richard_smith237

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Family loss of a breadwinner – You could make the same argument for outlawing motorcycles all together. 

Exactly — you could extend the same logic to countless other behaviours: how someone rides, whether they ride at night or in the rain, if they’ve been drinking, their diet, how they cross the road… it’s all part of the broader risk spectrum.

But here’s the distinction: for many, riding a motorcycle isn’t a choice of luxury, it’s a necessity. Choosing not to wear a helmet, however, crosses a line — it’s no longer a calculated risk, it’s negligence.

So while the arguments may seem to overlap at a glance, when you break them down through a balanced and practical lens, they’re not quite the same.

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Becoming a long-term burden if disabled -Then let his parents convince him to wear a helmet.

Agreed... OR just have the police enforce existing laws... Or would you have parents enforce all other laws too ?

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Psychological trauma to others involved in the accident –You could make the same argument for outlawing motorcycles all together. 

YOU could.. but it wouldn't be a very good argument, as discussed above: [while the arguments may seem to overlap at a glance, when you break them down through a balanced and practical lens, they’re not quite the same.]

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Increased pressure on emergency services –You could make the same argument for outlawing motorcycles all together. 

Again...  not when viewed through a balanced and practical lens.

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Higher healthcare costs shared by society – Why should his healthcare costs be shared by society? And again, you could make the same argument for outlawing motorcycles all together.

Because thats they way a national health care system works. Should you be prevented from having children because your 'Genetic testing' shows a sociability to alcoholism or cancer ? - we have to be very careful where we draw these lines...  Perhaps omit from health care anyone driving without a solid reason.. i.e. just going for a drive (in a car)...   

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Strain on healthcare infrastructure – Sure, but given the number that die at the scene, it's a good bet it would be a wash. 

There is still an additional strain from not helmet wearing - that can't be ignored. 

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Emotional toll on witnesses – And again, you could make the same argument for outlawing motorcycles all together.

Not really - not if that 'same rider' would have just fallen over and got back up again.

You are arguing absolutes in a world where a sliding scale of injures can occur.

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Encouraging unsafe behavior in others –A good reason to wear a helmet, not a good reason for a law. 

Its a perfect reason to enforce the law that many don't follow  - which is what this discussion is about.

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Loss of life that could otherwise contribute to community and society – And again, you could make the same argument for outlawing motorcycles all together.

Sure, you could make that argument - but as already outlined, it wouldn’t hold much weight.

If we go down that road, we’d be lumping helmet laws in with a whole mêlée of risky behaviours: drinking, poor diet, lack of exercise… what next? Ban pies? Fine people for not jogging?

The difference is, those risks are typically long-term and personal. Riding without a helmet is an immediate, high-impact decision that can devastate not only the individual, but everyone around them — from emergency services to their own family, whereas riding a motorcycle is a necessity for many, not wearing a helmet is simply an option they chose.

So yes, we all live with risk, but some choices push far beyond reasonable tolerance -  and riding without a helmet is one of them - its beyond the line in the sand from a 'moral perspective' but more importantly, from a legal perspective..... and thats why enforcement should be unwavering...  

The arguments I’ve laid out simply underline a key truth: not wearing a helmet isn’t something that impacts only the rider, as some conveniently like to believe.

When someone suffers a preventable head injury or worse, the consequences ripple far beyond the individual - families, bystanders, emergency services, and even the wider community often bear the fallout.

And no, pointing to other risky behaviours - like riding itself doesn’t negate the issue. That line of reasoning is a distraction, a way of dodging the real point: some risks, like choosing not to wear a helmet, are reckless, immediate, and entirely avoidable.

15 hours ago, AustinRacing said:

I’d like to see expats in pattaya fined double the fine. Pissing me off seeing old farts riding bikes with no helmet. Almost guaranteed they’d wear them in their home country ie they know better than the local Somchai. 

What’s the mentality behind this?.....  Why should expats be fined double for committing exactly the same offence as Thai citizens?

Why are you assuming Thai people don’t know better? That’s not only wrong, it’s insulting.

Thais are well aware that helmets and seatbelts save lives. It’s not ignorance at play, but rather habit, emotion, or sheer complacency overriding logic.

20 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

Why should people have to wear a helmet if they don't want to? 

Not doing so (helmet wearing) doesn't only impact themselves if a rider comes off and get seriously injured or die, needs long term medical care etc...  there is a long line of people it can impact....

