Para

if the British embassy in bkk does the affirmation immediately then you will be able to do same day with ease..

if they do not there is another way round it ,,

Jomtien consulate opens at 8am .. takes them 10 minutes to do ..

so worst scenario .. taxi from airport straight to jomtien (no ques, but check opening days)_ .. wait 10 minutes .. taxi straight to MFA . in traffic at that time of day it will take 2.5 hours to the MFA as once you hit bkk it sucks .. your still in time though as you have till midday for same day service.. 30 minutes for a translation then run upstairs and your nearly done .. // he will be all done by 2pm

of course if BKK embassy do same day thats better, but there will be bigger ques for sure .. i'd make soem phone calls if i was you or him and ask bkk about waiting times

Interesting option silentnine.....

So the trade off is instant turn around in Jomtien but a 5 hour there and back taxi against the wait at BKK? I see the up side of Jomtien but the potential for traffic problems Airport to Jomtien to CW is immense.

Can he get the freedom to marry stamped in the UK?

He can do it alone, the Thai MFA only certifies the translation by the translation agency and that the letter from the embassy is real. He can also have the tranlation agency do the MFA part and send it home to him.

translation is about 400 baht and certification by MFA 800 for express service. Anything more is the fee for the translation agency. Might be well worth doing.

Thanks for the quick reply and clarification Mario2008

His back is against the wall time wise he lands in on the 12th at 6am and was hoping to get both the British Embassy AND MFA done the same day do you think its possible?

Guys

A friend of mine is getting married and wants to sort out all the paperwork himself rather than have his girlfriend come alone or bring their baby to BKK.

Can he go to the MFA with an Embassy certified 'freedom to marry' then take the translation to the MFA at CW?

Does he need her or copies of any of her ID?

Sorry if this has been asked before......

Para

Sorry. Without the knowledge of lightheartedness involved, many of the posts appeared to be associated with strong belief.

I've often thought, what would the result be if travellors built their lives on the existence of realms only to find that they may only exist in the mind.

Nestled amongst Brahmanism, Jainism, Hinuism, and others, is it possible what the Buddha taught and what we are presented may differ?

Do not accept anything by mere tradition ... Do not accept anything just because it accords with your scriptures ... Do not accept anything merely because it agrees with your pre-conceived notions ... But when you know for yourselves—these things are moral, these things are blameless, these things are praised by the wise, these things, when performed and undertaken, conduce to well-being and happiness—then do you live acting accordingly.

Of course there are strong beliefs regarding this as it is in effect the path to Nibbana something every Buddhist strives for.

I have also wondered if this is not all a huge con but realized even if it is so what because we have been mindful of our actions and considerate of others. Evan as a Monk if I was to die and be told there is no more I could still smile knowing I had learned to lead a better way of life. That alone is enough for me and goes back to your comment about 'living in the day'.

Anything is possible considering how long ago we are talking about who can judge if the Dhamma taught today is what Lord Buddha wanted to be taught?

The issue with this thread is we are talking about what is speculation based on what has been handed down as teachings and whilst it goes against the 'prove it for yourself' ideology we accept there is more to life than the here and now. Without that belief why would people make merit, be mindful embrace meditation?

Are we not in a catch 22 situation here by accepting what has been taught without the means to question and discover for ourselves?

Isn't in much better to focus on the here and now and practice awareness in the present?

Realms may or may not be, but they should not make any difference to ones practice, otherwise it would suggest an attachment to aversion.

The aversion of wanting to avoid suffering.

I agree the here and now is the only real reality in life.

This whole thread is simply about opinions on what happens next there is no tangible proof. As you said in a previous post 'The sphere of infinite consciousness sounds like a good place to be.' and I agreed! My personal position on all of this is rather light hearted but am fascinated by some of the posts.

Living a mindful life regardless of what happens next should be reward enough.

Meditation do not show anyone the afterlife, one needs to achieve Bodhisattva.

Sorry so meditation doesn't allow you to see the afterlife (not my choice of words) unless you are a Bodhisattva and then meditating does?

Isn't that a contradiction?

Sadly just seen this thread Camerata but have signed up and look forward to Ajahn Pandit's next talk.

Thanks for sharing.

I agree. it is ridiculous stories like this that make Buddhists look silly.

Bankei

So you don't believe in in the higher planes of Gods/Deva's/Deity's?

