Prosecutors Vow To Arrest Thaksin Upon His Return To Thailand

[deminister]

One set of rules for the Elite and one for the rest of us. Prosecution for the Ratchada land, no prosecution for the stolen land from the current PM. Prosecution for the 2 and 3 digit lottery (because it was meant for poor students) no prosecution for the 2,3 digit lottery of this government. prosecution for more than 25% stake in a company, not even a request to resign by 6 members of this government.

It is the last thing you see when a chicken runs without a head. The prosecutors will soon be out of a job, so are the kangaroo court judges and CNS. It is pretty tough for the Elite to learn the benefits of a democracy.

Hmm well get used to it all old boys that have protected your sick interests are old very old and Thaksin is still young.

[Gianni77]

I am still stunned that the ordinary and quite poor people of Thailand supported the PPP, it is just beyond belief after Thaksin is almost certainly guilty of robbing these people of Thailand's inheritance of billions of Baht and ensuring their future will take many many more years before they can escape the poverty trap whilst Thaksin and his cronies just get richer and richer

I've never have understood why so many people who have lived in LOS for a couple rounds of government, thai style, cannot seem to grasp Thaksins ADMINISTRATION, was no more nor less corrupt than previous governments.

Is it that difficult? Is there a switch that just won't click? A mental block that stops all thought when this is stated? Unlike those governments he actually gave something to poor people. Yes he is corrupt, yes he is venally corrupt we all know this. I guess the point is if the other non Thaksin administrations would have been something less than as bad as Thaksins we could honestly throw brickbats at the people who voted for the PPP.

Obviously we cannot

he is giving 10 baht and taking 1,000 baht in return and of course many of the poor don't see this. thaksin is a businessman and everthing he does has to have profit. the rigth way to help the NE poor is not by giving them debts and cattles that they will eat anyway when they run out of money but to educate them.

Thanks man!!! Finally someone saw the truth, giving money? bullshit, giving debts, yes... After Thaksin gave loans to rural communities in the North of Thailand he sent an army of mobile phone salesmen after.

Something similar was done in Chile years ago (another 3rd world country with coups, but a lot less corruption), but instead of just giving money to the farmers they trained them first showing them what they could do with their land and the money they could receive, so the farmers not only received money but they were able to have a project and plans for that money, isn't that the way it should be? If you give a monkey a banana tree he'll eat the bananas until there's no more of them, if you give the same tree to a thinking individual he'll take the seeds and create a banana plantation so he can have more bananas and not starve to death once the bananas are gone, that's the way of helping, no just giving money, but giving oportunities.

In Chile they also gave free aducation to good student from rural areas, but they gave these scholarships thinking in the development of the same areas, you give an education loan to a person that just want to move to Bangkok? to some yes, but as a country a government has to think in developing areas outside of the capital... I've Master degrees working for me as administrative staff earning 20k per month just because they can't find a job in what they studied, I don't think that thinking with the head is a crime

I just wanted to give an example of an under-developed country like Thailand but with a big exception, they're trying to help. Some people sometimes tells me "but he's working so hard" and my answer is always the same, "one thing is working hard and another totally different is working well and is not always the case, hard and well is perfect but hard and bad is a waste of time"

Merry Christmas and the best wishes for the next year to everyone from an Italian globe traveller...

[didivolk]

I am still stunned that the ordinary and quite poor people of Thailand supported the PPP, it is just beyond belief after Thaksin is almost certainly guilty of robbing these people of Thailand's inheritance of billions of Baht and ensuring their future will take many many more years before they can escape the poverty trap whilst Thaksin and his cronies just get richer and richer

I've never have understood why so many people who have lived in LOS for a couple rounds of government, thai style, cannot seem to grasp Thaksins ADMINISTRATION, was no more nor less corrupt than previous governments.

Is it that difficult? Is there a switch that just won't click? A mental block that stops all thought when this is stated? Unlike those governments he actually gave something to poor people. Yes he is corrupt, yes he is venally corrupt we all know this. I guess the point is if the other non Thaksin administrations would have been something less than as bad as Thaksins we could honestly throw brickbats at the people who voted for the PPP.

Obviously we cannot

For the first part I disagree, he sold AIS to a Singaporian company, it was and is not a national asset, if that is the case then DTAC and TRUE are national assets as well........ if they are to be called national assets then Thailand may as well turn "communist", do we all want that? As for a billion baht, if Taksin had sold AIS while the Democrates ran the country like a school canteen during 1997 to 2000, then he would have yielded less. He transferred it to his kids and the question is justifiable raised by the ASC (kangaroo court) that the transaction should have yielded tax.... That still has to be answered in court. Should Taksin never had entered politics, he still would have sold it for $2 billion US and as with everybody else would not have had to pay any tax anyway!!!!!!!!!!! So the question is, if he had his time over again, would have Taksin have gone into politics... I bet the anwser is NO, emphatically no.... Why the pain for little gain. What, a piece of land in Ratchadar, I dont think so.

