Piichai

It's important the NACC prosecutes the remaining parliamentarians on the charges for the amnesty bill and the senate election regulations bill asap.

Then the whole caretaker government will be gone allowing Thailand to progress.

If they do so now, the ban will be only five years.

With reforms imposing a permanent ban on politicians convicted of abusing the public's trust, it would be much better to do it later!

The reluctance of the army to participate in a coup spurred on by politicians could mean that the army is terribly divided over this issue and that the involvement of one segment of the armed forces may result in civil war. The armed forces continues to insist on a negotiated settlement between all parties - compromise.

I think the odds are low that the military is terribly divided.

A military coup has always been the easy way out.

Maybe they realize the system is broken and want the politicians to work things out.

Abhisit discussed his reform framework with the military. Maybe the military believes it has some merit.

Might have been a choice of words (or bad reporting), but Abhisit's offer did seem to give the PDRC a rather prominent place in the reform making process, at the same time remaining unclear as to the identity of interim government and method of formation. To date, there is not even a real blue print of what the much talked about reforms include. And the PDRC been at it for months now....

Regardless of Abhisit not being a neutral mediator, or non-partisan, his offer was actually rejected by Suthep first...

The TVF Red Heads dismissed Abhisit's reform framework out of hand. But if one takes the time to study and think about it, and actually listen to what Abhisit says about it, one might find it's a little more nuanced than they were led to believe.

Without regard to what the Reds would have you believe, Abhisit isn't stupid; there's a very good reason why PTP run from any Abhisit debate. Yingluck may look cute in her braces and boots, but there is no way she can debate a juggernaut like Abhisit and not end up looking like a monkey.

Abhisit understands that the framework does not need to be one that everybody will like; he knows that the framework only needs to be one that those who want to make positive improvements to the country can work with.

And Abhisit said clearly and distinctly that no one will get all that they want.

So what do we have?

Abhisit knows that PTP are afraid of Suthep, so Suthep is included in the framework. Now Abhisit has something with which to bargain.

Abhisit knows that Suthep wants what Suthep wants, so he includes a referendum through which the reforms must pass. Anything other than rubber-stamping Suthep's reforms drives him to the center, and Suthep most likely won't like that.

Suthep bails? No problem, it just puts more pressure on those in PTP that still have functioning brain cells.

And don't forget about the smaller parties; there are many reasons why they are considering participating in the framework.

For sure Thaksin doesn't want to have anything to do with the framework because it would certainly be the end of his game. But if PTP has anything going for it at all, there's a good chance of some cool heads that are interested in a better tomorrow.

I don't think Abhisit isn't smart or does not understand the political situation. I'm sure he does.

I do doubt his sincerity (comes with being a politician) and his commitment to play on level playing ground.

His plan got something for everyone, that's right. It also requires everyone to make some serious concessions, which so far far, are not in the cards. It is even hard to say if the offer is still of any relevance after the recent legal proceedings and near future events.

You say that Suthep bailing out puts more pressure on reasonable elements within the PTP - who might those be?

Not baiting, just really doesn't seem like anyone there is willing to deal or is in a position to make binding decisions.

You're right, but a lot depends on how things roll out next week. I believe depending on the Senate's actions (or lack thereof) Abhisit's reform framework could gain more traction. Abhisit said he would not entertain changes to his framework, but he's a politician and suspect he's willing to negotiate.

The old guard at PTP can only do it Thaksin's way. Members willing to negotiate might be the less seasoned members that have been at the trough for a shorter time. And you're right again that they may not be in a position to make commitments, which makes me think that there is a chance of fracturing the party. But as a party and not just Thaksin's toadies, I do think it's their best choice for the future; after all, if they don't join the discussions, they won't be heard.

Abhisit has already said he wouldn't run in the election after reforms.

What's stopping PTP from entering discussions; Suthep already bailed on the framework.

If PTP doesn't join the discussion, there's a good chance the country will carry on without them. That could indeed cause a fracture within the party between those loyal to Thaksin, and those thinking about tomorrow.

You can ignore it all you want, but PTP is in a very bad place. Not only is their power-base crumbling, there is party dissolution and 5-year bans for 300 or so of their best and brightest looming large in the very near future.

The absolutely best choice and best chance for PTP right now is to work with Abhisit's framework.

Right Piichai! Yingluck and Abhisit debate and then she's gonna look stupid. OK fine, Abhisit runs in the election and in return he will get to debate Yingluck live on TV, then everyone will see how stupid she is and vote for him right?

