Dogmatix

RickBradford, on 30 Nov 2014 - 14:55, said:

Face it, the B2 are cooked.

The truth of the matter is irrelevant.

In a cargo cult society like Thailand, the appearance is everything, the substance nothing. There will be an indictment, a trial, and a conviction. Anything else is unthinkable.

Still. I will be interested what the UK inquest comes up with in January, though the language used will certainly be nuanced, anything to avoid a diplomatic spat.

I will be very surprised if it gets any stronger than: "We feel that the investigation lacked something in rigor and transparency, but we have no reason to doubt the conclusion".

Still. I will be interested what the UK inquest comes up with in January, though the language used will certainly be nuanced, anything to avoid a diplomatic spat.

I will be very surprised if it gets any stronger than: "We feel that the investigation lacked something in rigor and transparency, but we have no reason to doubt the conclusion".

I disagree. I don't think the U.K. coroner will hold anything back. There have already been serious doubts expressed over the deaths of the British man who allegedly hanged himself in police custody in Bangkok last year, as well as the man who died in suspicious circumstances in Koh Tao on New Year's Day this year, not to mention the Kirsty Jones case. I see the inquest as the "green light" for the victims' travelling companions to finally speak out about what happened on the night of the murders and I think the press are going to have a field day with it.

None of this of course will affect the outcome of the trial and I think what you stated in the first part of your post is what will happen sadly.

There weren't serious doubts in the case you cite, and it didn't involve a criminal proceeding in a foreign country.

There was an evidence gap. The coroner could not rule out suicide.

So, if the 2B have already been sentenced to death on probably contaminated DNA evidence alone, will the coroner say nothing for fear of Thailand's contempt of court laws, even if he or she believes there were serious gaps in the evidence?

Or was your point that a suicide pact a distinct possibility and that the coroner might raise this as a neat alternative to the not really believable theory of the 2B as assasins?

RickBradford, on 30 Nov 2014 - 14:55, said:

Face it, the B2 are cooked.

The truth of the matter is irrelevant.

In a cargo cult society like Thailand, the appearance is everything, the substance nothing. There will be an indictment, a trial, and a conviction. Anything else is unthinkable.

Still. I will be interested what the UK inquest comes up with in January, though the language used will certainly be nuanced, anything to avoid a diplomatic spat.

I will be very surprised if it gets any stronger than: "We feel that the investigation lacked something in rigor and transparency, but we have no reason to doubt the conclusion".

Still. I will be interested what the UK inquest comes up with in January, though the language used will certainly be nuanced, anything to avoid a diplomatic spat.

I will be very surprised if it gets any stronger than: "We feel that the investigation lacked something in rigor and transparency, but we have no reason to doubt the conclusion".

I disagree. I don't think the U.K. coroner will hold anything back. There have already been serious doubts expressed over the deaths of the British man who allegedly hanged himself in police custody in Bangkok last year, as well as the man who died in suspicious circumstances in Koh Tao on New Year's Day this year, not to mention the Kirsty Jones case. I see the inquest as the "green light" for the victims' travelling companions to finally speak out about what happened on the night of the murders and I think the press are going to have a field day with it.

None of this of course will affect the outcome of the trial and I think what you stated in the first part of your post is what will happen sadly.

Yes, the 2B will be convicted based solely on the DNA tests done by the police themselves without independent corroboration. They don't seem to have other evidence linking them to the rape and the evidence linking them to the murders seems only circumstantial too. They will probably have been already sentenced to death by the time any evidence from the UK is made public. The best the coroner can do is to point out serious discrepancies in police evidence, lack of independent forensic analysis, doubt that David's wounds were caused by the hoe. However, bear in mind that, unlike the case of the British man hanged in the police station and Nick Pearson's apparent murder in Samui, the cause of death here is not going to be disputed, since everyone can agree they were murdered. It is not up the coroner to say who murdered the victims. The UK will definitely couch it in such terms so as not to jeopardise trade, investment and tourism ties with Thailand.

Embasssies under Cameron have been slashed to mere trade posts with little or no interest in or resources to look after British citizens abroad. When Nick Pearson died the Foreign Office was too lazy even to write to his mother to explain the circumstances surrounding his death or what she had to do or what options she might have. They just called her up and in her state of shock and extreme grief, she couldn't remember what was said. It has become a total disgrace and a rip off of taxpayers' money. They may as well just save the entire budget and sell off the rest of the land on Wireless Road. British interests could be taken care of by the Nigerian Embassy for a small fee.

Pongpat looks like he might have been roughed up. I guess he knew what to expect.

Must be an interesting new cell mate for the inmates in the remand prison. A chance for a reunion with former customers perhaps.

I may be wrong, but I think the public would like to see criminals in jail. How can anyone blame them for being cynical, they have seen criminals of every stripe released on bail, some for decades. The Red Bull heir is classic case, in just about any other country a cop killer would be in jail, or executed. Here the cops fellow workers refused to release evidence to prosecutors, law enforcement, my -ss.

I think you are right. They are sick of seeing politicians and other wealthy and well connected people committing crimes with impunity. Those who talk about letting politicians off the hook for the sake of reconciliation are merely serving vested interests as usual. There is much more money to be made by letting the wealthy avoid prison that sticking them in it.

"Fifty per cent said the assets confiscated from Pongpat and his group, such as priceless artifacts, must be returned to the state."

OK, and where do the other 50% think the confiscated assets should go to ...?

They have already gone to the same place as the assets in the safes that mysteriously turned out to be empty.

Which means it is fair to assume that each and every officer that has ever been promoted by the former CIB chief is corrupt, as it is unlikely they would otherwise have 5 million baht to pay for a promotion. As I assume promotions are recorded somewhere, those investigating this should now have a list of suspects to investigate.