I agree his gov was corrupt, policy wise is most likely the evil culprit, and if they nail him on it, well and good.

hold on right there! it's suppose to be the whole SHIN corporation that he sold which included the SHIN SAT which is a national asset. now the singaporean can easily eavesdrop into thailands' communication system.

Whow!!!! what a great idea. Why the Singaporeans would like to do that? I mean that could be seen as an act of war against Singapoor. With all that senseless Thai blubbing in cars on motorbikes even push bikes the eavesdroppers could be bored to dead.

Didi

[sriracha john]

Maybe the game plan is:

Try to arrest him upon his return. Hope he tries to escape so he can be shot. All nice neat, tidy and legal

Tuck a few yaba pills in his pocket afterwards.... for the penultimate message.

[didivolk]

What is it with all the people in this thread apparently cheering for the military government? All they accomplished in 1 year is drive the economy into the ground, take away healthcare benefits for the poor (and then wonder why they don't get any votes from the poor), make visa regulations more difficult for foreigners, etc. While they still haven't brought a single charge forward against Thaksin.

Sorry guys, that government was a failure and it's time the old government came back. We all complained about Thaksin's government before, but after the past year, I have to say it was much better than the current one.

Some of them would even be happy if there was another coup and further military rule.

Their contempt for the Thai people is utterly disgusting.

Hey you made my day. This senseless Thaksin hate is disgusting, I was never a friend of him. But as long somebody is not convicted he has to be regarded as innocent. And "they" tried really hard (By the way he was rich before he went into politics). I'm happy that those bloggers have no vote ( I think mostly Pattaya Brits which have no idea of Thailand). Give me an honest farmer any day. They are not so stupid as the so called educated middle class are thinking. Lets hope the economy gets back on track and some body made have learned a lesson.

Didi

[rayw]

I am still stunned that the ordinary and quite poor people of Thailand supported the PPP, it is just beyond belief after Thaksin is almost certainly guilty of robbing these people of Thailand's inheritance of billions of Baht and ensuring their future will take many many more years before they can escape the poverty trap whilst Thaksin and his cronies just get richer and richer

I've never have understood why so many people who have lived in LOS for a couple rounds of government, thai style, cannot seem to grasp Thaksins ADMINISTRATION, was no more nor less corrupt than previous governments.

Is it that difficult? Is there a switch that just won't click? A mental block that stops all thought when this is stated? Unlike those governments he actually gave something to poor people. Yes he is corrupt, yes he is venally corrupt we all know this. I guess the point is if the other non Thaksin administrations would have been something less than as bad as Thaksins we could honestly throw brickbats at the people who voted for the PPP.

Obviously we cannot

Hey I am fully aware of past governments corruptions, I never said I wasn't, no mental block here my friend on that score. But I think Thaksin was one if not THE biggest thief of Thailand's assets and as such the very last person you would have thought any intelligent uncorrupted voter would want anywhere near the corridors of power here. That is something that I cannot understand why everyone who has lived here for several years cannot grasp (though indeed most seem to)

If you read the rest of my original post you will see I said that I thought it should be high time that the ordinary poor working people of Thailand formed their own politic party truly of the people to represent them rather than the elite rich as did happen in England back early last century to end the Elitist ruling class monopoly of power. I never said that the Democrat party were necessarily clean but they seem currently the lesser of two evils to me purely as an observer and I think I would have preferred to see them holding a small balance of power.

[sriracha john]

Thai prosecutors vow to arrest former PM Thaksin

BANGKOK -- Thailand prosecutors said they will not hesitate to arrest former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra as soon as he arrives in Thailand, for his alleged involvement in a land corruption scandal, local media reported on Thursday.

Sampan Sarathana, prosecutor of the Office of the Attorney General (OAG), on Thursday denied speculation that the pro-Thaksin People Power Party's imminent rise to power will affect the case against ousted premier Thaksin, who is believed to be the main driving force behind the People Power Party's founding.

"As soon as he sets foot in Thailand, which he claims will be sometime between February and April of next year, he will face police arrest. An arrest warrant has already been issued for him along time ago."

