SteeleJoe

After looking at this it makes even less sense and is even more inaccurate than I thought...

During WW II Half of the American OSS was hidden in Bangkok right under the nose of the Japanese and the Japanese are pretty smart people as a rule. That is why the American spies got along so well with the Thais and the Brits had problems with them. The Americans didn't care and the Thais didn't know. The Brits both cared and knew but the Thais still didn't know. So there you go. At the end of WW II there was nary a Brit to be seen anywhere but the Yanks were all over the place.

Say, what?

to the person who said they'd never seen any siamese cats here,i reckon,when you think about it,they're all siamese cats ???

Like the old joke about Chinese food -- in China it's just called food.

Ssshhh! Mind control? What mind control?!

*SteeleJoe picks up radio mic and calls for CIA/Mossad black helicopters to find Samran*

But allow me to rephrase:

I suspect that this OP will not be regarded with any seriousness or in some cases comprehension by any of the posters here with the exception of those who already know it to be true (thus derive no real benefit from it, other than some satisfaction at seeing their views so well and reasonably put). The blind will continue to describe the elephant based on what part of it they laid their hands on -- and will argue vehemently with people who have laid hands on a different part of the animal.

But it will no doubt be a catalyst for yet another back and forth from the two sides (neither of which will change their thinking at all) so I suppose it serves some purpose.

My apologies.

I have been reading Thai news for a few years now and I have come to the conclusion they have no meaningful statistics and never have had any.

The unofficial economy is so broad and pervasive that no economic statistics make any sense.

Population statistics, you gotta be kidding.

I can tell you how many bars are in Cleveland with plus or minus .01% accuracy. How many bars are in Pattaya? I don't think anyone knows within 5000. I don't even think you could get anyone to agree on what a bar is, let alone how many there are.

Think of how many people could use that information. All sorts of government and tourist agencies and marketing and advertising businesses and suppliers of the industry. But no one knows.

It is not just bars. How many businesses run off that electrical outlet? Oh, I don't know on Monday there is a bar, two noodle shops and a stuffed animal seller. On Wednesday a CD shop. Chinese mobile temple and two bird sellers. You get the idea.

Thais defend themselves by being confusing and then acting dumb. Or acting dumb and then being confusing. During WW II Half of the American OSS was hidden in Bangkok right under the nose of the Japanese and the Japanese are pretty smart people as a rule. That is why the American spies got along so well with the Thais and the Brits had problems with them. The Americans didn't care and the Thais didn't know. The Brits both cared and knew but the Thais still didn't know. So there you go. At the end of WW II there was nary a Brit to be seen anywhere but the Yanks were all over the place. The DEA is all over Thailand and has been since the 1950's. Accurate statistics? They don't have any. They really don't care and the Thais don't know. Same with all of the NGO's. If you want to be a successful NGO in Thailand the first requisite is not caring, because no one is going to give you any accurate data.

During WW II Half of the American OSS was hidden in Bangkok...

Err...I suspect that might be a bit off.

The DEA is all over Thailand and has been since the 1950's.

The DEA has only existed since 1973.

Don't really understand your references even if they were accurate -- what does the presence of the OSS or the DEA have to do with the OP?

thai guys look down on the thai women who date a farang,and they have a nasty term to describe the offspring of such a union

Please tell me what that is -- in over 20 years of speaking and listenting to Thais (in the Thai language), I don't think I've heard it or heard of it.

FWIW (not a lot):

