pizzachang

1 hour ago, Nowisee said:

That proof came in the way of a certified pension letter while apply for original visa at thai consulate in US.

Exactly, somehow a certified letter becomes "not acceptable".  I'm speculating here, but I wonder how much of a problem faking income was, before the new order? I have a hard time faking anything ????

10 hours ago, Suradit69 said:

I'm sure there are quite a few counties that manage to cobble together their own laws without deference or submission to America. 

Well, I actually agree with your statement. However, faking bank records is not much of a reason, since I could even use the computer belonging to the IO and open my banks secure home page, sign in and show that my funds came from a foreign source.  Some of the comments make me think permanent tattoos and rfid implants will be the only acceptable "proof".  In the age of electronic banking, records of any nation complying with international banking standards, should be "acceptable".  After all, you can go to any ATM in almost any country and access your funds right now, and the electronic record shows the source, origin and the location of disposition. This is the norm and expat pensioners faking bank accounts, doesn't seem like a real problem. I appreciate your comment and I really like Thailand, even after staying for 10 years.  

9 hours ago, Thaidream said:

However, I still fail to understand why Thai immigration needs to have funds transferred to a Thai bank when i can go to a Thai aTM- get 65K in a few  transactions- deposit the funds in a Thai bank and show a consistent pattern of income of 65K per month backed up by Award Letters showing an income stream of the same.

Exactly my original point. Lots of posts about complying and not complaining.  Maybe the problem is our Consulate/Embassy...although I can not understand why only 3 Embassies can't issue an affidavit verifying a freaking Social Security pension!

9 hours ago, Suradit69 said:

had to be accompanied by confirmation/certification from and an affidavit stamped by the US embassy in Bangkok

Yet, the Embassy somehow can't certify a Social Security pension?

2 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

Respect for the pizza oven.

Not new here and my op was rhetorical in that I'm quite interested in the subject. Not new here but have only done 10 previous 1 year marriage extensions. The rule change caught me by surprise (Has there been 12 months elapsed since the new rule was instituted?) Previously I used US Consulate affidavit letter and ATM's.  As I said, any legitimate applicant could easily prove source and disposition of pension funds, arguments to the contrary are lacking. The only reason, that I can see is the part of the rule that says "A Thai bank".  IMO this is arbitrary and not necessary for source and dispositions but then I'm not in charge of the rules or their interpretation.  I thoroughly enjoy making the best home made pizza. 

2 hours ago, jackdd said:

Because printing such a statement by yourself is very easy and verifying that you didn't print such a statement by yourself is very difficult, maybe impossible because the bank in your home country won't cooperate if Thai immigration should have questions.

A Thai bank book is way more difficult to fake and because the bank is in Thailand the police could probably verify the data if they want to.

 

As stevenl correctly said already, your embassy said that they can't verify it. So if your embassy say they can't verify it (they could maybe some get information from an US bank, and they should have way more knowledge about US bank statements than Thai immigration), why would you expect that Thai immigration can?

Well yes and no...it's obvious that any person applying for an extension can take their laptop computer into immigration, open their banks home page, log -in and bring up all the account information, showing the origin (source) of their funds and their disposition to Thailand ATMs - verifying that the money did come from a foreign source, AND then show the same money deposited into a Thai account. This would be pretty hard to fake (IMO) and when we are discussing expat pensioners, it would hardly be worth the effort to even try and fake it.

42 minutes ago, ThaiBunny said:

You do know that the Social Security letter is self-generated if you have an online account and can readily be edited before printing if you know how?

Almost everything is electronically generated - Social Security doesn't send checks by mail, except in special circumstances and even most US Banks would rather not waste the paper.

38 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

The reason they won't accept them is because as Ubon Joe stated-  The police order indicates the money has to be transferred to a Thai Bank Account.  However, if one can get an Embassy Letter- that is all that will be needed.

