newnative

They spent over 500 billion baht all over Thailand in 2019, with the majority of them traveling independently and not in tour groups. How did just the 'gov' and 'a few others' benefit and not all the hotels, restaurants, tourist attractions, entertainments and amusements, shops, etc. that they dropped the 500 billion+ baht on?

I guess we'll see--I think a number of posters made your same points for 2022 and Thailand managed around 11 million--even with a very slow start. I was one of the sceptics who thought, mid-year 2022, that Thailand would be lucky to hit 6 million, given the low numbers for the first half of the year. Recession or not, there's a lot of pent-up demand to travel by many, who have been stuck at home for several years. My partner and I just went to Europe in December and we are planning at least 1 but likely 2 trips out of the country in 2023, trying to catch up some with those lost travel years.

If you're a very small, very upmarket tourist destination like Monaco, the target would definitely be your 'high dollar' tourists. With a large country like Thailand, with a huge variety and number of hotel rooms to fill all over the country--from budget hostels to 5-star resorts and everything in-between--you need a wide variety of tourists at all budget points. Certainly, going after just one market was, indeed, a 'load of nonsense', in my book. If only 5-star tourists come, where does that leave all the non-5-star hotels, restaurants, etc.? It's just common sense. Nissan sells the March model for around 420,000 baht. It also sells the GT model for around 10 million baht. And, a number of models in-between the two price points. Have we seen Nissan's CEO make an announcement that Nissan now only wants 'high dollar' customers for its GT model, and never mind everything else? Of course, not. Thailand Tourism, like Nissan, is a business, plain and simple, with a broad product line, needing a broad customer base at all economic levels. I suspect the whole 'high dollar' thing was just a "Look, we're working!" TAT exercise; that days blah, blah, blah publicity handout.

The higher figure was from the Statista website, the lower figure was posted by another member and I can't remember the website, feel free to search it out. In any case, if you feel the numbers are inaccurate, please post your hard statistical data backing up your claim, not nonsense about tool sizes. Seeing 'Chinese tour groups around the world', while perhaps interesting, isn't relevant and doesn't back up your claim in any way. And, remember, the majority of Chinese tourists to Thailand in 2019 were not in tour groups. Again, provide some hard data, not personal observations. With 6 million Chinese tourists traveling around Thailand independently in 2019, it seems physically impossible that they could have all stayed at the 'same hotels, restaurants and tour companies.' Did the 6 million all get together and say 'let's all stay at this Chinese-owned hotel and eat at this Chinese-owned restaurant'? Again, it seems ludicrous that 6 million independent tourists, not to mention the other 4 million in tour groups, would benefit just a 'few businesses', as you claim.

Yes, it's less per person than other groups. For example, European tourists spent, if I remember correctly, around 68,000 baht per tourist. Tourists from the Middle East spent the most with around 72,000 baht. So, why does Thailand want Chinese tourists if they don't spend as much? Well, if you're Thailand, heavily dependent on tourists, would you want: 10.9 million Chinese tourists spending 532 billion baht, or: 857,000 Germans spending 59 billion 100,000 from the Middle East spending 7.2 billion 532 billion baht might not 'seem that much' to you but it sure beats 59 billion, or 7.2 billion.

In 2019, Chinese tourists in Thailand spent over 500 billion baht. One site pegged the figure at 543 billion baht, another said 532 billion. With either figure, it was the most, by far, of any country. Over 6 million of the nearly 11 million Chinese tourists were traveling independently, not in tour groups, budget or otherwise. To compare, UK tourists were less than a million in 2019. Any hard statistical data to back up your statement that only a 'few businesses' benefitted from that 500+ billion baht?

In a nutshell, there's no problem, there will be no problem, but if there is a problem, I'll pass the problem to another department to handle and take the blame. While likely thinking, "Wow, this job's a breeze."

In 2019, there were 10,995,000 Chinese visitors to Thailand. While the popular myth, which you seem to subscribe to, is that most were here on budget tours, that is not the reality. The reality is that over 60% of them were traveling independently on their own, not with tour groups. That equates to 6,597,000 Chinese choosing on their own where to go, what places to visit, what hotels to stay at, what tourist sites to see, what restaurants to eat at, what entertainments and amusements to stop at, what shops to shop at, and everything else each and every day of their visit--which they also independently controlled the length of. If you're wondering, that above figure of independent travelers is more than all the 2019 tourist visitors from Russia, Australia, the UK, France, Germany, and the US combined--your 'regular ones', I suppose. So, even if not a single tour group from China visited Thailand in 2019, the Chinese market of independent travelers would be more valuable to Thailand, and to all the many businesses associated with and depending on tourism, than the tourist market from any other country--far more valuable. Just taking one example, 6,597,000 Chinese independent travelers vs. 994,000 of your 'regular ones' from the UK. I think the real 'few in comparison' is staring at you right there. Whether traveling independently or in groups, Chinese tourists in 2019 were spending more per day in Thailand than any other country--again, far more.

As always, I am not and have never been a real estate agent, here or anywhere else. As I have stated before, I am far too lazy and far too impatient to do all the hard work involved with being an agent. I certainly appreciate them, and have benefitted from the hard work many have done on my behalf. See my previous post regarding my thoughts on your 'advice' and 'advising' comments.

