New ED- visa rules

[Myrhok]

Hello guys,

 

Nationality : Belgium

 

I came in Thailand with an ED-visa in 2014, learning Thai language and I loved that. The visa was extended two times, for a total of less than 9 months effectively staying.

For some reasons, indeed, I left the country before the last three months I could have got and that could have totalized one year of stay, with the same ED-visa.

 

Now, we are in august 2016, I did not get any thai ED-visa in 2015 and I’m now thinking to apply for a new ED- visa.

However, I have read, and I've also been told,

three different things 

about the new rules concerning the ED-visa in Chiang Mai. 

These are :

 

" if you got an ED-visa, even only one time, in the past, 

• either you cannot get a new one
• either you can get one, but for 6 months only, and so you cannot extend it up to one year.
• either you get 6 months and the other 6 months are depending on an exam organized by the immigration office."

 

Where is the truth ?

 

Any link and any accurate information about these new ED- visa rules are welcome.

 

Thank you for your help.

 

Have a wonderful day.

 

M

 

[elviajero]

If you are looking for an ED visa/extension of stay as a way to stay here it's no longer a viable option. They have clamped down on these visas and, in most cases, extensions are only for 90 days each time. There is no immigration exam.

 

If you find a school, and sign up for lessons, they will help you with the visa application and the extensions of stay. 

[derator01]

A post discussing an illegal activity has been hidden from view, along with an appropriate reply.  Per forum rules:

 

3) You will not post about activities or links to websites containing such material that are illegal in Thailand. This includes but is not limited to: gambling, betting, pornography, illegal drugs, fake goods/clothing, file sharing of pirated material, pyramid schemes, etc. Discussion of the above is permitted only as news items, but never as a "how to" topic.

[JackThompson]

Continuing by Ed Visa plan would be possible by completing your Thai language studies (limited to the courses available - one cannot take them repeatedly), then begin on new languages (any but your native language), and/or take the self-defense courses offered in Chang Mai by former military folks up there (not sure of the duration of the latter).

[darrendsd]

16 hours ago, elviajero said:

If you are looking for an ED visa/extension of stay as a way to stay here it's no longer a viable option. They have clamped down on these visas and, in most cases, extensions are only for 90 days each time. There is no immigration exam.

 

If you find a school, and sign up for lessons, they will help you with the visa application and the extensions of stay. 

 

90 day extensions are nothing new, they were that when I started to study Thai 6 years ago, you had to go to Immigration every 90 days and I remember being given a small test then

 

I really am not sure why people keep saying it is no longer a viable option for staying here longterm, as long as you go to the classes there really is no problem, as always in Thailand there is always ways round this

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, darrendsd said:

 

90 day extensions are nothing new, they were that when I started to study Thai 6 years ago, you had to go to Immigration every 90 days and I remember being given a small test then

 

I really am not sure why people keep saying it is no longer a viable option for staying here longterm, as long as you go to the classes there really is no problem, as always in Thailand there is always ways round this

The reason is that before you could sign up with a school, get the visa and a 1 year extension of stay, and never see the inside of a classroom.

 

The immigration bosses have, for several years, been clamping down on people using ED visas/extensions as a way to stay here. It is still possible, but it's harder and not viable unless a genuine student. It is certainly harder than it was 6 years ago and I think there is little chance that someone could live here for the next 6 years as a student to Thai.

[darrendsd]

22 minutes ago, elviajero said:

The reason is that before you could sign up with a school, get the visa and a 1 year extension of stay, and never see the inside of a classroom.

 

The immigration bosses have, for several years, been clamping down on people using ED visas/extensions as a way to stay here. It is still possible, but it's harder and not viable unless a genuine student. It is certainly harder than it was 6 years ago and I think there is little chance that someone could live here for the next 6 years as a student to Thai.

 

As I said if you go to School there should be no issues,

 

I never said that I have lived here for the last 6 years on a ED Visa

[elviajero]

2 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

 

As I said if you go to School there should be no issues,

 

I never said that I have lived here for the last 6 years on a ED Visa

And all I said was that it's not a viable way to stay here. There is a big difference between someone wanting to stay in Thailand using ED visa/extension, and someone that wants to come and learn the language that obviously needs to stay while they learn. The former are being clamped down on making it unviable. I think the OP is looking for a visa to enable him to stay rather than wanting to learn the language. An ED visa isn't needed to attend lessons and learn Thai.

 

I didn't say that you said that you'd lived here 6 years on ED visas! 

[darrendsd]

I'm not sure how many times I have said it is viable if you attend classes, if you don't understand this then that's your choice

 

The OP does not state anywhere in his post that he will not be attending classes, you seem to be assuming this? I'm not sure why?

