newnative

'Clearly' we have no idea what the undecideds will do and it's not 'safe to say' what they will do. What we do clearly have is 3 sets of figures that we do know to work with. The headline writer should have taken one of those clear figures and developed an accurate headline that reflected the poll. Such as: 'One quarter of those surveyed have still not decided if they will travel over the new year holidays.' And, slightly above 50% does not equate to 'most' in my book. Clara cut the cake roughly in half and gave one piece to John and one to Mary. Who got 'most' of the cake?

My partner and I no longer own any rental condos. But, if we did, and we were only getting a low rental rate due to covid, when we previously got much higher, I imagine we might be even more selective with whom we would rent to at that low price point.

Beat me to it. Another lousy, very misleading headline.

So, you like the cinemas and the higher 'quality of totty' in big malls. And, so, in want of either, off you go to take your business to a big mall, when a big mall suits your purposes. Perhaps a mall like Central Festival. Even though a bigger, better mall, built by capitalists, might result in less business at a smaller, inferior mall nearby, also built by capitalists. Perhaps a mall like Avenue. Me, too, by the way. Build a better mousetrap and I'll likely be a customer--and color me happy that someone is risking capital to build that better mousetrap. Risking capital with the full knowledge that some businesses work and some don't. Some will be richly rewarded, others not. From your earlier post, capitalists, in your words, 'worship only greed' and 'don't care about others'. This post was commenting on Leaver's post lamenting (totally inaccurately) that bad 'ol uncaring McDonald's came to Orlando and put all the other hamburger shops out of business. (Insert laughter here.) So, which set of capitalists illustrated in the first paragraph should people who also consider themselves capitalists, 'care about'? Should capitalists 'care about' their fellow capitalists that, for example, built the poorly designed and poorly managed Avenue shopping center? Or, should they 'care about' the capitalists that saw something poorly done and said, "we can do better". And, did.

In a nutshell, doing the same thing over and over with the same poor results. And, just what are they training the dogs to do? Sheer madness.

Please show me my post where I said, quoting you: 'This development is a good investment in Pattaya'. It didn't sound like anything I would say so I checked and I couldn't find it. I did find several times where I said developments like this are good for Pattaya. That's quite a bit different than saying they are good investments. About the only reference to investments I could find was one where I said investors always know going in there is risk in any investment. So, all this time you've been questioning something I never said. Obviously, I have no idea whether Aquatique will be built and, if built, whether it will be a 'good investment' in Pattaya. I do like that a number of the proposed elements of the project aren't currently offered on Pattaya Beach. One other thing I have said is some businesses work and some don't. True the World over. That has not been my focus with my posts. If you re-read them, my point has consistently been that new developments such as this, along with Festival, T21, and many others, are good for Pattaya. I remain of that opinion. Just as obviously, you still have not grasped the concept of synergy. In your eyes, anything new is always a threat, never anything else but a threat. One of something is good. Two or more and the first guy is at risk. Ask yourself sometime why so often you will see a half dozen new car dealers clustered in one area of town. Hint: Synergy. And, a belief in their product. Right now, there is an auto show going on in Bangkok; dealers are showing their vehicles and taking orders. With your reasoning, there should just be one dealer displaying and selling. No threats; he'll have no competition. Gotta be great, right? But, how many people will make a special trip to visit an auto show with just one dealer? With apologies to Gertrude Stein, there needs to be some 'there there'. And, so it is with Pattaya as a beach tourist destination. Aquatique, if built, will help put more 'there there'. And, give more visitors a reason to visit. Your example of McDonald's is just downright laughable. According to you, McDonald's arrives in Orlando and, quoting you (unlike you, accurately), 'it put all the other hamburger shops out of business.' Uh, no it didn't. You really lose all credibility when you put out howlers like that. I'll file that with all your ludicrous Central Festival claims. And, finally, you remain clueless on real estate.

My favorite is National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation.

Absurd. Try 14 days.

Boo hoo.

Your last sentence says it all--key word 'past'. In 2019, other demographic groups 'brought the money'. And had been bringing it for some time--which is why all those new hotels got built in north Pattaya, plus Terminal 21 and lots of other things. And, yes, the night life is still there and still important, waiting for covid to abate. It's just not the main thing anymore, no matter how many posters would like it to be.

Asked and answered already as to why I live here but, yes, I think we have both made the points we wanted to make. It's an absolutely gorgeous morning here--lovely blue sky, nice breeze and temperature. I shall enjoy my day and I hope yours is great, too.

Weren't you suppose to be on the dock waving? Oh, right. That ship has sailed. But, actually, pre-covid, there were still plenty of bars--some had just shifted to other parts of town as Pattaya grew. A big bar complex opened some years ago in Jomtien next to Kiss restaurant, for example. Not my thing but likely there's still some nightlife to be found in Pattaya.

