KhunHeineken

A DTA ensures the same money is not taxed twice. A DTA does not ensure the money is only taxed in one country. What you post about is a common myth, which this guy explains quite well.

A loophole surely to close in the near future.

You can buy 300 mins of Skype to Phone credit for Australia for $8.42. Good for all numbers in Australia. About 3.3 cents per min. https://www.skype.com/en/international-calls/Australia

Have you selected "International Roaming" inside your account? Check you have the right APN (Access Point Name) configuration for Amaysim in your phone?

All possible, but are they probable? I could address each of your 8 points, but how relevant are they? You have to remember, MONEY, MONEY, MONEY is there for the taking, in one way or another, and farang are soooooooo easy targets. Have you ever known Thai's to walk away from easy MONEY?

I agree. I don't know why some members think this is an impossibility, particularly as one member has already posted of his experience. I posted that if it's a requirement for new accounts, how long before the banks request the same from all account holders and some members seem to think it will never happen. Funny that.

Are you American?

I agree. Correct. I agree, but as I pointed out in another post, if you are topping up your 800k, tax, if you are using the 65k a month method, tax, if you are paying an agent, you can get around paying tax, but need to pay the agent. One may be cheaper than the other, but that comes down to individual circumstance. Either way, pay, pay, pay. It's laughable to me that so many think NONE of this will come back around to their retirement visa / extension. We will all have to pay something. Some people will have to pay big, some people will have to pay small, but it's not just going to go away like it never existed.

Firstly, you have to live in that "main house" for 12 months, otherwise, any capital gain can be taxed. I have never suggested it's not going to be chaos. I have never suggested this is a well thought out and well planned policy. I have never suggested the TRD has been recruiting and training staff to gear up for this. What I have suggested is the Thai's won't miss a chance to turn a baht out of it. It could be as simple as paying 500 baht for a TRD document for your extension, much in the way you pay 300 baht for a Certificate of Residence, even though they are free. It could also be showing the TRD a balance sheet from your bank showing total money deposited and that's what you pay in tax. I don't know what January to March 2025 is going to look like, and neither do you, but I can't see the Thai's missing out on their chance for more MONEY from farang, especially when this is a global tax. I'll ask you the same question I asked another member. Say this does all just go away, how do you think the Thai's will withdraw from it?

Could it be because the Thai financial / income year is the calendar year and that doesn't until the 31st December 2024? He said "TIN." I took that to be a Thai "Tax Identification Number." It could be his US number, so perhaps I have misunderstood. Do you know the member personally?

Deflection - and you know it. So what you ask, well, how do YOU know whether Thai banks will do the same as Australia and other countries, or do the same as the other countries where is doesn't happen? You just dismiss it as an impossibility, despite a member posting he was required to supply a TIN before he could open an account. What does that tell you? Do you think it's even remotely possible Bangkok Bank will contact account holders in the future and give them a date by which they have to also supply a TIN. I gave the example where we all had to register our sim cards, but you say there's no way banks would do it. It's laughable. Not every one is an "ostrich" like yourself. Burying their head in the sand and hoping it all goes away. Question for you. Say it was to "all go away" how do you think the Thai's would do it? Do you think between January to March 2025 if all foreigners do nothing then nothing will happen, carry on as before? Tell me how you think the Thai's will withdraw from this policy, particularly as there is MONEY involved.

A lot of opinion, but not much fact and relevance. Example: I couldn't care less about how well the Thai economy is doing, or how well their tourism industry is going, but he commented on these. All he did was take some quotes from a news article and give his opinion about it. Yes, the collection part of the policy is up in the air, and we will have to wait until early 2025 to see how they go about it, but they announced they will be enforcing the policy, and as of late June, for anyone who has been in Thailand since the 1st January 2024, you are now a tax resident of Thailand, so you are in the game.

Yes, it's also unlikely there will be yet another military coup, until the next military coup. It's funny to read many members putting forward reasons why this won't happen and why that won't happen, but they overlook the main reason why the Thai government is doing this, and that is, MONEY. Why would they walk away from a policy that involves MONEY????

We have a post from a member who has said Bangkok Bank require a TIN in order to open a new account. Are you stating that the member is lying? I have said in another post to you I have to supply my Tax File Number to my bank/s in Australia or the interest is taxed at the highest marginal rate. Why couldn't / wouldn't Thai banks implement a similar policy? This would basically force all account holders to supply their bank a TIN. As for speculation, the Thai government announced the laws will apply starting 1st January 2024. That was not speculation, that is fact. I think many members are speculating there will be no tax collection in 2025, for a variety of reasons, but the Thai government has put people on notice that this tax law will be implemented, and I don't see the speculation in that, as time ticks by in this Thai financial / calendar year.

I'm Australian. In Australia, if you do not give your bank your Tax File Number (TFN) the bank taxes any interest at the highest marginal rate. I am sure other countries have a similar system, yet here you are saying Thailand will not implement something similar? Also, my bank occasionally asks me to declare my resident status. Glad we sorted that out then. Why is that? It's their easiest way of enforcement. It brings the foreign tax payer to them, so no chasing. You already have to provide documents by way of a bank statement/s. Add one more document to the list. Even better for them if you have to pay for the document even if you don't have to pay any tax. Just another little earner for them, either legit or otherwise, like the Certificate of Residence.

