Being Approached By Schools To Teach English

[RasiMike]

I am a former Aussie living in Issan with my wife and son. I have no degree but do have a TEFL cert. From time to time I drop in to visit the local hardware store and the proprietors wife (former teacher) likes to have a chat to me in her best English. These chats have led to me being approached by the local high school staff..."to teach English speaking and listening as a volunteer - because it's legal to do it like this". They also add that, "nobody cares what happens in Issan schools". My investigations on this and other similar forums, indicate this is illegal without the proper paperwork.

While I'm keen to be a little more involved with my local community and make some new aquaintances, I do not want to bend the law too much while doing so.

Any ajarns/old hands out there with advice on what is required to be a volunteer, in the eyes of the MOE etc?

Mike

[Ijustwannateach]

Both answers are correct. You will be doing something that is technically illegal- and I can't recommend it- but at the same time, no one will likely care about it at all.

To do this legally, you would actually need a work permit. Since no money or tax will be involved, it may actually be possible in your circumstances to acquire one without too much effort (as long as you have the proper visa- i.e., not a tourist or a 30-day permit but an actual non-imm. O or .

"S"

[Thaddeus]

Both answers are correct. You will be doing something that is technically illegal- and I can't recommend it- but at the same time, no one will likely care about it at all.

I can concur a little. My only stipulation when I was asked to give some English lessons was that if anyone requested money to turn a blind eye, then I wouldn't do it and I wouldn't be paying for it.

I haven't been asked for over a year now.

[RasiMike]

I'm residing here on a non-imm 'O', due to be extended in a month or two. I was under the impression that I couldn't obtain a

'legal' work permit (to teach) under any circumstances, be it voluntary or otherwise.

Any tips on obtaining a relevant work permit? I have asked the local schools to look into it...... if indeed they are serious about having a 'local' farang on hand. They are a little reluctant, due to the "long and expensive" process. I presume that they just don't know where to start.

I'm aware nobody will probably care - most parents, teachers and local officials, will be happy if I spend a few hours a day speaking English with their kids....if they don't have to pay. That's why they send them down to play with our son at 'baan farang' now. I have my reservations about, baw pen yang/mai pen rai, applying indefiitely however and would like to avoid any problems in the future.

Mike

[PeaceBlondie]

Mike, it's great on your part to say you'll do it if they can make you legal.

If they want your free services strongly enough, they can figure out how to get you a work permit, through their own established community channels. If they can't do it, you surely can't by yourself. I guess you can always smile and say, "Oh I would love to do that, if YOU can just get me the work permit, thank you."

[RasiMike]

Mike, it's great on your part to say you'll do it if they can make you legal.

If they want your free services strongly enough, they can figure out how to get you a work permit, through their own established community channels. If they can't do it, you surely can't by yourself. I guess you can always smile and say, "Oh I would love to do that, if YOU can just get me the work permit, thank you."

I was at the school just this morning and suggested that exact same thing. There answer was that other farang in the past,(on tourist visas), "didn't need a work permit to volunteer".

.......So ends my investigation on the subject of volunteer teaching..... Thanks guys.

[kat1]

Hi Mike,

Just found your post and thought I would share my experience.

I volunteered my services to "assist" as a native English speaker at my local government school last year, and wanting to be legal, took it upon myself to get the necessary work permit.

With the correct paperwork from the school and LEA, plus the 3,000 baht fee it was not difficult, despite the fact that I do not have a degree, TEFL or any teaching qualifications.

There have been occasions in the past when others have taught at my school, and no doubt at many others, on an illegal basis, which could explain the schools' non-interest in adhering to the law, however ignorance of the law is no excuse, once caught out!

Maybe your school expects volunteer to mean completely free, so they expect you to pay for the WP!

[PeaceBlondie]

Hi Mike,

Just found your post and thought I would share my experience.

I volunteered my services to "assist" as a native English speaker at my local government school last year, and wanting to be legal, took it upon myself to get the necessary work permit.

With the correct paperwork from the school and LEA, plus the 3,000 baht fee it was not difficult, despite the fact that I do not have a degree, TEFL or any teaching qualifications.

There have been occasions in the past when others have taught at my school, and no doubt at many others, on an illegal basis, which could explain the schools' non-interest in adhering to the law, however ignorance of the law is no excuse, once caught out!

Maybe your school expects volunteer to mean completely free, so they expect you to pay for the WP!

Good for you, kat1. You wanted to teach legally even more than your local govt. school wanted you to teach legally. You had more respect for the laws of Thailand than they have. And in Chiang Mai, no less, where (according to our poster Loaded) most of the semi-qualified teachers aren't legal BECAUSE THE THAIS DON'T CARE TO MAKE THEM LEGAL. Please pardon my anger.

Mike, your school doesn't really want a (legal) teacher. Forget them, is my bitter advice.