Average TOEFL iBT Score by Country

Afghanistan - 71/120 Albania - 78/120 Albania - 78/120 Algeria - 75/120 Angola - 67/120 Argentina - 94/120 Armenia - 82/120 Austria - 97/120 Azerbaijan - 74/120 Bahrain - 76/120 Bangladesh - 82/120 Belarus - 87/120 Belgium - 97/120 Benin - 64/120 Bhutan - 85/120 Bolivia - 80/120 Bosnia and Herzegovina - 84/120 Botswana - 84/120 Brazil - 86/120 Bulgaria - 87/120 Burkina Faso - 65/120 Cambodia - 68/120 Canada - 91/120 Chad - 71/120 Chile - 83/120 China - 76/120 Colombia - 81/120 Congo - 61/120 Congo - 72/120 Costa Rica - 93/120 Cote D'Ivoire - 66/120 Croatia - 92/120 Cuba - 78/120 Cyprus - 78/120 Czech R. - 91/120 Denmark - 100/120 Dominican Republic - 80/120 Ecuador - 84/120 Egypt - 80/120 El Salvador - 86/120 Estonia - 96/120 Ethiopia - 76/120 Faroe Islands - 87/120 Finland - 97/120 France - 88/120 French Polynesia - 80/120 Gabon - 71/120 Gambia - 59/120 Georgia - 80/120 Germany - 96/120 Ghana - 76/120 Greece - 88/120 Guatemala - 79/120 Guinea - 68/120 Honduras - 85/120 Hong Kong - 81/120 Hungary - 91/120 Iceland - 95/120 India - 90/120 Indonesia - 79/120 Iran - 77/120 Iraq - 74/120 Israel - 94/120 Italy - 88/120 Jamaica - 79/120 Japan - 67/120 Jordan - 76/120 Kenya - 76/120 Kosovo - 74/120 Kuwait - 67/120 Kyrgyzstan - 81/120 Lao - 60/120 Latvia - 87/120 Lebanon - 81/120 Liberia - 68/120 Libya - 64/120 Lithuania - 87/120 Luxembourg - 99/120 Macao - 70/120 Macedonia - 85/120 Madagascar - 78/120 Malaysia - 88/120 Mali - 57/120 Mauritania - 62/120 Mauritius - 94/120 Mexico - 86/120 Moldova - 85/120 Monaco - 83/120 Mongolia - 75/120 Montenegro - 83/120 Morocco - 77/120 Mozambique - 66/120 Myanmar - 70/120 N. Korea - 75/120 Nepal - 77/120 Netherlands - 101/120 Netherlands Antilles - 80/120 Nicaragua - 84/120 Niger - 69/120 Nigeria - 78/120 Norway - 94/120 Oman - 66/120 Pakistan - 88/120 Palestine Territories - 70/120 Paraguay - 84/102 Philippines - 88/120 Poland - 88/120 Portugal - 96/120 Puerto Rico - 88/120 Qatar - 61/120 Reunion - 89/120 Romania - 93/120 Russia - 85/120 Rwanda - 69/120 S. Korea - 81/120 Saudi Arabia - 62/120 Senegal - 65/120 Serbia - 86/120 Sierra Leona - 69/120 Singapore - 99/120 Slovakia - 88/120 Slovenia - 95/120 Somalia - 69/120 South Africa - 97/120 Spain - 88/120 Sri Lanka - 81/120 Sudan - 72/120 Syria - 76/120 Taiwan - 74/120 Tajikistan - 67/120 Tanzania - 66/120 Thailand - 74/120 Togo - 68/120 Tunisia - 77/120 Turkey - 77/120 Turkmenistan - 80/120 UAE - 64/120 Uganda - 80/120 Ukraine - 84/120 United Kingdom - 93/120 Uruguay - 93/120 USA - 86/120 Uzbekistan - 76/120 Venezuela - 84/120 Viet Nam - 70/120 West Bank - no data Yemen - 67/120 Zambia - 86/120 Zimbabwe - 89/120

EDIT:

Whoa! That came out all funky, format wise. oh, well it's not really useful enough to bother with trying to fix it. Never mind.

Excellent stuff OP.

But wasted here.

*I think it should be noted that it goes both ways; so many of those who are not posting huge generalizations about Thais that are unflattering at best, are posting ridiculously idealized and over the top positive generalizations (though those seem to come less from experience than a lack of it and a reliance on very superficial knowledge); this is absolutely not me trying to use a sly way of saying that there is little or nothing good to be said about Thais -- I certainly don't believe that -- but I simply cringe at some of the silly things I read/hear from people who romanticize and (and unconsciously) infantilize Thais as they make them out to be some sort of far more enlightened and virtuous breed of human (often put down to Buddhism -- by people who have even less knowledge of Thai Buddhism and its role in life than their knowledge of Thais and their society).

The most likely scenario even if the Thais would have surrendered as a result of the British attack would have been the loss of a large part of the rice crop to the Allies and the starvation of hundreds of thousands of Thais.

Actually, that scenario was by no means reliant on any British attack (I'd be curious to see some more info on that): the British tried very hard to set up war reparations that would have meant most of Thailand's rice being taken away. The French weren't averse to that either. It was the essentially the US that saw to it that (rightly or not) Thailand faced very little repercussions for their alliance with Japan.

