Inheriting a condo

[inf]

My wife and I are both farang in their 50s living in Taiwan.

I'm thinking of buying a condo in the Pattaya area to spend much time there and eventually live there full-time.

However, looking at all the regulations, my main problem is this: according to the laws - correct me if I'm wrong - if say, I die first, my wife would be unable to inherit the condo I bought and would have to sell it within one year.

Is there really no way around that?

Could we buy the condo as a couple, each of us paying half the purchase price, and could she not buy out my half when I die?

 

I'd love to buy a condo in Thailand, I don't have any problems with the 800K and the 49% and the visa hassles etc, but that inheritance rule is worrying me.

[inThailand]

The cleanest solution to your question is buy a foreign freehold titled condo in both your names. Nothing to pass down or transfer, wifey becomes the sole owner upon your death.

[trogers]

Both of you are Farang. Open a Thai bank account in joint names. Transfer funds from overseas into this account and obtain a FET to buy a foreign-owned condo in joint names.

 

Both of you then make a Thai will separately with the other party as the executor and beneficiary of the wills.

 

Upon demise of either party, get a lawyer to submit the will to the Court to officially appoint the surviving party as the executor. Then submit the court documents to the Land office for title transfer. No new FET is required.

 

Only scenario that needs consideration is what if both of you meet a fatal accident at the same time...

Edited July 22, 2017 by trogers

[KittenKong]

1 hour ago, inf said:

My wife and I are both farang in their 50s living in Taiwan.

I'm thinking of buying a condo in the Pattaya area to spend much time there and eventually live there full-time.

However, looking at all the regulations, my main problem is this: according to the laws - correct me if I'm wrong - if say, I die first, my wife would be unable to inherit the condo I bought and would have to sell it within one year.

 

You are wrong.

 

As you are non-Thai you can leave your non-Thai name condo to anyone who is non-Thai, and they can keep it forever in their own non-Thai name. There will be some fees to pay but they wont be great.

 

Problems only arise when a Thai leaves land or property to a non-Thai.

[wpcoe]

I've seen no mention of a will so far.  Without a Thai will,  there is no automatic inheritance, is there?  A will from another country has no standing in Thailand.  I've always assumed that without a Thai will a judge in some court would assign assets, no?

[trogers]

1 minute ago, wpcoe said:

I've seen no mention of a will so far.  Without a Thai will,  there is no automatic inheritance, is there?  A will from another country has no standing in Thailand.  I've always assumed that without a Thai will a judge in some court would assign assets, no?

Yes, but more tedious with documentation and wait out period for death on intestate.

[inf]

Thanks you all so much for your advice.

[KittenKong]

3 hours ago, wpcoe said:

I've seen no mention of a will so far.  Without a Thai will,  there is no automatic inheritance, is there?  A will from another country has no standing in Thailand.  I've always assumed that without a Thai will a judge in some court would assign assets, no?

 

I understood that the Thai courts will indeed uphold foreign wills (at least assuming that nothing is being contested).

 

Personally my plan is to sell up and go somewhere else before I die as I doubt that my inheritors would enjoy dealing with Thai courts and real estate agents.

[trogers]

3 hours ago, KittenKong said:

 

I understood that the Thai courts will indeed uphold foreign wills (at least assuming that nothing is being contested).

 

Personally my plan is to sell up and go somewhere else before I die as I doubt that my inheritors would enjoy dealing with Thai courts and real estate agents.

Accidents are not planned.

 

A will is like an insurance policy...

[inThailand]

My Thai attorney recommended having a Thai specific will in addition to my home country will. Its in English written by me and witnessed by 2 Thais and 2 falangs. I did this because the whole point is to make it easier for the benefactors.

[wpcoe]

On 7/22/2017 at 7:53 PM, KittenKong said:

 

I understood that the Thai courts will indeed uphold foreign wills (at least assuming that nothing is being contested).

 

Personally my plan is to sell up and go somewhere else before I die as I doubt that my inheritors would enjoy dealing with Thai courts and real estate agents.

 

Well, I'll be damned.  All these years I believed that foreign wills had no standing over here, but apparently they do.

