ATF

Having rear view is the best. Been thinking for a long time about buying one of those reversing cameras and putting a small screen on my handlebars so I could ditch my mirrors and get a proper rear view. Don't like the name or the design of the helmet though. Think they should concentrate on a retro-fit system so you can use it with whatever helmet you like, maybe by just changing the visor? Would be great though to see all my Power Commander readouts come up HUD fighter pilot style. It's not as distracting as you may think because if you fully focus ahead you don't see them.

Explaining the physical mechanism of how a bike changes direction at speed can alarm new riders. Especially when you tell them the bike needs to be counter steered to change direction once you are at a reasonable speed where centrifugal forces are coming into play. Albeit this will become intuitive with experience and developing your road craft.

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Agreed, but telling people they don't need a helmet and to practice steering with no hands? Please!

Andre,

Everyone including myself has done their best to converse with you as a gentleman but you really have lost the plot. First you argued with RSD about the benefits of NOT wearing a helmet and now you are professing the benefits of riding a bike with no hands and telling everyone they don't need to learn. Everything is instinctive and if you can't do it automatically you're an idiot. Well I have an IQ over 160 and have to think everytime I enter a corner. If you are such a great rider how come your name isn't in lights? I started this post to try to help inexperienced riders understand the physics of motorbikes but you don't believe in physics. My post is not perfect as other riders have pointed out but it has created awareness. Just p$$s off and stay away from my posts in the future and ride with no hands and no helmet to your heart's content.

Paddy,

I love exposing the truth. This post was originally posted in Thai Visa Legal Forum. You didn't even get one response because the lawyer, who is Thai obviously thought this question came from someone who is a F%&*)^%#G RETARD!!! Every Thai person knows bikes drive the sidewalk and they are allowed to do so because there are no bike lanes and traffic is horrendous.

If you're worried about all the little "babbys" getting killed just think how many were killed by the IRA. You wouldn't walk down the Falls Road would you? Again you terrorist B#$$%%$D you were only really concerned with compensation anyway. Were you going to push your wife under a sidewalk rider?

I am not saying I have never got into fights with Thai people. By all rights I should have gone to jail in my younger years in Thailand. I've beat the crap out of cops and virtually everyone else. However I thank Thailand everyday for making me a better person and forgiving me for my wrongdoings. Just please try to understand that Thailand actually means Freeland and you have much more choices here than in the West. Motorbikes on sidewalks are a minor inconvenience in the great scheme of things. So enjoy what this great Country has to offer and salute Thailand.

At 20kph my bike will stop in about a foot or less.

Without you going over the handlebars????

Absolutely. Modern technology ABS. Dual front brake discs etc. However a M/C taxi with crappy brakes and a passenger on board will take much further to stop.

At 20kph my bike will stop in about a foot or less.

And by the way ATF, the annual fatalities is about 80% motorcyclists whether it is on the roads or sidewalks.

No.1 Cause of deaths for Thai males aged under 40 is Motorcycles or Alcohol or a combination of both. It's also one of the major causes of prostitution due to the lack of an income provider.

Now there is one thing we are going to agree on, you never get involved in any fights or arguments with a Thai, as it is almost certain you will need to take on six of them, and as you say, you would only lose.

Please remember, although you say you would never endanger anyone, there are people dead because of other people who said they would never endanger anyone.

All those half wits that ride on the wrong side of the road and force you into the path of oncoming traffic, are also people who think they would not endanger anyone.

This country has about the 3rd highest fatalities involving traffic in the world, and people who ride along sidewalks contribute to that.

OK driving on the wrong side of the road is 100% wrong shoot those monkeys for me.

Thailand is actually No.2 in the Worldwide road fatality stakes. I honestly don't know if this includes sidewalks. But Roadkill definitely No.2.

I promise and assure you I am a very safe, considerate and polite sidewalk driver. I even stop for pedestrians!

I don't fight with Thais just give them some money and bugger off! Cheaper in the long run. God Bless.

