Got SETV in Manila - Trip Report

[jspill]

This digital nomad blogger I follow recently got a single entry tourist visa at the Thai consulate in Manila. He had to show bank statement, hotel booking, inward and outward flight ticket, and some paperwork showing online earnings. He showed his offshore client contacts too. 

 

They didn't mind at all that he was running an online business, that satisified them that he wasn't working illegally in Thailand, and approved his visa. 

 

http://afarangabroad.com/2017/02/get-thai-tourist-visa-manila/

[JackThompson]

While this worked for this person at this time, I would suggest it would be far wiser to show simply regular transfers into one's bank- account - either FTT (foreign transfers) into a Thai bank, or funds-transfers into foreign bank - as proof of one's non-Thai income.  There would be nothing to be gained, and possibly something to lose in the future, by announcing one "does work" while in Thailand.   

 

Recall, that until a few months ago, no one every heard anything about a "TM-30" form when applying for a visa extension, to spite the law being on the books for years.  Old laws can begin to be enforced at any time.

[jethro69]

Let me warm this up as it's the most recently I found.

Planning for next years SETV, especially as I have to get already the ticket for my METV. Do you have to go to the Embassy in person, as a fact I never liked Manila, so no intention to stay there.

Assumed I provide all the documents, might there be agents, in Angeles or Boracay or wherever (not decided yet) who might handle the visa application?

[mstevens]

2 hours ago, jethro69 said:

Let me warm this up as it's the most recently I found.

Planning for next years SETV, especially as I have to get already the ticket for my METV. Do you have to go to the Embassy in person, as a fact I never liked Manila, so no intention to stay there.

Assumed I provide all the documents, might there be agents, in Angeles or Boracay or wherever (not decided yet) who might handle the visa application?

No disrespect intended, but the way things change with visa rules as well as at individual embassies and consulates, I think asking a question several months before you are to venture to a particular embassy and apply for a visa won't be fruitful.  Best to check back in much nearer the time.

[1SteveC]

On 2/23/2017 at 11:48 PM, jspill said:

They didn't mind at all that he was running an online business, that satisified them that he wasn't working illegally in Thailand, and approved his visa. 

 

Sorry, but a local hire in a random consulate issuing a visa does not constitute proof that your friend is "not working illegally in Thailand".

 

From the webpage "I simply told her the truth that I am here on holiday and run an online business from my laptop." - How can he be on holiday AND running a business ? According to his visa history, he has been here well over a year.....................on holiday?  Whatever.

Edited June 6, 2017 by 1SteveC

[IMA_FARANG]

A local Thai consulate whether in Manila or another may NOT have access to information as to whether a applicant is or is not working on-line via the internet I Thailand.

A bankbook for a Thai bank, can and often does show a record of a regular monthly transfer of funds into Thailand from outside of Thailand.

As I said before on this forum , I have a monthly pension transferred by direct deposit into my Thai bank account from the U.S.

I t shows up each month as a FTT incoming credit in my bankbook and many immigration officers know how to read a bankbook clearly.

I have had immigration ask to photocopy my Thai bankbook and the go through that photocopy underlining in red or yellow marker all the FTT entries, and then adding that marked photocopy to my visa application packet.

Don't think that immigration is fools, and especially the senior officers know precisely what they are doing and want to see from the applicant.

 

[jethro69]

13 hours ago, jethro69 said:

Let me warm this up as it's the most recently I found.

Planning for next years SETV, especially as I have to get already the ticket for my METV. Do you have to go to the Embassy in person, as a fact I never liked Manila, so no intention to stay there.

Assumed I provide all the documents, might there be agents, in Angeles or Boracay or wherever (not decided yet) who might handle the visa application?

 

10 hours ago, mstevens said:

No disrespect intended, but the way things change with visa rules as well as at individual embassies and consulates, I think asking a question several months before you are to venture to a particular embassy and apply for a visa won't be fruitful.  Best to check back in much nearer the time.

You're certainly correct on this, the "problem" is I need to book my flight out of Thailand when applying for my METV in August. I would go back to Phnom Penh, but I was advised not to do, as I had one SETV already from them. After all, I could still use the flight, and in case it doesn't work out with the visa, there's still the 30 day exempt available (maybe).

[midas]

1 hour ago, jethro69 said:

 

You're certainly correct on this, the "problem" is I need to book my flight out of Thailand when applying for my METV in August. I would go back to Phnom Penh, but I was advised not to do, as I had one SETV already from them. After all, I could still use the flight, and in case it doesn't work out with the visa, there's still the 30 day exempt available (maybe).

If you are in  PP and things don't work out as you say there you could simply catch one of the many buses over to Ho Chi Minh City and try at that embassy. It's only a six hour journey.

[1SteveC]

14 hours ago, mstevens said:

No disrespect intended, but the way things change with visa rules as well as at individual embassies and consulates, I think asking a question several months before you are to venture to a particular embassy and apply for a visa won't be fruitful.  Best to check back in much nearer the time.