And the Vietnamese suffered their famine primarily as a result of the (Vichy) French and Japanese policies -- and some natural calamities and general wartime conditions; not because of any Chinese invasion (they didn't so much invade as be assigned to disarm the already supine Japanese and administer that part of the country on behalf of the allies.)

"me mere noi, aow " is almost as common as "Sawadee kap" and "Sabai de mai" in day to day conversation.

It is? How odd -- after decades of living here and speaking the language, I have no recollection of having ever heard that nor do I have any idea what that means...

Oh, wait -- does the subject of the experiment own a car? Otherwise I have no interest...

Conducted the experiment last night.

I can confirm 1 of the 3 emotions described by 'Andrew of Bangkok' took place.

Wow -- that Andrew of Bangkok really knows his stuff!

Wanderlust --

Wow, very kind of you. I've been in LoS for decades (but have spent very little time in Hua Hin) so who knows -- maybe I can somethow retrun the favor some time. hope so.

Cheers.

(It's a shame I'm too thick to find Black Mountain or Nature Valley marked on your map but it still helps since I can see roughly where they are based on theire relative positions to the Royal Golf Course and Hin Lek Fai -- again, thanks)

EDIT:

Oh, wait -- I think I found them. Close enough anyway...

Thanks folks.

• I could probably work out how to make a map with Google -- if I had addresses, which I don't.
• I actually know where Villa is. Went a couple times last year and remember it (and indeed it's hard to miss). What I don't know is where it is in relation to Nature Valley -- becasue I haven't worked out where Nature Valley is on a map (haven't ever been there) and can't really suss out Hua Hin very well on maps as I barely know the place.
• I know Nature valley isn't near a beach - I wouldn't have expected it for the price I'm paying. It doesn't matter much as the beach is a low priority and at most we'd go twice in 10 days. What I asked about was the said was the nearest beach (not one that was near).
• Doesn't have to be a great beach. I've lived on some of Thailand's very best beaches and I'm not going to Hua Hin for an unspoiled tropical paradise; just wan't some sand and the ocean for the kiddies.

Oh, well. I traveled all over SEA without much info at all (and in the days when there wasn't the internet to ask people) and generally managed to get where I wanted to go -- and that was when I couldn't speak Thai and didn't know anything about Thailand. I'm sure it'll work out. Just thought I might be able to simplify things pre-armed with some local knowledge and such.

What I found in many cases during my 7 years in Thailand , Thai do not particularly enjoy working unless there is some ' Sanook ' in and of the project/job ..

What an absolute load of anti Thai rubbish.

You ought to mention that to Dr. Henry Holmes & Suchada Tangtongtavy -- regarded by most as being authorities on such things (and the latter being a Thai) that have lent their expertise to thousands of foreigners and Thais at major organizations -- who have written essentially the same thing. I've never met people less "anti-Thai".

Forgot to include this!

"Do not accept anything because it is the authoritative tradition, because it is often said, because of rumour or hearsay, because it is found in the scriptures, because it agrees with a theory of which one is already convinced, because of the reputation of an individual, or because a teacher said it is thus and thus. . . ."

-- Buddha in Kamala Sutta

And since I'm having my usual trouble getting to sleep, I'll add this bit: When the Thai government began – about 15 years ago? – to promote educational reform, one of the things they finally had woken up to was the need for "fundamental change in pedagogy away from teacher-centered learning emphasizing rote memorization to student-centered learning fostering independent thinking and creativity." And in their campaign for this reform they used " the visual metaphor of children with heads of parrots" as a "critique of conventional learning approaches and patterns." Unfortunately, very little, if any, progress has actually been made in such reform. (And the results are obvious and exhibited in everything from research and development to social ills to politics.)

And I'll throw in (free of charge) one anecdote about shows of respect: in 1997 I recall being at a certain 5 star hotel on the river where a party was being held for retired RTA general. This was not just any general but one who had run the government and the military when they shot down a still yet undetermined number of non-violent pro-democracy demonstrators. I stood there with my Thai associates, subordinates and friends and we discussed what an awful man he was and what a disgrace it was that he was being feted there. Then I watched, with little surprise but some dismay and even a tinge of disgust as those Thais joined a queue of people to make a show of respect to the general. When they rejoined me they made some very ugly comments (in Thai) about the man.

