newnative

I was responding to your question of 'Why are you all living in Pattaya?', not how much money is needed to live here.

Certainly there are plenty of retirees in the places you have mentioned. But, there are also significant numbers in other places, including a variery of higher-end housing projects on the Darkside--with more being built, and in the more expensive condo projects that have been built in the past few years, with the trend for new condos decidely more upscale than the no-frills VTs of yesteryear. The Cove, Northpoint, Baan Plai Haad, Northshore, Aeras, Zire, The Palm, Arom Wongamat, Cetus, Andromeda, Reflection, and others come to mind. Copacabana, for example, has an average price of about 123,000 baht a sqm. Arom Wongamat is at 163,000 baht. VT5 goes for just 52.000 baht a sqm.

Of course there are lower priced properties, both condos and houses. As I have said many times, one of the great things about Pattaya is the wide variety of housing to buy or rent, at all price points--from less than a million baht to over 200 million baht. Whether someone has the means to pay 10MB for a property has nothing whatsoever to do with whether he or she is a drinker, smoker, takes drugs, has a happy disposition, flosses, etc. Totally irrelevant. Also totally irrelevant is whether or not you are meeting these people. Just because you are, apprently not, does not equate to these people not existing. I am also referring to Pattaya, not the boonies. You might find it strange that some expats are spending 10 million on condos or houses but that is the case in Pattaya, which, again, is what I was referring to. I might also correct you that I never said, as you say I do, that I think the 'average expat' is doing this. What I actually said was that there were 'significant numbers', and there are. Pattaya has lots of housing projects with some homes in them going for 10 million baht and up. And, there are a number of higher-end condo projects that also have condos in that price range. Usually, these condo projects have the foreign quota filled, so about half of the buyers for these condos were foreign buyers. If there were not buyers for properties at this higher price point, they would not be continuing to be built. A number of the new housing projects, as well as some newly announced and just-built condo projects, are also on the higher, rather than the lower, end. Again, referring to Pattaya. Finally, why people choose to live in Pattaya--in 2MB properties or 200MB properties or anything in-between--has been discussed a number of times on the Forum, with a thread just a few weeks ago, if I recall. For my spouse and me, Pattaya simply checks more of the boxes of the things we want in a place to live than anywhere else in Thailand. I suspect your location does the same for you.

All my friends in Pattaya are not American; most are not. I also know British, Swiss, German, Canadian, Irish, Dutch, Australian, and others from other countries and most are what would be considered well-off. It's a bit ridiculous to say only American expats in Thailand have any money. Not sure your house values statement holds water. UK house values seem to be appreciating nicely--which is often crowed about on Asean Now by some of our British expats. From an average of 150,000 pounds in 2005 they have risen to an average of 290,000 pounds in 2023. Expats buying property in Thailand generally do not get a mortgage, they pay cash. So, if they buy a condo for 7MB, they're plunking down around $200,000 in cash. A house for 10MB, about $285,000 in cash. Since they are likely not leaving themselves destitute with the purchases, they are in possession of a fair amount of funds. Of course, not everyone fits this description but there are significant numbers who do, from more countries than just the US..

Buh bye bye.

Yes, I agree.

Good to see.

Spouse and I love our pool. Having our own private pool was one of the reasons we moved from a condo to a house--that and more room for the money. We usually swim at least once and sometimes twice a day--and love that we can year-round.

Read that the next season of The White Lotus will be filmed in Thailand.

My Dad had a heart valve problem, too. Lived to 95, not in a hospital.

no

As I said in my post, I am not saying they are CASH MILLIONAIRES. I am not saying they have a million dollars in cash lying around. What I am saying is that there are lots of Pattaya expats that have a million dollars in combined assets, which can include property, stocks, bonds, personal property, mutual funds, bitcoin, gold, and, yes, some cash. Total assets. If you are an older American and own your home, you are likely a good way to having a million dollars in assets just with your home, let alone what else you have saved. I have 5 siblings, all homeowners, and they all likely have a million in total assets. And, no, they did not have exotic jobs. They were in teaching, school secretary, worked for a builder, real estate agent, accountant, etc. Their spouses also worked. We're the generation that had the 'Greatest Generation' as parents, who were thrifty from the Depression, were hard workers, saved, and many passed their wealth to their children--including my parents. I'm not saying what I wrote applies to everyone but it does to many--including all the American friends and relatives I know. I'm also not blowing smoke. The average net worth of Americans between the ages of 65 and 74 is $1,217,700. I doubt that 32% of the men in Pattaya are ex Marines, SAS, or secret service. I also doubt that your lawyer, dentist friend, and so on have reached retirement age and have little in the way of assets other than their pensions and SS.

