ColdSingha

utterly disgusted by prayuth's comments.

hanging my head in shame over this

Pien "Daeng" Komonsilp, another food-stall owner, said she had hired some 10 men to help remove the structure of her eatery from the beach.

"But I am keeping my beach beds and beach umbrellas nearby as I hope to reopen my stall soon," the 57-year-old woman said.

In other words, as soon as they leave, and turn their heads, I will be putting up my stall again. The age old Thailand issue has reared it's head again. Crackdowns are only meaningful if they are backed up with enforcement, and followed up repeatedly. Nobody needs these vendors. They clutter the beach, and are responsible for trash, congestion, and high prices. Get rid of them all. They will find other jobs. Of course, they may not be able to find jobs where they earn 50k, 100k, or 200k a month, like with their stalls. But, they will find work. With unemployment at under 1%, no worries about that.

just got back from the beach and its the same as it was before apart from a small walkway throuh the middle. other than that, beach chairs all the way to the shore, food back at old prices (250 baht fried rice etc), dirty "kitchens" and an aggressive undertone from the vendors

a real shame for hua hin and made me wonder if the army/ncpo can't control their "local" beach i don't hold out much hope for the rest of the country

nearly 3K per person to ride bike for 30km? - LOL

i think i'll pass but good luck to you anyway

.

So winter lasts 6 months? Where? Siberia?

~

it's pretty grim in northern europe from october to march

not surprising when a populace equates being fat with being rich

I agree with you.

I wanted to be an electrical engineer i went to school and got my degree. if you want to teach here and that is the requirement then just do it.

A dive instructor needs to be certified, a car mechanic needs his tools to do his job. I wouldn't want a pilot not to be qualified, governments, companies etc have their requirements if you want to do that job get the qualifications needed to do it. A thai friend of mine wanted to work in the industrial area in Rayong. He went to school and got degree to allow him to work in the industrial arena, not just do construction work.

The problem is that the vast majority of schools in Thailand still pay the same wages they did 10 years ago. Go to Ajarn.com and look at the teaching jobs posted there. Most of them come with a salary that is between 25K baht and 40K. Would you pay to go to university and spend a few years getting a degree only to make 30K per month?

I wouldn't. Teachers with a legit degree can make 3 times that in Japan, South Korea or even the Middle East.

"entertainment" and living expenses are far lower here though..

Ok, that is an important step in bring back tourism. Keep making it easy for tourist to stay. I know many that want to stay 6 onths.

Now the next step. Allow all bars in tourist areas to be open 24x7. Tourist do not have to go to work in the morning. That is why there is a bar closing rule in the world to begin with. When I was in Irland the closing time was around 11pm - serioulsy.

Let the night life keep rolling allowing tourist to spend money their maximum amount that will refeash the Thailand economy. All areas in the world that are tourist heavy allow bars to be open 24x7 and some even 365. Thirdly, protect the tourist and serve them.

Maybe they should think about giving retirement visas to people under 50, if they have money to show they can live , what is the problem if they are young or old ? If they have money to stay and spend, and have clean criminal record, let's welcome than. Nobody can milk any system in Thailand, because there is no system, you pay for everything, so it makes sense to let people choose to spend their moneys in Thailand.

does your home country allow that?

would it make a difference to thai visa law? should they mirror the immigration laws of every country on earth?

RIP anyway

my wife's advice to bring our family up on the main land rather than on koh samui is looking more and more prophetic by the day

insanity the last few days, 2 stabbings and home made bombs

Come on you are forgetting the thousands of people that don't have problems

Any part of the world this can happen even the mainland

So if this the mentality of people here

He moment something happens in the news they move

Going to be moving allot then

dont be a <deleted> we didnt move because we read a headline we moved because the general atmosphere has become more and more toxic over the last 10 years. the rate of both violent and petty crime, particularly burglary has soared and we became sick and tired of living in "birdcages" to feel safe and secure our valuables. the village we lived on had over 20 burglaries in one year alone <deleted>

moving to hua hin has been a breath of fresh air, although not perfect we feel far safer and rarely hear of crime in the expat community. i'm not dissing samui, it is what it is but it is a far cry from when we first moved there 10 years ago

