newcomer71

So you give more credit to media report than to a first hand testimony of someone who knew the poor guy?

And this is a free forum, I guess if someone of RTP wants to tell their side of the story here is welcome, but don't expect that, so don't blame Sheryl for that.

I don't give credit to anything if you read my replies correctly. What I observed is that statements are inconsistent and that the findings of the pathologist are questioned by the mother of the dead person.

What gets me up in arms is the fact that whatever happens in Thailand to foreigners is grasps upon by the people that seem to be very unhappy in my country.

# 8 Lawless that’s what is happening; that’s what you get when you don't punish 'elite" criminals; Murder, rape and extortion...; Welcome to Koh Tao

# 22 Thai police don't cooperate - no compassion, tough luck foreigners. Thais have a bad attitude. Everyone knows that.

# 28 Look , only a few people are left still believing the Thai versions on almost anything these days. Some people refer to them as suckers - fools.

# 31 The RTP covering things up is hardly a far fetched scenario either is it ?

# 35 An appointed Thai one- whose evidence is refuted in more civilised countries

And it goes on and on.

But what would happen if I would say that all expats from the UK are here to assault and abuse Thai children?

Here is an article from the Guardian that shows that the cover up of child abuse is perfected for decades in the UK with the help of D notices that cover aspects of national security. Members of parliament and government figures seem to be involved in abuse and even murder of children it appears.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/dec/20/newspaper-boss-police-vip-paedophile-coverup-claim

It wouldn’t be fair now to claim all male British people are falling into that same category but for expats to make statements about all Thais comes very easy it seems following most forums here.

It seems you're going far off topic, starting a crusafe against foreigners negative about Thailand.

Indeed in this forum there are some of them but there are also some depicting Thailand like a perfect paradise... of course truth is in the middle. We should make a equilibrate analysis and not going to get all emotional or upset about some post that's obviously a rant.

Sheryl post seemed to me equilibrated differently from some of the ones you quoted...

I'm overall happy to live in Thailand but I feel if we can all can give a contribution to make it a better and SAFER place that would be just good for your country.

Seriously, what's wrong with junta?

It's really unbelievable how they can do more and more bs statements day after day.

I could have said they can't say past their noses, but now can't see even their noses!

If in Bangkok why dress like a tourist ? I am sure if you wear long pants and look respectable they will not even think about stopping you.

Oh well if you're sure, that's OK.

Just out of interest, do you actually live in the real world or just online?

I have lived in Bangkok for 3 years,. Never been stopped by the police. Not even in the so called tourist areas, day or night. I never walk around in shorts and I don't look like a tourist . Are you satisfied with my answer?

Your experience does not necessarily means that no one will be ever stopped the police. There are plenty of cases about this practice that has been going on for years in Thong Lor area, denying is it is just silly.

Calling you out on your agenda.

That's exactly what you are implying, in your passive-aggressive manner, by implying that it is the junta's fault, or that they are complicit, by doing nothing. Now you're just backpedaling

I would argue that Prayuth's government has both bigger issues to deal with and bigger fish to fry, none of which I will discuss here.

The fact that you immediately blocked off any debate of salient issues via PM is enough of an indicator that you are only interested in publicly smearing the current government every chance you have, ie your agenda.

The same arm-waving also to Pattaya in appropriate threads, with the same chicken little attitudes announcing that the govt (or whatever bogeyman) wants to shut do all sex tourism in Pattaya - again, rumors and speculations that have gone on for at least a decade back.

Considering some of the elements that sex tourism attracts, I can't fault the Thais if they did want to do that - except that's not going on. The majority of the crackdowns that are happening is that laws are being enforced more strictly that hadn't been previously enforced (ie visa abuses), which are interpreted incorrectly by those feeling entitled to break laws or abuse systems.

So, I guess we can add one more thing to Prayuth's achievements (take note, BigMountain) - an emphasis on actually enforcing existing laws on the books, without compromises. Something we can all agree on, can't we (including that 'democratic) governments that came before did absolutely nothing in that regard, something else we can agree on).