- Xinhua

[sriracha john]

Mustn't forget Pojaman will also be arrested...but at least she has previous experience with throngs of cops from showing up at court before....

also worth noting that Thaksin has more than one warrant out on him...

Thaksin faces arrest if he returns to Thailand: senior official

BANGKOK — Deposed prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra would face arrest on corruption and fraud charges if he returned to Thailand, a senior official at the Attorney General's office said Thursday.

"If they were in Thailand, police can arrest him and his wife because both are still wanted on Thai arrest warrants," Samphan Sarathana, chief of international affairs for the Attorney General, told AFP.

Thaksin told reporters in Hong Kong on Tuesday that he planned to return home by April, after his allies in the People Power Party (PPP) claimed victory in elections on Sunday.

But he and his wife Pojaman are on an immigration blacklist, meaning that they can be immediately arrested if they try to enter Thailand.

Samphan's agency has been pushing for the couple's extradition from Britain.

The Supreme Court issued arrest warrants for Thaksin and Pojaman in August over separate graft charges linked to a real estate deal in 2003.

In September a Thai criminal court issued another arrest warrant against the former first couple over charges tied to alleged fraudulent filings to the Securities and Exchange Commission in 2003.

PPP won 233 of the 480 seats in the Thai parliament in Sunday's vote. It is trying to cobble together a coalition government.

- AFP

[sriracha john]

The top brass in Thailand seem to have all the words for anything but doesn't seem to care when Mr.T's kid is seen riding around helping PPP campaign for the election. Didn't the kid owe the tax department some small change??

They took over a billion baht in back taxes away from him and lil' sis....

The money for the overdue taxes has now been taken...

Assets of Thai ex-premier's kin seized

BANGKOK, Thailand—Thai tax authorities have seized assets worth about $34.2 million *1,037,970,013 Baht* from family members of former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, an official said Thursday.

The assets, seized for unpaid taxes, were in the form of stocks, land, and bank accounts, said Assets Examination Committee spokesman Sak Kosaengrueng.

Thai authorities had already frozen more than $2.1 billion *63,735,000,801 Baht* controlled by Thaksin and his family since he was ousted by a coup in September 2006 after being accused of corruption and abuse of power.

Revenue Department Chief Sanit Rangnoi last month announced that his agency would seize the assets of two of Thaksin's adult children because they failed to pay $38 million in taxes from the family's sale last year of its shares in one of Thailand's biggest telecommunications groups, Shin Corp.

The shares had belonged to Ample Rich, a holding company owned by the former leader's daughter Pintongta and son Phantongtae.

The Assets Examination Committee -- a corruption investigation team set up after Thaksin was deposed -- ordered tax authorities in April to collect the unpaid taxes from Pintongta and Phantongtae. Both refused to pay.

- Associated Press

[plachon]

What is it with all the people in this thread apparently cheering for the military government? All they accomplished in 1 year is drive the economy into the ground, take away healthcare benefits for the poor (and then wonder why they don't get any votes from the poor), make visa regulations more difficult for foreigners, etc. While they still haven't brought a single charge forward against Thaksin.

Sorry guys, that government was a failure and it's time the old government came back. We all complained about Thaksin's government before, but after the past year, I have to say it was much better than the current one.

A few points of correction first - it was Thaksin's monumental mismanagement of the economy prior to this govt that "drove the economy into the ground". They inherited a pretty lousy hand on the back of 5 years of spending tomorrow's money today until there was nothing left in the till.

Secondly, they didn't take any healthcare benefits from the poor. In fact, they kept TRT's rather questionable system in place and reduced it from 30 Baht to free, so in fact gave even more (of a system that was spouting leaks anyway) back to the people, rather than make some difficult decisions about rationalising and truly reforming the Min of Public Health.

Thirdly, I hadn't realised visa regulations were more difficult for foreigners post-coup, but I note that the numbers of foreign people deciding to emigrate to Thailand still seems to be on a roll, and if numbers have slowed, then I would see that as a good thing on the whole. It's hardly a matter of major national importance though, set against other domestic and foreign affairs policies, which I would have to say have been a mixed bag of "good and bad" moves since the military stepped in. The important things as I see it, is they've allowed a semblance of an impartial judiciary to operate (totally absent under Toxin); cleaned up many national institutions by allowing some genuinely clean and honest people into the govt (think Seri in the cops and Khunying Jaruwan in the accounts dept); and they've fulfilled their promise to hold general elections before end of 2007. OK so they were delayed from original timetable, but at least they were not total scams like Thaksin's previous 2 elections.