800,000 pounds is only a little over 1 million US dollars. I think quite a few expats in Pattaya easily have that much. By that I don't mean a million in cash, but in the combined assets they have--property, stocks, savings, etc. As for the thread, I think the answer would depend on what sort of guaranteed income the person in question has coming in each month. Suzy Orman, the so-called financial guru, stated that one needs 5 million dollars to retire, and maybe 10 million. That might be true if you have no pension or social security but certainly is not true if you do have steady income coming in. Someone with a steady, guaranteed income of $50,000 a year will need far less in savings than someone with $15,000 a year in income, their spending being equal. I retired at age 52 with a pension and worked part-time until age 59, when I moved to Thailand. I certainly did not have 5 million saved, nor 1 million. for that matter. But I had, first, my pension, and then SS at age 62, both with COLAs--important. That guaranteed, increasing income was enough to live on and has since been augmented with stock dividends and other investments, primarily real estate.

Yes, me too. But, I think this sign is particularly bad because it is bright blue and white, with black on the top and bottom. Your eye focuses on the brght blue and white while the black part is not as noticeable, especially if you are doing something like jogging. You might glance at the sign and just see the blue and white and think you can pass under it. At first glance at the photo I didn't even notice the black part, which I think is what the people were hitting.

Of course the Darkside is part of Pattaya. What nonsense to claim otherwise. As is Wongamat, Jomtien, Cosy Beach, etc. Some parts may be a 'good distance away'--as are some parts of Jomtien and Na Jomtien--but other parts are just across the street of Sukhumvit. Khao Talo traffic may sometimes be bad but so can the traffic on Thepprasit and South Pattaya Road, and others. Bad traffic is not a reason for an area to not be considered part of Pattaya. Just because it is not an area you would consider also does not figure in. If traffic is something you want to avoid, you could consider the Pong area by Lake Mabprachan. From our home in that area of the Darkside, we can be at Index, Terminal 21, Home Pro, Boonthavorn, Little Market, and Bangkok Hospital in less time than anyone living in Jomtien. We 'cross over Sukhumvit' at least two or three times a week. It's very easy where we are--we just jump on the Motorway, with no traffic lights until we actually get to Sukhumvit.

Never been to the UK. We are always in Steerage--which we find isn't too bad with Asian or Middle East carriers. I avoid United, too, after some bad experiences. Thai might have improved. We had a nice flight with them from BKK to Rome and I also had a good flight with them on a 380--my favorite plane--in 2019 from Frankfort to BKK. They were very helpful in switching my seat as I wanted an aisle seat. The flight was almost full but they were able to make the change. (Was not impressed with Frankfort's airport.) I really liked Seoul's airport the one time I used it. Flew to the US, again in 2019, from BKK with Korean and when we landed in Seoul to change planes, the gate for the next flight was just a short distance away--pity they aren't all like that!

Here is my experience flying Emirates, both legs, to Europe with my spouse. We had to change planes at Dubai at your so-called 'real airport'. We get off the plane, walk about 10 minutes. Wanted to use the bathroom but they were all out of service on our route. Not kidding. After the long walk, we took an elevator down to another level, and another long walk. At some point we found a working bathroom. Then we boarded a train, which took us to, I guess, a different terminal. Get off the train. Another long walk, another elevator, more walking, and then we went outside to the hot desert and boarded a bus that took us on a very long ride--at that point I figured we were already half-way to Europe--that finally dropped us off outside, once again in the hot desert, where our next Emirates plane was waiting. But, at least it wasn't raining. At this point we entered a time warp and we were transported back to the 1960s, when you boarded a plane even at major airports by going up a set of stairs pulled up to the plane. God knows how the other airlines are treated if this is the experience with Emirates. Hopefully, our experience was not typical. The airport may very well be nice--we only saw corridors, elevators, a train, a bus, and desert.

Total farce.