One last thing, and then we can just agree to disagree about riding on the sidewalk, I am going to ask you a question. About what is the top speed you ride at along the sidewalk? Please tell the truth.

Very slow, I assure you. I have a big bike and only use the sidewalk to circumvent traffic jams. I never look at the speedo just listen to the revs but I doubt if it's in excess of 20-25 kph. My bike stops on a dime and I would certainly stop to let pedestrians pass first. Steam always gives way to sail!

Now there is one thing we are going to agree on, you never get involved in any fights or arguments with a Thai, as it is almost certain you will need to take on six of them, and as you say, you would only lose.

Please remember, although you say you would never endanger anyone, there are people dead because of other people who said they would never endanger anyone.

All those half wits that ride on the wrong side of the road and force you into the path of oncoming traffic, are also people who think they would not endanger anyone.

This country has about the 3rd highest fatalities involving traffic in the world, and people who ride along sidewalks contribute to that.

OK driving on the wrong side of the road is 100% wrong shoot those monkeys for me.

Thailand is actually No.2 in the Worldwide road fatality stakes. I honestly don't know if this includes sidewalks. But Roadkill definitely No.2.

I promise and assure you I am a very safe, considerate and polite sidewalk driver. I even stop for pedestrians!

I don't fight with Thais just give them some money and bugger off! Cheaper in the long run. God Bless.

I would not walk anywhere in a union jack t-shirt, and I have no love of Ian Paisley. Yes, different countries have different cultures, but no matter what country you are in, you are entitled to walk the sidewalks in safety from those idiots who speed along on motorbikes with no regard for anyone but themselves.

I don't know if your a family man, but what if your child walked out a doorway or alleyway into the path of one of those halfwits speeding along the sidewalk and was seriously injured or killed. I bet you would change your tune then.

If you think it's OK to risk innocent peoples lives, then you are entitled to your opinion. We will just have to agree to differ, and thanks for the compliment of calling me Paddy.

Sidewalks and Zebra crossings are danger zones. Buddhists believe in re-incarnation and this is mainly responsible for their Laissez-faire attitude to life or death. Because most Thais would prefer to be re-incarnated as something better. As I said I ride the sidewalks when traffic dictates but I would never endanger anyone.

Please don't get into fights with Thais. You will only lose. Saw a falung get a broken leg over a 20 Baht Tuk-Tuk fare. We only have one life so spend it wisely.

> I believe it is not against Thai law to ride a motorcycle on the sidewalk.

The OP obviously has been long time in thailand

Eight years in Thailand, and the first time I was walking down the sidewalk with my girlfriend, her sister, and her sisters 7 year old daughter. A motorbike came down the sidewalk and I stopped him and tried to pull him off, and my girlfriend kept shouting at me "no, no, you go to jail" or words to that effect.

Most falungs and Thais ride their bikes on the sidewalk. It's an alternative to to sweating off your testicles in a traffic jam. You're lucky you listened to your girlfriend otherwise an m/c taxi gang would have kicked your a**. This is not Ireland it's Thailand and the sidewalks belong to bikes. Next thing you'll be complaining about the potholes!

You come down a sidewalk on a motorbike near me, and there are no witnesses, I will personally pull you off it. I am not just being a keyboard warrior here, I really mean it.

Sorry to break this to you Paddy but different countries have different cultures. I wouldn't walk around in Ireland with a Union Jack T-Shirt or profess my love of Iain Paisley. Sounds to me like you've been living on the farm too long eating bugs and your trip to the Bright Lights was spoiled by this M/C incident. You are really putting yourself in mortal danger if you try any such shenanigans. Know that bikes use the sidewalk and keep out of their way or buy a car. I would like to nuke every M/C sidecar shop because they stop and turn without warning, but how can I do it?

> I believe it is not against Thai law to ride a motorcycle on the sidewalk.

The OP obviously has been long time in thailand

Eight years in Thailand, and the first time I was walking down the sidewalk with my girlfriend, her sister, and her sisters 7 year old daughter. A motorbike came down the sidewalk and I stopped him and tried to pull him off, and my girlfriend kept shouting at me "no, no, you go to jail" or words to that effect.