I don't know much about US visas but guys like yourselves who are clever enough to work the loophole game in the US shouldn't really have a problem doing the same here in The Kingdom.

i agree but i'm not a nomad i'm an investor and legal, my tech days are a life ago, before thailand.

however, i'm in the community and i know for a fact asking a fresh faced 20 year old with a laptop and bundles of motivation to form a thai company, then sign it away, hire 4 staff and get them office space.. while still hungover from the last full moon party is laughable

much talent passes through these shores and then goes somewhere more favourable (business wise) begrudgingly when the party stops

Per post #392: The USA O-type visa for someone with exceptional ability requires that one have employment by a US company. It is not a visa for some non-US high-techie to come over as an individual and immediately go into start-up mode.

true, but you could set up a Delaware LLC and hire yourself with the right lawyer, which isn't hard.

There are also various other visas as well, H-1B and for Australians an E3, admittedly requiring employment, but you'd take a gig and set up your startup on the side if you'd prefer to do it on the ground.

or go for an E-2 after the first round of funds has been raised

bottom line, if you have skills you will get a visa or get sponsored for one and with none of this handing half your company away for nothing

there is no reward here for hard work, company control is gone before getting started (madness) so no-one bothers

i meet many who build their businesses (shape initial ideas) as nomads and then start them elsewhere where the rules are more favorable

Who the hell cares? Just don't tell anyone what you're doing. Nobody needs to know. Got it?

I have a business that I run too. There's no visa. There's no taxes. That's the beauty of making money online. Nobody knows..

I read all from the begin, very interesting discussion!

When somebody ask you "how do you get money for live?"

what's the best answer?

1- I have a business IN UK regarding investments and finance.

2- I have a lot of money! I don't work!

3- I'm 30 years old and I get a pension...

4- I won the lottery.

5- I live wthout money, I don't need them.

Please vote you're preferred or add yours...

6- own properties in "..."

7- rich family

What about the family guys who actually have a skillset and good reasons to stay, who would easily make 100k+ baht a month and wants to pay taxes? The only way would be to start a company, rent offices, hire 4 employees and an accountant etc. You are aware that costs more than 50k a month, right? And yes, that's before we get to the actual tax payments.

Are these criminals that should be thrown the hell out of the country, or would it be wise to have a system in place where they could stay and contribute legally (apart from the ridiculous idea of setting up an expensive company when they really shouldn't need one, that is)?

Don't you think that very old and outdated law is, in fact, making criminals out of ordinary people just trying to support their family?

if they are family guys, why do they need to hire 4 people ?, one supposes the are married to a Thai national, therefore its only 2 they need to employ, one can be the Mrs and the other a maid...and they only need a THB 1.0 mil capped Ltd company.

and I dont believe you on the THB 50k month costs either, and one can minimise any tax burden by paying only enough salary to get the extension based on a persons specific nationality...but you said you have a company inThailand so you knew all this already didnt you ?

Actually, you won't get a work permit with two employees even though you're married. And if your wife's the Director, she won't count as an employee. So no, I didn't know. Please enlighten me.

yes you can, I know guys who have this exact set up, the wife doesnt need to be a director or even a share holder in the company.

how can you say you will not get a WP, this is exactly what is quoted under Thai law in the civil and commerical code under Ltd company formations...

it's location specific - some areas require 4 staff, actual office, matching uniforms (!) even if wife is partner or director, others do not

does your home country allow everybody to come and stay permanently just because they have decided they want to live and work there?? mine sure doesnt.

mine sure as h*ll doesnt, in fact in this sort of situation, tourists are allowed 180 days a year in country and after that bugger off...come back next year

why oh why cant our leaders see how easy it would be to make our countries so much more powerful and wealthy if they would only recruit every hobo with a laptop that wants to get permanent resident status at no cost and work in other countries so he doesnt have to pay any tax?? how can they be so blind???

well they do in america and the uk - talent from all over the world heads to silicon valley or cambridge to found startups.

the same would start happening here if the government didn't expect 51% to be handed over and 4 layabouts employed before even a line of code has been written

I checked in to this about one year ago, and several conditions apply

You must be employed in your home country, and be payed by your employer in your home country, You need to get your salary in your home country and pay all taxes there.

