ianf

> I am happy to offer you a "real" ride to the airport if you are ready to go back to your fantastic country that has none of these issues.

The fact remains that Thailand has an enormous amount of corruption. I am amazed that the Health Minister stole $50 million dollars from the people of Thailand, and that it has taken ten years for the gov't to demand that he pay the money back. Of course, his first response was to say that he won the money in a casino, which was an obvious lie. Thais don't seem to care that they lie, or steal. And now the Health Minister is a monk. A rich monk, I think. It is so silly and childish. It doesn't matter that other countries have similar problems. What matters is that Thailand will never be a successful country when the people of Thailand lack moral character.

I think we could have a whole thread on the lack of moral character in Thai people. Those who have suffered at the hands of ex-wives - with their thieving, lying and duplicity, know this full well. My ex-wife Ami, a graduate civil engineer no less, set herself up as the most honest of brokers, berating the Isaan girls and others who steal and lie. She ended up far worse than them. The double standards of these people is extraordinary. I could not think of an intelligent Western girl behaving in the same way. Deceit is their middle name. It makes me think that they are not fully civilised.

And in the end the cameras are NOT used for the protection of the people. Cameras has never been proven to prevent any crimes.

Please note that only about 30% of the cameras used in the UK are 'loaded'. Normal practice.

Multiple times they have pulled my taxi over, making me get out for a "body check" wasting my time and hoping they will find something illegal to then be able to extort money.

Many of them are "low lives". I think 99.9% of Thai people feel the same.

Yes, you are quite right. My partner is a law abiding 'wouldn't harm a fly' type of person, but she, togther with every Thai I know absolutely detests the brownshirts.

This week I was pulled over twice, once for 'speeding' (75kmph down Highway 1 would you believe) and once for, actually I don't know. The second one however led to an interest ing exchange between my partner and the cop. He was apologetic and said that his chief had told the team not to go back to HQ until they had collected 10k baht for him. He was an unusual cop in that he was quite sheepish about it! My Mrs felt sorry for him and gave him 100!!!!

Any help?

Where can I go in Chiang Mai to find someone who can print some basic body numbers (1-50) for cyclists to pin to the rear of their jerseys whilst competing. These need to be reusable (not like runner's numbers that are chucked after the event!); Size about 8" Square, black on flo yellow! Thanks

If I say 'no, give me a ticket and I'll pay at the police station' to the clear request for unrecorded cash at road blocks my Thai wife gets annoyed at my cultural terrorism, beckons them around to her side and pays them off. Result!

My partner was taking a taxi from Bangkok to Rayong, when the Taxi was pulled over just outside Rayong. The police tried to say that the Taxi had no right to ply his trade in that district, even though he tried to explain that he was on a journey FROM Bangkok. OK, said the cop "500 baht". The Taxi driver tried to get my pa rtner to pay. My partner (all 40ks of her) went ballistic, demanded an ID from the policeman and then took his picture on her phone. He left, empty handed, very sheepishly.

quote name='JurgenG' timestamp='1315962983' post='4695701']

A couple of sentences in this column really hit the mark "

"... the military and the old establishment together have further intensified the crisis. Violent confrontations have become normal events in Thailand."

" Throughout the past five years, the political stalemate that has shaken the nation - playing with the Thai people's emotions and deeply polarising our society - has unveiled so many dark secrets in politics. For one thing, it has revealed the anxiety on the part of the old establishment about a more open society. This has now clearly emerged as a threat to their power position. From this view, Thaksin is not really a menace to the Thai elite - an open political space is. "

What people really want today is put these five years behind them. If you read Thai forums, what real Thai people talk about in the social forums, you will realize they have moved on.

It's true that for the past five years, violent confrontation was becoming an "acceptable" way of solving political dispute. But Thai people realized they didn't solve anything and they were left footing the bill. Now, all they want is peace and reconciliation.

One more time, a couple of TV posters show they are out of touch with the realities of the country. It's not good for foreigners in Thailand. How long before the government realizes that a couple of foreigners still call for civil war and some even for murder and makes us all pay the price ? As guests in a democratic country we are of course entitled to express freely our opinion but it should be done in a moderate and balanced way.