 

Can you please tell me what these changes to visa rules are? You insinuate that they are constantly changing - do you have any evidence of this?

Edited June 6, 2017 by 1SteveC

[jethro69]

On Tuesday, June 06, 2017 at 4:35 PM, midas said:

If you are in  PP and things don't work out as you say there you could simply catch one of the many buses over to Ho Chi Minh City and try at that embassy. It's only a six hour journey.

Yep, something to consider as well. I might even go through my old mails, I believe I still have contacts in the Phills, just checking what they say, or I might just stay there ?

[IMA_FARANG]

Simply acquiring a entry visa does NOT legally allow you to work on line in Thailand.

In fact working on line in Thailand is illegal and MAY be a violation of the law.

The law about working in Thailand does NOT allow you to work on line here.

However like many things in  Thailand the law is out of date, and has not considered on line working as a "Digital Blogger" or whatever you call yourself.

without a work permit, and a Thai based company hiring you as an employee, you are technically in violation of Thai labor law.

In reality, however, Thailand doe not have the capacity  to monitor  your on line business activity, and therefore they allow it.

However, it is illegal in Thailand to work 0n line in Thailand, but simply not enforced.

as an on line blogger for profit however you violate the intent at least of  Thai work law without a work permit.

So now, you know, continue at your own risk, and don't complain if you get caught and are fined or deported, as unlikely as that may be.

 

-------------------------------------------------

To borrow a slogan from another poster:

I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you

 

 

[jspill]

On 2017-6-8 at 4:27 AM, IMA_FARANG said:

Simply acquiring a entry visa does NOT legally allow you to work on line in Thailand.

In fact working on line in Thailand is illegal and MAY be a violation of the law.

The law about working in Thailand does NOT allow you to work on line here.

However like many things in  Thailand the law is out of date, and has not considered on line working as a "Digital Blogger" or whatever you call yourself.

without a work permit, and a Thai based company hiring you as an employee, you are technically in violation of Thai labor law.

In reality, however, Thailand doe not have the capacity  to monitor  your on line business activity, and therefore they allow it.

However, it is illegal in Thailand to work 0n line in Thailand, but simply not enforced.

as an on line blogger for profit however you violate the intent at least of  Thai work law without a work permit.

So now, you know, continue at your own risk, and don't complain if you get caught and are fined or deported, as unlikely as that may be.

 

-------------------------------------------------

To borrow a slogan from another poster:

I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you

 

 

It not being 'legalized' (as in officially recognised, taxed, with it's own visa status like online freelancer visas in Estonia, Germany etc. does not necessarily make it 'illegal'. 

 

A more realistic view is that it exists in a grey area. No armchair lawyer on an expat forum should explicitly label it either legal or illegal. It just has not been classified as work yet, it isn't on the list of jobs that Thailand says require a work permit. 

 

No one's ever been convicted of a crime for simply running a blog or Youtube channel the notion is ridiculous. Unless it encompasses another crime like producing porn, gambling, etc.

 

I think you know no one would ever be deported or see the inside of a court it would simply be a small 'fine' because the low level officer decides to consider it work and the online worker wouldn't want to wait for a court date and official ruling. Or one would simply be told ok you need to change visa status now. 

 

Look at expat of many years Richard Barrow he's an extremely prominent blogger. Or the learn Thai from a white guy dude, the list goes on.

Edited June 10, 2017 by jspill

[BritTim]

58 minutes ago, jspill said:

It just has not been classified as work yet, it isn't on the list of jobs that Thailand says require a work permit. 

What list is that? I am aware of a list of occupations that are restricted to Thais only, but no lists of occupations that are "work". There are always grey areas in the law. However, I think it reasonable to describe the digital nomad, not receiving money for work done in Thailand, as tolerated rather than legal. The letter of the Working of Alient Act (2008) certainly suggests that is the case.

Quote

"Work" means engaging in work by exerting energy or using knowledge whether or not in consideration of wages or other benefits;

Quote

Section 9. No alien shall engage in any work other than the works under section 7 and the permit shall be granted by the registrar, except for the alien who enters into the Kingdom temporarily under the law on immigration so as to engage in necessary and urgent work for a period of not exceeding fifteen days and that alien may engage in that work after giving written notification to the registrar.

The Act does allow for a few exceptions (such as diplomats) but certainly does not include digital nomads.

The law as it is currently formulated is ridiculously over broad and impractical. That is why it is not enforced in various situations. However, like prostitution, working without a work permit is not a grey area. It is simply an example of a law not consistently applied.

[johnsjourney]

Technically illegal to work online in Thailand, but in practice it is tolerated at some immigration areas more than others.  I would not recommend Phuket or Hua Hin for example, but Chiang Mai would be fine, but I also agree don't mention it if not necessary.  It is of course a grey area as many high value tourists have to respond online while on a normal holiday.  The key thing in implementation is is it an issue for local people and the sort of tourists an area decides to attract or discourage.