You can not write a single line of code for a Thai company, You can not get payed by having money sent to your thai account,

But if you work for, as an example, a Swedish company, that makes home pages for other Swedish companies and you get your salary in Sweden by that Swedish company, and you pay Swedish taxes you are allow to sit here in Thailand and work on a Tourist Visa.

How (and who) established these conditions and did they put it in writing ??

Those conditions was explained to us from the Thai Consulate in Stockholm.

And here is a Swedish webpage concluded about the same thing: (Google translated)

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=sv&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=sv&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.paradisebusinesscamp.se%2Fvisum-till-thailand-vid-arbete-via-internet&edit-text=

thanks for posting this

(on a side note amazing how good google translate is now, i read that back in my head with a swedish accent )

So where do you pay taxes if you are a digital nomad?

If you stay XXX amount of days in Thailand they have right to tax you.

Should be no problem on a single visa since you wont hit the hard limit on days in the country.

(and I dont remember but its around 180 days at least for Swedes were the tax should be payed in Thailand instead of Sweden.

And when the Thai government understands that they can earn a ton of tax money on this: could be fun.)

183 days is the OECD model convention to which schengen / euro counties operate.. This is also superceeded depending on source of income, amount fo clients, all manner of variables. It can be day one when working for a local establishment.

Thailand does not operate that the same way. They expect day 1 when working within the kingdom.

depends if you receive income directly i suppose

IMPORTANT........... Inspect your wheels before driving away.

The clamp is yellow, but unless you see it before trying to drive away, you will be for a sudden shock and maybe some car damage. I don't think there is one standard wheel used, especially if some wheels are too near obstructions like curbs.

Five years ago I came to my truck to find a clamp installation in progress. I wai, beg in English and bow lots. I dropped a 500 on ground. Nice smiling officer picked it up, took away the clamp, pointed to a sign in Thai saying wrong side of street, and here is the best part....

OFFICER STOOD IN A PROPER SPOT, HELD IT OPEN FOR ME, AND THEN WAVED ME IN. He saluted me.

It was then that I knew I had moved to the correct place for me!

haha not surprised he saluted others are saying the fine is 200 baht

if you took all the money away from the rich and gave it to the poor within 10 years the rich would have it all back again and the poor would once again be poor..

cant fix being pennywise

You are drinking too much Singha. No one is talking about taking from the rich and giving it to the poor. There is a several hundred year history of the rich consciously and methodically keeping rural people dumb and so poor that all options to better themselves are simply nonexistent.

It is about leveling the football field because right now the poor are running up a 20% incline. It is about increasing NOT eliminating the money for rural development and small or even micro business funding and it is about fixing the biggest blight on Thailand:the educational system. It is about decentralization of the industrial policy so that factories with good paying jobs and the training to do them really well are built in rural areas. It is about making Paddi farming profitable and providing inexpensive crop insurance.

But that is not what the news is about, is it?

BANGKOK — Thailand's military junta is considering new inheritance and property taxes to address the country's wealthy disparity, sources say.

Ministry of Finance officials said the NCPO also agreed with raising taxes on properties owned by land magnates in Thailand and cutting taxes for the poor.

certainly looks like it

You may think its the best, because its what you want to hear.. However the superintendant of Phuket immigration was 100% clear.. As was the officer at the dept of employment.

The question was for online activity not in any way connected to Thailand.. Both answered you need a non imm visa and associated work permit..

This isnt grey or out to debate.. You can choose to break the law, but they have stated clearly that the law applies.

and you too may state the same as that is what you wish to portray.. but it was never specified whether business was inside or outside thailand:

Is earning money through online advertising, website affiliate marketing or operating a business that has only an online presence whilst staying in Thailand considered working? Would that person be required to have a “business visa”?

Do I need a ‘business visa’ to work online?

Is earning money through online advertising, website affiliate marketing or operating a business that has only an online presence whilst staying in Thailand considered working? Would that person be required to have a “business visa”?

