins hate my visa as they usually get a Non Imm B 1 yr extension for nearly all the farang teachers. It is different and it is more work for them. But then if you leave the school, you have 7 days to leave LOS and I did not like that possibility. So I insisted on keeping my Thai Wife extension.

The challenge of teaching grade schoolers is stimulating in itself but TeflTommy is probably right with his warning. Language schools, corporate work or a Uni have students that are much easier to teach for sure.

If you want an easy road, that would be it.

Edited October 28, 2006 by paulfr

[PeaceBlondie]

Of course, there are some exceptions, such as green-suited boys who never grow up............

Yes there are always exceptions but I personally would be very wary of any 55+ teachers coming to Thailand wanting to teach children when there are more suitable teaching opportunities available for them and I would also question their motivation for doing so. But hey that's just my personal opinion.

I do know a great 58 year old teacher but he has been working here for many many years and has a wife and kids. You see there are exceptions

If I were the wary type of worrier, I would be more wary of younger, unattached men, with higher libidos. Especially those who have no more suitable teaching opportunities available for them; I would question their motivation, too, if I were a doubting type.

I started instructing or teaching at age 19, again at age 24, and at age 53, and this last time at age 60. Maybe I'll do it at age 64 or 71, as well.

[wapipatjohn]

Of course, there are some exceptions, such as green-suited boys who never grow up............

Yes there are always exceptions but I personally would be very wary of any 55+ teachers coming to Thailand wanting to teach children when there are more suitable teaching opportunities available for them and I would also question their motivation for doing so. But hey that's just my personal opinion.

I do know a great 58 year old teacher but he has been working here for many many years and has a wife and kids. You see there are exceptions

If I were the wary type of worrier, I would be more wary of younger, unattached men, with higher libidos. Especially those who have no more suitable teaching opportunities available for them; I would question their motivation, too, if I were a doubting type.

I started instructing or teaching at age 19, again at age 24, and at age 53, and this last time at age 60. Maybe I'll do it at age 64 or 71, as well.

I agree, I have met many young unattached men teaching here in Thailand, and I would be very wary about their motives in teaching young children. Most do not plan to make a career of teaching, but just plan to travel around asia, not staying in one place long. So they are not dedicated teachers who put their students welfare first. They gain their trust then move on when it suits them to.

The older person is more stable and I feel more trustworthy, because most want to stay at one particular school for a long time and not Butterfly like the younger ones.

An older person is better at controlling the students, mainly because the Thai students show more respect the older you are. I have seen young barely out of Nappys ( diapers ) teachers completely destroyed by their rebellious class because they do not have the experience of life to handle the situation.

Also unlike some younger teachers we are not all looking for that cushy job, despite our age we are still up for that challenging job. :

So stop knocking us oldies, we have a wealth of experience of life to offer our students ! What have the younger inexperienced teachers got to offer them? It's certainly not stability.

[TeflTommy]

Of course, there are some exceptions, such as green-suited boys who never grow up............

Yes there are always exceptions but I personally would be very wary of any 55+ teachers coming to Thailand wanting to teach children when there are more suitable teaching opportunities available for them and I would also question their motivation for doing so. But hey that's just my personal opinion.

I do know a great 58 year old teacher but he has been working here for many many years and has a wife and kids. You see there are exceptions

If I were the wary type of worrier, I would be more wary of younger, unattached men, with higher libidos. Especially those who have no more suitable teaching opportunities available for them; I would question their motivation, too, if I were a doubting type.

I started instructing or teaching at age 19, again at age 24, and at age 53, and this last time at age 60. Maybe I'll do it at age 64 or 71, as well.

I agree, I have met many young unattached men teaching here in Thailand, and I would be very wary about their motives in teaching young children. Most do not plan to make a career of teaching, but just plan to travel around asia, not staying in one place long. So they are not dedicated teachers who put their students welfare first. They gain their trust then move on when it suits them to.

The older person is more stable and I feel more trustworthy, because most want to stay at one particular school for a long time and not Butterfly like the younger ones.

An older person is better at controlling the students, mainly because the Thai students show more respect the older you are. I have seen young barely out of Nappys ( diapers ) teachers completely destroyed by their rebellious class because they do not have the experience of life to handle the situation.