As for not "bringing a single charge forward against Thaksin", I don't really know what to say about this, as I know you read TV often and presumably other news sources and you have a modicum of intelligence and sincerity, so I can only assume that akin to other people on reading things that happen to run counter to your own little prejudices and worldviews about how things should be, you just switch off and block them out entirely. There must have been literally thousands of posts discussing charges brought against Thaksin and his family. C'mon Rainman, you've got some catching up with the plot to do, or you're in danger of missing it entirely!

[pointofview]

Pathetic - and the world laughs on! Only inThailand.

I only hope when thaksin takes the reigns again he relaxes visa restrictions on british citizens - after all we harboured him when he was a wanted man!

[sriracha john]

cannot seem to grasp Thaksins ADMINISTRATION, was no more nor less corrupt than previous governments.

say... now that sounds like it might make for a good thread.....

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=159693

Was Thaskin More Corrupt Than Previous Governments?

[usaca]

Why do the democrat party and the government have to do anything to stop PPP being new government since this sucks stupid soldier government cannot do anything good for Thailand? And I think that's why Thailand can't be peaceful because of this. Why this government just can't accept the truth and result of the election on Sunday? Democrat prime minister in the past always waited waited waited and waited over and over to fix the country's problems and finally didn't fix or do anything for us. I just can't stand this stupid government. TIT! Thailand sucks.

[chiang mai]

There are two major groups of people in Thailand, the rural poor and the residents of Bangkok. The rural poor do not, in many cases, have access to, interest in or capacity to understand the facts about a political party or its leader - "facts" as far as this group is concerned is what the most senior or most respected resident heard or knows, often it's simply a case of believing what everyone else believes. Bangkok residents on the other hand are more likely to work with or for more informed sources of information and represent a more aware group. It therefore comes as no surprise that, as always in Thai political history, Issan voters win the day and that the PPP will now form the next government. Posters should not be so surprised.

[plachon]

A few points of correction first - it was Thaksin's monumental mismanagement of the economy prior to this govt that "drove the economy into the ground". They inherited a pretty lousy hand on the back of 5 years of spending tomorrow's money today until there was nothing left in the till.

Of course having a coup really boosts the economy. Be honest, the Junta's handling of economic affairs has been dismal, slowing economic growth to the lowest in the region is some feat, even by this farcical Junta's standards.

Thirdly, I hadn't realised visa regulations were more difficult for foreigners post-coup, but I note that the numbers of foreign people deciding to emigrate to Thailand still seems to be on a roll, and if numbers have slowed, then I would see that as a good thing on the whole.

How many people emigrate to Thailand per year? A few hundred? Less? Do you have stats?

Hint: Staying in Thailand on a Non-Immigrant visa means you have not emigrated to Thailand and are not an immigrant.

You've obviously missed the little idea floated about managed economic growth under a "sufficiency economy" principle, as proposed by HM The King. I would say Thailand has done a pretty good job, under pretty lousy circumstances and entrenched interests, about first floating and then applying parts of these principles. Of course, they run counter to the dominant world order and many people's belief systems of "how things are and should be", so there was bound to be resistance and confusion, but then all (seemingly) radical new ideas face the same hurdles when they require a paradigm shift in understanding.

And by "emigration", I meant it purely in the soft sense of people moving their place of main residence from one country to another. I consider that I emigrated to Thailand for the past five years and have now re-emigrated back to UK, even though I was on non-immigrant visas throughout my stay in the Kingdom. Irrespective of whatever the visa category was called, I was not there on holiday, but lived and worked in Thailand as if it were my home, which to me was a migration. I note some people thought that it was okay to do the same on tourist visas in the past and the govt. has quite rightly taken steps to tighten down this loophole.

[sriracha john]

What is it with all the people in this thread apparently cheering for the military government? All they accomplished in 1 year is drive the economy into the ground, take away healthcare benefits for the poor (and then wonder why they don't get any votes from the poor), make visa regulations more difficult for foreigners, etc. While they still haven't brought a single charge forward against Thaksin.

Sorry guys, that government was a failure and it's time the old government came back. We all complained about Thaksin's government before, but after the past year, I have to say it was much better than the current one.

A few points of correction first - it was Thaksin's monumental mismanagement of the economy prior to this govt that "drove the economy into the ground". They inherited a pretty lousy hand on the back of 5 years of spending tomorrow's money today until there was nothing left in the till.

Secondly, they didn't take any healthcare benefits from the poor. In fact, they kept TRT's rather questionable system in place and reduced it from 30 Baht to free, so in fact gave even more (of a system that was spouting leaks anyway) back to the people, rather than make some difficult decisions about rationalising and truly reforming the Min of Public Health.