The biggest menace to Thai Society, to political freedoms and to democracy itself is the dictator in exile.

The guy is a cardboard cutout of all the great despots.

Unfortunately there are things we cannot talk about on this forum, or indeed Thailand.

But the truth is hidden in what we cannot see.

Open your eyes Jurgen!

Not at all. Abhisit is acting in the best interests of Thailand and democracy. It is the role of the opposition to oppose where they think they need to intervene and support where that is needed too. This is democracy at work. Fortunately Abhisit is better placed to understand the true nature of democracy that the despots currently in power. That he lost the election has nothing to do with democracy. It has a lot to do with the campaign of villification against Abhisit in a way that would never be accepted in true democracies. This campaign extended to the heartlands of the North East where 'training in democracy' (ie propaganda and indoctrination) were key tools to use on the masses against the Democrats. During the election I drove from Chiang Mai to Chantaburi. On the way I must have passed a thousand or more posters advertising the Democrats - 99% of these were defaced. I also passed the same number of Red posters. Only one was defaced. In true democracies you must let all sides have a voice. The reds, under Thaksin's evil guidance, ensured that Abhisit's democratic voice was taken away. Indeed all the lies and filth spoken against Abhisit (including the carefully manipulated red riots in BKK and the associated deaths) were a successful long term strategy to overturn the Democrats. But was this a democratic campaign? Not at all!

And is Thaksin and his family not part of the elite? Although he comes from a wealthy and privileged background did Thaksin not add to his considerable wealth by stealing from the Thai people? For every 100 baht that he claimed to give to the poor through his various schemes, I think a figure of 94 baht was the sum that ended up in the Shinawatra family coffers.

Those who cannot see the truth here will no doubt be singing from a different song sheet in the next two years. There are many examples of despots grabbing power then emptying the wealth of their country into numbered Swiss accounts. Idi Amin? The Marcos? Gadhaffi? Many many more and Thaksin is of the same breed. He is the worse kind of anti-democrat because he has the gift of twisting events and circumstances, fact and truths to such an extent that he creates his own truth. So forcefully done that the dispossessed, the uneducated and the poor farmers actually believe him.

Abhisit fought his own people because they did not want the corruption to end. There is no evidence of Abhisit being personally corrupt. And if he is the monster that you make him out to be, then why did he not flee the country when the fascists won their manipulated election with the support of 35% of Thai people??

Referring to Abhisit as the back of a person's bottom is ill considered and rude. What qualifies YOU to make such a judgement? Fascism, dictatorship and the like feeds on such ignorance.

Very good post !

I especially like "It is the role of the opposition to oppose where they think they need to intervene and support where that is needed too." Very deep indeed !

Why your post reminds me Abhisit so much ? Oh I remember "good only at using big words ..."

On a more serious note , knowing that Abhisit failed at everything he ever tried, I believe we don't have to worry too much about having the chance to soon welcome Khun T. back home.

Hopefully Jurgen you will consider the content of my post and respond accordingly? Your previous posts, all in support of the demagogue, suggests to me that had you been in Germany during the 30s, the National Socialists would have had a committed member! I jest! I do think there's a lot to be said for carefully considering Thaksin's raison d'etre and the antics he has been up to, including all the duplicity (such as self contradiction) over the past few years. Notwithstanding the 2600+ deaths in the extra judicial killings of so-called drug dealers. I have never understood why the likes of Thaksin, Marcos, Gadhaffi, Idi Amin et al attract supporters. By supporting these tyrants people are effectively responsible for the tortures, the deaths, the theft and so on that many of these people are responsible for. If your aim is to build a better world then support those who share that aim and are able to work towards that goal. The reason I personally detest Thaksin is because he has been shown to be a liar and a thief and is only in this for himself and then in order to contraol and maintain power fools those poor souls who do not have the wit, the education or the resources to see through his scams.

Abhisit positions himself as the (seen) leader of the prevent Thaksin from returning side.

Abhisit's criticism of the transfers wouldnt be as hollow if his government hadnt made many many times more to fill positions with their political mates.

