Advice Needed On Uk Visa For Same-sex Partner

[AjarnJohn]

Hello fellow board members.

Any advice on the following would be much appreciated.

I plan to apply for a UK visit visa in January for my Thai partner, who is a ladyboy.

Now I am still married to my Thai wife but we now live apart, having separated 2 and a half years ago. She lives with my parents and I have been with my "girlfriend" for 3 years.

I have visited my partner about 7 times in the last 3 years and have visited Singapore together aswell as going around Thailand.

I support him and send money to him via his bank account and through a credit card. I have records of this and will put it in his application for a visa.

Although he currently works in a cabaret show, he will finish in January in order to apply for his visa and come to the UK for 4 weeks. He does plan to learn beauty therapy at a local college on his return.

Aswell as this he does have reasons to return. He has his apartment room which has all his belongings and he has to keep an eye on his younger brother who is at college and his elderly mother. His older siblings all have their own young families to look after. I will state all this in his application.

We both have plans on buying a house in Thailand together. I have deposited just over 2 million baht in his bank account for this purpose. I will photocopy his bank book and show this amount. Would this amount of money in his account show immigration of our commitment to one another? After all, you wouldn't really put this amount of money into anyone's account if you didn't trust them and have commitment to them.

Any further advice would be welcome. We will submit his application on 29th January. My return flight is 20th February. I'm uneasy that this isn't enough time incase he needs an interview.

Does anyone have similar experiences of being married to a Thai national and then seprarating and applying for your new partner? Does this affect an application?

Hoping for any advice. Many thanks.

AjarnJohn

[GU22]

Family commitments are not viewed as a reason to return because many Thais travel abroad to work and send money home.

Putting large amounts of money into his account is not a good idea, IMHO. This can be viewed as him taking advantage of you, and once the money dries up, what then?

Does he own the apartment?

Can he get a letter from the college confirming when the course starts and that he has been accepted onto it?

Having said that, as the basis for the application is your relationship, and this has subsisted for 3 years, and you can presumably show this, then I would say that you would have an excellent chance.

Except you have not divorced your wife. For this application to succeed then, IMHO, you need to show that you and he intend to make a long term commitment to each other. The fact that you have not divorced your wife will put a large doubt about this in the ECO's mind. You will need to address this point very carefully in the application.

Also, how long after your wife obtaining ILR did you separate? When she obtained her ILR you both would have had to state on a legal document that you intended to live together indefinitely. If it can be shown that this was not your intention at the time, then you may find yourself being prosecuted for perjury.

[LaoPo]

Strange you keep saying 'he/him/his' about your ladyboy friend whilst ladyboys feel/think and are 'she'.

Anybody in a relationship with a Ladyboy would call her 'she', that's why I mistrust your post.

Strange.

LaoPo

Edited November 9, 2006 by LaoPo

[AjarnJohn]

I do think of him as "She". Sorry for any confusion. It's just I chose to word gender differently for this post.

The money in her bank account has been paid in for 2 years now. There have been no large withdrawls. She has stated to me that this is for our house, so it will be left in there until we can find a property.

As for my wife, we split up about 2 years after her ILR was granted. Would it be better for my partner's application if I showed that divorce proceedings had begun?

Both my wife and I are in no rush to get divorced. Would it be a good idea if I got my wife to write a letter stating her current status with me, and that she doesn't mind me applying for my partner's visa, and gives full backing?

[GU22]

The issue of your marriage still being extant must be addressed. What you suggest may go some way toward this.

[AjarnJohn]

Thanks.

I will get a letter from my wife detailing all this.

So long as she states that we do intend to divorce but not just yet. We both have full time jobs and just havent really got round to it yet. If she gives her full blessing for my new partner to come here, then hopefully that will be a positive sign for the visa application.

On a separate topic, will my wife's ILR be void if we divorce? I'm not sure on this. She has lived in the UK for 4 years and it is her intention to apply for British Citizenship.

[GU22]

On a separate topic, will my wife's ILR be void if we divorce? I'm not sure on this. She has lived in the UK for 4 years and it is her intention to apply for British Citizenship.

As for my wife, we split up about 2 years after her ILR was granted.

Now I am still married to my Thai wife but we now live apart, having separated 2 and a half years ago.

Sorry, these statements contradict each other. They cannot all be true.

If you separated from your wife 2.5 years ago, then that would have been when she had been in the UK 1.5 years; 6 months before she could apply for ILR! I can't remember offhand when the qualifying period changed from 1 to 2 years (2002, I think) but even if she got her ILR after 1 year then you still separated 6 months afterwards, and started your relationship with your boyfriend before she got her ILR!

If the Home Office discover this, and they will if this application for your boyfriend goes ahead, then it's possible prison for you and deportation for her.

Edited November 9, 2006 by GU22

[AjarnJohn]

GU22 Sorry about this confusion.

My wife came to the UK on a marriage visa in August 2002. She went up to the Immigration House in London a year later and was granted ILR. That would have been I think July 2003.

My relationship with my new partner started in February 2004.

My wife found out about our relationship in October 2004, this is when we separated.

She had been given her ILR before I met my new partner.

What are you thoughts now? Many thanks again.

[midas]

AjarnJohn I really hope things workout for you with all this -the just be careful

you are building up a lot of potential liabilities with an ex-wife and now

a partner who get used to your generosity ? You need to be more protective

of your assets for which I'm sure you have worked hard to earn

[atlastaname]

This is a complex case isn't it ? What seems like a case that would be ok is being severely complicated by this business of your wife. GU22 makes a lot of important points which they will look at very closely if you applied for a visa for your partner. If i were an ECO i would be asking why you are not divorced from her ? You say you are both in no rush , but why? Its going to hamper your future applications . You seem to have explained the rest but not this bit. Until you divorce you have problems.

