Koh Tao murders: David Miller family confident Thai court "made correct decision" by upholding guilty verdict

[jenifer d]

On 2/3/2560 at 9:42 PM, Thomas Hannah said:

In others words.The thai,s have made laws stopping you reporting the truth.now the law in western society is.You can record crime and the police in there duties as they are public servants.But they cannot record you.And the people on here who always try to say crime is the same in other countrys.Yes it is.But the laws are not.And yes certain people can get away with crimes.Tony Blair for one.Of thousands of others who just resign.or if your mother was prime minister.but thailand is a thousand fold compared to are way of life.The way they are now is the way that we were not very long ago.

yes, it was one of my posts that was originally removed, when i cited the same info in the (still available) ThaiPBS report...

EVERYBODY in Koh Tao, Thai AND foreigner, KNOWS who did it, i cite the ThaiPBS report for whom...

[jenifer d]

7 hours ago, Eligius said:

Yes, the business with the phone is a complete shambles and botch-up and pack of distortions, as with everything in this case. Even if one of the Burmese lads stole the phone - which I doubt - that does NOT prove murder or rape. Totally separate issues. There is not one shred of hard evidence of murder and rape attaching to the Burmese lads - not one.

 

Sentencing them to death without one iota of hard, reliable, relevant evidence is a scandal beyond all imagining.

yes, and i TRULY pray for Thailand's karma if these two COMPLETELY innocent scapegoats are executed

[Khun Han]

7 minutes ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

If the Police already had David Millers Cell Phone, as you said, and also Hannah's, why would the question of any cell phone be brought up by the Police in the first place? Or in the Court Room? Do you think they looked in the jungle for a smashed up cell phone, just to return it to the owner? Only because they heard thee 2 guys found one?

 

Really! Make any picture you want and put a face on it, and the whole world will believe it is true.

 

Go Figure?

 

Make any picture you want and put a face on it, and the whole world will believe it is true.

 

Which is what the Thai police have tried to do with the phone and just about all the other evidence. The people who made the big calls chose to believe it, for whatever reasons.....A few people like yourself chose to believe it, for whatever reasons.....nobody else in the world believes it, they see it for the sham and stitch-up that it is.

[GOLDBUGGY]

16 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

 

It is plainly obvious to any honest, unbiased person what points Laura Witheridge was getting across. You try to put wild and quite deliberate  misinterpretations on what she wrote. That's trolling.

No I am not. I am not putting any words in her mouth. All I said is that if she thinks the 2 Accused are innocent, then she never saw so.

 

From what I read I never saw that or what you think you saw. But if you see different than fine. But the courts and appeal court don't agree with you, and that is what counts here.

 

That is not trolling but voicing an honest opinion. They have the Supreme Court now, who they must try and convince, and not you or I.   

[Khun Han]

11 minutes ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

No I am not. I am not putting any words in her mouth. All I said is that if she thinks the 2 Accused are innocent, then she never saw so.

 

From what I read I never saw that or what you think you saw. But if you see different than fine. But the courts and appeal court don't agree with you, and that is what counts here.

 

That is not trolling but voicing an honest opinion. They have the Supreme Court now, who they must try and convince, and not you or I.   

 

As has been pointed out to you by myself and another poster, Laura specifically accused Thais of murdering her sister. The two young men convicted of her murder are Burmese. Yet you continue to troll..

[jenifer d]

2 hours ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

David Miller's Phone was discovered missing early on in the investigation to these murders. The police decided to keep this a secret from the press in hopes of catching the murderer with this phone so nothing was said at first. There was some early mix up in reporting this as the news quoting by a high ranking police officer reported it was Hannah's phone missing. But he made a mistake, or it was reported wrongly, and it was actually David's Phone. Which to keep that secret they could say nothing to correct that.  

 

When the 2 Accused were finally arrested and held in custody, they were asked about this phone. One of the Accused admitted to having the phone who he gave to a friend. This friend was soon questioned and he admitted that he was given this phone. But he said it didn't work so he smashed it up with a hammer in a plastic bag and threw it into the jungle behind his living quarters. After a search of the area by police, this cell phone was located and recovered.

 

The Thai Police tried to piece this broken cell phone together and find the identity of this cell phone owner. Since this cell phone was purchased in the UK they asked the UK Police for assistance. But under UK Law Police are not allowed to assist in a Capital Punishment Cases, so there assistance was refused.

 

Somewhere along the line David Miller's Family catch wind of this. They were able to track David's Bill of sale and from that get the ID # of the cell phone. Which seemed to match what the Thai Police had in there possession. This missing cell phone was brought up at the trial, but whether the Prosecution brought up the matching numbers done by the Miller Family is unclear.  