Thanks for understanding my post and I agree 100% that the real reason is as you state. Has anyone actually asked the US Embassy or Consulate if they can verify a Social Security pension or a State pension?  The original affidavit forms did not ask or provide any way to verify sources of income, but official letters issued by Social Security, (I have one and it called: verification letter) and also one from my State pension that's similar, could serve as proof to the officers at the Consulate ( I assume this only) to issue an Embassy letter.

1 hour ago, mtls2005 said:

Origin isn't so much an issue, other than to say it must be from outside of Thailand, but rather the destination, and amount of course.

My point is origin = outside Thailand. destination ( disposition) = serial numbered ATM inside Thailand....amount is sufficient, otherwise why bother?  I have already proceeded with the new rule, so in 12 months, I'll have Thai "documentation" 

On 6/4/2019 at 2:21 PM, Jingthing said:

Or you could do an international SWIFT wire directly to Thailand. 

If I use a SWIFT transfer, is that coded so that it is acceptable to Immigration?  I realize that it would be a different deposit coding than the deposit and in person transfer from Bangkok bank NY.  

22 minutes ago, Gumballl said:

 

Either way, anyone with a computer could easily fabricate the gibberish that the OP posted; hence why it is unacceptable.

Why would anyone fabricate such easily available information. This is not even mentioning the official letters provided by the SS Admin, stating that the person HAS a pension and the Federal 1099's , the official letter showing a State pension. As I stated bank records are easily obtainable and the norm for proof in any legal proceeding (in the USA) If a non 0 person wants to hide income source because of illegal activity, couldn't they just pay "Speedi Visa" to provide cover? As I stated, I understand the requirement "in a Thai bank" , I just wonder why there is a difference. If the difference is the lack of English language skill, I can understand that as well. It seems that the origin of the funds is easily provable by means other than having a "Thai bank" foreign deposit code. The funds withdrawn from an ATM are electronically recorded as to the origin of the funds.

In the USA, electronic bank records are routinely used in courts of law, in fact many banks don't even send these records by mail but have switched to electronic data.  So, my questions pertains to the reason or non-reason that my bank statement from the US wasn't acceptable to Immigration - the statement clearly shows the origin and disposition of my funds, even to the serial numbered ATM in Thailand, where funds are withdrawn.  I realize that "in a Thai bank" is a separate issue but regardless of that, the actual information proving the origin is the same no matter what bank issues a statement.   I've enclosed a PNG of the pertinent information that clearly shows the origin and disposition of deposits from my pensions. Comments are welcome.

2 hours ago, Maca said:

Original and a copy of your marriage certificate.

Copies of your wfes house book registry (page 1 and the page she is shown on) and ID card signed by her (date not required).

Photos are 3.5 X 4.5 cm.

..................................................................................................................................................................................

Is a copy of the photo page on the blue card(house book registry) a new thing? As I've got a Non O spouse visa twice now from Savannakhet before and never had to show it 

Did you get a 60 or 90 day visa?  I am assuming the 1 year extension can only be obtained inside Thailand.

"It's only because some embassies are unwilling/unable to verify what you claim as monthly income that immigrations has had to resort to a more reliable method of proof ... actual foreign sourced monthly deposits in a Thai bank. "  Interesting comment. My experience today was that CM IO will not accept a US bank statement, showing the source of deposits, the disposition of those deposits to a serial-numbered ATM here in Thailand. So much for providing proof. Electronic records that are acceptable in law courts in the USA are not accepted here.  We have to make adjustments.

Jingthing,

Asking because the criteria for assigning the funds for monthly deposits needs to show that the money came from outside Thailand. Apparently electronic bank records showing this fact are not acceptable. I need to get money into my account to make up a very small shortfall on the monthly amount requirement and hoped it could be done by that method (or may have to find out if a SWIFT transfer will suffice, from my US bank to my Thai bank.

Anyone know if it is possible to transfer money from a US bank account to the Bangkok Bank New York branch? If it is possible, what are the methods?

[However, if your mean the US govt payment was received free that is not correct as two fees are applied]

Pib,  How do you know what my account is charged? I'm amazed.  Now, I have to admit that this deposit was my first IDD, and it is quite possible that a fee will be shown on my monthly statement, however the amount that appeared in my account in Thai baht, was exactly what I get each month when calculating the exchange rate + or - fluctuations.  So, at least for the first deposit, I'm happy with the process. Thanks for all your input and I'll be watching my statements for fees. 