WRONG! In fact abhisit will not agree to that solution because then he would have to support an election instead of trying to push through a dictatorship labled "reform"

If the red shirts make up the majority of Thailand, compared to Bangkok's few, it will be a very short civil war.

But they don't. Red Shirts are roughly 7% of the population.

That's what civilised people do.....clean up after their mess.

Any chance of the reds taking any notice?

They received quite a bit of bad publicity last time, so it'll be interesting to see if they learned their lesson.

If not, it wouldn't be a bad idea for the Works department to send them a bill!

All the options mentioned involve unilateral actions.

Maybe if the sides would try using their words (rather than slinging them at each other), things could be solved without (too much) bloodshed. Both seem unwilling, though, and still hold on to the delusion that they can "win".

Hardly. Abhisit has put forth his reform framework and invited PTP to discuss. Additionally, Abhisit has said clearly and distinctly no one will get all that they want.

But if they are part of the solution, they might get what they need.

Might have been a choice of words (or bad reporting), but Abhisit's offer did seem to give the PDRC a rather prominent place in the reform making process, at the same time remaining unclear as to the identity of interim government and method of formation. To date, there is not even a real blue print of what the much talked about reforms include. And the PDRC been at it for months now....

Regardless of Abhisit not being a neutral mediator, or non-partisan, his offer was actually rejected by Suthep first...

The TVF Red Heads dismissed Abhisit's reform framework out of hand. But if one takes the time to study and think about it, and actually listen to what Abhisit says about it, one might find it's a little more nuanced than they were led to believe.

Without regard to what the Reds would have you believe, Abhisit isn't stupid; there's a very good reason why PTP run from any Abhisit debate. Yingluck may look cute in her braces and boots, but there is no way she can debate a juggernaut like Abhisit and not end up looking like a monkey.

Abhisit understands that the framework does not need to be one that everybody will like; he knows that the framework only needs to be one that those who want to make positive improvements to the country can work with.

And Abhisit said clearly and distinctly that no one will get all that they want.

So what do we have?

Abhisit knows that PTP are afraid of Suthep, so Suthep is included in the framework. Now Abhisit has something with which to bargain.

Abhisit knows that Suthep wants what Suthep wants, so he includes a referendum through which the reforms must pass. Anything other than rubber-stamping Suthep's reforms drives him to the center, and Suthep most likely won't like that.

Suthep bails? No problem, it just puts more pressure on those in PTP that still have functioning brain cells.

And don't forget about the smaller parties; there are many reasons why they are considering participating in the framework.

For sure Thaksin doesn't want to have anything to do with the framework because it would certainly be the end of his game. But if PTP has anything going for it at all, there's a good chance of some cool heads that are interested in a better tomorrow.

The military command relies on Special Operations forces to execute its coups - the military high command knows the mass of the conscripted regular army originates from a general population whose roots are opposite those of the Bangkok ammart and elites. Neither do most military commanders originate in the ammart or elites. Career military officers join the elites on their way up the ranks. Some however retain their original identity.

They rely on small groups of Special Operations forces because that is all that's needed to get the job done; how many people are needed to surround a building or three?

It should be noted that the watermelon soldiers had no problems chasing the Red Shirts out of Bangkok back in 2010.

Hold an election, no matter who wins = violence & blood in the streets.

Don't hold and election = violence & blood in the streets.

Appoint a "neutral" PM & cabinet = violence & blood in the streets.

Have a coup by the military = violence & blood in the street.

All roads lead to the same point.

All the options mentioned involve unilateral actions.

Maybe if the sides would try using their words (rather than slinging them at each other), things could be solved without (too much) bloodshed. Both seem unwilling, though, and still hold on to the delusion that they can "win".

Hardly. Abhisit has put forth his reform framework and invited PTP to discuss. Additionally, Abhisit has said clearly and distinctly that no one will get all that they want.

But if they are part of the solution, they might get what they need.

I find it a bit ironic that both sides talk about it, one side will bitch about it if it happens yet keep painting the army into a corner, blaming them for having to constantly defend themselves publically, instead of working together behind the scenes to do everything in their power to divert it.

I suspect ordinary folk on both sides are tired of it and wish for a system with proper checks and balances but until the day comes when they can look further to the future beyond tomorrow, the status quo will remain...sadly.