 

As to the 2 Accused, once they recanted their Guilty Plea, they provided additional information about this missing cell phone. On the night of these murders and rape, they claim they were too drunk to remember the exact time they got home except it was quite late. That is after finding some of there clothes missing after going for a swim in the sea near the murder scene. But repeatedly kept saying they never saw either David or Hannah at all that night. So they now claimed they found David Millers Black Cell Phone on a dark night on the Beach. The explanation they gave for giving this expensive cell phone away to their friend is that he in the past helped them out a lot. No explanation was given as the why this friend beat the tar out of this expensive cell phone, other that it did work when he first tried it.

 

Does any of there changed statement make sense to you? Well this is up-to-you to decide. But obviously the court didn't buy it, or the Appeal Court either. All that is left now is the Supreme Court, and even if they will hear this case. But their guilt or innocents doesn't rest on my responsibility or what I think. Or Yours.        .   

you are really deluded; EVERYBODY on Koh Tao KNOWS who really did it, so did the 1st police investigator (see the ThaiPBS story, linked through another poster here), who was suddenly taken OFF the case before the 2 Burmese were scapegoated...

 

[jenifer d]

10 hours ago, greenchair said:

The defense did nothing to dispute the ownership of the phone. 

He pled guilty. To me it was more important than the dna. 

yes, the Burmese were near the scene, and found the phone which had dropped during the murders perpetrated by the actual killers

[jenifer d]

20 hours ago, bbbbooboo said:

hmmm...... we will probably never know the truth

oh, those of us w/friends in Koh Tao KNOW the REAL truth-

and these 2 Burmese ARE INNOCENT!!!

[berybert]

1 hour ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

What if I told you that her statements are damaging to many people in Thailand, and especially on that Island, who make there living through tourism? That her words are liable to make some people very angry. To perhaps to the point of a death threat.

 

I think that if she thinks the Accuses are innocent, she would have said so. She does not strike me as a person who would hold back words when she has something to say.  

 

1 hour ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

I never heard of a Mass Exodus from the Island, so I guess they are happy their.

 

Tourist seem to be keep coming their still to.

 

Go Figure?

So what is it ? they are worried or they are not worried ?

[Khun Han]

3 minutes ago, berybert said:

1 hour ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

What if I told you that her statements are damaging to many people in Thailand, and especially on that Island, who make there living through tourism? That her words are liable to make some people very angry. To perhaps to the point of a death threat.

 

I think that if she thinks the Accuses are innocent, she would have said so. She does not strike me as a person who would hold back words when she has something to say.  

 

1 hour ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

I never heard of a Mass Exodus from the Island, so I guess they are happy their.

 

Tourist seem to be keep coming their still to.

 

Go Figure?

So what is it ? they are worried or they are not worried ?

 

Whatever answer suits his argument at the time?

[greenchair]

9 hours ago, Khun Han said:

 

The only twisting and translating has been by the Koh Tao mafia apologists, who also disrespected Hannah's sister by saying that she was being manipulated by supporters of the scapegoats.

 

I know you've deliberately mis-phrased your fourth paragraph so you can deny what you wrote, but I don't recall Hannah's family saying that the evidence was 'absolutely overwhelming'. In fact, I seem to recall that they said they were reserving judgment on the verdict.

After a meeting with the the UK police and pressure from the media to join the circus, the evidence is compelling and  those boys have a lot to answer to.

Yes, I stand corrected. the Miller family said the evidence was absolutely overwhelming. 

[greenchair]

5 hours ago, jenifer d said:

yes, the Burmese were near the scene, and found the phone which had dropped during the murders perpetrated by the actual killers

Well it seems progress is being made.

You can accept that the phone came from the murder scene. 

You can accept that the Burmese had that phone.

Well done.  

[Mises]

 

The police/prosecution’s version of events does not make sense to me, consider:

David was found naked apart from one sock, the only time I have one sock on is when I have just put it on or am about to take it off. The prosecution case would make more sense to me had David been found with his shorts around his ankles.

Hannah was fully clothed, albeit in disarray apart from her panties and flip flops.

The major wounds to David’s scalp did not look like wounds from a hoe, they looked more like wounds from a blunt instrument. Additionally David had other wounds such as the one on his left shoulder that looked more like a knife wound.

 

The photos below:

       

 

In the first photo we can see David’s shirt then in the fore ground his shorts and belt with the offset rivet and Hannah’s panties in front of the belt. There is also a beach towel on the rock in the back ground which suggests to me that someone (David?) had gone for a swim. But what is the black item under David’s shorts and why is it not in the second photo or the one below?