That sort of thing is perfectly normal here. Ergo, someone adhering to social customs that include rituals designed to demonstrate an attitude of respect may or may not actually feel that respect. (Not every student in a class of 40 who stands up and wais ther teacher respects that teacher. No more than every solider who salutes an officer respects him).

And if you don't recognize the importance of form here and aren't aware of how often concealing your true feelings is paramount here and the only socially acceptable thing to do (as well as being what is so deeply ingrained as to be automatic and untroubled)...well I respectfully suggest you have rather a lot to learn.

edit for typos and vain attempts to get more normal format

By the way, not sure which "stupid episode" I started -- I was merely replying to what I saw (and still see) as an untenable argument but I apologize if I did so in an offensive way.

It;s late but I guessI'll quickly knock this out before I go to bed...

...thediscipline and respect given to all of the teachers (and their parentsincidentally) is in another league. I'm convinced its to do with their buddhistupbringing!!! What we say is gospel and they do not question it, fullstop.

Notquite. More to do with Confucianism and other cultural factors than (the Thaiversion of) Buddhism, per se. Besides shows of respect are often just that- a show, ie a matter of form. Whatyou say is "gospel"? To the extent that that is true (and youwon't know because again, the deference they show is first and foremost about show-- even when they do believe virtually everything yousay as some may do); but that's also simply because they aretypically taught all their lives to not not to question authorityor think for themselves (which is NOT particularly Buddhist -- arguably ratherthe contrary); you think that's a good thing? I

know for a fact that Thai (lets call them teenagers) do not engage in thosethings you've stipulated ie: sex, drugs and R&R, this is not to say thatthis won't change/come later in life.ALL Thai men LIKE to drink cheap whiskeyand smoke cheap cigarettes and quite a number have a penchant for the ladies(their wives AND girlfriends), that I do know!!

Youknow no such thing "for a fact" -- because it isn't one. And :ALLThai men LIKE to drink cheap whiskey and smoke cheap cigarettes?" Areyou for real?!

Now where do I start??At the beginning of course!! 1). "I know for afact" means: and I quote - to possess knowledge, understanding,or information through experience as well as to regard something as being truebeyond all practical doubt" and I DO have all of these in abundance asthere has NEVER been ANY incident involving a child showing any form ofindiscipline to a teacher in 2 years in our school (there are 300+ dek dek'sand an awful lot of schooldays in 2 years so you do the math) and, so it isperfectly correct and appropriate to use this statement as I havedone. 2). When I say "ALLThai men LIKE to drink cheap whiskey and smoke cheap cigarettes" then itis pretty darned obvious that ALL doesn't mean ALL, as in every single Thai manin Thailand as it would be rediculous to assume this being the case!! It is anexpressional INFERENCE implying that a large number (comparative to othernations) are fond of ciggy's and a good swig of the old "Mekhong" andnothing more than this. I could quote numerous examples with similarities but Ithink one will be sufficient, lets make it two related one's. How many peopleactually die when they are given a cigarette when they utter the words " Iwould die for a ciggy"???? or kill somebody when they say"I'd killfor a cigarette" not too many!!! - get the point??? 3). When I put"what I say is gospel" this simply means it is the"unquestionable truth" and as they NEVER ever question the reason formy saying it, then that to me, makes it the "gospel truth" - there isno question about that, either. 4). To show respect isnot a form of show. When you show off do you show them your off?? Do you showsomeone your watch at show time??? To show someone respect is "the state of beingregarded with honor or esteem with deference" and that is what they kidsshow me and the other teachers in our school. They are taught to respect theirelders and people who are higher in the social order (this applies in all walksof life) - even the king has to wai a monk and the monk needn;t wai him back astechnically the monk is higher in the social order (according to my wife)!! Itis not a show!! it is a genuine acknowledgement of respect as "I know thisfor a fact" - please refer to no. 1). for an explanation Buddhism, according toan expert/authority - namely Justin Choo say's that his understanding of theteachings of buddhism is to show respect to all forms of life - which rathersuggests to me that 'to respect' IS taught in their religion. To answer your question- Yes!!! I do think that that is a good thing for them not to questionauthority!!!!! If they adopted this in my home country (and America) then therebelious attitudes that the unruly brats have and are not frightened todisplay wouldn't pervade the classroom with such destructive consequences. Canyou imagine that - perfectly behaved students attentive in all theirlessons, actually listening to what he teacher is saying.in complete silence -perhaps this is a step/hope, too far!!! 5). You should be morecareful and not leave yourself open when you get on your high horse (and nothis doesn't mean that I think you own a Shire horse)!! Your parting shotdelivers a rather dumb question, if I may say so. It's OK I just gave myselfpermission to....., and I quote: "Are you for real?! Of course I'm for real,as if I wasn't then I wouldn't be able to reply to you!!! Would I, and I justhave, haven't I !!!!!!!!! Well YOU started this rather stupid episode!!!