Family loss of a breadwinner – A father dies in a crash without a helmet, leaving his family struggling to cope financially and emotionally.

Becoming a long-term burden if disabled – A young man suffers a brain injury and requires lifelong care from his elderly parents.

Psychological trauma to others involved in the accident – A driver is haunted by guilt after hitting a cyclist who wasn't wearing a helmet and suffered fatal injuries.

Increased pressure on emergency services – Paramedics spend extra time and resources stabilising an unhelmeted rider with preventable head trauma.

Higher healthcare costs shared by society – An unhelmeted crash victim racks up hundreds of thousands in medical bills covered by taxpayers.

Reduced productivity and economic contribution – A previously employed person is left unable to work after a preventable head injury.

Strain on healthcare infrastructure – ICU beds are occupied for longer by patients with severe brain trauma that a helmet could’ve prevented.

Emotional toll on witnesses – A passer-by watches a motorcyclist suffer fatal head injuries, resulting in lasting emotional distress.

Encouraging unsafe behaviour in others – A teenager mimics his older brother by riding without a helmet and ends up in intensive care.

Loss of life that could otherwise contribute to community and society – A young volunteer dies in a bike crash, leaving local projects without their lead organiser (yeah, I know questionable).

I have two passports.. 

One with my Thai Visa...   Another with some overseas Visas.

Invariably I'll use my overseas Passport at the check-in desk and its a different one that I'd registered with the airline....    

... This is not something I'd ever considered before, and certainly something which as never raised any issue whatsoever.... 

Airlines are only serious about the accuracy of your names (the order doesn't even matter)...  

I once travelled to the UK as Mr & Mr Smith with the Wife... without any issue !!! 

- The airline somehow screwed up (issuing the awards ticket) but wanted $200 to re-gender my wife correctly !!...   Nope !!! not a chance....

1 hour ago, JaxxBKK said:

Certainly don't need gay apple pay. That's for Fing sure. Can't say I'm gay louder than apple pay

1 hour ago, JaxxBKK said:

Drinking milk in coffee is for the women and the gay

erm... ok sailor 🌈🌈🌈  

This is so tragic, yet another series of wholly avoidable deaths. 

Drowning is the leading cause of death of children Thailand.

Water Safety 'could' so easily be taught in schools...   even without swimming lessons, just teaching kids awareness of the the risks of these ponds... 

5 hours ago, impulse said:

Edit:  But I'd add that there are a lot of places where the water is easy to get in, and impossible to get out on a steep, slippery bank.  (Or a dock with no ladder.) Kids don't have that kind of judgment yet, even if they can swim.

As you pointed out, a lot of these ponds have steep slick sides and can't be climbed out of - Its not hard to put a rope across the diagonal of a pond and a ladder laying up the side...  if a kid falls / slips in, at least they can hold on to something... 

26 minutes ago, kwilco said:

you are unbelievable - you cut and paste my stuff and then try to change the conclusion - you keep posting about stuff that you know nothing about.

What are you crying about now ? I've not cut any pasted anything of yours....

You are now arguing for the sake of it - the 'fatality impact of helmets' (i.e. reduction of fatalities due to wide-spread helmet use) in Thailand is not know, there are no available stats for Thailand.

I provided a lot of reasons why the Stats from Western Nations (such as those in the EU) may not be transferable or may not accurately project across to a nation such as Thailand.

One day - I will copy and paste an exact statement you have made - I believe you would still argue against it !!! 

1 hour ago, Upnotover said:

Adapt or die.  It's so easy.  Carry a large size helmet and a bag of hotel style shower caps for the sensitive.  The law didn't change only the current enforcement, so likely all back to normal again soon.

Indeed..  If people are 'so sensitive' about using a shared helmet  they can carry their own hair-cap thingy...

50 minutes ago, it is what it is said:

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

In an unusual turn of events in Singapore, but not unusual in the slightest in Thailand...   Both the public urination and the bribery... 

 

 

 

yes, and no, you step out of line in singapore and it's pretty common for the authorities to come down on you like a ton of bricks... 

In an unusual turn of events in Singapore  >>>  that was actually quoting the OP:

2 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

In an unusual turn of events in Singapore, a Thai national found himself sentenced to 10 days in jail after resorting to bribery in an attempt to avoid a fine for public urination.

4 minutes ago, Geoff914 said:

11 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Debate done to death...  No!