Where exactly in that sentence am I 'advising'? Stating a fact is not the same thing as 'advising'--except, apparently, with you. If I say, 'Some people use agents to facilitate their retirement visas.', would that statement of fact also be interpreted as 'advising' people to use agents?

As always, 'satisfied'.

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If outbound Chinese are being tested, how did a plane land in Italy with 52% of the Chinese passengers infected with covid?

I think there is lots of non 'sex businesses' development going on but most of it is not in your area, which makes sense when you think about it. Some of it is quite visible in the north Pattaya Beach area, and the rest scattered around in many places all over greater Pattaya. In recent years we've seen Terminal 21 and a number of nice, new hotels come to town. Centre Point Space is a new, major addition for Pattaya and very family-oriented. Two large new water parks outside of town. Legend Siam. Dolphinarium. Flowerland. Tiger Park. New attractions at Nong Nooch Gardens. New golf courses and some new parks. We sometimes forget the beautiful, family-oriented resorts like Centara tucked away on the beach in Wong Amat. Lots of new condo projects and nice housing estates going in all over. New retail, both large and small, popping up everywhere. Visited the new BYD car dealership a week or so ago. Didn't even know it was there until we happened to drive by. When did that go in, my partner and I asked. Always something new. Pattaya is growing--and thriving. More is on the way with Icon Siam being developed. If it happens, the massive Aquatique, along with a number of new hotels, will be a huge addition to Pattaya Beach. Lots of old and decrepit has recently been leveled--note sometime the huge, now cleared plot next to Marina--in preparation for something new to be built. The new motorway extension is really going to have a big impact on the future development to the south of Pattaya, as we are already seeing. My partner and I have been here since 2010 and have witnessed a lot of this new development. We used to live at Centric Sea and we would go up to the 45th floor, where you can look out in all 4 directions. It was fun to point out so many large projects that were not there when we first arrived. That's new! That wasn't there! That's new! That used to be____. Literally hundreds of new, big projects., in every direction we looked, that didn't exist in 2010. I believe Pattaya is changing in a positive way--except for lots of traffic issues tied to all this growth.

Browsing thru Yahoo this morning and just saw an article stating that almost half of the Chinese passengers on 2 flights from China to Italy tested positive for covid, prompting Italy to impose mandatory covid tests. Thailand may need to re-think its policy and do the same--it's likely to get far more Chinese visitors than Italy.

This is simply incorrect. Read the posts and maybe learn something. Or, back up your statement with actual, hard, verifiable data.

You might be surprised to learn--as I did--that the majority of Chinese tourists in 2019 were traveling independently on their own, staying, eating, and visiting wherever they wanted, and not in tour groups, budget or otherwise. Regardless, whether in a group or not, they were spending more per day in Thailand than tourists from any other country. As previously stated, their individual spending was less--in the 40,000 baht a day range vs. Europeans in the high 60,000 baht range. But, there were far more of them at nearly 11 million. To say 'it won't make much difference whether they come or not' is absurd.

Real plastic.

True, Europe brings in more than the ASEAN countries. But, Asia, including ASEAN but not China, brings in more than China or Europe. Asia, even without China, is number 1, followed by China. When you include China with Asia numbers, the revenue is overwhelming more than Europe--and even with Europe and the Americas combined.

I don't miss winter.

You're both correct. In 2019, Chinese were the number 1 spenders per day by country, but not individually. You are correct that the biggest spenders per head were not the Chinese. Those from the Middle East, if I remember correctly, spent the most per tourist but their tourist numbers were small. If you're Thailand, do you want 10 million Chinese spending 40 some thousand baht each a day or a couple hundred thousand tourists from the Middle East spending 70 some thousand baht each a day? I should think Thailand wants both, but likely has a more enthusiastic wave for the Chinese.

My partner and I used to live at Northshore--probably not a huge distance from wherever you are. Soi 6 was a block down the street. Did that bother us? No. Never went there. Same for Walking Street, Soi Buakhao, or any other party areas. Not our interest, we just avoided them, they never were a problem. Had no problems walking the beach and the promenade--but, not out walking at 2am, either. We were out mornings before it got hot and evenings around sunset. Lots of regular people out and about then, too. Instead of going to Walking Street, we went to Terminal 21, Big C Central Marina, Central Festival, seafood restaurants in Naklua and Wong Amat. And, other restaurants we liked scattered all around the city--some in Jomtien, some in Pratamnak, some in Cosy Beach. Frequent shoppers at Index, Home Pro, Chic Republic, Boonthavorn, etc. Liked to hunt out interesting small shops. Went about our normal lives. We are now living on the Darkside in a pool villa. Pattaya is an easy ride into town on the Motorway--we are enjoying the much less congested traffic. We didn't leave because of the nightlife; we just decided we wanted to try something new--living in a house rather than a condo, something we could not afford in the area of the US where we lived. If you feel you are being overwhelmed by the nightlife where you are, you might try a change of scenery--either in your living place or where you choose to spend your time when you leave your condo.

Yes, turn the heat up on this--way up. Gross incompetence all around from the get-go.

Probably lots of pushback from everywhere. Bad decision to cancel in the first place so close to the event. Very poor judgment. Hope they learned a lesson.

Pattaya is huge. There are many other places to go. Try them, instead.