Most falungs and Thais ride their bikes on the sidewalk. It's an alternative to to sweating off your testicles in a traffic jam. You're lucky you listened to your girlfriend otherwise an m/c taxi gang would have kicked your a**. This is not Ireland it's Thailand and the sidewalks belong to bikes. Next thing you'll be complaining about the potholes!

i like japanese animations and such a bike is a good idea.

instead of buying a scoot, i buy this.

Look how far back the handlebars are from the front wheel. Almost like a chopper. This makes is difficult to steer. If you want a 750cc bike there's a lot of better alternatives out there. Of course if you would buy it just for the looks its up to you. No idea on the price but it'll probably be around 400K Baht. But unless you're very old you'll have a lot more fun with a Triumph/Ducati/KTM or one of the many Jap bikes for this price.

This is from the Thai customs website, which notes that motor vehicles (among other items) are excluded- http://www.customs.go.th/wps/wcm/connect/custen/individuals/importing+used+or+secondhand+household+effects/importingusedsecondhandhouseholdeffects+

There's a recent thread going on GTR at the moment regarding this subject- I can't link it due to forum rules, but you can easily find it.

Roll halfway down the page:

http://www.customs.go.th/wps/wcm/connect/custen/individuals/importing+personal+vehicle/importingpersonalvehicle+

Here's a detailed explanation of the process:

http://www.examiner.com/article/counter-steering-revisited-redux-how-it-works

^

I believe motor vehicles aren't included in that particular tax exemption.

Cars and motorbikes are included as far as I know you can only really do it once and cannot sell for three years. Everything else is sketchy. I have to go to Laem Chabang tomorrow I'll see what I can find out.

There's been a lot of discussion about bike import taxes. Wonder if someone can put me straight. As I understand new bikes over 800cc get taxed 123%, secondhand or bikes in parts can't be imported anymore. However I believe one hope still exists. If you import a bike that you owned overseas there is minimum duty imposed but you can't sell the bike for 3 years, not an inconvenience. Can I get some further details here, like how long would you have had to own the bike overseas? Would you have to show proof of ownership? All help appreciated

Ugly piece of junk. Honda says it's aimed at young first time riders. Well putting a 750cc engine in it isn't very responsible. However it's over 250kgs wet. That's getting into Harley weights, so the performance will be #!*^. It'll corner like a brick too. Manual gearshifting is available with a button on the handlebars otherwise it's scootermatic. Only people I see buying this in Thailand are the geriatric Pattaya crowd.

"Again it's very important to keep your body parallel with the bike when you shift your weight. Don't only shift your bottom, your arms and upper body must come over too. Again whole body PARALLEL with the bike."

I am not comfortable with that description. The upper body isn't parallel to the bike. Your leaning the bike and staying upright by swivelling at the hips. Your lower body stays with the lean of the bike. Staying parallel with the bike is what one does when leaning the bike into a curve without counter steering.

Agree with you on this..

Back in late 60's early 70's when i was 'playing around racing' on a BSA Gold Star this was indeed the technique It was normal then to keep your body parallel to the bike at all times, including hard cornering,and you were taught to ride tidy ..ie you never even stuck a knee out on a high speed corner,let alone hang off it... you kept it so body and bike always looked to be one and the same.

Obviously counter steering happened as it is normal, but i remember being told to only 'use body english' to control the bike...pressure on the sides of the gas tank from the knees being the main one AFAIR..worked for sure at the time, but things were a lot less sophisticated then than now

.

Dunlop Triangular Tyres were the tyre of choice then and because of their triangular profile you literally fell into a corner with very little input of your own.You were either up right vertical or over to the flat of the tyre..not much in between...a weird feeling..$(KGrHqV,!rcFDu1!rkbBBRMM8wJJ3g~~60_35.JPG

The front tyre on the right shows the profile which remained much the same when inflated..