OK. I am a new member. Sorry I didn't trawl though the last 10 years of history first.

Here you go... 

https://aseannow.com/topic/1355969-do-i-have-to-carry-my-passport

https://aseannow.com/topic/1331480-if-you-are-a-resident-in-thailand-should-you-always-carry-your-passport-with-you

https://aseannow.com/topic/1284693-do-you-carry-your-passport-with-you

https://aseannow.com/topic/1278841-should-i-carry-passport-with-me-all-the-time

https://aseannow.com/topic/959389-carry-the-passport-with-me

https://aseannow.com/topic/665725-should-i-carry-my-passport-original-or-a-photocopy-when-walking-around-in-bangkok

https://aseannow.com/topic/804465-carry-passport-or-not

https://aseannow.com/topic/1215676-pink-id-card-debate

https://aseannow.com/topic/849682-passport-copies-as-id

https://aseannow.com/topic/943628-foreigners-id-requirements-what-is-legal

5 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

The original assault was only two against one.

Two men against one woman. 

The woman was slapped by each man ? - where is your proof ?

3 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

Says the poster who was claiming padded bills, provocations, and a story about “I knew a guy…..”.

No way of proving what I witnessed so no point arguing with you about that....

3 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

I have proven your fake claims wrong countless times, an imaginary pitbull that turned out to be a thai breed dog, some imaginary sunglasses and window tinting, an educational matter and even did a poll or two proving you wrong.

Yawn..  pathetic gaslighting rubbish duly ignored....

3 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

=are you up for a little bet Rich?

if I post it it, proving you wrong yet again, you agree not to post for a month.

If I can’t, I will not post for two months.

 

Let me know.

Juvenile idiocy... Just post it... if you can.... 

It still won't mean it's anything more than a posting from a random nobody and you are attempting to peddle provocation... 

16 minutes ago, Geoff914 said:

18 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Cyclists need to carry their passport ?

Isn't everybody "supposed" to carry them?

Debate done to death...  No!

1 minute ago, Nick Carter icp said:

Did you make the claim up ?

To deliberately trigger and provoke... 

13 minutes ago, Geoff914 said:

Where do cyclists put their passports?

Cyclists need to carry their passport ?

1 minute ago, MalcolmB said:

No, all I am saying is that in the comments section in the Facebook page that it said Israelis.

 

I don’t know if that is true or not, but what I do know is true is that is what was posted.

And that is all I said. It is a fact. 
Unlike your made up version. 

Sure... ok.. Go ahead and present that post - screen print and backup your claim...   no one else can find that information.

1 minute ago, MalcolmB said:

Just posting facts. 
 

Not making up alternative stories to blame it on the Thais as you habitually do.

Facts ??? really Malcy ??    -     the postings from a random nobody on a facebook thread is now a fact ???

You can't even prove that such a comment exists - prove me wrong with a screen print.

1 minute ago, MalcolmB said:

That is correct and that is what I posted.

It is there for anyone to read.

What is your point?

The point has been spelled out to you a few times... Translate the post to English so you can stay within the rules to so fondly cherish (or hide behind), take screen print and post the image of 'information' you are claiming...   

1 minute ago, MalcolmB said:

12 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Facebook posts wouldn't be an acceptable media source for links to news storis on here .

   "Someone on Facebook says................................" 🙂

Where do you think the OP came from?

try and keep up.

So you are suggesting a comment from a random nobody that no one else has seen, amongst 225 comments on a facebook thread is a valid source of information ???...       hmmm......  

4 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

You are not admin Rich, when they give me the go ahead I will post it.

Or you could just check it yourself rather than arguing all the time.

You've already posted in Thai with the translation of israeli... so clearly that doesn't bother you.

Its also extremely simple to 'translate the Facebook comment into English' and screenshot and post that... 

So... you are claiming 'some random person' amongst 225 (as of now) comments - mentioned that the men could be Israeli...  and you think that has some relevance.....     your trolling is transparent.

4 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

In Thai script so I am not allowed under forum rules to post it here.

If admin gives me the ok to, I will post a screenshot. 

... your usual nonsense: just translate the comment to English and post the screenshot. Simple, really - unless, of course, accuracy gets in the way of your little narrative.

Still, even if such a comment exists buried among the noise of Facebook - it’s just that: a throwaway remark from a  nobody. Hardly a credible basis for asserting someone's nationality, unless desperation now qualifies as evidence.