1) You seem to havemisunderstood your own post. What you claimed to know for fact was not anythingabout "Indiscipline", it was that "Thai (lets call themteenagers) do not engage in those things you've stipulated ie: sex, drugs andR&R" --and that is simply not something that you possess knowledge, understanding, or informationthrough experience as well as to regard something as being true beyond allpractical doubt because it'scompletely false.

Now as to your claimthat in 2 years there has never been a single case of indiscipline at yourkindergarten: that's quite remarkable, even (or especially?) for toddlers.Unfortunately even if it's true, it proves nothing (other than maybe you reallyknow how to run a KG).

Now let's compare thatrecord of your to the thousands and thousands of cases of"indiscipline" in schools throughout the country...

2) ExpressionalINFERENCE (sic)? Instead of making up phrases, why not just admit it was anabsurdly broad generalization and get over it.

3. "When I put "what I say isgospel" this simply means it is the "unquestionable truth" andas they NEVER ever question the reason for my saying it, then that to me, makesit the "gospel truth" - there is no question about that,either."

That makes no sense. Atbest it's circular logic if not just double talk and gibberish.

4.) You say: "To showrespect is not a form of show." but I never said it was a "form"of show. It is – by definition – a show. That has nothing to dowith whether it's sincere or not or even to what degree the sentiment may ormay not be genuinely felt.

You ask: When you show off do you show them your off?? Doyou show someone your watch at show time??? But these example ofphrasal verbs have nothing to do with the meaning of "show" and theycertaily don't support anything you've said or refute anything I've said.

You say: 'To show someone respect is "thestate of being regarded with honor or esteem with deference"' Butwhat you've done there (quite dishonestly) is copy the definition for "respect" –NOT the definition of a show of it.

This?

Allow me to qoute from your source: "show or have respectfor" -- notice how they distinguish between showing and having(ie while they may both be there the latter is not dependent on the former).

5.) Yes, they are taught to respect their elders and people whoare higher in the social order (this applies in all walks of life). Yes, thatis true and it often is something they adhere to o one degree or another.

Your comments about HM the King have no relevance whatsoever.

But you say 'it is a genuine acknowledgement of respect as "Iknow this for a fact"' and while I don't doubt it, there's no way you knowfor a fact what HM the King feels when he wais a monk -- or what astudent feels when they show respect.

And with all due respect, I think for you and I have to have aproductive exchange about Buddhism, you'd have to learn a bit more. I'm noexpert (like Justin Choo?) but I've done a certain amount of study of it aswell as other aspects of Thai culture and I stand by my posit -- you areoversimplifying what Buddhism's about. (By the way, I think if you wee toconsult your man Justin, he'd tell you that the Buddha did not tell peopleto abandon critical thought in favor of unconditional respectbased on age or position).

And your notion that never questioning authority and not thinkingfor yourself are traits in Thai youth that are beneficial to Thai, you mightwant to take a good look at what has resulted from that in this country (andperhaps read the many Thai academics, social scientists, political analysts etall who bemoan this aspect of Thai social norms). You might also want topconsider that the US wouldn't even exist with that sort of thinking and norwould it have succeeded to the extent it has. The same goes -- to greater orlesser degree -- for many another developed country.

There's a lot of beautiful and admirable things about traditionalThai culture -- even sometimes the parts that you are so enamored of -- but tobe oblivious to the downside not questioning authority and not thinking foryourself and to assume that that's what's needed in the US and the UK?

Are you really for real?

Oh, and this:

Can you imagine that - perfectly behaved students attentive inall their lessons, actually listening to what he teacher issaying.in complete silence

Coincidentally, I just spoke with a recent graduate ofThammasat law this very evening about a subject I've been studying anddiscussing for around 15 years and he was in complete agreement with me -- as are so manyThai social scientists and educators and the Royal Thai government -- there'sfar too much sitting in complete silence in Thai classrooms and no questioning,interacting or engaging critical/analytical thinking. edit for typos and to add: I commend you for your Kindergarten experience but do you think that just maybe others might have a bit of experience and training in educational matters here in Thailand? Maybe even someone one who read your comment?