 

I said I attended classes 6 years ago, you said it would not be possible to stay here for the next 6 years on a ED Visa, I think it's obvious what you were referring to 

 

 

[elviajero]

2 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

I'm not sure how many times I have said it is viable if you attend classes, if you don't understand this then that's your choice

 

The OP does not state anywhere in his post that he will not be attending classes, you seem to be assuming this? I'm not sure why?

 

I said I attended classes 6 years ago, you said it would not be possible to stay here for the next 6 years on a ED Visa, I think it's obvious what you were referring to 

You questioned why some (quoting me) say it's not viable to stay long term. I explained why. And it's obvious I'm referring to people using ED visas as a way to stay without wanting to attend lessons as many have done during the past 6+ years.

 

My assumption is based on the fact that the OP posted another topic asking about staying longer than 3 months using Tourist Visas.

 

You said you started learning Thai 6 years ago. I didn't assume that you've been on ED visas ever since although your comment could easily be taken that way. I was simply pointing out that due to the changes over the past 6 years (being your chosen time frame), and the fact that people have stayed many years in the past, that there is little chance of being able to do that over the next 6 years or longer.

 

The conversation is not about genuine students, but the unviability of people being able to game the system.

[darrendsd]

Again the OP did not state he would not be attending classes, you assumed this

 

If you really knew your stuff you would know that it is not possible to take a Thai course for 6 years

 

Anyway Poppet you win if it makes you happy 

[elviajero]

25 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

Again the OP did not state he would not be attending classes, you assumed this

 

If you really knew your stuff you would know that it is not possible to take a Thai course for 6 years

 

Anyway Poppet you win if it makes you happy 

Again! I didn't say the OP said he wouldn't be attending classes. I have explained that my assumption, based on two separate topics, is that the OP is looking for a visa to enable him to stay. Not a visa to enable him to learn Thai.

 

I know it's not possible to take a Thai class for 6 years, but many people stayed for many years in the past without attending class, and that door has now been closed. That is the point I was trying to make to the OP before you started with the nonsense.

[darrendsd]

What nonsense?

 

You stated : The conversation is not about genuine students, but the unviability of people being able to game the system.

 

No this is not what the conversation is about, it's only YOUR conversation by assuming that the OP will not be going to class, something the OP has NOT stated, sure he may have asked about other visas but does that mean he will not attend class if he get's a ED Visa?

 

If you want to have conversations with yourself a public forum is probably not the best place to do it

 

BTW Your last paragraph in the post above about the door being closed shows how little you really know, it really is wide open and opened from those at the top for those who want to enter it

 

 

 

Edited August 24, 2016 by darrendsd

[elviajero]

25 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

What nonsense?

 

You stated : The conversation is not about genuine students, but the unviability of people being able to game the system.

 

No this is not what the conversation is about, it's only YOUR conversation by assuming that the OP will not be going to class, something the OP has NOT stated, sure he may have asked about other visas but does that mean he will not attend class if he get's a ED Visa?

 

If you want to have conversations with yourself a public forum is probably not the best way to do it

 

BTW Your last paragraph in the post above about the door being closed shows how little you really know, it really is wide open and approved from the top for those who want to enter it

 

The attached post is a good example!

 

You replied to my post. It was my conversation that you joined in with. 

 

I didn't assume he wouldn't be attending classes. I was warning someone I knew to be looking for a way to stay in Thailand  that staying long term using ED visas is not viable. I didn't specify 'without attending class' because I would expect anyone with half a brain would understand my point.

 

Are you claiming that those at the top have approved people to stay here long term on ED visas without the need to attend classes? Because I am pretty sure they have ordered the opposite.

[Suradit69]

You can study Thai while in the country on any visa or visa exempt entry or any extension of stay. There is no requirement that you have an Ed visa or extension to do language study.

 

Probably easier to get a tourist visa or some other visa and extension option if you qualify. While it is possible to go the Ed visa and extension route, it has been made more onerous because some people were abusing the system and some "schools" no longer qualify.

Edited August 25, 2016 by Suradit69

[seedy]

Flaming post removed

[LPCustom69]

18 hours ago, darrendsd said:

 

90 day extensions are nothing new, they were that when I started to study Thai 6 years ago, you had to go to Immigration every 90 days and I remember being given a small test then

 

I really am not sure why people keep saying it is no longer a viable option for staying here longterm, as long as you go to the classes there really is no problem, as always in Thailand there is always ways round this

Because in their heart, they know it shouldn't be an option ?

[sixlegs]

Someone who reads these boards on a semi-regular basis could predict easily what the "answers" would be for such question.

 

Seriously, do you guys have nothing else to do?

[innocenthai]

17 hours ago, elviajero said:

The reason is that before you could sign up with a school, get the visa and a 1 year extension of stay, and never see the inside of a classroom.

