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New politics? 70% dragged in and 30% elected? Or 50-50? Because they are minority but want to have power for good?

Who are they? Farmers, teachers, noodle vendors, taxi drivers - all those groups that will send their representatives to the parliament under 70% quota?

What IS the minority is several thousand utterly corrupt politicians who have stranglehold on Parliament and who do not represent anyone but themselves and their paymasters. They are your real enemy, not yellows.

They need red shirt support to destroy anyone standing in their way to plunder the country - judicial system and bureaucracy, and educated middle classes, represented by yellows at this point.

Bureaucrats are the only group with enough power to thwart their corrupt schemes that hurt the country. Bureaucrats are not the enemy of the people, they are the ones who oversee its developement and actually implement all the projects and policies, and they have life long commitments to their jobs. Politicians, on the other hand, change every six months and they all want to get rich quick during their short spells in power, they don't care about long term effects, they don't need to keep the "golden goose", so to speak.

If you are going to have reconciliation and are genuinely trying to make things fair you either clamp down on both sides or none.

For any meaningful reconciliation you need people to agree on some common things. For any long lasting effect you should agree on respecting the law first and foremost. To follow the law means punishing people according to their crimes, not your feelings of "fair" on the spur of the moment.

Your call to clamp down on yellows has nothing to do with either reconciliation or following laws, or fairness, for that matter, you just hate yellows and think they should be destroyed.

Comlpeltely destroying both sides is not reconciliation, it's annihilation. Yes, it will all look equal then. Equally destroyed, with lots of other things ruined in the process, too, like the law or sense of right and wrong.

That's Reconciliation TM - trademarked and copyrighted, Thai style, or rather red style.

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Practically, first step towards reconciliation means realising that yellows were right - people's enemies are not Prem and bureaucrats, people's enemies are politicians, regardless of your personal color.

Shame this thread appeared when Win 7 was not available anymore.

About a month ago I installed PclinuxOs on two computers and reinstalled Win XP on one.

Fresh XP install flies, literally. Nothing like 22 sec boot but it's definitely faster than Linux on the same machine. It took me a while to install drivers off CDs (network card and ATI) on XP and get them working properly, nothing like that on Linux, BUT

I still have no idea how to get Linux to connect to the Internet on startup or connect ADSL in one click. As I type now, the dam_n NetApplet thing tells me my internet is down while torrents are completely unaware of that message and are downloading at 230kbps. When the connection actually drops there's no way to know it, and no automatic way to reconnect, and even when it is connecting there's no progress window so I check traffic report in my torrent program to check if I'm on the Inernet or not. In a few clicks I can start another network monitor program but it takes nearly a minute to initialise. It's just pathetic.

Copying downloaded files from external drive to USB stick takes forever, at least half an hour for 1GB. Now I copy them to Linux drive first, then move to USB - saves time but requires extra attention.

Tried to set this machine as Internet gateway for other home computers - no luck, it just throws me "no network cards found" error. Manually, via terminal, I was able to make this machine reply to ping from laptop windows, but it refuses to connect them to the Internet. The GUI setup program still tells me I have to network cards, stupid thing.

Linux doesn't show up in Windows network groups either despite me trying all Samba set up options I could find. Luckily windows machines are visible and I can copy files across network, but it's still pathetic.

The main idea was to get some Compiz eye candy and leave it downloading 24/7 without AV consuping CPu resources scanning all the incoming traffic. Compiz works, but torrent program loads up to 50% of CPU at all times all by itself, worse than Azureus+Avast in windows. I haven't given up on Linux yet, but I'm less than impressed.

The other Linux machine has a different setup and doesn't give me any of these troubles, but it was screwed in its own way - fonts looked just awful. Tried everything under the sun, then run LiveCD again - fonts were crisp and clear. Reinstalled linux, tunred Compiz on - it switched to 800x600 desktop and refused to budge. Reinstalled again, it's just 20 min, but 800x600 desktop still persists. In the end even liveCD was at this low resolution. What was worse is that it cropped content of all the windows - no top, no bottom, no scrollers.

fuc_k that - got the first CD that was nearby, OpenSuse, and installed it instead. Now I have the worst shade of green imaginable everywhere, and it takes five clicks to open any program from a start menu and another five clicks to go back up the tree to open something else. It is reasonably fast, but no visible advantage over well maintained, four year old XP on another partition (that XP has never been reinstalled and has hundreds of programs collected over the years, btw).

So, back to Win7 - would it be a legit version if I download it off torrents? It was offered for free, was it not? XP is hardly ever used on my home machine, I can wipe it out and install Win7 instead, just for fun. Specs are below recommended but, apparently, it's not such a big deal. When 7 was announced it was my low specs that put me off.

So, will I be able to update Win 7 if I get piratebay version now? What's the legal status here?

There certainly ARE laws of nature that cannot be broken.