[garro]

I have taught for free for three years in two of our local schools. I have done this without a work permit as the two schools in question couldn't afford my petrol money mever mind to pay for a work permit. In fact one of the schools has needed to close. I previously taught in BKK without a WP but gave up paid work as I didn't like working illegally. Although the work I am doing now is also technically illegal I am willing to take the risk as I feel the local kids are benefiting from it. I intend to go back to paid teaching next year legally. The local police are aware of my work in the school and so is a fairly high ranking immigration officer. I have not had any problems as yet.

[billd766]

Hi Mike,

Just found your post and thought I would share my experience.

I volunteered my services to "assist" as a native English speaker at my local government school last year, and wanting to be legal, took it upon myself to get the necessary work permit.

With the correct paperwork from the school and LEA, plus the 3,000 baht fee it was not difficult, despite the fact that I do not have a degree, TEFL or any teaching qualifications.

There have been occasions in the past when others have taught at my school, and no doubt at many others, on an illegal basis, which could explain the schools' non-interest in adhering to the law, however ignorance of the law is no excuse, once caught out!

Maybe your school expects volunteer to mean completely free, so they expect you to pay for the WP!

I am in a similar position up here in the central region waaay out in the sticks.

I would love to spend a few hours a week helping the local kids speak English though my salary request would be on the side as they would have to keep me in tea and cold drinks (water as I am trying to give up fizzy drinks).

My main problem is to be able to speak enough Thai to begin with so that I can cope before teaching them English.

At almost 63, married with a Thai wife and son I should have little problems (hopefully ) on the legal side.

[BronzeRider]

With the correct paperwork from the school and LEA, plus the 3,000 baht fee it was not difficult, despite the fact that I do not have a degree, TEFL or any teaching qualifications.

How did you do this? I would sure like to know more information.

BR

[kat1]

With the correct paperwork from the school and LEA, plus the 3,000 baht fee it was not difficult, despite the fact that I do not have a degree, TEFL or any teaching qualifications.

How did you do this? I would sure like to know more information.

BR

As the head-master and teachers did not appear to be aware that I would need a work permit, I took it upon myself (with the aid of my wife) to discover what was needed at the Labour Office, and then completed the paperwork. I supplied copies of my GCE 'O' level results and a City and Guilds in Computers that I have as qualifications. I guess the Labour Office leave the assessment of qualifications to the LEA, who obviously just produced the contract and supporting letter as requested by the head-master.

I am always being asked by teachers from other schools to help them too. Any native speaker with a genuine desire to help (plus a lot of patience and no expectations) would be welcomed at any government school that does not have such resources.

[Thaddeus]

So many comments ..... so many thoughts...... but just the last couple of posts first.

From PB............. "BECAUSE THE THAIS DON'T CARE TO MAKE THEM LEGAL"

In the rural areas many teachers do care, they just lack the funding needed to get some help, they are overloaded with class sizes, they don't have the capability to teach English, as they can hardly speak it themselves (my sister in law is an English teacher.... I'm yet to have a conversation with her were we did not resort to chucking in the odd word or phrase of Thai.... in fact her spoken English is crap....... I probably know more Thai.... and that's saying something)

They don't have the time, patience or funding required to get a farang through the legalities.

From Bild.............. "My main problem is to be able to speak enough Thai to begin with so that I can cope before teaching them English.

At almost 63, married with a Thai wife and son I should have little problems (hopefully ) on the legal side."

I do speak a little Thai now, enough to take a class of young'uns through some basic English, and have a laugh along the way. Unfortunately I'm only 47, got the money, but not in a way that will satisfy the authorities ..... they cut their own noses off to spite their face, I feel no urge to reciprocate.

I have a degree in Computer Science (it's 25 years old, punch cards, really big disks and Joe 90 type tape drives) and I spent about six years passing on my knowledge to students while I was updating myself..... I can teach..... well I can teach IT .... can I teach English?

About a thousand times better than my Thai Sister-in-Law is the simple answer to that one, but I am not allowed to.

Kat1, you have my praise for doing what you did, but my feelings still remain the same. The Thai authorities make life so difficult for people that actually would like to help to drag Thailand out of the mire of its own making, most people, like me, just end up doing nothing.

Thailand - Third World- Developing Country .......... it's been handed on a plate for more than half a century ... how long does it take?.... maybe the next few generations will have some foresight and learn not to bite the hand that can help them.

[colino]

iv just finished a term where my agency kept telling me my wp was being proccesed uh 4months and no wp only thing my school said was dont worry you teach policemans kids if they like you your ok Grrreat signed bag of nerves

[TerryLH]

RasiMike said "I'm residing here on a non-imm 'O', due to be extended in a month or two. I was under the impression that I couldn't obtain a

'legal' work permit (to teach) under any circumstances, be it voluntary or otherwise."

What type of O visa do you have? If it's an O based on marriage you can get a work permit.

If you have a retirement visa, probably not.

Terry

Edited April 7, 2007 by TerryLH

[RasiMike]

RasiMike said "I'm residing here on a non-imm 'O', due to be extended in a month or two. I was under the impression that I couldn't obtain a

'legal' work permit (to teach) under any circumstances, be it voluntary or otherwise."