...the discipline and respect given to all of the teachers (and their parents incidentally) is in another league. I'm convinced its to do with their buddhist upbringing!!! What we say is gospel and they do not question it, full stop.

Not quite. More to do with Confucianism and other cultural factors than (the Thai version of) Buddhism, per se. Besides shows of respect are often just that - a show, ie a matter of form.

What you say is "gospel"? To the extent that that is true (and you won't know because again, the deference they show is first and foremost about show -- even when they do believe virtually everything you say as some may do); but that's also simply because they are typically taught all their lives to not not to question authority or think for themselves (which is NOT particularly Buddhist -- arguably rather the contrary); you think that's a good thing?

I

know for a fact that Thai (lets call them teenagers) do not engage in those things you've stipulated ie: sex, drugs and R&R, this is not to say that this won't change/come later in life.ALL Thai men LIKE to drink cheap whiskey and smoke cheap cigarettes and quite a number have a penchant for the ladies (their wives AND girlfriends), that I do know!!

You know no such thing "for a fact" -- because it isn't one. And :ALL Thai men LIKE to drink cheap whiskey and smoke cheap cigarettes?"

Are you for real?!

we only use a small portion of our brain.

I haven't actually been able to find the post where Ian states this, so for this reason I want to point out that I am by no means holding Ian accountable for the statement itself.

From a strict biological perspective, "we only use 10 or 20% of our brain" is an urban legend. However, it only takes reading a few threads on this forum before it becomes obvious that it is in fact true.

Not going after Ian but just want confirm that I wasn't making it up:

IanForbes, on 2011-03-19 00:29:11, said:

Most of us never reach our full potential when it comes to intelligence and we only use a small portion of our brain. That boils it all down to "street smarts"... which is being able to adapt to our environment. I've met all sorts of book smart people who don't have a clue how to get along in the world, and even less in an unfriendly environment

Oh, and thanks for the welcome and the compliment (facetious or not!)

Ianforbes:

...we only use a small portion of our brain.

That's a widely held but almost certainly fallacious belief. Surely we use 100% (the idea that we don't makes little sense, in fact, unless one disregards a minor thing called evolution).

The greed and sociopathetic behavior are more pronounced in those countries that feel Thailand is a third world country. It's a shame that the internet has exposed certain countries to things that they "think" they want. What exactly are they falling short of?

Heh. Not much "pronounced" greed or antisocial behavior here, is there?

And "think" they want? Gee, presumptuous and paternalistic much?

I think any country that is swamped by a much massivly disproportionate amount of 'totally unqualified ' farang teachers' that can barely speak the local language is going to have a negative impact on the education system here.

yeah, sure -- all evidence points to little or no problems with the Thai educational system except for 'totally unqualified ' farang teachers' that can barely speak the local language"...

As for the OP: just too loaded and generalizing to reply to.

I would probably deliver one of those emotions if you did the same to me...

For that matter there are plenty of "working girls" who'd have the same reaction -- some simply out of surprise and some who don't like that sort of thing and some who only like it or permit it when a certain level of trust and/or arousal is achieved -- which also applies to "good girls"; and this applies to virtually any and all sexual activities to one degree or another. Just as would the case be (to a greater or lesser extent and varying proportions) in virtually any other country.

Surprise -- people are people and certainly there are cultural norms that make a difference there's a wide range of individual tastes or tolerance -- especially when it comes to sex and relationships. But don't we all know that already? (Why do people apparently think that's the case in their countries but not here?)

You know part of my last post was too presumptuous even for me and I apologize for it: what do I know about the posters' experience or lack thereof?

I simply meant that anyone who happened to have had certain kinds of experiences with Thai women (including those of both the "professional" kind and "good girls") would know that there exceptions to the absolute and broad statements made: and it wouldn't seem -- going by decades of personal experience and that of those male residents whom I've known (Thai and foriegn) over those decades -- that the exceptions are necessarily all that rare.

Edited to change "that" to "my".

As in any society, there are all sorts and your generalizations here are allowing your lack of experience shine through.

The first part of the qoute should be obviously true and it's self-evident to me (indeed, a proven fact). And while the latter part is speculative, I'm inclined to mostly agree (though perhaps I might have said something like "relative lack").