Thirdly, I hadn't realised visa regulations were more difficult for foreigners post-coup, but I note that the numbers of foreign people deciding to emigrate to Thailand still seems to be on a roll, and if numbers have slowed, then I would see that as a good thing on the whole. It's hardly a matter of major national importance though, set against other domestic and foreign affairs policies, which I would have to say have been a mixed bag of "good and bad" moves since the military stepped in. The important things as I see it, is they've allowed a semblance of an impartial judiciary to operate (totally absent under Toxin); cleaned up many national institutions by allowing some genuinely clean and honest people into the govt (think Seri in the cops and Khunying Jaruwan in the accounts dept); and they've fulfilled their promise to hold general elections before end of 2007. OK so they were delayed from original timetable, but at least they were not total scams like Thaksin's previous 2 elections.

As for not "bringing a single charge forward against Thaksin", I don't really know what to say about this, as I know you read TV often and presumably other news sources and you have a modicum of intelligence and sincerity, so I can only assume that akin to other people on reading things that happen to run counter to your own little prejudices and worldviews about how things should be, you just switch off and block them out entirely. There must have been literally thousands of posts discussing charges brought against Thaksin and his family. C'mon Rainman, you've got some catching up with the plot to do, or you're in danger of missing it entirely!

Thank you for taking the trouble to post the major corrections... indeed the news clipping forum has been chock full of posts...and it's great to see that at least some of the thousands of views were retained as well as read. There's a veritable library of factual information contained therein.

It's important for accuracy that misperceptions such as end of health care are properly corrected.

Has the current government made mistakes? Certainly... but I'm pragmatic enough to believe that given the choice, while it's certainly not ideal to have a coup, that things have improved with the consideration that the current government is on its way out.

How things develop from here on in will be to see if this overall improvement continues... and something that would go a long way in that is that if Thaksin stands trial and, if found guilty, is sentenced appropriately.

[Dario]

We just (at 17:53) drove from Rangsit inbound past Don Muang Airport (we live in Don Muang) and we saw several trucks packed with soldiers in combat uniform and each with a rifle driving in a convoy towards Bangkok City.

The Thai population was just informed, I think, it was on Tuesday, that troops had orders to leave Bangkok and head back to their bases in the provinces.

In MHO not a good sign ...

[sriracha john]

Why do the democrat party and the government have to do anything to stop PPP being new government since this sucks stupid soldier government cannot do anything good for Thailand? And I think that's why Thailand can't be peaceful because of this. Why this government just can't accept the truth and result of the election on Sunday? Democrat prime minister in the past always waited waited waited and waited over and over to fix the country's problems and finally didn't fix or do anything for us. I just can't stand this stupid government. TIT! Thailand sucks.

A 15 year-old Thai girl that posts with "TIT!" and "Thailand sucks" ?????????????????????????????????????????

I'd like to know if there will be anything wrong or any complaints for a 15 years old girl to be a helper for the English camps? Well, that 15 years old girl is me. I want to be a helper for the English camps, maybe just call as a volunteer because I don't expect for the money. I just want to help the students with their English at least I can help them for a bit is better than I don't help. Many people told me that my English is quite good and those people who told me were the native speakers. My achievement is that I've won the 1st prize of my province from the English tests from Sermpanya Company for 2 years ( last year and this year ). Last year I got 88 pts out of 120 pts. This year I am ranked at 1st of Phrae Province, 16th of Northern part of Thailand, 93rd of Thailand and 105 pts out of 120 pts. I think I improved quite much in 1 year. So, if teachers who run the English camps want to have a volunteer/helper for their camps can contact me [by sending a PM to the poster]

Thanks,

A

Edited December 27, 2007 by sriracha john

[LomSak27]

sorry can't find the quote key --

Hey I am fully aware of past governments corruptions, I never said I wasn't, no mental block here my friend on that score. But I think Thaksin was one if not THE biggest thief of Thailand's assets and as such the very last person you would have thought any intelligent uncorrupted voter would want anywhere near the corridors of power here. That is something that I cannot understand why everyone who has lived here for several years cannot grasp (though indeed most seem to)