[KittenKong]

1 hour ago, wpcoe said:

 

Well, I'll be damned.  All these years I believed that foreign wills had no standing over here, but apparently they do.

 

Yes, as long as things are straightforward a foreign will should be acceptable. Problems may arise if some Thai person contests it. So I would say that a farang with no Thai partner or child leaving his own-name condo to some other farang should not be a problem.

 

Of course having a Thai will that confirms what's in the farang one should only make it easier, and perhaps safer if there is any likelihood of fake wills appearing.

[inThailand]

Why all this discussion about wills?

Put the condo in both names and it's done.

 

 

[trogers]

2 hours ago, inThailand said:

Why all this discussion about wills?

Put the condo in both names and it's done.

 

 

Each name owns only 50%, leaving a ? on the passing of ownership of the deceased.

[trogers]

2 hours ago, KittenKong said:

 

Yes, as long as things are straightforward a foreign will should be acceptable. Problems may arise if some Thai person contests it. So I would say that a farang with no Thai partner or child leaving his own-name condo to some other farang should not be a problem.

 

Of course having a Thai will that confirms what's in the farang one should only make it easier, and perhaps safer if there is any likelihood of fake wills appearing.

Problem can arise upon contest by siblings or surviving parents of the deceased, especially intestate. Having a Thai will to cover the condo clears any ambiguity.

[KittenKong]

2 hours ago, trogers said:

Problem can arise upon contest by siblings or surviving parents of the deceased, especially intestate.

 

Very unlikely when the deceased has a will in his own country. Hence my comment specifying that.

[inThailand]

6 hours ago, trogers said:

Each name owns only 50%, leaving a ? on the passing of ownership of the deceased.

The OP's question was about leaving the condo to his wife upon his death.

[inThailand]

8 hours ago, trogers said:

Each name owns only 50%, leaving a ? on the passing of ownership of the deceased.

The OP specifically asked about leaving a condo to his wife upon his death. What can be easier than joint ownership? 

[trogers]

44 minutes ago, inThailand said:

The OP specifically asked about leaving a condo to his wife upon his death. What can be easier than joint ownership? 

And when there is no written will, parents of the deceased cannot contest for part of the asset?

Edited July 24, 2017 by trogers

[inThailand]

14 minutes ago, trogers said:

And when there is no written will, parents of the deceased cannot contest for part of the asset?

The husband through his will could leave his 50% of the condo to anyone he desires. The wife as 50% owner retains her half. Her will will determine who gets her half when she terminates. The OP did note mention any childern. With no will and no children the wife automatically becomes the sole owner of the condo when he terminates.

Edited July 24, 2017 by inThailand
fat fingers

[trogers]

18 minutes ago, inThailand said:

The husband through his will could leave his 50% of the condo to anyone he desires. The wife as 50% owner retains her half. Her will will determine who gets her half when she terminates. The OP did note mention any childern. With no will and no children the wife automatically becomes the sole owner of the condo when he terminates.

And the parents of the deceased? Not mentioned in your points above...

[inThailand]

13 minutes ago, trogers said:

 

Edited July 24, 2017 by inThailand

[inThailand]

I did not see anyone including myself dispute the value of having a will.

 

By its self, a will is not the cleanest, easiest or least expensive method for the husband to ensure the wife gets the condo upon this death. Joint ownership does. A will does help by re-enforcing his desires.

[trogers]

18 minutes ago, inThailand said:

I did not see anyone including myself dispute the value of having a will.

 

By its self, a will is not the cleanest, easiest or least expensive method for the husband to ensure the wife gets the condo upon this death. Joint ownership does. A will does help by re-enforcing his desires.

"If you should die without a will while you are in Thailand, your assets are distributed according to the law in Thailand and this means that family members are given priority. Half of the estate will automatically be passed to the spouse and then the rest will be divided first among the children, then to surviving parents, then full-blood brothers and sisters, then half-blood brothers and sisters, then grandparents and finally aunts and uncles. If you should die with no will and there is no family, then the state has the right to take all your property and sell it as it sees fit."