I agree there are 'condotel' type projects, which are set up differently from a project set up legally as a 'condominium'. A project set up as a 'condominium', and which is legally registered as such at the Land Office, abides by the rules and regulations of the Thailand Condominium Act. In order to legally rent for less than 30 days, a hotel license is required, which most legally registered condominiums do not have, and do not want to have.

Yes, and the goal should be to make that 'problem' as small as possible. This can be done by doing as much advance plannng as possible. For example, my parents bought their burial plots, headstones, and caskets so we didn't have to make, or pay for, those decisions. They also selected the funeral company, the type of services, and paid for their funerals. In Thailand, some of this can also be done in advance, such as choosing a cremation service and what you want done with your ashes, etc. It's important, of course, to have a good Will to start with, with detailed instructions that cover everything that might come up. If you want Aunt Edna to inherit your valuable stamp collection, put it in the Will. There should be an Executor and an alternate. Your Executor should know where to locate your Will and any other important papers that will be needed to execute the Will. Even though you have a Will, it's very important to sit down with the Executor and go over absolutely everything that the Executor will need to do. This can involve having up-to-date contact information for those people who will need to be contacted. Burial arrangements, including how they will be paid for, who you would like notified, etc. Sometimes, a final tax return will need to be filed; the Executor will need to know how to do this, the forms and paperwork involved, how to get everything needed, etc. Will a tax preparer be used and, if so, who? If there is a pension or pensions, these will need to be taken care of. If benefits will be transferred to a survivor, this needs to be handled. What exactly needs to be done with the stock portfolio? The mutual fund account? The credit cards? What bank accounts are there and what is to be done with them? And, how? If property is rented, how is the remainer of the lease to be handled? And, paid for? What about the contents? If property is owned, what is to be done with it while the Will is being executed? Be specific on what needs to be paid--pool guy, gardener, electric, water, etc., how they will be paid, and how much. What services need to be cancelled and how, such as internet, Netflix, cell phone, etc. If the property is to be sold, be specific on how that is to be done. Is there a home safe? What's in it and how is the Executor to access it? Where is the rental contract, the chanote, the car/motorcyce papers, the insurance papers, etc.? Health insurance account? These are just some of the things that come to mind. Obviously, every death is different and will involve its own set of tasks. Someone dying single in Thailand with no relatives here can be more of a challenge for an Executor than someone with a surviving spouse, who often is both the Executor and an inheritor. Often, a Will will state something but not be specific on how that is to be done. For example, "I leave all my money in Bangkok Bank to my son Frank, Jr. in the US. " Ok. When you sit down with your Executor you want to detail how exactly he or she is to get that money to your son, starting with his up-to-date bank account information. With the stamp collection for Aunt Edna, where is it located and how and where is it to be shipped, and insured for what amount? The more detailed and specific you can be, the easier a time your Executor will have.

Probably because it's a great place to live if one is in Thailand, for whatever reason. And, if you are a reputable Thai lawyer with good English you can make a decent living with just farang clients. It's getting to be sort of a broken record--one that really no longer plays with the Pattaya of today: why would someone live in Pattaya if they could live elsewhere? Sometime when you have a moment check out Siam Royal View on Hipflat. It's a large housing project on the Darkside. Cheapest single family home listed is 15MB and the most expensive is 200MB, with a few others in the 120 to 160MB range. More running 20MB to 65MB. Why would someone who can afford a home for 65MB or more choose Pattaya? Again, because it's a great place to live if one is in Thailand. Not all expats--or Thai lawyers, for that matter--live at Nirun.

Nice--I'd go maybe two floors higher.

I might be wrong but I don't think a project legally registered at the Land Office as a 'condominium' can also be registered as a hotel.

Totally agree. I think if you are oceanfront facing the ocean and nothing else, a lower floor is better so you can see the beach, some vegetation, and activity. If you are on a high floor, you'll likely just be seeing water and sky. In order to see the beach, you'll have to go out to your balcony and look down. Higher floor views can be nice, though, when you are looking at ocean, beach, shoreline, and city skyline, such as Northshore looking south and north. Higher floors are desirable if you are not oceanfront. We were on a high floor at Centric Sea, some distance from the ocean, and had nice views looking south, west, and north. Our favorite oceanfront condo remains the one I mentioned in an earlier post that was on floor 4. We had a view of the pool, gardens, some beach. and a fishing pier.

I don't know what project is being referred to but, yes, we did sometimes hear the waves at some of the projects we lived at.