I hear that all the time. First there is significantly more money in the economy today so looking number one is easy, taken as a percentage drain on GDP is another matter and Thaksin might be struggling to place in the top 5 (most C) since WWII. Thaksins crimes in his last years in power were well publicized; power groups who opposed him had a number of media outlets. However was his corruption different in scale than others? PLEASE think about it a bit. This last July we had the 10-year anniversary of the bhat meltdown, cronyisms nemesis comes to call. People claim that General Phao was so avaricious in the 1950’s he literally bankrupted the country. I think that these stand up as far more damaging than anything Thaksin has done or could do. And of course the long term complaint against the Democratic party. They are big city big business, as corrupt as T and do nothing for the rural population. In fact the rural people are thought of as little more than cheap labor to fuel the economy. They were instrumental in knocking out the legal props supporting the rural population back in the 1960's with of course IMF backing. Their is a tradition of explotation with the dems I am not even getting into and of course, always, corruption

How would you vote

1) Corrupt administration you get nothing

2) Corrupt administration you get something

Remember the over all corruption level is NO DIFFERENT, has not changed in the general economy. Getting rid of Thaksin did not and could not make corruption disappear overnight. By the way if they made a substantive effort to try, just TRY in the last year and a 3 months to reduce it then the PPP would be footnote. They did not and PPP just won the election. End of story.

[AlexLah]

Well what can I say.

There is a clear decline in votes for TRT/PPP compared to previous results so I guess some people got the message.

Some of the people here say that when you are pro Democrats you are in favour of military rule/coup.

This just had to happen to stop any more damage done, you do know that Thaksin was about to declare martial law when he was in the US?

We foreigners living and working here are just witnesses of things done to Thailand by people with just one thing in mind, how to get rich fast.

We foreigners cannot change a thing, we can only try to inform partners and relatives and hope they understand.

Live could be so much better for ALL Thai people, if all would say no to bribes and other corruption, just refuse to play that game.

This is not only for Thailand it is for the whole world.

As long as we ( The people) strongly reject to those practices we have a chance to live in a better world.

And please do not reply with something like: "This is Thai culture and how long have you been living here"

Thank you.

[Nickel]

I am still stunned that the ordinary and quite poor people of Thailand supported the PPP, it is just beyond belief after Thaksin is almost certainly guilty of robbing these people of Thailand's inheritance of billions of Baht and ensuring their future will take many many more years before they can escape the poverty trap whilst Thaksin and his cronies just get richer and richer

I've never have understood why so many people who have lived in LOS for a couple rounds of government, thai style, cannot seem to grasp Thaksins ADMINISTRATION, was no more nor less corrupt than previous governments.

Is it that difficult? Is there a switch that just won't click? A mental block that stops all thought when this is stated? Unlike those governments he actually gave something to poor people. Yes he is corrupt, yes he is venally corrupt we all know this. I guess the point is if the other non Thaksin administrations would have been something less than as bad as Thaksins we could honestly throw brickbats at the people who voted for the PPP.

Obviously we cannot

Brilliantly put. I was on the verge of replying in a similar vein just before reading this. Thaksin was bought down solely because he shared the cake between himself and the poor people. The generals, Democrats and middle and upper classes want it ALL for themselves and to give nothing to the poor from whence it came. The implication that the poor are stupid is insulting. I have met several who took the bribes offered from several parties and then voted according to their own convictions. There was no other party the poor could vote for, it was the PPP or dont bother to vote at all. Wait for the next military coup!

[LomSak27]

Post script or final thought a la Jerry S to above post

That is something that I cannot understand why everyone who has lived here for several years cannot grasp (though indeed most seem to)

Frankly I think Thaksin hit a sour note with the expat population when he let loose morals man 'Purachai'. Now the strait mans main job was coralling those out of control thai teens but their was a carryover effect and farang establishments came in for a barracking. My god I don't know of how many nights I had to listen to howls, jeers and gnashing of teeth from a seriously angry expat mob at my local watering hole. Dimming the lights of Sodom and Gomorroh ! Thems fighting words mate!

I remember this when I run into these rabid Thaksins haters who have lived here "for several years" as you say. Is it because Thakisn is a corrupt politician, or because he threatened their private sandbox, they dislike him so ?

[MrWizard]

It is very easy, the government from yesterday, was not very efficient either. When Taksin was in command the economy was far better and investors from abroad (which are needed for a better growth) had faith in Taksin. Any government takeover by militairy in a "democracy" will scare off tourists and large investors. Result cancelled contracts and closing factories. Restrictions towards the people, which are potential protestors, because of losing jobs. I am not saying Taksin is a bad man or batman , but the fact is that the just past government had strong issues within the party, and making -fony- gestures towards the people in general.

Ofcourse like any other party they had some good points, which where "on the side" problems for the Taksin-side team.

All in all, in I would still prefer the Taksin side. In my point of view, besides the corrupcy-case, they did a little better job plus a better economy. So it is still 2-1 for Taksin-team.