"...those investigating this should now have a list of suspects to investigate." And be on a list of suspects themselves.

What police have not paid for their promotions from the lowly constable who has to pay to get on a lucrative road block to the police chief?

Seems like they are doing the right things for the wrongs reasons here. That means the investigation will ring fence a certain group of corrupt cops and ignore the rest and there will be no police reform. When the dust has settled a new criminal gang will have taken over the vacated businesses. Hey ho.

Better put all them up against the wall and shoot them for treason. No need to worry about being short staffed. It would be easy to recruit many highly qualified expatriates. That worked well for King Chulalongkorn who hired a British expat police chief, a Danish admiral of the fleet etc., as well as many expat bureaucrats, particularly in his audit department for auditing corrupt ministries and government departments. The old guard, of course, hated the expats because they reduced their income from corruption. Time for a radical rethink and get back to tried and tested methods that worked well in the past.

Thai PBS TV said that the Samui prosecutor is now satisfied with the evidence he has received from the police and expects that the trail of the 2B will start by the end of next week.

It's time for her to accept her punishment like a woman. She debt she created will takes Thais a generation to pay off. We are only talking about banning her from politics here. She should prepare herself for her criminal case and the civil case to follow.

The numbers reported here are nonsense. Next year aiming for less tourists than in 2013 but for 50% revenue? I was there and what she actually said and put up in her slide was 25.5m for 2014 and 29m for 2015 which makes sense - a slight drop of 4% for this year and a pick up of 14% in 2015. But her expenditures numbers didn't make sense - B1.8 trillion in 2014 and B2.2 trillion in 2015. The TAT's website says B1.2 trillion for 2014, i.e. no change from 2013, which makes sense but I have no idea what expenditures are really being forecast for 2015.

The speech highlighted ideas like making Pattaya a family and sporting destination, promoting the attraction of Thainess and the Thai people and promoting secondary destinations like Nan for the over 50s who still have high salaries but don't need any night life. In the panel discussion and Q&A afterwards there was discussion about how to promote Thainess as an attraction when there are hardly any Thais working in the tourism industry in the South any more, where most foreign tourists go. It was also pointed out that promoting secondary destinations like Nan might be counter productive as there is inadequate tourism infrastructure and tourists might be disappointed with poor quality hotels and staff. Better to promote destinations with the capacity to handle more tourists. Some hoteliers complained that the deckchair and vendor mafias were already coming back to the beaches as many had connections with police and other local officials. Just about everyone complained that martial law was impacting their business and hoped it would be lifte as soon as possible.

Ban her from travel and from politics by putting her in jail.

It's getting just a little bit harder to argue that police would never dare to take bribes to cover up a murder just because the victims are foreigners.

Everything is for sale at a price and the revenue is humungous. Thais who study at expensive schools overseas often find that that some of their classmates are offspring of Thai police generals.

This case is just the tip of the iceberg in a highly selective purge.

I've got a 2 year WP and I'm a teacher, so not sure about all the BOI requirements members are talking about.

There is some confusion with the requirement to work for a BOI company to get a NON-B visa for 3 years max which is in the National Police orders for all to see and the Labour Ministry's secret guidelines on issuing 2 year WPs.

Glad to hear you got a 2 year WP as a teacher. Last time I got one in Bkk they were only giving them to employees of substantial companies but things might have changed and might be different in different provinces since there are no conditions in the law.

Since most employers and expat workers don't know about the 2 year WP and have never asked for one, I guess the govt can get away with taking credit for this 2008 law! LOL.

This should be an easy win for the government, since the maximum period for WP was already increased to 2 years in the 2008 Working of Aliens Act without any specific conditions. The problem has been the reluctance of the Labour Ministry to follow the law and issue 2 year permits. Normally they will only do this if the employer has hundreds of millions in paid up capital or is public company. The catch 22 is that these companies also qualify for the one stop visa and WP service which has not been allowed to issue 2 year WPs as far as I know. Anyway a 2 year WP is less useful if you can't also get a 2 year nonB visa at the one stop service.

I have been on 2 year WPs since 2009 and it's useful for me but only coz I have PR and am thus ineligible for the one stop service, even tho my company is.

Seems they just need to tell the Labour Ministry to apply the existing law without wrinkles but I am sure they will want to maintain conditions that will still make 2 year WPs unattainable for most. Hoping to be proved wrong.

There are regular reports of Thai bank staff syphoning off cash from clients' accounts and helping themselves to valuables from safe deposit boxes. A foreign retiree without connections might be thought of as a soft target. Better leave your money safely in the Thai stock market where it can go forth and multiply.

I suggest you watch the Tourist Authority of Thailand 'I Hate Thailand' video for the answer to this question. The video shows how a penniless farang can find love with a died blond Thai beauty.

Has Pridyathorn provided more details of the assumptions behind his prediction?

Heavens be praised. The bells are ringing with endorsement for the junta.

Akkharawut was cooperative and gave useful information to police, he said.

Perhaps he was too cooperative and fingered more police generals than he was asked to before taking the balcony fall.

I wonder how they selected just these corrupt cops for a purge and left all the others standing. Were they negligent in passing a tythe up the pipe or was it political or both?

I suppose they are familiar with police interrogation techniques and know that the most painless approach is to sign the confession without fuss and retract it later, claiming it was extracted under torture.

Guess he was about to go public with some information about the inner workings of the CSB and took a balcony fall.

Chain gangs, a great alternative to slave labour. If they don't perform, the entire chain gang can be dumped over board with a cement block on one end and replaced at the local jail house on payment of a standard fee.

Time to find a less stressful occupation.