What type of O visa do you have? If it's an O based on marriage you can get a work permit.

If you have a retirement visa, probably not.

Terry

Terry, forgive the lateness of my reply, as I have been busy helping my in-laws build a 'little corner store' (bending the law as I do so) and haven't been logged on for a while.

I am married to a Thai lady and our son is a dual citizen. I understand I can get a work permit based on marriage ('O' visa). It is my understanding that I couldn't get a 'legal' work permit for teaching as I don't have a degree.

As an update to my first postings... I have been approached again by my hardware store friend and she has expressed her views and those of the local school staff. They seem to think my not wanting to help their students is a little silly and selfish, as I should "ignore the law in Thailand" as they all do.

I am fully aware that is the general view here, but as I pointed out to my friend - "I am a farang who has to ask permission every year to 'visit' my wife and son (# 2 arriving any day now). While doing so, I have to prove that I earn aproximately 8 - 10 times the average income and spend it here. I have put a substantial amount of money into my 'holiday home', land, car corner store, etc, and I don't want to risk my familys' happy life".

I also pointed out that if the school wants to help their students, perhaps they could invest some of the money (which they have paid illegal teachers in the past) to bribe the individuals responsible for WPs. In doing so they may just get themselves a reasonable quality teacher for free, (who can actually speak English and enough pasa Issan/Thai), for more than a month or two at a time.

The law is to be ignored in these situations......is it not?

Her response (remembering that she is a former teacher) was..... Yes, she/they are aware that they can obtain the relevent documents one way or another, but it is easier not too.......

Ahhh.... you gotta love it here huh?

Mike

I

[helicoptor]

iv just finished a term where my agency kept telling me my wp was being proccesed uh 4months and no wp only thing my school said was dont worry you teach policemans kids if they like you your ok Grrreat signed bag of nerves

This tells me they have not processed anything for you, my WP application took about 2 weeks, no more than that.

They are banking on the policemans kids that you teach, lets hope you dont upset them hey

[PeaceBlondie]

Maybe we could explain to the Thai teachers, "Oh you clever Thais know which laws you can break; we dumb farang think we have to obey all the laws. Can you give me a complete list of all laws we can break with impunity, where we don't even have to pay bribes, please? Thank you. Have you eaten yet? Oh, the food is aroi, pet mahk. I'm fine. And you?"

[Khonwan]

I too have been constantly asked by teachers and heads to teach English in local schools around my district. Rather than oblige, I offered to establish an English conversation club to help raise the standard of the Thai teachers. Teach the teachers and you help many more children.

I explained that, since I would be volunteering my services free, I expected them to attend after school, since school-time is for the kids. I had only one teacher take up my offer. From anecdotal evidence, it appears that too many Thai teachers are just happy to have a farang take a class in order to allow them a free break - I'm told that the Thai teacher usually leaves the class.

[kat1]

I too have been constantly asked by teachers and heads to teach English in local schools around my district. Rather than oblige, I offered to establish an English conversation club to help raise the standard of the Thai teachers. Teach the teachers and you help many more children.

I explained that, since I would be volunteering my services free, I expected them to attend after school, since school-time is for the kids. I had only one teacher take up my offer. From anecdotal evidence, it appears that too many Thai teachers are just happy to have a farang take a class in order to allow them a free break - I'm told that the Thai teacher usually leaves the class.

Hi Khonwan,

Yes, this is my experience. When I first started my volunteer stint at the local school, the teachers asked for a class to improve their English, but when it actually came to organising something, reality took over from novelty............

The teachers tend to leave me to it, but I actually prefer this, as when they do stay, they tell the kids what to say, before giving them a chance to think themselves. This is my main issue - getting the kids to think, rather than just choose an answer or repeat something parrot fashion.

[mellow1]

I would imagine that most expat who speak English get approached for help.Either to teach individuals or to help out at their kid's school.There are many reasons for, and against this.The law obviously forbids this.I am sure that you would not like being separated from your loved ones by being kicked out of the country or jailed and possibly both.You may step on somebody's toes.It would not be wise to give someone, something over you,which may affect your life.Teach your own children,they may one day need to go back to your home country.They will need all the language skills you can give them.They will probably want the chance,to make a better living than is available to the many bright young Thais,who graduate and find jobs,for 8 or 9000 Bath/MO or none at all.Prepare your children, for when you are no longer able to provide for them.We are old, we have our pensions,our children are only starting.Teach them all you can.Start today.Best Regards,mellow1. PS.Go slow and easy don't let them hate learning.

[Scott]

A problem for a lot of schools, especially in rural areas, who do not routinely employ foreign teachers, is that they truly don't know the laws or rules. Like in a lot of countries, people know the laws that pertain to themselves, but not necessarily to guest workers etc.

That's why some of them need some help and guidance on the Work Permit issue. They also need to pick up the phone and start calling a few people!