Human sense of justice is relative. Relatively strong states have relatively strong justice.

I don't see a reason to celebrate general lawlessness, the country can't function if people don't trust eachother because there's no sense of justice.

everything seems to be functioning to me.

How about your 3G phone?

How's that 300 km Bangkok mass transit system progressing?

How about dual track railways around the country?

Have you got enough CNG stations in your neighbourhood? E85?

Any luck with 8mbps internet connection to the world?

High definition TV broadcasts?

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It's been nearly five years without any sign of progress in any of those areas, and problems are not technological - they are all highly political issues, with opposing sides pulling in different directions.

Another five years and we'll be going to Laos or Cambodia to fully enjoy next generation Apple iPhone or download hi def movies in their internet cafes, or just for a bit of a glimpse of a modern techonology.

Nation is not in charge of investigation. It reports on any developements as they are announced by police. If today's version say it was a bronze Isuzu, they report bronze Isuzu, if tomorrow it's a black Toyota, they'll report black Toyota.

You live under assumption that Nation knows exactly what has happened and are just teasing us with bits of contradicting information everyday.

There certainly ARE laws of nature that cannot be broken.

Human sense of justice is relative. Relatively strong states have relatively strong justice.

I don't see a reason to celebrate general lawlessness, the country can't function if people don't trust eachother because there's no sense of justice.

This thread should be closed - it's not news in any sense and the title is very misleading.

I suspect it was resurrected only for the sake of screaming headline only.

beating defenseles people who lay on the ground

Who do you want to hold responsible?

Soldiers doing the beating? Their superior officer? Thailand Supreme Commander? Anupong? Abhisit? Prem?

They were putting down armed insurrection, they can give orders and follow up at best of their capabilities, but to hold them responsible for each soldier's action is just whimsical and capricious, especitally coming from PTP ranks who fully supported far bloodier crackdown in October.

October 9 was only two days after police unprovoked and bloody crackdown on demonstrators. PAD's been bracing for more.

Somehow opposition MPs do not mind THAT, a day when there was a lot more innocent blood spilt, but try to find some non-existent victims of Songran riots.

The answer - they were in charge in October, violence perpetrated by them is alright, their victims do not deserve any justice.

It's a four year old thread, it has nothing to do with the CURRENT government.

There's absolutely no reason to resurrect it and mislead TV members - unless you check the posting dates it appears kosher.

This screaming headline should not be masqueraded as a "news", there's another thread on current govt media war.

No one has been slammed for anything.

Dual citizenship is illegal for Thais, is it not? Having two passports is a proof of dual citizenship, legally.

In practice, however, I've never heard of anyone being punished for that, or revoked Thai citizenship, for any reason.

I doubt Ortega was expecting Thaksin to bring investment to his country, it was just an excuse for public consumption.

Thaksin appears to be looking for a new base, after being kicked out of Dubai. Nicaragua's time zone makes it difficult for subversive activities against Thailand, Africa is better, but he needs infrastructure.

Whatever, July's trial is coming soon, he won't have a chance of stopping it, but he has no other choice but keep trying, so we are forced to watch this drama til the end.

Insiders probably knew, or maybe not, maybe they all have been taken for a ride. Majority of supporters and minor shareholders were in the dark and happily cheering for Thaksin.

If he could pull that off thousands miles away in a faraway country that is as democratic as they come, with a club that is their heart and soul, imagine how his magic works on Isanese.

It is politically incorrect to say that Isanese brains might be duped, though. They are incorruptible, as we all know. They are always right, because there are so many of them.

I'm sliding into a rant here.

PAD was against the amnesty right from the start, it was in the news a couple of days ago but that doesn't mean they going to start street protests anytime soon.

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This amnesty is not driven by compassion, it was forced by staging mass riots and burning Bangkok. What good can possibly come out of this?

PTP behavior in parliament during current debate clearly shows that there will be no reconciliation of any kind. Waste of time, brace yourself for another round of fighting.

That is share given to employee as part of compensation package on top of general income.

Thaksin kids bought the share from his father at 1 Baht. It was was given to his kid as part of a compensation package.

The "kids" are fully grown adults, his son once was listed as the richest Thai.

And don't even start the nonsense like "he bought the share from his father", you have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. If you want to educate yourself - look at TV threads for January-February 2006, all the info with references is there. He was a company director and he bought shares from the company, next day he put them up on SET - instant, taxable profit.

Proof it that the spec say so.

I mentioned this case as an example how political meddling can overwrite tech specs. Now you, without any knowldege of the case, demand proof. Are you imlying that it didn't happen and I made it all up? How about you go dig up news articles from 2003-2005 concerning this project. It was extensively covered in Bangkok Post Database. Then you come back and show where I was wrong.

Wouldn't it be the bodies of blue/yellow/the Govt/the army/police/green aliens?

The weapon has 2 triggers (one for bullets/one for grenades) and in the hands of someone inexperienced, he/she could have inadvertently pulled the wrong trigger.

