backtonormal

Extremely plausible when it was reported that 120,000 rounds of ammo, that had been issued to soldiers, were never returned. Too much of the recent past did not fit together but with this and I expect other revelations it is starting to. Does anybody know how many of the 2000 injured where actually injured by bullets. I would imagine it would be quite high. Some previously 'untouchables' will be getting squeaky bum if any of this is true

Where and when was this reported? I googled it, and there were no hits.

http://asiancorrespondent.com/51168/did-the-thai-military-fire-117923-bullets-at-red-shirt-protesters/ a good alternative read to the bum wipe media

Extremely plausible when it was reported that 120,000 rounds of ammo, that had been issued to soldiers, were never returned. Too much of the recent past did not fit together but with this and I expect other revelations it is starting to. Does anybody know how many of the 2000 injured where actually injured by bullets. I would imagine it would be quite high. Some previously 'untouchables' will be getting squeaky bum if any of this is true

Where and when was this reported? I googled it, and there were no hits.

This is old information that was given out by a member of the old government and vociferously explained by Jatuporn in government house. Do a search on thaivisa for threads I know I read it on here. 2200+ sniper rounds not returned

Do you have ANY facts to support this, or is it just part of your stream of rabid drivel?

Do you have ANY facts to disprove my theory? Which part are you so angry about, the incompetence is already proven to be fair, as for my other thoughts they are merely possibilities, hence the use of the word 'possible' in my post, at no point to I present anything in my post that i purport to be hard facts.

Deary me haha

The person making the accusation has to prove it true, not the other way around.

Thats why you will like LM so much. Nobody has to prove anything

How come its the first time we hear of 169 missing Red Shirts? Where were the inquiries from family and friends over this allegedly missing people?

Red Shirts have been going on and on over the 92 people killed during their protest, but I haven't heard a pip about any missing persons.

I think this is a bone thrown to the Red Shirts (who are keen on feeding on dead people) to keep them fired up.

Not that I'm denying the existence of the bodies, but coming out and saying that this are missing Red Shirts doesn't sound believable to me.

Depends if you think that the army consider themselves untouchable in this country, and that for the most part the media of the day parrots the line that a sitting government and army want them to parrot. It would take a pretty brave policeman, journalist and owner to have investigated this story under the last government I think. If 169 can disappear, what odds a couple more?

I find it entirely plausible that these are bodies from the riots, however, I worry that the truth now is irrelevant and the army are going to come out swinging because they will have been backed into a corner.

Extremely plausible when it was reported that 120,000 rounds of ammo, that had been issued to soldiers, were never returned. Too much of the recent past did not fit together but with this and I expect other revelations it is starting to. Does anybody know how many of the 2000 injured where actually injured by bullets. I would imagine it would be quite high. Some previously 'untouchables' will be getting squeaky bum if any of this is true

So far so good closer and closer to dear brothers return

The wedding is in 4 months - chaimai?

Miitary Coup next month..... any bets..?

Lets hope not. It would potentially set off utter chaos. I dont know of anyone who would support that, and a lot of the people I know dont even vote PTP, but accept that Thaksin is going to be part of the future of a country that is going to have differences of opinion on many things, which will have to be resolved through democracy. Quite a sophisticated opinion really. Then again most people whether they like Thaksin or not have far far more important things to worry about, and one trend I notice among Thai friends is that everyone thinks he is coming back and so it might as well be sooner rather than later as once he is back it ends all the games that go on while he trots round the world and one lot try to keep him away and the other try to bring him back. I am actually amazed that every non-PTP person I know right down to the most ardent PADer thinks he will be back and not serve time

Yes hes coming back, nailed on and rock solid, put your house on it. All the people who voted for Peau Thai knew he was coming back and accepted it. Being convicted for corruption ( abeit by a military controlled judiciary) is no barrier to running the country but being part of the slaughter and attempted slaughter of 100's of Thai citizens surely is.

Pheu Thai Party must "keep its word" because the party promised, after the crackdown, to give families of red-shirt protesters who died in the turmoil Bt10 million each.