Well, to be fair, Abhisit put forth a workable framework for reforms. It might not be perfect, but it's time for PTP to go to the table. Either that, or they'll be left behind.

The only time I had any contact with one of these guys ( I tried to ask if I should turn back), he screamed 'stike' stike' (strike I suppose) and his eyes were rolling around his head, he didn't even look at me. Looked like a case of yaba to me. Keep away.

Drove through Asoke daily and never had a problem.

Seems easy enough, Suthep has only to escalate violence via his thugish guards against the red protest group, and presto, the coup he has always been dreaming about, how convinient

Another fantasy post. Not once in 6 months has the PDRC attacked the Reds. What makes you think they will begin now? If anything the REDS will attack the PDRC.

Suthep has done a pretty good job minimizing violence from his supporters. Even though his rallies and supporters have been attacked almost daily. Closr your eyes and go back to sleep so you can dream up more BS to post

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Forgetting the PDRC supporters and students attacking the Red Shirt bus last December aren't we?

Widely covered by Bangkok Post and The Nation.

Boredom set in after being couped up in the stadium, and a few Red Shirts decided to wander around the campus. Sadly, on their walkabout, they defaced a statue and a couple posters.

A half-dozen or so students went to complain to the rally's organizers, and one of the students ended up shot and killed.

The students spread the word, and ended up chasing the Reds out of Bangkok.

I hope there will be no civil war. Sadly it sounds like the red-shirts want one, based on the rhetoric of the red-shirts.

you see THIS is the problem - it's the 'red shirts' not the fake monk... Suthep and his thugs... it's those pesky 'red shirts'

you KNOW???... the ones who keep WINNING elections... terribly inconvenient to the yellow, elite ammart who want to keep raking in the cash

They win the election, but they don't rule justly.

Therein lies the problem.

As opposed to a People's Council, who will be able to totally ignore justice altogether because they won't be answerable to ANYONE .

I think that's an even bigger problem

Only Suthep cares about the People's Council. Abhist's framework will gain traction.

I am the only person in the world watching the live feed - in the world !! (see view stats under the video on You Tube !)

Not surprising.

You don't need a civil war, Just let the Red Shirts march to parliament and Government House and demand that the area be given back to the government than see what happens from there. It time both sides met and either discuss a solution to their problem or solve it by other means.

The Reds already tried that with the students, and it didn't work out so well for the Reds.

You're half right. I saw the interview, and read the transcripts from it. He didn't say "he" bought votes, he said the Democratic party spent more on vote buying than the PTP, and they still lost, so, in his opinion "vote buying" had/has no bearing on the final vote count.

No, it's still a lie, he said they spent more in the electoral campaign, not in vote buying.

How is it a "lie" when the interviewer was specifically asking him about vote buying, not about overall spending?

You mean you are surprised when a politician doesn't answer a specific question directly? This is standard play - and every politician does it - change the question to safer ground and answer that instead. Only a fool would have answered such a loaded question - and he simply would not let himself walk into it.

Mis-quoting him later by adding in words that were not in his statement - or even intimated in his statements - is a lie. That is what you were caught out on - you stated above " I saw the interview, and read the transcripts from it. He didn't say "he" bought votes, he said the Democratic party spent more on vote buying than the PTP" - which was untrue. Simples

You know what's crazy about this is that although political parties may disclose what they spend on advertising and campaigning, it is quite simply ludicrous to think that Korn would actually know how much the Reds spend on vote buying.

Even Thaksin doesn't as he has no idea how much is skimmed off the top.

Oh and it has airforce provided toilet buses. As I said, I cannot explain the significance, either you understand or your don't.

If you're implying that the Air Force is pro-Thaksin, you're sadly mistaken. The Air Force is *still* butthurt about Thaksin's budget cuts, which forced much of their F16s to remain grounded. Some point to this as the single reason the military (who is responsible for the area around Swampy) allowed the Yellow Shirts to march to the airport.

yes those terrible 'media' who will not broadcast the megalomaniacs daily speeches. How dare they!!! those speeches are pure GOLD (well yellow at least!!!)

CAPO made a big mistake pressuring the stations to not cover arguably the biggest Thailand story in the last six months. Who wouldn't expect a backlash?

Looks like a big turnout!

Richard Barrow photo taken at 11AM.

Don t worry the reds channel can take such an angle that it looks like a massive crowd. . .

Notice the placement of large umbrellas throughout the site so overhead observation cannot be used to determine crowd size.