This topic is not about politcs or Junta, so please stop to derail the topic.

Curious that NNT is the only news agency to report this... must be true!

If these police aren't real police with powers of arrest, or even if they are real but are right at the bottom of the police food chain, then what happens if you just keep walking away when they approach you? Are they really going to chase after you? Are these the type of police with guns who actually look like police or are they those scruffy, sweaty types with no guns....sort of turds on legs that just sit by the road all day?

This thread has degenerated into mostly useless bickering. We need strategy, not useless bickering.

I think the only strategy possible is that whoever has first account episodes of harassing, extortion, and humiliation, must document it to newspapers, TAT, tourism related websites, social media, or anything that has visibility.

And go through official channels as I did, reporting the episodes to your embassy.

I hope you are not talking about me, because I strongly agree law have to be enforced. But living here for more than 10 years made me learn that that's a rare case, sadly.

Welcome any crackdown and law enforcement for ANY kind of crime! Security is all we want I think.

But exploiting and condemnation of every bribe or extortion episode is our duty!

No, not talking about you or even necessarily any particular person, but I think a lot of this thread and the so-called reports (most of which I don't believe are credible) of police abuses of stop and search is motivated by several factors - 1) people who are involved in illegal activities trying to make it into an issue to tie the hands of police, 2) a certain mentality that perceives Thailand with a racist and colonialist mentality and "how dare they interfere with my fun", 3) a desire to discredit the current government (which I think is the predominant motivation here), and 4) the group that always shows up here to condemn Thailand ("Suicide, yeah right?" "Thai people hate farang" etc). Anyway my experience here in Thailand has been a positive one. Maybe that is because Thailand interjected itself into my life long before I ever had a chance to visit the country. My undergrad years I majored in Asian studies, but none of the courses touched on Thailand, but in life, after graduate school, Thailand and I became very intertwined. I have noted that there is an element in many online forums that see Thailand in a light tinted by racism and colonialism ("It's ours, how dare they make us obey the law") not beyond comparison to a document I read in the National Archives of Malaysia where the British wanted to charge the Sultana for a license to have a radio! Thailand is not a colony, not a sex playground. It is a great and proud country that welcomes those who respect it, and those who do not respect it the question arises why are they here? I am here because it is home...

I'm here because is my home as well, and of course whoever likes to bash on Thailand and Thais on every occasion is just a sad individual. Until here we agree.

You are even free to not believe in reports (besides some of them are grossly exaggerated, I concede that), but can't tell EVERY report is fake. I had first hand reports and I strongly believe my friend and my 2 colleagues.

One of my 2 colleagues was even on first trip to Thailand and felt really threatened and make demand to our HQ to NOT come back to Bangkok ever again. You can imagine the consequences of people being harassed and talking about their experience when they will be back at their home country...

And believe me, not one of the person I know have been harassed is a druggie, a parvenu, a fan of the sex-o-meter places. So it's good to make a distinction of cases where police try to do their job, and cases where people try to extort money.

We had lots of bad examples in the past and that does not play in favor of the RTP.

Now, me and you live in Thailand and know that it can happen, but sure SHOULD NOT happen. And if no one do much, I feel anyway it;s my duty to report what happens here, and suggest to avoid that area. Said that, I love Thailand and this is the place where I will live the rest of my life.

Wishing it to be a better place, does not mean to hate it, at opposite.

Peace.

I dont really see the problem. If a person has done nothing wrong then they are on the right side. I think the only people who dont like this type of policing are guilty of something.

I am all for it. The more the police do to protect the innocent then all for the better.

I hope this method sends out a message.

It is not harassment at all. The police are doing their job and its about time.

If the tourists being stopped and searched dont like it then go home.

A lot of people in this forum think Thailand is their personal playground, a place to party, do drugs, get laid, walk down the street with a beer in each hand, doing things they would never get away with in their home countries. And many of them tend to immerse themselves in the ghettos they have carved out, guess where... There's nothing wrong with wanting familiarity but it goes beyond that on Sukhumvit - pornography openly sold (including bestiality), allegedly (but probably fake) controlled drugs being openly sold, a lot of illicit drug activity, hookers (both girl-girls and ladyboys), on and on.... Actually the police should crack down on all of it, Thai and foreign, clear out the prostitutes, stop the sale of illegal drugs (fake or genuine), stop bad behavior,... For that though we likely will have to count on the Army, as was the case with the so-called "happy-ending" massage parlors.