No, it is not a contradiction. The long-life god realm is a samsaric realm characterized by a blissful and meditative existence. Its character is bliss. They live so long that they are oblivious to mortality until they approach death. They indulge in bliss for aeons. They have no motivation to practice the dharma. When their karma is finally exhausted, it is only then they experience the suffering of change. Not having developed any positive qualities such as wisdom and compassion nor performed any positive actions, they have no positive basis for the future. They have exhausted all the positive merit which caused them to be reborn as gods. As their death approaches, they see their future rebirth as a hell being, animal, or preta...then their suffering is immense. It is not a contradiction, it is one of the six destinies.

Interesting comment and one I would agree with.

Imagine the pain of living a mindful human life accumulating karma and wisdom so as to be able to break human samsara and live in a plane so much more than I am sure we can even imagine only to then lose it all through lack of discipline following the Dhamma and meditation knowing you will be reborn back down in this living hell.

In terms of what may have happened to Steve, isn't what happens to us not necessarily aligned with our belief?

Otherwise, in order to achieve a certain outcome, all you have to do is believe in it.

Absolutely we all follow our own paths hoping that it will lead us to the place we feel is best for us. IMO.

Wow. Available in mobi (Kindle) format too.

Camerata you know I am always happy to convert pdf's to mobi's for you just as long as you don't mind the splattering of random Chinese characters!

Good find Fabianfred thank you.

Yes there is very minor suffering in the kamasugati realms, but the main problem is that one hasn't escaped samsara.

I would agree there seems to be only minor suffering in Kamasugati what about the 4 lowest planes Kamaduggati Bhumi?

(Planes of misery - State of loss)

Daemons

Unhappy Spirits

Eight Major Hell's

But isn't samsara in every plane until Nibbana is reached?

Thank you so much for posting the 31 planes I was only told of 16 I have learned something.

The sphere of infinite consciousness sounds like a good place to be.

In all honesty, the upper Deva realms might be subject to somekind of suffering, but compared to what we see around our planet, this would be "spoilt for not appreciating what you have" level.

Nothing like, the killing, torture, sickness, loss, anguish, pain and other suffering which humans are subject to.

In which Sutta's does the Buddha cover such realm detail?

+1

Wonder if they offer a fast track there!

The trouble with life in the heaven realms is that there is no suffering

In the six heaven (Deva) realms above the human realm the only forms of suffering are three...

So there is suffering in the higher levels due to samsara and as outlined by the Four Nobel Truths?

As human beings we are aware of suffering and the cure for it with the Eight Fold Path but when we have attained enough positive merit we escape samsara in the human world and enter samsara in the Deva world but are then made to endure the same suffering as we had as humans, craving, attachment etc.

So what about the next 10 realms there are as I understand it 16 in all?

I don't follow the logic on this I am sorry.

unfortunately "half-yak stories" like this are putting off most people who are interested, respectively learn more about Buddhism

No disrespect Naam but when you say 'most people' what are you basing that on?

This is a single thread that is discussing he path to Nibbaba sounds pretty Buddhist to me. If people don't like what's being discussed here they are free to read the next thread.....

Phra Para

Perhaps like being married/monogamous for a million years.

I think either would cause severe Dukkha!

Curious if even the lowest class of Deva's are able to like such an enjoyable life what is the incentive to reach Nibbana?

They have the chance to hear the dhamma when a Buddha is alive and teaching, but once he is gone we humans are in a far better position to study and practice.

In the higher realms of Brahmas etc. they live in bliss similar to the four jhanic states....and the higher realms are without difference in sexes.

I was taught the first 6 realms the deva's have a physical property about them where as the upper 10 realms there is no physical and that the only way to move up a realm was through the deva's making merit through Dhamma and meditation?

Thanks for filling in a couple of blanks I had on what was taught to me.

Do they also avoid Dukkha?

I know you asked fabianfred but my understanding is they still endure samsara to to me that means some degree of Dukkha but I am open to correction!

Buddhism recognizes 'gods' as a level of existence within samsara. What you are referring to, I believe, is that Buddhism says there is no creator god who created everything, an over-seer god, the Christian "God."

Absolutely agree.

they dwell in bliss, in high states of meditation, whatever they wish for or want immediately appears to them, etc.