Sooooo, to sum up, Central Festival ruined the fun dump that once was Pattaya, according to your previous post. But, in this post, it's '...families and single western women that will ruin Pattaya...'. Wait, I thought it was already ruined by Festival? Oh, well. Let's just blame them all. Hold on, maybe include me, as well. I've been shopping and dining at Festival regularly since 2010. Likely I helped contribute to its success--which led to more 'ruin' with T21. Uh-oh. Plenty of blame to go around, I guess. Meanwhile, color me happy that Pattaya is attracting a more diverse visitor demographic. And, as a full-time resident, I welcome all the new development that makes living here quite nice. Maybe take a gander at JensenZ's terrific post. I'm a cheer leader, too.

There's a street in Bangkok that has furniture stores lining both sides of it. Can't remember the name but there's a wide variety--I remember one store had a huge selection of dining chairs. My partner and I bought a nice dining set in teak with good quality wood and craftsmanship at a shop there. We have been doing custom cabinets with kitchens, bath vanities, armoires, desks, etc. We like being able to design exactly what we want and have it made and installed for not much more than off the shelf. We like IKEA for their sisal rugs--good selection in various sizes--and also some of their housewares and lighting. We also like their selection of big ottomans with storage, something hard to find in Thai-based stores. We use Index, Chic Republic, SB, and Lifestyle Furniture at Boonthavorn for things like bed frames, sofas, and easy chairs. We like Asian antiques for things like sideboards, bedside tables, side tables, and cabinets for under tvs. Asian antiques can make a nice pairing with sleek modern. From past experience, I would avoid anything made in vinyl from China.

Well. actually you, yourself, seem to be offering two 'different viewpoints'. You've said in other posts that Pattaya is a dump. So, if that's the case, how can it be 'ruined' by something new like Central Festival? It's already a dump in your eyes. And, since you think Pattaya is a dump, why would you be so opposed to new developments, such as Aquatique, that might move it up a few notches from your dump status? I do agree the marina area needs work. The city is doing a few things. Pattaya Beach has been widened and is being kept clean; Jomtien Beach is now being widened and it will also be much better. Some of the overhead wires are starting to be buried, a slow process, I will admit. Some sidewalks are being worked on, also slowly. Overhead wires and bad sidewalks, however, can be found all over Thailand so I'm not sure it's fair to use them to confer dump status. The pedestrian lights on Beach Road are working, as well as those on North Pattaya Road--stopped at one the other day. The very large public-private partnership car park is about done in north Pattaya, an area that is getting very popular. A lot of roadwork is being done around town, and has been for several years. Still lots to be done--again true for most places in Thailand--but I do see improvement. I think anyone who would look at Central Festival and see it as something that has 'ruined' Pattaya is one who doesn't want any change of any kind; rather, they want Pattaya to stay static, to remain what it was in, I suppose, the 80s and 90s. As I said in an earlier post, that ship sailed long ago and there is no going back to then.

Would not have come close to the target and a new variety of covid had nothing to do with it. Requirements just too difficult for most.

Slow with everything. Just endless talk and endless committees.

Laughable, as always. The mere fact that there are 'ANNUAL air pollution issues' is the best example of the ANNUAL lip service 'pledge' we get to this never improved, never solved issue.

You're probably right that Pattaya's reputation likely will not 'vanish'. But, in the 10 years I have been here it has improved quite a bit. I think it started with Central Festival opening. Pattaya had reached the point in 2009 that it was no longer a one trick pony and it could support a major mall. The great Bangkok flood a few years later brought a lot of Bangkokians to Pattaya to escape the flooding, including many of my Thai partner's relatives, who had not been to Pattaya in ages, if ever. What they discovered was, hey, Pattaya wasn't so bad. Nice mall, good seafood restaurants on the beaches. With the motorway it was an easy 2 hour beach escape from the city. Wouldn't it be great to have a small, inexpensive, weekend getaway place? Lumpini listened and built the massive Lumpini Park Beach, a 3 building 30-story complex of 1800 units in south Jomtien. Mostly small, affordable units of 28 to 32 sqm, with some larger units thrown in. Lots of Bangkokians snapped them up. So, they built two more massive condo projects in Naklua and Wong Amat. Also successful. Just for good measure, they added another 2 building highrise project behind Park Beach, Lumpini Seaview. You'll note that Lumpini hedged its bets by putting its projects quite far in either direction from Walking Street. Bangkokians wanted Pattaya, but maybe not certain areas, yet. Sansiri, SC Asset, Raimon Land, and Supalai took note and soon there were major new projects from those developers scattered all over town. (Raimon Land had some years earlier taken over and finished Northshore condo.) Two of the developers, Sansiri and SC Asset, decided that Pattaya had reached the point where they could build right in central Pattaya, with Centric Sea condo daringly close to Soi 6 and The Base not a huge distance from Walking Street. Both very successful so their bets paid off. Proximity to the beach and Central Festival trumped Soi 6 and Walking Street being near. Raimon Land soon followed with Unixx in south Pattaya. And, so it's been, with the most recent large new arrival Terminal 21, followed by some nice, new hotels and restaurants in that area. Every new project makes Pattaya a bit more desirable and its reputation a bit better, with the result being a larger and more diverse visitor demographic, which is healthy. There's no reason Pattaya can't have both nightlife areas to support those visitors, as well as the more traditional beach entertainments of a beach town. Aquatique should fit in nicely.