 

http://www.expatfocus.com/expatriate-thailand-wills

 

You need a will to ensure your spouse gets all that 50% of the condo uncontested.

[KittenKong]

3 hours ago, trogers said:

And when there is no written will, parents of the deceased cannot contest for part of the asset?

 

I think that it is always advisable to have a will, even if it's only a foreign one.

 

Anyone wanting to buy property in joint ownership should look at the difference between tenancy in common and joint tenancy  - http://estate.findlaw.com/planning-an-estate/whats-the-difference-between-joint-tenants-with-survivorship-and-.html - though the application and validity of that will depend on which country you are in. I certainly dont know how it's applied in Thailand, if at all.

 

[trogers]

34 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

 

I think that it is always advisable to have a will, even if it's only a foreign one.

 

Anyone wanting to buy property in joint ownership should look at the difference between tenancy in common and joint tenancy  - http://estate.findlaw.com/planning-an-estate/whats-the-difference-between-joint-tenants-with-survivorship-and-.html - though the application and validity of that will depend on which country you are in. I certainly dont know how it's applied in Thailand, if at all.

 

It's 50/50 in Thailand.

 

I paid 2% transfer fee on 50% of the condo's assessed value which was in joint names of my parents, when I inherited my dad's share.

[Delight]

On ‎24‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 8:08 PM, trogers said:

Each name owns only 50%, leaving a ? on the passing of ownership of the deceased.

 This is correct

 

I can find no reference to the OP's circumstances in the condo Act

 

Logically only 50 % of the appraised value of the condo needs to be brought into Thailand as new money.

i.e if the condo has an appraised value of say 5M baht then the widow or widower will have to bring in 2.5M Baht to obtain the FET

Of course the foregoing is only my opinion.

 

As inThailand  has stated it may be simpler and cheaper(in the long run) to put the condo into a company.

You really need  specialised lawyer  advice should you decide to go down that path. With the company route both yourself and your wife must have wills

[trogers]

1 hour ago, Delight said:

 This is correct

 

I can find no reference to the OP's circumstances in the condo Act

 

Logically only 50 % of the appraised value of the condo needs to be brought into Thailand as new money.

i.e if the condo has an appraised value of say 5M baht then the widow or widower will have to bring in 2.5M Baht to obtain the FET

Of course the foregoing is only my opinion.

 

As inThailand  has stated it may be simpler and cheaper(in the long run) to put the condo into a company.

You really need  specialised lawyer  advice should you decide to go down that path. With the company route both yourself and your wife must have wills

There is not need to bring in new money for a new FET, even for only 50%.

 

The FET that covers the 50% of the deceased's ownership can be passed on to his heir, Thai or non-Thai. A written Thai will would makes the title transfer easier.

 

I know because I inherited my late father's condo a year ago, and both of us are non-Thai.

 

Complications with the Condo Acts occur when the deceased is Thai and heir is non-Thai, because there is no FET for the property, and the foreign ownership quota for the project may be fully used.

[KittenKong]

On 25/07/2017 at 5:40 AM, trogers said:

And the parents of the deceased? Not mentioned in your points above...

 

How many people are outlived by their parents?

 

And how many parents would care about getting value out of a Thai condo in such circumstances?

 

https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/930474-no-parent-should-have-to-bury-a-child-no

[Delight]

6 hours ago, trogers said:

There is not need to bring in new money for a new FET, even for only 50%.

 

The FET that covers the 50% of the deceased's ownership can be passed on to his heir, Thai or non-Thai. A written Thai will would makes the title transfer easier.

 

I know because I inherited my late father's condo a year ago, and both of us are non-Thai.

 

Complications with the Condo Acts occur when the deceased is Thai and heir is non-Thai, because there is no FET for the property, and the foreign ownership quota for the project may be fully used.

 Thanks for the correction

 

Does that mean in your case when your mother passes away then you could inherit the whole foreign owned condo without a need to bring in foreign funds?

Does the arrangement applicable to your circumstances also apply to non marrieds. So for example I could add my son's name to my foreign owned condo-such that there would be no need,-when he inherits my half- for him to supply an FET to the land office