Also unlike some younger teachers we are not all looking for that cushy job, despite our age we are still up for that challenging job. :

So stop knocking us oldies, we have a wealth of experience of life to offer our students ! What have the younger inexperienced teachers got to offer them? It's certainly not stability.

I was not knocking older teachers. I was just saying their more suitable teaching opportunities for older teachers outside of high schools. i see nothing wrong teaching uni students. As for younger teachers, they have to learn sometime. What age would you suggest some start teaching?

22+ sounds ok to me. You too had to learn about life all those years ago.

[Ijustwannateach]

Bashing of older teachers or gay teachers will not be permitted on the Teaching In Thailand subforum.

[Loaded]

So stop knocking us oldies, we have a wealth of experience of life to offer our students ! What have the younger inexperienced teachers got to offer them? It's certainly not stability.

Older techers in Thailand tend to have more natural respect from the school, parents and students because of their age. In general they also take a much more mature attitude to the Thai concept of planning and organization. Often parents view them as what they expect the school to provide as teacher for their children. But they may be set in their ways and may not adapt well to any suggestion to change the way they do things. Plus often their energy levels are not high enough to teach 18 classes of 50 kids in non-air-con rooms week in and week out.

Teachers in their 20s are usually full of energy and imagination, but their lack of life experience can lead to a less mature response to the everyday operations of the school. Plus, I have to agree many teachers in their 20s enjoy nightlife at the expense of their performance as a teacher.

[WapiJohn]

So stop knocking us oldies, we have a wealth of experience of life to offer our students ! What have the younger inexperienced teachers got to offer them? It's certainly not stability.

Older techers in Thailand tend to have more natural respect from the school, parents and students because of their age. In general they also take a much more mature attitude to the Thai concept of planning and organization. Often parents view them as what they expect the school to provide as teacher for their children. But they may be set in their ways and may not adapt well to any suggestion to change the way they do things. Plus often their energy levels are not high enough to teach 18 classes of 50 kids in non-air-con rooms week in and week out.

Teachers in their 20s are usually full of energy and imagination, but their lack of life experience can lead to a less mature response to the everyday operations of the school. Plus, I have to agree many teachers in their 20s enjoy nightlife at the expense of their performance as a teacher.

Not all teachers lack the energy levels needed to teach properly, I teach 23 different classes a week in non air conditioned classrooms, and the average size of my classes are 55 students.

I suppose because I did manual work for many years, I have kept reasonably fit, and now because I am learning something new every day, I keep mentally alert.

I am not the sort of teacher that sits behind a desk at the front of the class all day either. I am always walking around monitoring my students and helping individuals if they have problems. As a TEFL trained teacher I was taught to constantly seek new ideas as a teacher/researcher, this I do. I was also told that it was usually the teacher that had been teaching for many years ( and some of those were not that old ) that were set in their ways, and resisted change.

But I must admit I do get a little mentally tired on Fridays, when I have to teach M4/1 then next lesson it's M1/10. My top and my bottom classes. It's a good job I don't have to teach M1/10 first !

I tell my fellow Thai teachers that I welcome constructive criticism .

I am constantly improving my teaching methods as a result of their suggestions. Fortunately I am in a school where we all help each other, and I have not seen any petty politics here yet. ( perhaps because I am the only Falang here ? )

NOTE: I notice I am signed in as WapiJohn and not Wapipatjohn. But it's the same old me, I thought I messed up the original registration and did it again using a slightly different handle!

You see I am always tring to improve things, not set in my ways at all!

Edited October 30, 2006 by WapiJohn

[WapiJohn]

Bashing of older teachers or gay teachers will not be permitted on the Teaching In Thailand subforum.

Thankyou Teacher, can we still bash the young teachers?

[Ijustwannateach]

I think that's called "mentoring."

Btw, I don't see a big problem with changing your account if you can't figure out how to get to your old one (and admin can reset your password for you on that one if you like) but please be aware there is a rule that each user can only have one account- so please choose one or the other and use that one exclusively, or you may risk losing access.

"Steven"

[Ijustwannateach]

Some posts have been deleted and a holiday has been given. Someone's not getting the message.

[The Dan Sai Kid]

Glad to see you enjoy your teaching job. I too want to return to teaching, having taught for over 14 years here in Thailand, all with work permits and Non-Imm visas. I converted to a retirement visa 2 years ago, and while busy each day physically I do miss the intelectual stimulation of contributing as a teacher.