Anyone who ever used M16 with a grenade launcher knows that Alternate Fire is usually assigned to right mouse button.

it will in its own way play out and strengthen and weaken certain players positions.

I doubt that speculation and rumors about who did what are going to change anything. It's just a feed for low grade journalism, too much ado about nothing.

He doesn't have much credibility here and he is in a unique position to accuse anyone he doesn't like without any proof.

Speculating is pointless, there's no chance the case will be solved, ever. Even if it will be, forget about prosecuting the culprits, any discrepance in witness testimonies and they walk free. Who thinks that masterminds will be exposed?

Thaksin have a plane load full of passport.

Shipping passport by air is expensive, I bet the bulk of it is shipped by sea.

If IE doens't work, none of the programs that depend on it would, and bank sites not only check how your browsers declares itself - they rely on IE only activeX controls, no Firefox/Linux substitutes for those.

Nanlaew needs to fix his IE8, not try to revert to some ancient 4.0 version that worked like a dream in 1998.

ID cards specs required 32MB of usable memory

If your company issues you shares at special prices as a part of your renumeration package and you then sell them on SET at market prices you'll have to pay tax. Everybody does, it's the law. You'll have to pay tax on the difference between your buying price and the market price on the day you registered them on SET, not the price you sell them three months later.

That's what they taxed Thaksin's kids on.

I think it's time for everyone to take a step back...hang up their red or yellow shirts in a closet somewhere and refuse to take up arms or do anything illegal.

After all, there are only a few real "Trouble Makers". Let them fight it out amonst themselves.

Civil War doesn't benefit anyone at this point. Esspecially, when only greedy leaders will emerge in the end (no matter who thinks they won)

Time to stop the rhetoric and get this nation back on track. New elections will come soon enough, for everyone to show their approval, or disapproval, with their vote.

Hmm, sounds reasonable, but you forget that the recent uprising was manipulated not for its own sake but to advance hidden agendas.

Ok, Thaksin have lost, but there are plenty of others stepping in and capitalising on it - look at amnesty and const amendments push.

People have been slugging off with each other on the streets, now they are exhausted, now it's the time for politicians to make their moves, no one has any energy to oppose them.

You hope that new elections would settle the arguments - yes, arguments between people, hopefully, but the real enemy is not reds or yellows - the enemy is politicians abusing their power, and they are the only winners in this otherwise self-annihilating red-yellow war.

Also, the real goal of elections is to choose a competent government, the best possible, and it ain't going to happen if elections are used only as another weapon in a fight between people themselves.

We have a crisis on our hands, remember, it's not really a good time to forget about governance and try to score cheap points against each other instead.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2009/...ksin-shinawatra

This article from Guardian is extensively quoted in today's Nation.

It appears Thaksin had the club pay his son for doing PR work for the Thailand tour he forced on them, and even lent the money to the club at nearly 12% interest.

There are lots of other numbers - "City lost £33m up to then under Thaksin, and their bank borrowings increased from £49m to £64m. The amount owed to all creditors ballooned from £134m to £209m."

Sounds like Thaksin, doesn't it. The same way Thai household debts doubled during his reign, and it was all about "helping the poor".

But you are completely wrong.Most people would far rather the army disperse the red protestors without bloodshed, and credit to Abhisit and the security forces for doing just that.Naturally there was a huge amount of frustration but I think most people just wanted an end to the situation.

In the long run, yes, but on the spur of the moment many people wanted someone to shoot the reds for what they did.

Lives are cheap here and if killings are percieved as justified no one would shed a tear.

Even if PTP finds some proof that the army really killed some protesters, the anger would be about denial, not the shooting itself.

Similar feelings towards Tak Bai - do you really think Thais give a dam_n about some dead troublemaking muslims? Do you really think they give a dam_n about those killed inside Krue Sue mosque? At Ratchaburi hospital? Do you think they care about thousands of lives lost during drug war? During 1976 crackdown? Communists killed in Isan jungels afterwards?

Once your innocence in the public eye is lost, you are a fair game, no mercy. Welcome to Thailand.

It was incredibly funny to hear Speaker Chai's response to the Puea Thai accustation that many people had been killed. He said "feel free to bring in the bodies to show us, we'll wait"! LOL

That's because before the debate Chalerm promised to bring corpses into the parliament to show proof.

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Abhisit is playing with fire here, this amnesty proposal has the potential to completely discredit the parliament. I don't think it would be a coup, and not even massive street protests, just general discontent and bad mood. I'm afraid it's with us to stay for years and years and years until the current bunch clears out.

It's people vs politicians, the battle that started in 2005 but got obershadowed by the coup and red shirts.

I'm waiting to see when red shirts realise who their real enemies are, the amatiatipattai is only a diversion, a red hering, but it proved too much for mighty isanese brains and even progressive retards like Giles.