And appropriately, Thaksin = PTP, and thus 10 million per each of his dead supporters and who gave their lives so that he can get his other money back and his power over the country restored is easily affordable from his own private accounts. It's the least he can do to show his appreciation for their sacrificing themselves for him.

Besides, he'll easily recoup it with just a few corrupt government deals in the future.

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Only 3 words into your reply and theres that dirty word 'Thaksin' , dont you get bored because I do. Compo for reds , yellows, officials nothing mentioned about Thaksin. Dems lost their credibility and the election because all their policy where either slagging Thaksin or trying to copy him. Bit like you really.

The Nation writes a lot of nonsense from time to time, in another article today they write :

"Thaksin, who was invited by the Japan, China, Asean Institute of Economy and Culture, plans to hold a news conference and give a lecture during his visit. He also plans to visit areas affected by the earthquake and tsunami."

So it is not really Thailand that mr Thaksin is representing is it ???? He was invited ..... Your headline is misleading ...

Sad to see that this editorial is so biased but hardly surprising ... would never spend a THB buying it .

Report news instead don't create it.

Dont think I would trust the date on this newspaper. Pity many on here base a lot of their opinions on this and similar tabloids.

Winners and whiners....this forum unfortunately is full of the latter. The armchair loser critics whose only objective in life is to jealosly knock the winners.

It is very plainly obvious the "we" consists of the vast majority of Thai voters.

Thailand desperately needs proactive progressive business minded leaders. Saying Thaksin is only in it for himself is forgetting the why he was charged with trumped up retrospectrive charges. The whiners single him out but forget the blatent back pocket stuffing bumbling Govt ministers that were so resoundly beaten at the polls. Seems the Thai population know more than the armchair whiners ..... And I am not saying what he stood accused of was right or wrong. Compared to some Thaksin is lily white. But charges aside .....where are the people who would make a better roving Trade Ambassador? Time to forget the past and get on with the future and bring a progressive future for Thailand

Strange you should mention armchair whiners (Dem supporters), only started posting recently after a couple of years of read only. It as not escaped my attention that since the July 3rd Massacre of the Dem party more and more dem sympathisers have been posting on here. Thats a tad strange that the whiners are growing when you think it would be prudent to keep quiet after that election humiliation. I always believed that winners attract winners but the red sympathisers (in numbers) have generally stayed at about the pre election level. The voices on the political threads on here are not representative of the westerners I have met in Thailand over the last 11 years, so I can only hope the exchange rate changes in your favour asap and you can afford to get your butt off the computer and go back to the bar

i don't understand, what is the big deal with allowing him to have a new citizen passport?

i) He's a convicted criminal that has not served his sentence.

ii) He's on the run from the law.

Convicted by the same system that ordered the coup, a point not lost on other countries around the world (Japan and Germany for a start). We have not heard the rhetoric about him being a terrorist for a good while. People who knock him on here would be kidding themselves if they think hes in the top 100 Thai crooks of the last century. Anyway the people have given him a mandate to help them, please give him a chance. If he delivers for the masses once again what chance some famous sculptor will be commissioned to make a Thaksin statue

At last, the truth is starting to emerge, many of us already knew this but the blinkered few on here still believed otherwise, and no doubt will go on believing otherwise.

Yes many of us knew all along what was going on - I am still surprised that the truth might come out after all TIT.

Kudos to the police and public prosecutors to bring this to light.

Now if Thailand should ever really want to change – THE TIME IS NOW.

Pass retroactive laws - like the coup makers did - declare the pardon they gave themselves void - and arrest all those who were involved in the illegal coup.

Replace them with capable officers and not according to the "class" they attended together. Investigate the theft of billions in taxpayer's money to pay off those who helped them to stage the coup. Investigate the private wealth of those involved in the coup.

Those who ordered / carried out the killings of unarmed civilians with war weapons should be charged and prosecuted.

And oh yes – the police chief and army chief should come up with something better than – "I am a soldier / policeman – I just followed orders " - that's the number one excuse most Nazi officers had in their defence for torturing and murdering millions of people!

Thailand should make a clean cut now – for far too long those in power got away with their crimes and now feel they are untouchable and above the law!

Looks like another one of these thugs in uniform not only just got away with torture and murder - but the torture victim has been jailed.