Ting Tong Farang, Phuket Town Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM “Any foreigners working or starting a business in Thailand, online or off, need to first get a proper visa.

They can apply for a Non-Immigrant B visa at a Royal Thai Embassy in their home country.

Once they get it they can come to Thailand and apply for a work permit with the Department of Employment.

If we find out that a foreigner is doing business online without a work permit, we will arrest them and take legal action through the court.” Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM Pol Col Panuwat Ruamrak, Superintendent of Phuket Immigration

“Doing business online is considered a type of work, so foreigners are required to have a work permit to do so.

The first thing to do is get the proper business visa. Foreigners with any other type of visa generally cannot apply for a work permit.

An exception to that rule is made for foreigners legally married to Thai citizens.

For more information on the visas and documents required to apply for a work permit, we advise foreigners to contact us or the Department of Employment in the area they live.

We need detailed information from the foreigner before advising on further action.

Please call Phuket Department of Employment at 076-219660-1 ext 13 for further information.” Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM Somkiat Baiadul, an officer at the work permit division of the Phuket Department of Employment - See more at: http://legacy.phuketgazette.net/issuesanswers/details.asp?id=1175#sthash.Naz16bF0.dpuf

I dont see that as being open to any interpretation.

“Any foreigners working or starting a business in Thailand, online or off, need to first get a proper visa."

what if business is not registered in thailand?

what if business's business is not conducted in thailand?

what if alien is not "working" it but merely maintaining/owning?

I see this as being open to interpretation.

I am not an attorney in Thailand, but I was an employment attorney in the U.S. for many years. I have lived in Thailand for four years now. This is my best understanding of the rules:

Scenario 1. You are employed by a foreign company (or are self-employed in a foreign country), and you happen to be performing your work while in Thailand. So long as your work is not engaged in commerce in Thailand, and so long as your activities in Thailand are not the subject of your work in a manner that engages thai commerce, you are not working in Thailand such that you must have a work permit. Your business is registered outside thailand, your taxes are paid outside thailand, your money is earned for work which does not concern Thailand, and no profits are earned from thai customers or customers who elicit your services because you are in Thailand.

Think of it as long holiday telecommuting. It is not illegal to telecommute from Thailand while you are on long holiday from home.

In this case, you can be here on a tourist visa, and as such you cannot live full time in thailand. You also can probably be here on a retirement visa and still virtually perform work back home, so long as the financial source of your income is outside thailand, and paid to an account that is outside Thailand. The retirement visa would be more of a "don't ask, don't tell" gray area.

Scenario 2: You work for a company that does business in Thailand, and your work for that business involves Thai commerce, and you perform your work in Thailand. In this case, you need your company to sponsor you for a work permit in Thailand.

Scenario 3: You start a business in or move an existing businesses' operations to Thailand. You do not have a business entity registered in another country, you do not pay corporate taxes in another country, and you perform all work for which you earn money in Thailand. In this case, you need to set up a Thai company, have a minimum of 4 thai employees, and obtain a work permit --- even if your customers are outside of Thailand.

Depending on how you arrange your affairs, self publishing via Amazon could arguably fit into any of these three scenarios. If you book is about Canadian fall flowers, and all you do in Thailand is sit beachside to do online research, writing and editing, then you are probably in Scenario 1. On the other hand, if you are here writing travel guides about Patong nightlife and self publishing them on Amazon, that is likely Scenario 3. If you are employed by Amazon to write books that in some way connect to Thailand or are sold to customers in Thailand, then that's likely scenario 2.

In short - the answer most likely depends on what you actually plan to do, and how you plan to do it. Best course would be to consult a Thai attorney to get expert advice.

That's probably the clearest and best informed answer I've seen on this often raised subject, working on line covers such a wide array of activities and circumstances the only way to get a clear answer would be to get advice from a Thai attorney.

There is probably a good reason that this topic keeps getting raised and that's because every time it pops up JL and Co jump on it and it descends into completely uninformative irrelevant prattle, these guys are "experts" on everything from why the Thai government doesn't do things, to the detrimental effects that someone writing an e-book will have on the Thai governments stated objectives on crab fishing.

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