Well that's something I never knew. Triangular tires. They must have caused a lot of accidents? Thanks for giving me some background on yourself now I understand you a lot better. I was always a car guy. I had a Hillman Hunter GLS when I was 18 and used to rally it. It had overdrive on 3rd and 4th gears (only four gears then!) and twin carbs. Since then I've had lots of fast cars including top end Italians. I've ridden bikes for over 20 years but only got the fast bike bug about 5 years ago, and I'm glad I saved my biking days for later life, otherwise I don't think I would have been around to enjoy them. When I get into something I do it 100% and try to find out everything about it - obsession!

I want a KTM RC8R NOW!!!!

You write a lot...maybe some proper videos to help your(or THE) 'proper' technique ....as mentioned before,there are many,so which one will show/explain this the best... ?

As I said there are dozens if not hundreds of videos on You Tube and the internet about this and as some members have quite rightly pointed out my countersteering instructions have got mixed up with cornering techniques. However it is difficult to separate them. Countersteering is a completely illogical process and watching vid after vid will probably leave you confused. The way I was taught is to PUSH LEFT to steer left instead of saying turn right or pull right to turn LEFT. That really messes with your brain, like trying to pat your head and rub your stomach at the same time. It doesn't matter if you ride a scooter or a Harley, follow my initial instructions on a straight road to get a feel for it, because your brain will tell you not to do it so you have to convince your brain that it does work. No amount of vids will convince your brain. Bike tires are round, car tires are flat so what you are basically doing is rolling around on the tire. If you had flat car type tires on your bike countersteering wouldn't work. Unless you were drifting I suppose.

IMO you are making a very simple automatic riding technique into an overly complicated proceedure that most new riders will find very daunting if they follow your posts..very confusing OP and now this one making it sound like a nightmare to any newbie relying on posted advice.

Dear Andre,

All I can say in my defense is if I have brought the awareness of one person to the benefits of countersteering I have achieved my goal. Not only will I have enriched their life but hopefully started them on the road to learning new and proper riding techniques. Most foreigners in Thailand only ever learn to ride a bike here. Myself included. Countersteering never came to me naturally I had to be taught together with other techniques. You have the benefit of being an experienced rider and obviously this post is not for you. But if you can explain it better than myself please go ahead. I would appreciate anything I could learn about bikes or any other subject from you or anyone else. Maybe you could start with your top ten do's and don'ts when riding or maintaining a bike?

You write a lot...maybe some proper videos to help your(or THE) 'proper' technique ....as mentioned before,there are many,so which one will show/explain this the best... ?

As I said there are dozens if not hundreds of videos on You Tube and the internet about this and as some members have quite rightly pointed out my countersteering instructions have got mixed up with cornering techniques. However it is difficult to separate them. Countersteering is a completely illogical process and watching vid after vid will probably leave you confused. The way I was taught is to PUSH LEFT to steer left instead of saying turn right or pull right to turn LEFT. That really messes with your brain, like trying to pat your head and rub your stomach at the same time. It doesn't matter if you ride a scooter or a Harley, follow my initial instructions on a straight road to get a feel for it, because your brain will tell you not to do it so you have to convince your brain that it does work. No amount of vids will convince your brain. Bike tires are round, car tires are flat so what you are basically doing is rolling around on the tire. If you had flat car type tires on your bike countersteering wouldn't work. Unless you were drifting I suppose.

Good advice but I think most will probably need to start with "basic" riding lessons .

If you are learning to ride you should learn countersteering at the very start, otherwise you will need to un-learn yourself later. Obviously no-one would expect you to start dragging your knee for a while!

The rider in the pic is 'backing it in' and steering with the rear- that goes beyond simple counter-steering, and is often the result of a good rider showing off or a poor rider getting into the corner too hot (occasionally resulting in a high side)- it's usually not the fastest way around a track unless you're on a dirt bike or supermoto. You used to see it more in MotoGP (famously by Gary McCoy), but with improved tires and clutches it's not as prevalent today.

RSD,

I chose that pic because it's easy for everyone to see the front wheel moving in the opposite direction of the corner. Are you telling me you don't countersteer? Or what method do you find best to corner at high speed?