Has anyone, having already converted to a Non-Imm retirement visa where no work, even that of volunteering is permitted; converted back to a standard Non-Imm B visa to work again? What is the procedure please, or am I destined to remain 'retired'? Regards...tango

I'm in a similar position, and recently asked those basic questions to Sunbelt Asia. He replied that it is possible to stay on your O retirement visa and get a work permit. I believe Sunbelt that it's possible, but I don't know how easily you could convince a school, and a local MoE office, to get the WP for you.

The consensus is that even volunteer work technically requires a work permit.

Good luck.

I got a WP on my Non-Imm O visa - they know about it at CM immigration - your school can call and confirm it.

I missed out on a all-expenses-paid trip tto Penang (by plane) because of it - I ditn't know whether to laugh or cry!

[mijan24]

wapipatjohnn - Loaded & Steve, good reading but i feel the current situation may eliminate the older brigade from offering/providing a service in what i consider to be the valuable second tier of the teaching service.

(Please note the use of the term second "tier teaching service" does not and is not intended to demean this valuable resource. ( i am part of the older (not old) brigade) too. You are only as old as you want to be in my view. Having initially taught in LoS in 2525 i do have a few grey (gray) hairs these days but i am (hopefully) still able to consider/evaluate things out of the norm.

Edited November 2, 2006 by mijan24

[PeaceBlondie]

Perhaps I'm the oldest teacher on this forum, and I literally ran circles around the classroom, up to four classes per day in the heat, with my grey, silver, blond, brown and white hair (very long, very thick hair). So can we roughly define "older"? Waipipatjon is clearly providing good service out in the countryside; so did I, at an older age. Is the situation changing, such as supply and demand for TEFLers, or the visa changes?

[mijan24]

Perhaps I'm the oldest teacher on this forum, and I literally ran circles around the classroom, up to four classes per day in the heat, with my grey, silver, blond, brown and white hair (very long, very thick hair). So can we roughly define "older"? Waipipatjon is clearly providing good service out in the countryside; so did I, at an older age. Is the situation changing, such as supply and demand for TEFLers, or the visa changes?

PB there are many cliches about "old" and I am sure you have heard them all.

I believe you have confirmed the definition/best description by simply using the word "older" not the self destructing/defeating adjective of "old" - happy 60+ to you too.

[lawman3966]

WapipatJohn:

I'm a 46 year old American harboring thoughts of semi-retiring in Thailand, and looking at teaching in Thailand as a second career, not merely as a side event. Thus, starting from this perspective, I really appreciate your post. I feel I can credibly look forward to a teaching career in Thailand in my 50s and beyond.

Separately, was the ageist who posted earlier asleep when John Mark Carr was arrested? Perhaps I'm looking at life through a middle-aged lens, but I'd say Carr is on the young side. I would have thought it was obvious, but apparently this needs to be stated: sexually and morally disordered people come in all shapes, sizes, ages, and degrees of familly attachment. Carr is a good illustration as he is only 42 now, was married, and has several children.

Les

[Nemo.]

There is a difference between a 58 year old NEW to teaching and a 58 year old that has 30 years experience. Funny enough research in UK showed that teachers peak early on in effectiveness and that new teachers are better in improving performance of students!

A 35 year old after 10 years of teaching is less effective that a 58 year old after 1 years teaching per that research. I suppose its burn out? lack of enthusiasm after a couple of years teaching?

[WapiJohn]

There is a difference between a 58 year old NEW to teaching and a 58 year old that has 30 years experience. Funny enough research in UK showed that teachers peak early on in effectiveness and that new teachers are better in improving performance of students!

A 35 year old after 10 years of teaching is less effective that a 58 year old after 1 years teaching per that research. I suppose its burn out? lack of enthusiasm after a couple of years teaching?

I went on a course with TEFL where I was told An older person with no previous teaching experience

was far more reacceptive to new ideas and challenges, than a person who had been teaching for years, and was set in their ways. Probably because the unexperienced teacher didn't know any better.

I have been teaching for about a year now and do not have any signs of " Burn out " yet!

In fact I get a real buzz from my students and this gives me the energy to carry on.

I teach full time in one school and part time in two others.

Unlike many teachers, I watch or I listen to my students.

This helps me to improve my lessons for them.

[Ijustwannateach]

I *may* have run into some younger teachers who also listen to their students once in awhile...