Not so sure on this but its only my opinion. They still endure the suffering of samsara it not until they reach Nibbana they are in true bliss. As for 'whatever they wish for or want' don't you think this the same as lusting (craving) and attachment as defined by the Four Nobel Truths and thus the root of all suffering? If life is so good at the lowest level then why strive for Nibbaba?

One week before they pass out of the god-like existence, they have a vision of their next life, their clothes become dirty and they smell bad, their attendants all abandon them. Soon, they are reborn into another realm.

Its been said that people able to attain Jhana the deepest depth of meditation are also to see not just previous lives but where they are going to be born in the next.

They don't practice the Dharma in the god existence because they see no need, their existence is already blissful and without problems.

I disagree they have to practice Dhamma and meditation to escape the lower 6 classes which have a physical form attached to them to enter the upper 10 classes which are formless. Even at the 16th level they still endure samsara and it not until full enlightenment is attained and they pass to Nibbaba that their suffering/problems stop and life is as you say blissful.

This is all conjecture but if I am ever able to achieve even the lowest class I will try and get a message back letting people know what its like!

With metta

Phra Para

He was very disappointed to find out that the parallel universe only had wireless access to platforms running Windows OS.

I think he would be more angry to find it running on Android!

The word is 'deva', เทพ and เทวดา in Thai. http://en.wikipedia....Deva_(Buddhism)

Seems to me it might be best to avoid translating the word as angel or god, as neither of these words seems to be the same type of entity as a deva.

Deva and Deity are the same http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deity#Buddhism

Thai's believe in 2 types of non-beings they are either ghosts (bad) or angels (good).

Using http://www.thai-language.com to translate

เทพ - angel; fairy; god; deity; divine being

เทวดา - a male angel.

Cross referencing with http://www.thai2english.com....

เทพ tâyp god ; goddess ; angel

เทวดา tay-wá-daa god ; goddess ; angel

My Abbott explained to me about the 6 classes of Angels and used the word Angels but hey he is only the Abbot of the temple and has a Doctorate in Buddhism.......

As was explained to my by my teacher there are 6 classes (levels) where Angels or Deity's live before NIbbana is reached.

Anyone in one of the 6 classes still needs to make merit to achieve samsara so are subject to birth/rebirth just not on the earth as 'living' people.

The time spent there is almost beyond our comprehension. According to Wiki and Naraka there is one hell Avīci – the "uninterrupted" Naraka. Beings are roasted in an immense blazing oven with terrible suffering. Life in this Naraka is 3.39738624×10¹⁸ years long which I am sure you would agree is quite a while!

BTW There are no gods in Buddhism.....

Whilst I don't know if he would be half Yak I wouldn't be surprised if he is now living in one of the 6 Angel Classes.....

Interesting thought maybe I will talk to Laung Poe Sinh who is able to meditate to see these classes.

Yet another tragic waste of life due to the lack of fire precautions.

How many more people must die before fire escapes are not just available but not chained up?

As for the comment about his name what difference does it make he died on holiday in Thailand because of the way Thai's are allowed to run their businesses.

R.I.P.

What kind of punishment is he facing?

Dependent on quantity not that long as cocaine is a class 2.

If he had 9 x 1g bags and please guilty he will get about 3 years. Will have to serve 1/3rd in Thailand and because the original sentence is less than 7 years will be free as soon as he lands back in the UK.

Neither the links to other web pages nor the links to embedded sound files work.

My bad I didn't read the part where he wants to embed media content.

Options.....

Use HTTrack to rip the site and content it creates a front HTML page with the media where it should be. But this doesnt create the required PDF file.

I am not a webmaster but isn't there some way of exporting the web page from Dreamweaver or similar decent web page creator?

I have been using CutePDF for years now and it works a treat.....

I have a wedding to attend up in Korat in September and can not for the life of me find the chant!

I have been told its the same as a house blessing but not confirmed.

If anyone has the chant in either Thai or preferable English will them PM me with it.

With metta

Phra Para

I'm not sure 'attempted murder' will stick, it is now well publicised that Adam had previously been in a coma after a very nasty bike accident and had to have re-constructive surgery etc, it may be fair to say that he was in a very weakened state, and any action from the bloke that hit him may have opened up an old injury so to speak.

So if someone has been previously assaulted and had their nose broke then gets involved in another incident sometime after resulting in another broken nose will, in your opinion mean a downgrade of ABH to assault?

Get real regardless of Mr Pickles prior head injuries this poor SOB was hit with a metal bar!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!