Abhisit's call on the government to state they were not treating Thaksin specially would not ring so hollow if his government hadnt made Thaksin a special case with a foreign minister dedicated to houding the man around the globe while doing utterly nothing to bring home such notables as Kamnan Poh and Vattana who reportedly reside just over the border.

Two sides of the same coin with power reversed but this time by a decisive electoral decision. One would think that Abhisit would be concentrating on a different issue to that which saw his party thumped at the recent election if he were looking to future electoral success. Maybe he isnt looking at that route to power however

In posting the above drivel it shows that you misunderstand Abhisit and the true nature of democracy.

Your comment is worse than drivel. "true nature of democracy". Let me see coalition bought and paid for, on command from the invisible one, done deal in an army camp. Mass murder of its own citizens(which will be proved by that 'name and shame committee') Army chief abusing his power and using popular tv to tell the electorate to vote for good people. Do me a favour - clock off

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. A thousand times wrong! How can anyone be so blinkered? I really do not mean to be rude but let me tell you my background. For three years (c 1976) I was a press/publications employee at that major NGO, Amnesty International. I have been involved in Human rights issues from a democratic (non political perspective) all my life. I have delivered humanitarian aid inside Karen Burma. And a lot more besides. In my 63 years on this planet I have spent the vast majority of them fighting injustice, unfairness and lies, damned lies. It is so glaringly obvious to me that what I have posted above is close to the truth that I cannot for the life of me understand how other normal and rational human beings (at least those who do not wear religious or political blinkers) cannot see it. Yes glaringly obvious. Did Abhist order the shooting of so many people? 100% not. Why would he when he showed so much patience with a violent and unruly mob who were armed to the teeth and backed by violent rhetoric from their masters? I could carry on all night about this but the small minority of farangs on this board who persist in not facing the truth only serve to support the forces of evil that are at large in this country and no longer on a short leash. It may take one or two years, perhaps less, perhaps more, but any trace of democracy in this country is being eaten alive by the parasitic family, their exiled leader and the unprincipled power-hungry disciples that have moved from the red stage in BKK to positions of power in Government House. To tell you the truth I don't give a @@@ who rules this nation as long as they do it fairly and openly and above all democratically. Same in the UK. I really can't stand entrenched dogma, be it Labour or Tory (or even Liberal) - I just want to see people goverend properly and able to live safe and decent lives free from suffering, free from being ripped off and with decent welfare systems in place. PTT are not concerned with that and neither is their leader. They are only concerned with Power, control and the enlargement of their own personal fortunes. I didn't see that with the Democratic Party.

It is quite amusing to see how so many on here go on about how Abhisit is the best thing for Thailand and democracy just after he got it handed to him by the Thai electorate who obvioulsy dont agree with the finer minds of the TV community. Dont wory Im sure if there is a coup or some other shenanigans he will get his chance to once again be PM. He may even get to have a bunch more people shot on his carefully engineered PMship again too. I guess that would make those on here that cannot accept he and his party are not wanted by the people happy.

I don't think you read my post.

Abhisit positions himself as the (seen) leader of the prevent Thaksin from returning side.

Abhisit's criticism of the transfers wouldnt be as hollow if his government hadnt made many many times more to fill positions with their political mates.

Abhisit's call on the government to state they were not treating Thaksin specially would not ring so hollow if his government hadnt made Thaksin a special case with a foreign minister dedicated to houding the man around the globe while doing utterly nothing to bring home such notables as Kamnan Poh and Vattana who reportedly reside just over the border.

Two sides of the same coin with power reversed but this time by a decisive electoral decision. One would think that Abhisit would be concentrating on a different issue to that which saw his party thumped at the recent election if he were looking to future electoral success. Maybe he isnt looking at that route to power however

Abhisit is nothing more than a sore looser. He needs to be reminded that the people showed he didn't do anything while in office and they disapprove, not by a little, but a landslide. He acts like a child and therefore needs to be treated as such. Just pat him on the head when he speaks and tell him to be a good boy and sit down. He is part of the Bangkok elete born with a silver spoon in his mouth and wants to have a voice. He had a voice and blew it. He needs to go back to England where they put up with a$$holes like him and get a real job. Something he has never had.