Yes, that's right. You have contradicted yourself. This is from your previous post. "Furthermore, for income that is exempt from tax in Thailand according to a Double Tax Treaty (“DTA”) - or if the DTA specifies the other contracting states (foreign countries) that are designated as the tax collectors and Thailand has no authority to collect tax according to the DTA - if such income is brought into Thailand in the case mentioned above, the Revenue Department has not yet issued clear criteria or guidelines to determine whether or not such income is subject to tax according to Section 41, paragraph two of the Revenue Code." See where it says, "Thailand has no authority to collect tax according to the DTA?" You posted it, not me. I have linked the DTA between Australia and Thailand. Can you show me where it says "Thailand has no authority to collect tax according to the DTA?" The one I posted is worded the same. Here's the Australian one from the treasury department. It's also worded the same. https://www.austlii.edu.au/au/other/dfat/treaties/1989/36.html From the treasury department. https://treasury.gov.au/tax-treaties/income-tax-treaties I have read it, have you? Where does it say "Thailand has no authority to collect tax according to the DTA?"

I tend to agree. It will be chaos. However, they either have something up their sleeve, or, as I have said, it might be like the Certificate of Residence that should be free, but we all pay 300 baht for. It may be possible that to get a tax clearance certificate, or similar, you just pay 300, 500, 1000 baht, or whatever, to the TRD, and you are good to go. It may simply be just another backhander foreigners have to pay, and we know the money goes up the ladder. Who knows? Of course, for high net worth individuals, or tax evaders, or criminals, they can apply this law as it would be well worth it for them to do so. We will all get to see how this unfolds early 2025, but I just can't see an announcement from the Thai government early 2025 that the whole policy has been scrapped and it all goes away.

They are starting to connect all the dots. I would not be surprised if current bank account holders are given notice that they have to supply a tax number before a certain date, similar to the way we had to register sim cards. Failure to supply the tax number before the date will most likely see the account frozen until a tax number is supplied.

Did you read the laws? Did you read the announcements made by the Thai government? Where's the speculation? It's happening at this very moment.

What country is that? Why do you say "little return?" Many expats remit millions of baht a year. What about those buying a property here. That's a nice one off earner for the TRD, same with those moving the 800k for a retirement visa, or buying a car. Over hundreds of thousands of expats, all over Thailand, it's a new revenue stream.

They said that about cannabis as well. I remember one member banging on about how they would never legalize cannabis, even after they passed the laws legalizing it. You say 99% it will never happen, yet, it's actually happening as of this moment. You are betting on Thailand not having the infrastructure to handle collection and enforcement, but bureaucracy expands to cater for the ever increasing bureaucracy.

Those neighboring countries will eventually come online with the global tax system. This is not just a Thailand thing, it's global. Vietnam seems to be a popular choice for those looking to stay outside of Thailand for 6 months of the year, but they have similar laws. They are just not enforcing them YET, but give it time. https://www.vietnam-briefing.com/doing-business-guide/vietnam/taxation-and-accounting/individual-income-tax "A tax resident is defined as someone residing in Vietnam for 183 days or more in either the calendar year or a period of 12 consecutive months from the date of arrival. Tax residents are subject to PIT on their worldwide employment income, regardless of where the income is paid or earned, at progressive rates from five percent (5%) to a maximum of thirty five percent (35%)." I am considering 179 days in Thailand, 182 days in Vietnam, and the few days difference in Singapore for the F1. I am staying the full tax year in 2024, so they will get me for this year. If I feel it's a rip off, they will only get me once, because I will implement the above plan.

Can you show me where in the DTA between Australia and Thailand is says "Thailand has no authority to collect tax?" Here's the DTA. https://www.rd.go.th/fileadmin/download/nation/australia_e.pdf Article 1: "Personal Scope" - This agreement shall apply to persons who are residents of one or both of the contracting states. Article 2: "Taxes Covered" - 1) The existing taxes to which this agreement applies are: a) in the case of Thailand - 1) income tax. b) in the case of Australia - 1) income tax. Etc, Etc, Etc. It appears to me the DTA between Australia and Thailand DOES give authority for Thailand to collect tax.

I think you will be in for a shock in 2025. Have you ever known the Thai's to let a baht slip through their hands?

I tend to disagree with you because I would think it's a lot easier using an ATM than dealing with Thai Revenue Department authorities. We just don't know how much of a head <deleted> this is going to be until early 2025, so I don't blame people for using an ATM in order to sit back and wait to see how all of this unfolds. Flying under the radar here is what many try to do, thus minimizing any and all dealings with Thai officialdom, and I don't see this tax as anything different. If you can stay outside of the Thai tax system, for me, that's preferable to being inside the Thai tax system. However, as I mentioned in another post, for those topping up their 800k, or those using the 65k a month method, they are going to need a paper trail of remittance, thus, some tax to pay, or, pay an agent.