I absolutely agree with you that people have a choice - to be here or not be here. If they cannot respect the laws and traditions, well... they have no business complaining about enforcement. Personally I feel freer here than I do in the USA, and Thailand has been nothing but good to me. I love Thailand, and I respect its laws.

I hope you are not talking about me, because I strongly agree law have to be enforced. But living here for more than 10 years made me learn that that's a rare case, sadly.

Welcome any crackdown and law enforcement for ANY kind of crime! Security is all we want I think.

But exploiting and condemnation of every bribe or extortion episode is our duty!

I dont really see the problem. If a person has done nothing wrong then they are on the right side. I think the only people who dont like this type of policing are guilty of something.

I am all for it. The more the police do to protect the innocent then all for the better.

I hope this method sends out a message.

It is not harassment at all. The police are doing their job and its about time.

If the tourists being stopped and searched dont like it then go home.

Cool, I wish you never meet a policeman trying to extort money from you.

Peace.

Sensationalising and exaggerating comes to mind, coupled with journalistic style embelishments.

The problem exists and calling sensationalism and exaggerating the reporting of a crime it sounds funny...

A problem with no independent verification of its existence. Richard Barrow is not one of my favorite people, but he is certainly no fan of the current Thai government or its agencies. That said, while I think he often words things to suit his own POV, he is basically honest - maybe not objective but honest.... If he had seen any evidence today of illegal behavior from the police I am certain he would have posted it.... I was in that area a week ago and saw nothing. Richard Barrow was there today and saw nothing. This entire thread concerns something that is known to happen sometimes and made it seem a common occurrence. It clearly is not....

I wrote this post earlier in the thread, specifically replying to one of your many posts here.

I have been stopped in the past two weeks on Sukhumvit just passed Asoke intersection. I showed my passport and everything was alright. That is the normality.

In the last 2 months 1 friend and 2 colleagues in visit in Bangkok have been stopped, one of them did not have a passport with him but a copy and have been asked 2,000thb for let him go. Another one 10 days ago has been asked to take an urine test, but he was lucky to be with another Thai staff at office and very disgruntly have been authorized to go. My friend not more than 2 weeks ago have been stopped, they keeped his passport and asked 2,000 for irregularities without even explain what the problem was, he wanted to call his company for ask assistance and they took his phone too.

He has been forced to give 2,000 thb as well and let walk.

Now: I send a brief report to my Embassy for let know about this problem, I don't give a d#%n whichever the government in charge is now. This is a police problem, whichever is the cause.

Downplay the problem is just silly.

This entire thread concerns something that is known to happen sometimes and made it seem a common occurrence. It clearly is not....

So, if sometimes police will extort you money, it will be ok? Good to know then..,

Let's look the other side until we will get slapped.

P.s.: I think you will say, I don't have any proof, it doesn't matter as I reported the problem to an official institution already and that's all I needed to do for my part.

Sensationalising and exaggerating comes to mind, coupled with journalistic style embelishments.

The problem exists and calling sensationalism and exaggerating the reporting of a crime it sounds funny...

I'll say it again, those who are gearing up to leave or have already left for greener pastures, I say, you have made the right choice....this place is going down hill and going fast. I was hoping to get out this past September, but now it looks like I'll have to wait until March or April....

From the sounds of it, perhaps you can get together with the other TVFers on this thread and get your own charter flight.

Which TVFers? Who is reasonably worried for a bad phenomenon rising? Or who else?

I'm not the one sounding desperate.

The phrase you posted in all caps shows your real motive, and actually is factually inaccurate as the current allegations are 6 months after the military's actions last May, which put an end to the violence and intimidation directed at protesters and which resulted in the murders of several children.

The issues you attempted to interject were far more relevant prior to military intervention than they are now.