Not at all. Abhisit is acting in the best interests of Thailand and democracy. It is the role of the opposition to oppose where they think they need to intervene and support where that is needed too. This is democracy at work. Fortunately Abhisit is better placed to understand the true nature of democracy that the despots currently in power. That he lost the election has nothing to do with democracy. It has a lot to do with the campaign of villification against Abhisit in a way that would never be accepted in true democracies. This campaign extended to the heartlands of the North East where 'training in democracy' (ie propaganda and indoctrination) were key tools to use on the masses against the Democrats. During the election I drove from Chiang Mai to Chantaburi. On the way I must have passed a thousand or more posters advertising the Democrats - 99% of these were defaced. I also passed the same number of Red posters. Only one was defaced. In true democracies you must let all sides have a voice. The reds, under Thaksin's evil guidance, ensured that Abhisit's democratic voice was taken away. Indeed all the lies and filth spoken against Abhisit (including the carefully manipulated red riots in BKK and the associated deaths) were a successful long term strategy to overturn the Democrats. But was this a democratic campaign? Not at all!

And is Thaksin and his family not part of the elite? Although he comes from a wealthy and privileged background did Thaksin not add to his considerable wealth by stealing from the Thai people? For every 100 baht that he claimed to give to the poor through his various schemes, I think a figure of 94 baht was the sum that ended up in the Shinawatra family coffers.

Those who cannot see the truth here will no doubt be singing from a different song sheet in the next two years. There are many examples of despots grabbing power then emptying the wealth of their country into numbered Swiss accounts. Idi Amin? The Marcos? Gadhaffi? Many many more and Thaksin is of the same breed. He is the worse kind of anti-democrat because he has the gift of twisting events and circumstances, fact and truths to such an extent that he creates his own truth. So forcefully done that the dispossessed, the uneducated and the poor farmers actually believe him.

Abhisit fought his own people because they did not want the corruption to end. There is no evidence of Abhisit being personally corrupt. And if he is the monster that you make him out to be, then why did he not flee the country when the fascists won their manipulated election with the support of 35% of Thai people??

Referring to Abhisit as the back of a person's bottom is ill considered and rude. What qualifies YOU to make such a judgement? Fascism, dictatorship and the like feeds on such ignorance.

Abhisit positions himself as the (seen) leader of the prevent Thaksin from returning side.

Abhisit's criticism of the transfers wouldnt be as hollow if his government hadnt made many many times more to fill positions with their political mates.

Abhisit's call on the government to state they were not treating Thaksin specially would not ring so hollow if his government hadnt made Thaksin a special case with a foreign minister dedicated to houding the man around the globe while doing utterly nothing to bring home such notables as Kamnan Poh and Vattana who reportedly reside just over the border.

Two sides of the same coin with power reversed but this time by a decisive electoral decision. One would think that Abhisit would be concentrating on a different issue to that which saw his party thumped at the recent election if he were looking to future electoral success. Maybe he isnt looking at that route to power however

In posting the above drivel it shows that you misunderstand Abhisit and the true nature of democracy.

I guess I'm in the minority here. I am all for extrajudicial killings of drug dealers. They don't get rehabilitated.

Ask yourself which news story you'd rather read:

Motorcycle Taxi Driver High on Yabba Rapes then Kills School Aged Girl

Heroin Addict Kills Family Member's Baby with a Knife while High

or

Drug Dealer Shot Dead in Alley at Lunchtime

Give certain trained police the right to end drug trafficker's lives right now before more innocent lives are lost.

Just my humble opinion.

jim, we’re talking about police killing people that don’t get a chance to prove their innocence in a court of law. I presume you come from a developed country. If so, it is classed as ’developed ’ because extrajudicial killings are one of the things not allowed. Try and educate the local natives rather than be one.

Many of the people murdered in the last round w ere not drug dealers. NGOs running drop in centres will confirm that users on programes were randomly selected and shot. My ex-wife's uncle was also shot - he wasn't a dealer. He was a Thaksin political opponent and he was not the only one wiped out in that way!