From the Asian Human Rights Commission:

http://www.prachatai3.info/english/node/2704

My thoughts exactly

When or if Democrats return to power someday, you will read the following: ""Police investigators and public prosecutors claim they were pressured by policy-makers to stop filing terrorism charges against red-shirt demonstrators despite plentiful of solid evidence, the Truth for Reconciliation Commission (TRC) said yesterday."" And maybe you are so naive to hope to know all the truth about everything.

Right on, he (she) who pays the piper calls the tune

The Dems wont be returning to power in at least the next eight years and hopefully never. They had a year to report on events but never did, thought they would be here for ever.

""Police investigators and public prosecutors claim they were pressured by policy-makers to file terrorism charges against red-shirt demonstrators last year despite a lack of solid evidence, the Truth for Reconciliation Commission (TRC) said yesterday.""

Maybe Abhisit and Sutthep were so naive that they thought they would remain in power forever so no one would ever find out ? There is probably a lot more interesting stuff hidden under the carpets...

Oh Yes those dem dummies honestly believed that their crimes would not get exposed. I still believe some Dems think Prayuth is going to ride in on a white horse and return the nation to normality. Its not going to happen, Thaksin has neutered the C in C fervour for more confrontation, maybe by exposing his role in last years crackdown. You can guarantee the carpet has a huge bump where all the dem crap is hiding. Honest Abhisit my tut

what cracks me up about lese majeste law is the people who promote will unfaillingly say every Thai loves the royal family. So- if this the case - why would you need a lese majeste law.

I

Excellent post. Very few need to be jailed under this law, reprimanded or fined maybe. Rewriting this law to meet todays requirements will give a little freedom of speech. A few in this country fear that thought

The police chief is not a relative of the Shinawatra family so he has to go to make room for one that is. Entirely valid and reasonable decision.

If you look at the way Thai families do business it is an acceptable decision to have a family member in a trusted position. In business here the alpha son will be head of the company while his father still pulls the strings in the back ground. Another son or daughter will be head of a department, one will be the accountant etc etc. This just happens to be the government but Thaksin is renowned for running the country like a business

Whatever the enquiry turns up I must believe that somewhere someone gave orders that where not acceptable or somebody disobeyed orders. In whatever case whoever is found guilty will be use as a bargaining chip - we will wipe the slate clean in return for no protests about Thaksin returning. Suthep indicated that he would be stepping down from politics to concentrate on charges, he may know whats coming.

Discussing Thaksins possible return, with a friend, we both agreed that Thaksin has acquire many vice like grips on some opponents 'nuts' that he will have no problem returning soon. An example of a 'vice like grip' is possible LM charges, against some prominent members of Thai society, arising from diplomatic cables. It does not bear thinking about, Thaksin tried to have one of these prominent people arrested on coup night. The intrigue intrigues me.

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A nice article if you live in the land of make believe. Truth before any reconcilliation

Well, for a start he picked the PM...

And what an excellent decision that was.

Another allegation in respect to senior military officials discussing issues with the former PM. I don't believe that the General met or spoke with former PM Thaksin. However, I do believe that armed forces members, emissaries if you will, have been in dialogue with former PM Thaksin. The hints of such meetings have been in the public domain for quite some time, ever since some other "people" reached out to former Thaksin to urge his assistance in bringing a peaceful end to the confrontations of last year. Slowly, but surely, the whispers are becoing roundabout suggestions. And soon they shall become soft whispers.

On the other hand, it should reassure those members of TVF that have insisted that the former PM is selecting cabinet ministers. After all, when the top military commander states, he will discuss the nomination for the post only with the people who can make a decision about it. then he has to be telling the truth, right? Mr. Thaksin is therefore not involved in the selection process.

It would appear that thaksin has defused and nullified every threat to his expected election victory. Even the honest hard bitten Dem supporters may be doffing their caps to a brilliant politician. Long may he be with us

Two and a half years where a foreign policy only entails chasing one man. Quite pathetic really. Now Thaksin gets invited to Japan and I think Germany, was he only ever out of favour in Thailand. Foreign governments are aware who is the power broker in Thailand so now they want to court him. Can anybody think of anything the Dems did right ummmmm.