 

 

Early on there was mention of some black shorts being found but I don’t have a link. If the black item was black shorts what happened to them? Is the fourth photo below a clue?

 

 

[AGareth2]

6 hours ago, jenifer d said:

yes, the Burmese were near the scene, and found the phone which had dropped during the murders perpetrated by the actual killers

are you saying the B2 witnessed the murders?

[metisdead]

An off topic post about the 23 Year Old Russian Girl Missing from Koh Tao has been removed, there is already a separate topic running regarding this here:

 

 

23 Year Old Russian Girl Missing from Koh Tao

 

 

Edit:  A shills troll post has now been removed. 

 

 

Edited March 4, 2017 by metisdead

[chainarong]

On ‎3‎/‎2‎/‎2017 at 10:44 AM, DiscoDan said:

They sat through the court case they chose to make their own mind up instead of listening to convicted criminal Andy Hall and his bunch of activists and journalist who were only willing to report one side of the story.

How come then the next day after the murder a senior RTP officer said and I quote: The culprit is not an Asian, the DNA indicates this, I have seen the RTP in action before,  this case smells.

[chainarong]

1 hour ago, Mises said:

 

The police/prosecution’s version of events does not make sense to me, consider:

David was found naked apart from one sock, the only time I have one sock on is when I have just put it on or am about to take it off. The prosecution case would make more sense to me had David been found with his shorts around his ankles.

Hannah was fully clothed, albeit in disarray apart from her panties and flip flops.

The major wounds to David’s scalp did not look like wounds from a hoe, they looked more like wounds from a blunt instrument. Additionally David had other wounds such as the one on his left shoulder that looked more like a knife wound.

 

The photos below:

       

 

In the first photo we can see David’s shirt then in the fore ground his shorts and belt with the offset rivet and Hannah’s panties in front of the belt. There is also a beach towel on the rock in the back ground which suggests to me that someone (David?) had gone for a swim. But what is the black item under David’s shorts and why is it not in the second photo or the one below?

 

 

Early on there was mention of some black shorts being found but I don’t have a link. If the black item was black shorts what happened to them? Is the fourth photo below a clue?

 

 

I'd like to see an independent DNA test done in Singapore , because at the very start a senior RTP officer stated the DNA indicates it is not an Asian, this case stinks

[GOLDBUGGY]

8 hours ago, Khun Han said:

 

As has been pointed out to you by myself and another poster, Laura specifically accused Thais of murdering her sister. The two young men convicted of her murder are Burmese. Yet you continue to troll..

So are you claiming now that Laura was on the island the night the rape and murder took place and witnessed this murder?

 

Otherwise how would she know who did it and who didn't? Especially since she already pointed out that the Police were not very cooperative with her or her family in updates and any new information.

 

But what reason you claim she knows more than we do, I might also claim that the Miller Family does to. But they leave no doubt that they believe the correct killers were captured and prosecuted. Now do they?

[GOLDBUGGY]

8 hours ago, jenifer d said:

you are really deluded; EVERYBODY on Koh Tao KNOWS who really did it, so did the 1st police investigator (see the ThaiPBS story, linked through another poster here), who was suddenly taken OFF the case before the 2 Burmese were scapegoated...

 

I just love when people come along and put words in the mouth of the rest of the people on the island when they themselves have not been their, or even know a good trusting friend who has even, who may have questioned these people to get such a powerful answer.

 

Did you personally ask anyone on the Island what they thought to be able divulge such valuable information here? Even if you did, which I highly doubt, what special information did they have or get, that the rest of us didn't get through police statements and the media, for them to pin point who the murderer (s) are?

 

This Special Police Commissioner was taken off the case because he was given a higher post in the Police Commission Office filling in for someone who was now Retiring. This promotion was well on the books for a long time and prior to this rape and murdered case. So would he be expected to turn down a once in a life-time promotion based solely on one murderer investigation? Although when he was required to leave his last posting he did agree to help out in this investigation as much as possible. .  