A week or so ago Chalerm also said that there's nothing wrong with extrajudicial measures to fight drugs.

By stating that there would be no extra-judicial killings in this round of drug -user suppression - I am assuming that they are admitting that there WERE extra extra-judicial killings in the last round! Well! Well!

Is this a new branch of the Chinese restaurant near the Night Bizzare?

I agree, totally bizarre.

Do you have any Y fronts for sale? If so can you let me know age / size & price.

On reading the headline for this thread my first thought was "Give yer stuff to charity mate" far more beneficial than getting a few baht for them.

I suspect that if he were any more of a mug, he would have a handle in the middle of his back.

Read this soft-soap interview with a touch of cynicism and his image becomes clearer;

His business folds due to the asian economic crisis - of course that can't be because of his failure to adapt, it must be the government's fault.

He is inspired by Thaksin, despite all the evidence that the man is corrupt - I wonder what he aspires to.

Doesn't want to be anybody's enemy, but gets sucked into the red shirt mess.

Becomes a "people's politician" and is rejected. No worries, get on the party list.

Is glad he joined the "fight for democracy" - probably will never see the light and realise he was used to get thaksin's cronies back into power.

Thinks Thaksin should be allowed to return because he has a lot to offer - whereas Thaksin wants to return because there is still a lot to take.

How about an interview with some REAL questions, like is corruption acceptable, why were armed militants allowed to mix with protesters, was it necessary to burn BKK ?

you guys are so funny.

The Drivel showers roses over the Dems and you people don't say squat, but if it is a piece about red shirt, suddenly you know how to "read critically".

maybe you should remember : in the financial crisis of the 90s a lot of companies went under - and it was primarily due to imposed conditions from the IMF which (and yeah, it's documented) made the situation worse. The Dem government in the 90s fell in due to extraordinary corruption. This guy runs out of the democratic strong-hold, how many PTP were elected in the south? But you imply he is a failure. He took a stand against a military coup which in his mind is a fight for democracy, but clearly not in your mind. Yay for TVF democracy. Sure he feels that Thaskin should come back - and other people feel that he shouldn't - but his right to an opinion is called "being used" by you. And let's just forget that it was the PAD who were the first "armed-militants" or that the protests last year were peaceful for over a month before the violence started. Let's forget that the PM Abhisit rejected the request to hold elections (which is what had to happen in the end anyway), and that 90+ people are now dead because of it. And let's forget that the government was the side doing the killing on a 10-1 scale - why was that ?? Why did they use a sniper to kill an ex-military man while he was giving an interview? Why did the government authorize, EVER, the use of lethal force against the protesters? And *someone* did torch Central World (do you know how hard it is to set a building like that on fire?) - anyway, last time I was in BKK Central World was looking just fine, but 91 people are still dead - ohhhh, poor burning Bangkok, tears of a clown...

Cheers, Tom

Obviously Tom when the GOOD reds marched peacefully to Bangkok, they ignored their leaders' speeches that were riddled with violence. They didn't bring empty bottles or petrol; they didn't engage 300 'men in black'; they didn't steal weapons from the military and the police; they didn't threaten to burn Bangkok. They didn't take any advice from Mein Kampf and listen to speeches that offered no 'argumentation' only emotional manipulation in the time honoured fashion of fascist leaders, etc etc, boring etc. When Khun Abhisit offered an early election, they didn't accept because it wasn't soon enough. Or perhaps that offer was made in Jest. And when the famous military leader was targeted as a high profile sacrifice to the red movement, they rang Khun Abhisit and asked if he would kindly send a sniper in to blow his brains out. So kind of the then PM to oblige. Dear Tom, I must say to you that what you think you see is not what you get. You can fool some of the people some of the time but you can certainly fool the dispossessed all of the time. And if you get that right, then you can grab back the ownership of the country and do as you will. Or perhaps I'm just a cynic and the then PM was really out there pulling triggers? Somehow my intellectual reasoning thinks not!!

the constant references to hitler and mao on this forum are a joke.