[GU22]

I can't remember offhand when the qualifying period changed from 1 to 2 years (2002, I think)

I've now checked, and the change from 1 year to 2 came into effect on 1/4/03.

AjarnJohn, in your explanation to the visa section you need to be very precise on the dates Being vague about them, as you were originally here, means they could easily leap to the same conclusion I first did! They still might. That is, they could easily conclude that you, a gay man, married your wife purely so she could enter the UK, remained in a false relationship with her until she obtained her ILR and then, having achieved that aim, went your separate ways.

The ECO, and possibly the Home Office, will be asking if it is feasible that in the 6 months between your wife obtaining her ILR and you starting the relationship with your boyfriend you suddenly discovered that you were gay. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't, I don't know enough about the subject to offer an opinion. What you have to do is show them that it is.

You also have to offer a convincing explanation as to why you and she have not yet divorced. After all, it has been nearly 3 years since you discovered that you were gay and started a gay relationship, and over 2 years since your wife discovered this and the two of you separated.

I therefore feel that there is a risk to both you and your wife that bringing all this to the attention of the Home Office may very well cause them to question the honesty of her spouse visa application and subsequent ILR application. What action they would decide upon, I can't say. They may very well do nothing, but they could decide to investigate further and even prosecute. The penalties were they to do so and prove their case could be severe, as already mentioned.

Some may say that you could avoid all this by not mentioning your wife at all. This would be folly. The fact that you have previously sponsored a spouse visa will be on record. Telling them about it and trying to explain the circumstances and history may mean that your endeavour is successful. Ignoring it and letting them discover it for themselves would be disastrous for you, your boyfriend and your wife.

[AjarnJohn]

Many thanks for all the posts.

After giving it much thought, I think it may be best to start divorce proceedings now. I'm sure my wife would agree. I will speak to her about it.

When I apply for my partner's visa, I can then show ECO that I am going through divorce proceedings now. I guess this would be beneficial to the visa application. I could mention that the divorce reason is adultery. They shouldn't discriminate based on the gender of the person I had adultery with?

I will have to get my dates right though. Perhaps state that I met my partner a year after my wife got ILR, instead of six months.

But then again, maybe I should wait a bit and get my divorce through first and then apply for my partner's visa.

More advice please.

[atlastaname]

Although it shouldn't matter if you are in the process of divorcce or actually got it , i think you are in a stronger position if you are officially divorced. That will close some areas of weakness in your application. So i would wait , on balance.

Don't bother lying about 6 months or a year after ILR that you met your b/friend. If it was 6 months then say 6 months . If they are going to draw any negative inferences from you meeting someone after your wife got her ILR , then really there is no difference between 6 months and a year. Its perfectly possible that someone can get ILR and then the husband/wife meets someone else the next day . It might look suspicious but sometimes it happens. Certainly 6 months is enough time after the ILR and , more importantly , ITS THE THRUTH!! So say it like it is .

After the divorce , and assuming all your paperwork is up to scratch , you should have no problems .

BTW in my opinion , i wouldn't make a thing about calling your b/f a "she" in official circles if i were you . Prejudices still exist amounst those who cannot understand , so as he is officially a he , keep it like that . Refer to him in all correspondance between you and the Embassy as a he . Its a minor thing really but there are people who that would irritate , so why take the chance . Just my opinion .

[GU22]

I could mention that the divorce reason is adultery.

I think that once you have been separated for two years you can both petition for a 'no fault' divorce. I believe that this will be quicker (and cheaper) than your wife divorcing you for your adultary.

You need to speak to a solicitor about this anyway, so they should be able to advise on the best option ( and confirm if my assumption above is correct).

I agree with Atlastaname. Certainly if divorce proceedings have started you will have a better case. If they ask why you waited so long you can say that you were waiting to be separated for the 2 years to get a quick no fault divorce.

I also agree that you should always tell the truth on a visa application. If they discover that you have told them one lie, and they probably will, why should they believe anything else?

But the first thing you need to do is see a solicitor and start the divorce proceedings.

[the gent]

( DEEP SIGH )

It's another troll, chaps...............

Or are you going to say that you know this already but because worthy issues are being raised you thought it sensible to pretend otherwise..........?

Gullibility or stupidity?

[GU22]

Instead of throwing this accusation around every time someone asks something that is outside your area of knowledge you should simply ignore the thread, that way you wont appear so foolish.

(Or you could actually read it, and so learn something)

[atlastaname]

To the gent.

I agree with GU22. I am sure we all get taken in by trolls, but to simply say one is without showing the proof doesn't confirm your belief does it? If you have such proof show us it and we may then believe you.

Also as said above , if a post is not to your liking or you don't want to contribute to it , then just don't read it and don't post. Its that simple really. Even if those you accuse are trolls, the advise given is still valid advice , and may help others.

I actually do think the gent has many positive contributions to make and i do agree with a lot he writes , especially on the subject of there being a state agenda and the State being guilty of all kinds of things behind the scenes. I am very sceptical about the State's continuing attempts to control all we do and all we think and see. I know from his previous posts that the gent also thinks this ( e.g. his scepticism over the real reason why sponsers are no longer allowed into the compound at the BE in Bangers) and i agree with this . But if you keep accusing people of being trolls without providing the links or proof then your points on other subjects will be ignored by the majority , which would be a pity.