[smedly]

7 minutes ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

This Special Police Commissioner was taken off the case because he was given a higher post in the Police Commission Office 

you do not suddenly remove someone heading a high profile double murder case no matter who retired

 

 

stop posting this twisted garbage nonsense

[smedly]

19 hours ago, smedly said:

they found a phone......just a phone

 

they also found a phone at the crime scene

 

That is two phones, out of these two phones they claim one of them belonged to David the other one has vanished into thin air and is unaccounted for, now the police claim the phone found at the B2 residence was Davids but have as yet explained who owner the other one,

 

Now lets assume for a moment that this was indeed a stitch up job, if you were the police and allowed to do whatever the hell you like and you had two phones - which one would you claim was found at B2 residence, but then you ask - how do they explain the other phone..................well they didn't

 

and also note that a lot of the stuff that has caused massive questions like the one I described above was in fact revealed by the original investigating team who were suddenly removed, they made a lot of their findings public very early on in transparent progress reports to the media

 

just to be clear about the phones

[smedly]

On ‎3‎/‎3‎/‎2017 at 5:32 AM, smedly said:

anyone that was unfortunate to see the pictures that were published online of Hannah and how she was found would know this was more than just a rape, it was a brutal crime of hate by something very evil on that island that wanted to put their cowardly work on display and demean this lovely innocent girl , a criminologist/crime profiler would take one look and know exactly what went on and why - without the alleged rape there was no motive and you need a motive  - it is primary to any murder investigation - the display left on the beach for people to find was no rape - just an evil act of extreme violence from a coward who lost face in front of their subordinates - how dare this scum farang deny me   

also worth noting that B2 were supposed to have carried out this double murder without so much as a scratch....really

[GOLDBUGGY]

8 hours ago, jenifer d said:

yes, the Burmese were near the scene, and found the phone which had dropped during the murders perpetrated by the actual killers

Can I check to see if I got what you are saying is right.

 

The 2 Accused had already admitted that they were on the beach most of that night drinking, near the murder scene, and playing music, on the night of the rape and murders. They even stated that they went for a late night swim in the sea near the murder scene. But they both claimed they did not see David or Hannah at all that night. In fact they claimed they did not see anyone else that night near the murder scene either.

 

But you are now claiming that the actual murderers walked by the accused, which they would have to get back home, and dropped this cell phone in the sand, which they never noticed right away, and who the accused also claimed they didn't see that night, but they somehow managed to find this cell phone in the sand later on.

 

So the 2 Accused didn't see David or Hannah that night, or you claim the actual murderers either, or anybody else for that matter, but somehow managed to find a black cell phone at night time hidden in the sand, which so happens to belong to David Miller.  

 

Is this what you are trying to tell us?    

[GOLDBUGGY]

18 minutes ago, smedly said:

you do not suddenly remove someone heading a high profile double murder case no matter who retired

 

 

stop posting this twisted garbage nonsense

Well obviously you must be wrong because they exactly did do this. Otherwise he would have still been on this case.

 

Look! They had there day in Court with the best legal counsel money could buy, even though they are poor. Their Defense Team, and there were many on it, put up a hell of a fight for them, but lost on damning evidence. All of which you questioned and rejected.

 

Non the less they lost this case and now a year later or so, the appeal case as well. Also based on this damning evidence. What you or I think and if the accused are guilty or not, makes no difference at all. So get a grip on yourself and stop attaching people just because they don't agree with you.

 

It was better when you didn't reply to my posts.

 

[GOLDBUGGY]

18 minutes ago, smedly said:

also worth noting that B2 were supposed to have carried out this double murder without so much as a scratch....really

How would you know? They weren't arrested until many days (weeks) later so any scratch would have long been gone.

[GOLDBUGGY]

9 hours ago, Khun Han said:

 

Make any picture you want and put a face on it, and the whole world will believe it is true.

 

Which is what the Thai police have tried to do with the phone and just about all the other evidence. The people who made the big calls chose to believe it, for whatever reasons.....A few people like yourself chose to believe it, for whatever reasons.....nobody else in the world believes it, they see it for the sham and stitch-up that it is.

I believe they are guilty because I don't believe the made up story they came out later after they first admitted to being guilty.

 

Sitting at the beach all night and even going for a swim near the murder scene but not seeing anything or anybody all night. Missing clothes from their late night swim, when everyone is in bed, which makes you also wonder who would steel some old clothes or flip flops, which they must have thought turned up at the murder scene. Remembering everything that night except what time they got home, as they said they were too drunk.

 

Not seeing anyone all night long but being able to spot a Black Cell Phone in the Sand at night time, which turns out to be David Millers. Yet with both of them being quite poor, they decide to give this expensive cell phone to a friend based only because he has helped them in the past. But this story gets better and is my favorite one. How does this Friend show his appreciation to the Accused for getting such and nice expensive gift like that for doing nothing?