I see Taksin as a strong leader and thats what Thailand needs standing on the side with China. Thailand needs growth in economic ways. They have to move ahead with a leader who is capable in keeping the so called local bosses in line and quiet.

Good or not, Thailand has to stick with the leader who can bring peace and contracts to Thailand. And YES a shake out for Drugs/Ya-Ba as well. Many promessing students go down with this drug. A little point forgotten with the just past government.

[plachon]

You've obviously missed the little idea floated about managed economic growth under a "sufficiency economy" principle, as proposed by HM The King. I would say Thailand has done a pretty good job, under pretty lousy circumstances and entrenched interests, about first floating and then applying parts of these principles. Of course, they run counter to the dominant world order and many people's belief systems of "how things are and should be", so there was bound to be resistance and confusion, but then all (seemingly) radical new ideas face the same hurdles when they require a paradigm shift in understanding.

Oh I understand sufficiency economy only too well. Remember in his own words "some people are more sufficient than others".

Are the remarkable increases in military spending part of a sufficiency economy also?

I suggest you go and read HM's Birthday speech to the nation

And by "emigration", I meant it purely in the soft sense of people moving their place of main residence from one country to another. I consider that I emigrated to Thailand for the past five years and have now re-emigrated back to UK, even though I was on non-immigrant visas throughout my stay in the Kingdom. Irrespective of whatever the visa category was called, I was not there on holiday, but lived and worked in Thailand as if it were my home, which to me was a migration. I note some people thought that it was okay to do the same on tourist visas in the past and the govt. has quite rightly taken steps to tighten down this loophole.

What you consider about yourself is not important especially when you were erroneously using Immigration in a previous post as an example of how little impact the Junta had on Thailand economically.

According to Thai Law, you did not emigrate to Thailand, as you were on a Non-Immigrant visa you were a temporary visitor for purposes other than tourism.

I take it you have no stats to back up your statement that "but I note that the numbers of foreign people deciding to emigrate to Thailand still seems to be on a roll" and as such it should be completely disregarded.

As I clearly said, I was not taking a strict Thai legal meaning of the word, but purely referring to people who are moving from one country to another in order to live and/or work (no matter what their visa status is). And as far as I can see, minor regulations changes in the past year have not radically altered the movement in people from West to East, although other factors such as political uncertainty and exchange rates may have slowed the tide somewhat. You are free to disregard my views, stats or no stats.

[mitrapaap]

Maybe the offer was not for 1 billion Baht - but the buying of votes certainly seems to be a trait of the PPP - as the EC is finding out.

I am still stunned that the ordinary and quite poor people of Thailand supported the PPP, it is just beyond belief after Thaksin is almost certainly guilty of robbing these people of Thailand's inheritance of billions of Baht and ensuring their future will take many many more years before they can escape the poverty trap whilst Thaksin and his cronies just get richer and richer. Thaksin is a clever and dangerous man as he knows how to dangle irresistible carrots in front of the poor and usually badly educated Thai folk, they then take the carrot with hopeful misguided eyes and he cunningly continues to line his own pocket at the expense of Thailand's real people.

How can it be right in a country of such abject poverty that a few like Thaksin and his cronies can be so rich, and that they carry on ensuring that the poor people of Thailand remain poor, is it maybe for continued cheap labour? This is to me immoral. Sorry but I totally despair now of the future here until the electorate see some sense and start their own REAL peoples' party, much like in the UK 100 years ago when the poor working class majority had little say in politics until they formed their own political party and even then it was still problems until the 1990's when finally it became a realistic political movement of the people and showed how it can make a country prosper for an extended period. I was hoping that the world of extreme right and left politics were almost over and we could move to the consensus and truly productive centre ground, but this election has shown the extreme right can and do still deceive the masses even today.

Still this is not my country but I am a law abiding guest here who loves the place so although I can make my views known, as Thailand does support free speech in principal, there is nothing else of course we can or should do but be good guests and enjoy life here and keep our heads down. I must say though Malaysia is looking more promising for the future, I hope I am wrong but time will tell.

Good to see a post from someone with a pro Thailand outlook. Iagree with the comments but unfortunately the poor N.E. only consider amassing enough money to buy the weeks food and maybe a bottle of Lao Khao , so promises from the likes of PPP(Mr "t") are accepted with out question.