I was in that area 6 days ago and didn't even see a single police officer so I know from my experience this claim is spurious.

Sorry to disturb the "conversation", but if I'm allowed...

To tell that you were there 6 days ago and even did not see a single police officer does not mean anything.

I do frequently walk in that area on daytime, as for work I do visit customers. I often see policemen stopping foreigners and I have been stopped myself.

My personal experience is not bad, as I only showed my passport and work permit and I have been let go. Not the same for some colleague and friend, that have been let go after pay a "tribute".

Free to believe me or not. I think it's a good thing to tell everyone who has to go in that area at least to pay attention.

Edit: messed quote

If i remember correct this is Thailand not your home country. If you obey the laws, do not cause problems, not over staying your visa, being obnoxious and disrespectful to the Thais or their customs you should have nothing to worry about. Never in all the years living here had any problems when i was stopped at a police road block. Show respect to the Thais, learn to speak some Thai if you plan to stay here for any length of time, don,t dress like a slob, don,t walk around drunk with beer in hand, no problems.

While I agree with you on most of the points, I think your thoughts do not apply to cases where foreigners are harassed, like that elderly couple from India harassed and forced to give an urine sample... That's against any logic and against even human rights.

RTP respects people and they will have respect back from everyone.

Whilst what you say is true, would the policeman know about it?

If he did, would it make any difference to his behaviour?

Is your Thai good enough to fully argue the point?

What really worries me is reading so many different posters suggesting that the BiB may plant something or alter the result of a pee test!

That really gives me an uneasy feeling.

A previous poster mentioned that many countries issue long term foreigners with an ID card.

I've had one for Spain and it has to be renewed every 5 years.

The ID number is used all the time.

There are no 90 day reports but you must register your address with your local town hall.

Everything is on computer, country wide and I have no problem with it.

When I was working in Taiwan almost 50 years ago, we were issued with a black passport and instructed to carry it with us at all times. We were working in the mountains in the middle of nowhere. Still we were occasionally stopped in the street of a tiny nearby village and taken to a police station and interrogated. At the time, they were very worried about infiltration by the Chinese and wanted to know everything about the foreigners in their jurisdiction. Once the officers got to know us, they just nodded and that was that.

What I am reading here though does not seem to be based on security but more on extracting money from gullible foreigners.

Perhaps someone would like to post the embassy numbers for Al foreign embassies in Thailand and pin it?

From previous threads, I got the impression that to get a job/promotion in the police force, the Thai had to pay for the privilege.

The pay is small but the tea money is big.

They got used to high levels of tea money and the army has made severe inroads into it, street vendors, happy ending, stop the music in bars etc.

I guess what we are seeing is a direct result of these crackdowns.

Maybe someone had to borrow money to pay for the job/promotion and the loan shark must be paid?

The salary won't do it!

How many police men do you observe living way beyond their means in your moo Baan?

Perhaps someone would like to post the embassy numbers for Al foreign embassies in Thailand and pin it?

I think it's a good idea. Also if they try to force you to give an urine sample or search you and you feel harassed, it's a good idea to ask to speak with your embassy before with your phone, or with your lawyer (if you're not a tourist).

This is a comprehensive list of embassy and consulates in Thailand with their phone numbers and other contacts:

http://embassy.goabroad.com/embassies-in/thailand

Ban them.

Totally agree... They will continue with their criminal practices until they will be hit in the pocket.

Nobody here seems to even consider a possibility that these two may actually be guilty....

I don't know if they are guilty or not. I only know that RTP did show the total and utter incompetence, bullying behavior, and resort to shady moves they are capable of along the whole investigation.

That deserves coverage, and deserves people and media to speak about it.

I hope that 2B will be convict if they are guilty and if there will be a fair trial, but the premises are everything but encouraging.

To know the opinion of the public will they order a Dusit poll? Or a NIDA poll?

Yesterday: Latin America. Today: Canada. Tomorrow: ........................................ fill the space with a random country at your ease.

The truth is so far from the hopes being spread daily to paint a heavenly image of Thai economy.

RIP