 

The immigration bosses have, for several years, been clamping down on people using ED visas/extensions as a way to stay here. It is still possible, but it's harder and not viable unless a genuine student. It is certainly harder than it was 6 years ago and I think there is little chance that someone could live here for the next 6 years as a student to Thai.

 

 

So what he is saying is right ! if you attend classes you can study and live here as long as you want !

 

 

 

[ev1lchris]

I remember back in the glory days where an ED Visa was for one year and you could just get another when after it's finished.

 

Man, this country is changing for the worse.

[Ronuk]

1 hour ago, ev1lchris said:

I remember back in the glory days where an ED Visa was for one year and you could just get another when after it's finished.

 

Man, this country is changing for the worse.

They are doing no more than applying the rules. The Police and immigration are on a hiding to nothing. When they do nothing people moan, when they do something people moan. People cannot just do as they like anymore and expect to be left alone. If you play by the rules it's great here. If you want to attempt to twist and manipulate them to suit the agenda, expect an issue. Yes, it's changing here but a lot of people would actually say for the better. You can hardly look back and call days past 'Glory days'. The place was full of undesirables that were stuck here because to go back home, invariably meant years in prison.

Edited August 25, 2016 by Ronuk

[JackThompson]

18 minutes ago, Ronuk said:

They are doing no more than applying the rules. The Police and immigration are on a hiding to nothing. When they do nothing people moan, when they do something people moan. People cannot just do as they like anymore and expect to be left alone. If you play by the rules it's great here. If you want to attempt to twist and manipulate them to suit the agenda, expect an issue. Yes, it's changing here but a lot of people would actually say for the better. You can hardly look back and call days past 'Glory days'. The place was full of undesirables that were stuck here because to go back home, invariably meant years in prison.

 

As far as people not being able to stay for years on Ed visas ... well, they are and do exactly that.  The only change is that it is a bit more expensive now, due to tuition increases to cover the extra hours required, one must change subjects/languages more frequently, and one must pay a 'fee' 3 times per year to have an extension approved regardless of attendance. 

 

I use Tourist Visas, but if I were on the ED, I'd be afraid to try those extensions without paying the extra fee, even though I most certainly would attend the classes I was paying for.  Not paying extras means someone is not happy about not receiving them, and I don't need enemies in the system.  I perceive issues regarding the acceptance of Tourist Visas at the border, new questioning, etc to be nothing more than pressure to push people into visas which involve 'extra fees' - like the ED.

 

Based on people I have met, the 'crackdown' on Ed Visas has not changed anything regarding the concerns used to justify it.  Someone somewhere might have had good intentions, but the effect, regardless of intent is this:  Doing things the "honest" way goes against the grain, and makes someone, somewhere, angry.

 

The same dynamic appears to be true for retirement-extensions, based on other threads, which explains some offices starting to reject 800K in the bank unless it is 'showing money going in and out' (not the law), require special extensive medicals from a certain place, etc.  But use an agent, and you don't need money in the bank, a letter stating your income, etc - more of the same.

This is nothing unique to Thailand - it is the same everywhere; your money goes to an 'agent', a 'lawyer', or whoever, to get a desired result from a government bureaucracy - criminal, civil or otherwise.  The "loopholes" to be closed are usually ways to do something without paying special people - or to block payments to some, and shift those payments to others.  The reasons given are for various possibly valid reasons, but the results never correlate.

[ubonjoe]

I have just removed 11 posts that was a continuation of a bickering battle between 2 members. Time to end it now or warnings will be given.

[Grubster]

My question is why don't people simply go to immigration [ with a smile] and tell them what you wish to do and ask them to please help you? I really don't think most of them are the enemy.

[Cletus]

On 25/8/2016 at 9:09 AM, JackThompson said:

 

As far as people not being able to stay for years on Ed visas ... well, they are and do exactly that.  The only change is that it is a bit more expensive now, due to tuition increases to cover the extra hours required, one must change subjects/languages more frequently, and one must pay a 'fee' 3 times per year to have an extension approved regardless of attendance. 

 

I use Tourist Visas, but if I were on the ED, I'd be afraid to try those extensions without paying the extra fee, even though I most certainly would attend the classes I was paying for.  Not paying extras means someone is not happy about not receiving them, and I don't need enemies in the system.  I perceive issues regarding the acceptance of Tourist Visas at the border, new questioning, etc to be nothing more than pressure to push people into visas which involve 'extra fees' - like the ED.

 

 

 

Excuse me, what is this "fee" "extra fee" you are talking about? Is it bribe money, agency fee? The school is paying it for you? You pay it at immigration? I'm asking because I'd be interested in studying thai and get an ED visa.