This is brilliant - Now with immunity while parliament is in session Japtuporn and co can as MPs make the laws for us mere mortals to follow, yet these laws don't apply to them. Now there is a classic double standard.

The old adage, 'do as I say, not as I do', springs to mind.

The first motion of Parliament should be to revoke the immunity part of being an MP - otherwise how can we, the people be expected to respect the law if our MPs don't and have a free hand to do what they want with impunity.

No wonder so many alleged criminals are turning up as MPs . Maybe it's possible to convince one of them to ahem, remove, Jatuporn permanently. After all they have immunity and needn't fear jail time.

If I anot mistaken he was arrested for an LM charge. So have many others under the exiting government. Abuse of the law to me. I for one am happy he has been released, he reminds me of those great politicians ranting from the hustings, like Tony Benn and Michael Heseltine. When you had the dems complaining about being heckled whilst campaigning the real politicitions would have taken them on in there own den. To do that you have to believe in whatyour saying, unfortunately most politicans here dont have belief. Jatuporn could take on many if not all other politicians in a debate and beat them hands down. Good luck mate they love you on Thaivisa

Prime minister-designate Yingluck Shinawatra said her government would of course support plans that would benefit the country's national security.

"But budget allocation must take into account other needs too. We also have to budget for people's well-being," she said.

Is this a veiled threat to reduce military budget in the coming years. Thoughts please

Yes - who WERE the men in black? I would love to hear the answer - Jayboy? Geriatrickid? Anyone? Who were they? And why were they carrying automatic weapons, and grenades...

I wonder...

You might also like to wonder why they chose to initiate the violence. The killing of the army commander on the scene was obviously a well-planned operation.

According to the amsterdam report the chances of any red shirt hurling that kind of munition the distance shown on the video was not possible. More truth in another soldier rolling it in from the side and standing behind the APC. It had the desired effect, it made the soldiers fire more bullets.

"According to the amsterdam report........." You consider that a reliable source? The man is a spin doctor and obfuscator, and anybody that believes anything he puts out is an idiot.

It certainly would be impossible to hurl a HAND grenade the required distance, but as he was killed with an M-79 which is fired from a launcher, max. range nearly 400m. The projectiles from the two types are quite different/distinctive, the M-79 uses buckshot, hand grenades flattened wire nicked to break apart into ~1/2" lengths. As there were also reports of him being targetted with a laser pointer, it makes Amsterdam's report sound like the smoke and mirrors crap that he normally issues.

"It had the desired effect, it made the soldiers fire more bullets." Absolutely correct. Now ask yourself WHY was that the desired effect.

I managed to stop the video at the point of explosion and had a full screen of what looked like molten metal. Is that an M79, sorry no arms expert. It may not be a reliable source but its more reliable than anything else that has been published to this date. The report was made by a military expert, not Amsterdam himself and are we to doubt his credentials or his he also selling his reputation for a few thaksin dollars.

As for the desired effect, only my opinion, to justify some of the actions of those present. Justification comes from which side of the fence you are.

Yes - who WERE the men in black? I would love to hear the answer - Jayboy? Geriatrickid? Anyone? Who were they? And why were they carrying automatic weapons, and grenades...

I wonder...

Just my tuppence. They may have had automatic weapons and grenades because they were issued them from the army stores. Just a thought

Yes - who WERE the men in black? I would love to hear the answer - Jayboy? Geriatrickid? Anyone? Who were they? And why were they carrying automatic weapons, and grenades...

I wonder...

You might also like to wonder why they chose to initiate the violence. The killing of the army commander on the scene was obviously a well-planned operation.

According to the amsterdam report the chances of any red shirt hurling that kind of munition the distance shown on the video was not possible. More truth in another soldier rolling it in from the side and standing behind the APC. It had the desired effect, it made the soldiers fire more bullets.

Yes - who WERE the men in black? I would love to hear the answer - Jayboy? Geriatrickid? Anyone? Who were they? And why were they carrying automatic weapons, and grenades...

I wonder...

Excellent question.

Surely you watched the movies. Tommy Lee Jones and Will Smith