 

Their Friend tries the cell phone but it doesn't work. Does he: 1) Try to get fixed so he can use it later? 2) Give it back to his Friends with a Thank You for the gift but sorry it doesn't work. 3) Put it on a shelf and forget about it. No to all answers! What their Friend does is he puts it in a Plastic Bag, takes out a hammer so he can smash it up to small pieces, then throws it in the jungle in his back yard never to be found again. The Police only knew he had it because the Accused told them, when they first confessed.

 

Believe that if you want to but I don't. For the court case it was other evidence as well they claim to have, like DNA, which they felt was far to overwhelming and enough evidence to convict them. The Appeals Court agrees to that verdict. Whether it is or isn't, has always been up for debate. But it is what it is.

[Khun Han]

4 hours ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

So are you claiming now that Laura was on the island the night the rape and murder took place and witnessed this murder?

 

Otherwise how would she know who did it and who didn't? Especially since she already pointed out that the Police were not very cooperative with her or her family in updates and any new information.

 

But what reason you claim she knows more than we do, I might also claim that the Miller Family does to. But they leave no doubt that they believe the correct killers were captured and prosecuted. Now do they?

 

Er.....weren't we discussing your deliberate misinterpretations of what Laura was saying? Finish that conversation first please before you turn your trolling to something else.

[Khun Han]

3 hours ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

I believe they are guilty because I don't believe the made up story they came out later after they first admitted to being guilty.

 

Sitting at the beach all night and even going for a swim near the murder scene but not seeing anything or anybody all night. Missing clothes from their late night swim, when everyone is in bed, which makes you also wonder who would steel some old clothes or flip flops, which they must have thought turned up at the murder scene. Remembering everything that night except what time they got home, as they said they were too drunk.

 

Not seeing anyone all night long but being able to spot a Black Cell Phone in the Sand at night time, which turns out to be David Millers. Yet with both of them being quite poor, they decide to give this expensive cell phone to a friend based only because he has helped them in the past. But this story gets better and is my favorite one. How does this Friend show his appreciation to the Accused for getting such and nice expensive gift like that for doing nothing?

 

Their Friend tries the cell phone but it doesn't work. Does he: 1) Try to get fixed so he can use it later? 2) Give it back to his Friends with a Thank You for the gift but sorry it doesn't work. 3) Put it on a shelf and forget about it. No to all answers! What their Friend does is he puts it in a Plastic Bag, takes out a hammer so he can smash it up to small pieces, then throws it in the jungle in his back yard never to be found again. The Police only knew he had it because the Accused told them, when they first confessed.

 

Believe that if you want to but I don't. For the court case it was other evidence as well they claim to have, like DNA, which they felt was far to overwhelming and enough evidence to convict them. The Appeals Court agrees to that verdict. Whether it is or isn't, has always been up for debate. But it is what it is.

 

Most of the this post is just your extremely subjective interpretation of events. Apart from your confidence in the discredited dna evidence, which is just a plain old leap of faith.

 

The appeals court in this case was the same court as the original trial, so it just agreed with itself. But you knew that anyway.

[berybert]

You don't believe a story about missing clothes as told by 2 Burmese boys.

You don't care about Hannah's missing clothes that would have been covered in the murderers DNA.

These are clothes that were in the custody of the RTP that you have 100% faith in.

 

[GOLDBUGGY]

5 hours ago, Khun Han said:

 

Most of the this post is just your extremely subjective interpretation of events. Apart from your confidence in the discredited dna evidence, which is just a plain old leap of faith.

 

The appeals court in this case was the same court as the original trial, so it just agreed with itself. But you knew that anyway.

My extremely subjective interpretation of events? None of this statement was made up by me.

 

These are the events that the 2 Accused admitted openly to the police themselves and in which they have never tried to denied them later. If you don't believe them than I don't blame you because as I said I don't believe them either.

 

I do find it odd that when you give a friend an expensive cell phone as a gift, and later beats it to pieces with a hammer, then throws it in a jungle. Even if it didn't work at first. But then when you consider he did not do this until the 2 Accused were arrested and being held in custody, then it all becomes very clear why.

 

As to this "Discredited DNA Evidence" this is only your interpretation of what you think you know about it in this case. If it is discredited at all, it was done by false media reports. The case seemed to be fought more through the media than the court room.  

 

If you had heard the original verdict, you would know that the courts did not find this DNA Evidence Discredited at all. In fact the Court commented on that and said this DNA Evidence met the required standard.

 

I did read or hear a long time ago that the main judge in this case may sit on the Appeals Court also, but it was never confirmed later to me. I also saw nothing I the latest news about it either. I certainly didn't hear all 3 judges were sitting on the same Appeals Court.

 

Do you care to share this information with us with some credible link so we know this also and how you found this out?