On 4/20/2019 at 1:52 PM, ubonjoe said:

That is not required for the current direct deposits to Bangkok Bank via New York or the new International Direct Deposits (IDD) to Thai banks.

When they first announced IDD being available they stated they had be going to dollar account but changed it to Thai baht accounts. The transfers are done in baht.

 

I received my SS to the "direct account" , went inside the bank and transferred the funds to my local account(ATM/savings) today.  No fees of any kind.  No "Transferwise" or SWIFT code. In Thai baht.  Now, I am assuming that simply filling out another 1199a  at my local Bangkok Bank might eliminate the NY branch.  I couldn't check today, since the bank officer who is in charge of that, wasn't in. This is the same person who set up my NY branch account, so I'll post again after speaking with them.

12 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Don't get into a big rush to do it. Manilla is not prepared to process them yet. They have informed people it is still in the testing of it phase.

They do have this special sign up form for it. https://www.ssa.gov/forms/SSA-1199-OP107.pdf

Not really disputing your post but curious as to why Thailand would appear on the list if "Manila is not ready to process them yet."  If an applicant were to apply online, inside the USA, would they not just simply fill out the 1199a with their Thai bank account number? Would they then get a communication from Manila telling them it's not ready yet?  Thanks for all your help and input about this very important subject

As a note of interest to all. I checked the US Social Security list of IDD eligible countries and Thailand is now on the list.  It was not on the list when I went through the process of opening a deposit account with Bangkok Bank, New York. I'm going back to my BB and changing to Direct Deposit.

Kimchibob, 

Am I not keeping up?  I was under the impression that affidavits from the US Consulate were't being issued. [with income affidavit from the US Embassy, dated 21 Dec 2018,] Did you have to show a Thai bank account with the monthly transfers from the USA?  As I've stated before, with worldwide electronic banking, the ability to instantly show an Immigration Officer where your money is deposited, it's source and disposition to an ATM in Thailand, the "requirements" seem frivolous and petty. 

An interesting comparison, if I may.....I have a US bank account, from which I can instantly download my deposit records. In the USA, these records are acceptable to law courts and, in fact can be subpoenaed as factual evidence. My bank deposit records indicate clearly where my deposits come from (in my case including SSA and PERS retirement benefits) My bank activity records will also indicate when, where and what ATM in Thailand was used to withdraw them. These facts meet all the requirements for the finances portion of the Immigration requirements - except the bank account in Thailand.  Since I've read the new Immigration order, I've wondered who exactly benefits from the Thai bank account and why this makes a difference? In this age of electronic banking, I fail to see any difference in practice - the practice of proving where the money comes from and transferring the money electronically.  Is money-laundering a serious problem among expat Social Security recipients? 2 to 3 thousand dollars per month seems a bit unattractive to launderers, I would think - especially since we can so easily prove where our funds originate.  Just some random thoughts for comparison.  

Thanks Danthai

Lopburi 

The relevant agency is the Treasury Department and I filled and submitted the change of direct deposit form on their website.  The date they provided for this to take effect was April 1st. I guess what I don't know, is will the account number provided by my local branch be accepted by the New York branch.  The local branch provided the routing number for New York because I asked to apply for the Direct Deposit account for New York.

4 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

Living in Thailand requires that you process SS through the Manila Embassy SS office AFAIK.  The current issue is that SS is sending in both international and domestic to Bangkok Bank New York and effective April 1 any in domestic will be rejected - so kind of important for people to be aware and they will probably want to confirm.  A third wheel is that Thailand has just been approved for direct deposit but no details on how it will work.  

Not sure at all about Manila, since all my SS deposits were always into a US Bank and I just used my ATM to access. (much simpler and my bank didn't even charge a fee for "foreign transaction" so only had the Thai bank fee) April 1st seems to be the change to the [The International ACH (IAT)