Thank you

[JackThompson]

18 minutes ago, Cletus said:

 

Excuse me, what is this "fee" "extra fee" you are talking about? Is it bribe money, agency fee? The school is paying it for you? You pay it at immigration? I'm asking because I'd be interested in studying thai and get an ED visa.

Thank you

 

I have been following the Ed-Visa stories here for years.  According to what some people have reported about their Ed-visa extensions, they are 'encouraged' to pay a fee to the school, for each extension, who then obtains their extensions for them. 

 

Prior to the 'crackdown', students could simply to to the immigration office with some paperwork from the school, every 3 months, to receive their extension.  After the crackdown began, Immigration officers started giving 'Thai Language Tests' to students applying for extensions - often asking to demonstrate abilities they had not yet learned in their classes.  That is when, just coincidentally, the 'fee' system appeared.  Then the minimum hours of study were increased, causing a rise in the tuition-rate. 

 

In essence, the only change, is that it is not as cheap to stay here for years on Ed Visas. 

[JerryinTH]

1 hour ago, Cletus said:

 

Excuse me, what is this "fee" "extra fee" you are talking about? Is it bribe money, agency fee? The school is paying it for you? You pay it at immigration? I'm asking because I'd be interested in studying thai and get an ED visa.

Thank you

 

Well thats pretty obvious. He said 'regardless of attendance'.

[Myrhok]

Hello guys,

 

I'm back here to read the answers to my topic and I'm really confused.

 

The question is not about to stay semi-legally here without attend the classes or indefinitely. 

 

Of course I will be enjoying staying here but that's not the point : if I'm applying for an ED-visa, it's for attending the lessons. It's for learning thai, effectively. And I'm not afraid by an eventual exam in thai. I love to learn this language. And languages generally.

 

As I said, I used this visa only one time in 2014 and less than 9 month and I've been attending the classes.

 

But the question is more dramatic here. It's about this if you don't mind I'm copy/paste a part of my original post - please re-read it completely above : 

 

" I've been told these three different things : 

 

" if you got an ED-visa, even only one time, in the past, 

• either you cannot get a new one
• either you can get one, but for 6 months only, and so you cannot extend it up to one year --- I do know it's by periods of three month that you can stay here, it was always the case in 2014 ... but I'm talking about the total length of stay ...
• either you get 6 months and the other 6 months are depending on an exam organized by the immigration office."

"

 

Now I have to add this :

 

- I went to a website of a school in CM, and they explicitly say on their website : "if you got an ED-visa, even only one time, in the past, you can get one, but for 6 months only - this new rule is available for all the schools in CM"

- I went physically also to another school in CM and there, it was worse. I've been told that I had to choose another language since I was a student in 2014 and had already got one ED-visa in the past.

- A third school proposed me an illegal behaviour : to go to my original school of 2014 and to ask them to cancel my previous visa ... What I would never do.

 

Do you really think we can speak thai in 9 months ? I cannot ... And if I want to learn chinese, I go to China or Taiwan. If I want to learn Thai, I think it's better to come in Thailand ... I have private reasons to learn this language as well. 

 

Please, don't discuss the fake students that are living in Thailand or don't assume that I would not attend the classes. And don't tell me that there are other visa to come in Thailand. I do know ... But I want to check if I can apply for an ED-visa here. Only. 

 

If someone can help about the rules here. The official rules ...

 

Thank's a lot guys and have a nice day.

 

 

Edited September 1, 2016 by Myrhok

[JackThompson]

58 minutes ago, Myrhok said:

- A third school proposed me an illegal behaviour : to go to my original school of 2014 and to ask them to cancel my previous visa ... What I would never do.

 

Do you really think we can speak thai in 9 months ? I cannot ...

 

Like you, I would also attend classes I was paying for.  What may have been requested regarding contacting your previous school, is some way to show you only attended classes there for 9 months, hence the last 3 months of your visa was not used.  Assuming you left Thailand at that point, I am not sure why this would not be self-evident, but ...

 

You can only study Thai through "language-schools" for a limited time (full universities are another thing).  If that limit is now 18 months (due to the newly-increased-minimum hours), this would explain the "only 6 months more" rule you are running into.  It may be the case that Immigration is just looking at it as "1 year + 6 months in total Ed-Visa time for Thai" - regardless of whether or not you used "the whole visa" previously, or not.

 

So what the 3rd school may have been after, is a way to get you a legal way to obtain at least 9 more months of Thai study.

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, Myrhok said:

Hello guys,

 

I'm back here to read the answers to my topic and I'm really confused.

 

The question is not about to stay semi-legally here without attend the classes or indefinitely. 

 

Of course I will be enjoying staying here but that's not the point : if I'm applying for an ED-visa, it's for attending the lessons. It's for learning thai, effectively. And I'm not afraid by an eventual exam in thai. I love to learn this language. And languages generally.

You don't need an ED visa to attend Thai classes.