Well, let's see. D'Luck Theater. Legend Siam. Cartoon Network Water Park. Colosseum. Tiger Park. Flowerland. Dolphinarium. Ramayana Water Park. Nongnooch Gardens entertainment halls. Floating Market. Art in Paradise. Underwater World aquarium. Pattaya Easykart. Bowling at Central Festival. Movie theaters at Festival and T21. New park with a bike/walking trail around Lake Mabprachan. New golf courses, including one by Silver Lake. Probably a number of nightlife venues. Likely I missed some but there's those Google websites I mentioned in an earlier post. One of the things I like about the proposed Aquatique is there will be a number of entertainment elements, which that part of Pattaya Beach needs more of.

Missed my last paragraph, I guess. I'm not 'keen' on the nightlife ending; rather, I'm welcoming all the new developments that are making Pattaya a more attractive tourist destination to a more diverse tourist demographic. While, at the same time, also making it more attractive to year-round residents.

No response? Page back up; I've given a number of responses. But, they've all fallen on deaf ears. You don't want to hear it. Example. Your ludicrous claim that there were closed stores at Central Festival, even before covid, and that means the mall was not doing well. (Let's ignore your even more ludicrous claim that the only stores getting any foot traffic were the banks and telcos. Also ignored, the even more preposterous claim that the rest of the foot traffic in the mall was people using Festival as a shortcut to the beach.) My response was that stores closing at a mall was normal and one should not automatically see that as the mall failing. To illustrate my point, I used the example of the Tysons mall in the US, one of the most successful malls with one of the best sales per sq. foot. Even this very successful mall, I said, had store turnover. A store would close and, in due time, another would open in its place. Perfectly normal. Some business work, some don't--even at a very popular, successful mall. Your response? What is the relevance of a mall in the US? If you can't see or pretend not to see the relevance, you are either incapable of reason or a troll. Likely the latter. It was the same when I tried to explain synergy in the tourist business to you and used Orlando as a very good example. Your response again? Orlando is in the US what does that have to do with Thailand. Obviously, if that is always going to be your response, what's the point? By the way, owning a property does not automatically confer on you any knowledge of the real estate business. I own a car but buying it did not automatically confer on me any knowledge as to how it works and how to fix it. Same with my tv. Your statement saying all the thousands of condos for sale are competition for my selling a condo is the best example of your lack of knowledge. I could explain, and did in a post sometime ago, but it would likely once again fall on deaf ears.

I must confess I don't think I'd ever heard of the Bottle Museum before your post--yet another farang who has not visited it.

Mostly with my posts I report what I am observing in Pattaya. I do think a lot of the new development has been positive and I welcome having more choices for housing, health care, retail shopping of all kinds, restaurants, entertainments, etc., than I did when I arrived in 2010. I don't hang out in beer bars and I don't go to the gogos, massage places, etc. Just not my thing. As I've stated a number of times, with a number of reasons given, you can live a very nice life in Pattaya and never go in any of those places. And, never set a foot on Walking Street or Soi 6. You might also be confusing a bit a tourist visit to Pattaya vs. someone married living here year-round. I like living in a beach town and prefer Pattaya's proximity to Bangkok and the airport vs. Hua Hin. Visited Hua Hin several times but did not like the property choices for seaview, which I wanted, and did not like the drive to Bangkok. Pattaya to Bangkok is a breeze in comparison.. I mentioned in a recent post to you that Pattaya will likely always have the nightlife component and it will likely always be an important component, but not the main component. I think this is overall a good thing for Pattaya's future.

I think I have made the points I wanted to make. I will just add that your knowledge of how people actually shop for property, be it a house or a condo, and how properties actually get sold, is woefully lacking, as you have also shown with many of the statements you have made regarding retail, Central Festival, T21, and this proposed project.