I would not believe you if I didn't hear it myself. A friend of mine who used to work with me has recently opened his own little shop. After the elections I asked him which party he voted for. Simple answer: PPP. I asked him why PPP. His answer was (and I'm not joking!): "I don't care how rich some people get, I just want my little shop running and money coming in". The guy does not CARE about corruption!!! He believes that PPP is making the economy better (after his amazing answer I doubt whether he knows what "economy" stands for) and that this is what keeps his shop going. He is convinced that from new year on his shop will do much better. I did not ask him what exactly made him believe that the Democrats with Abhisit (who I believe has a degree in economics) would not be able to improve the economy. Sorry for that, I just was really speechless.

[AlexLah]

And no reply on my post, keep dreaming all and have GOOD TIME.

[sriracha john]

Post script or final thought a la Jerry S to above post

That is something that I cannot understand why everyone who has lived here for several years cannot grasp (though indeed most seem to)

Frankly I think Thaksin hit a sour note with the expat population when he let loose morals man 'Purachai'. Now the strait mans main job was coralling those out of control thai teens but their was a carryover effect and farang establishments came in for a barracking. My god I don't know of how many nights I had to listen to howls, jeers and gnashing of teeth from a seriously angry expat mob at my local watering hole. Dimming the lights of Sodom and Gomorroh ! Thems fighting words mate!

I remember this when I run into these rabid Thaksins haters who have lived here "for several years" as you say. Is it because Thakisn is a corrupt politician, or because he threatened their private sandbox, they dislike him so ?

There's 1001 reasons to despise Thaksin that have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Purachai's Social Order crusade.

[mitrapaap]

sorry can't find the quote key --

Hey I am fully aware of past governments corruptions, I never said I wasn't, no mental block here my friend on that score. But I think Thaksin was one if not THE biggest thief of Thailand's assets and as such the very last person you would have thought any intelligent uncorrupted voter would want anywhere near the corridors of power here. That is something that I cannot understand why everyone who has lived here for several years cannot grasp (though indeed most seem to)

I hear that all the time. First there is significantly more money in the economy today so looking number one is easy, taken as a percentage drain on GDP is another matter and Thaksin might be struggling to place in the top 5 (most C) since WWII. Thaksins crimes in his last years in power were well publicized; power groups who opposed him had a number of media outlets. However was his corruption different in scale than others? PLEASE think about it a bit. This last July we had the 10-year anniversary of the bhat meltdown, cronyisms nemesis comes to call. People claim that General Phao was so avaricious in the 1950’s he literally bankrupted the country. I think that these stand up as far more damaging than anything Thaksin has done or could do. And of course the long term complaint against the Democratic party. They are big city big business, as corrupt as T and do nothing for the rural population. In fact the rural people are thought of as little more than cheap labor to fuel the economy. They were instrumental in knocking out the legal props supporting the rural population back in the 1960's with of course IMF backing. Their is a tradition of explotation with the dems I am not even getting into and of course, always, corruption

How would you vote

1) Corrupt administration you get nothing

2) Corrupt administration you get something

Remember the over all corruption level is NO DIFFERENT, has not changed in the general economy. Getting rid of Thaksin did not and could not make corruption disappear overnight. By the way if they made a substantive effort to try, just TRY in the last year and a 3 months to reduce it then the PPP would be footnote. They did not and PPP just won the election. End of story.

Aren't you a bit harsh or unfair with your two choices? Imagine you run a 20 billion business with lets say 2000 employees. You have to hire a CEO. Who would you choose?

1) A 75 year old TV cook

2) A 43 year old man with sound educational background and work experience?

I would really be pleased if you answered this question by just giving the number, 1 or 2.

[sriracha john]

And no reply on my post, keep dreaming all and have GOOD TIME.

They were good remarks, Alex... thank you for posting them...

and Happy New Year (soon).

Edited December 27, 2007 by sriracha john

[yeeowww]

If the majority of the Thais can't see how evil, dangerous and vile Toxin is, & they've elected into power his bottom-feeding, money-grubbing, foul-mouthed cronies, then just as anyone who voted for George "Dubya" better not cry one frikkn' tear about the cost of fuel, then they deserve all of the calamitous, pernicious and dire fates that are yet to befall them. This whole ordeal of the past 2 years has been nothing short of painful to watch, as they've been spoon fed and swallowed all of Toxin's blithering crap while he's funneled the country's money into his deeeeeeeeeep pockets. The illusionary "Greatness" of Toxin is nothing more than a classic case of "The Emperors New Clothes" and tragically, the population of the country at large has fallen for it hook, line and sinker. The lovely, amazing and beautiful people that are the Thais deserve better, but don't know how to achieve it. May God have mercy on you all... you poor, sad, blind lemmings.