If you study the mass psychology of fascism, then you may understand that this is not a joke. Sadly some people are so gullible and that allows this type of Sh** to happen.

A sad, tragic reality with no end in sight.

Certainly no end in sight in spite of all the positive types of noises around these days.

I have also trekked through the jungle to some vollages. And what I saw was tragic and will live with me forever.

People who do this are heroes.

Tom, after reading through all the above comments I think if only the westerners are allowed to vote in the last election, Ahbisit and the Democrats would have won the election hands down...

Off course.

I suspect that if he were any more of a mug, he would have a handle in the middle of his back.

Read this soft-soap interview with a touch of cynicism and his image becomes clearer;

His business folds due to the asian economic crisis - of course that can't be because of his failure to adapt, it must be the government's fault.

He is inspired by Thaksin, despite all the evidence that the man is corrupt - I wonder what he aspires to.

Doesn't want to be anybody's enemy, but gets sucked into the red shirt mess.

Becomes a "people's politician" and is rejected. No worries, get on the party list.

Is glad he joined the "fight for democracy" - probably will never see the light and realise he was used to get thaksin's cronies back into power.

Thinks Thaksin should be allowed to return because he has a lot to offer - whereas Thaksin wants to return because there is still a lot to take.

How about an interview with some REAL questions, like is corruption acceptable, why were armed militants allowed to mix with protesters, was it necessary to burn BKK ?

you guys are so funny.

The Drivel showers roses over the Dems and you people don't say squat, but if it is a piece about red shirt, suddenly you know how to "read critically".

maybe you should remember : in the financial crisis of the 90s a lot of companies went under - and it was primarily due to imposed conditions from the IMF which (and yeah, it's documented) made the situation worse. The Dem government in the 90s fell in due to extraordinary corruption. This guy runs out of the democratic strong-hold, how many PTP were elected in the south? But you imply he is a failure. He took a stand against a military coup which in his mind is a fight for democracy, but clearly not in your mind. Yay for TVF democracy. Sure he feels that Thaskin should come back - and other people feel that he shouldn't - but his right to an opinion is called "being used" by you. And let's just forget that it was the PAD who were the first "armed-militants" or that the protests last year were peaceful for over a month before the violence started. Let's forget that the PM Abhisit rejected the request to hold elections (which is what had to happen in the end anyway), and that 90+ people are now dead because of it. And let's forget that the government was the side doing the killing on a 10-1 scale - why was that ?? Why did they use a sniper to kill an ex-military man while he was giving an interview? Why did the government authorize, EVER, the use of lethal force against the protesters? And *someone* did torch Central World (do you know how hard it is to set a building like that on fire?) - anyway, last time I was in BKK Central World was looking just fine, but 91 people are still dead - ohhhh, poor burning Bangkok, tears of a clown...

Cheers, Tom

Obviously Tom when the GOOD reds marched peacefully to Bangkok, they ignored their leaders' speeches that were riddled with violence. They didn't bring empty bottles or petrol; they didn't engage 300 'men in black'; they didn't steal weapons from the military and the police; they didn't threaten to burn Bangkok. They didn't take any advice from Mein Kampf and listen to speeches that offered no 'argumentation' only emotional manipulation in the time honoured fashion of fascist leaders, etc etc, boring etc. When Khun Abhisit offered an early election, they didn't accept because it wasn't soon enough. Or perhaps that offer was made in Jest. And when the famous military leader was targeted as a high profile sacrifice to the red movement, they rang Khun Abhisit and asked if he would kindly send a sniper in to blow his brains out. So kind of the then PM to oblige. Dear Tom, I must say to you that what you think you see is not what you get. You can fool some of the people some of the time but you can certainly fool the dispossessed all of the time. And if you get that right, then you can grab back the ownership of the country and do as you will. Or perhaps I'm just a cynic and the then PM was really out there pulling triggers? Somehow my intellectual reasoning thinks not!!

I would imagine he is referring to his Thai driver's license and not Thai ID which is available to Thai Nationals only.

C.M. Night Safari is a great cheap outing for those with kids. Sometimes they even waive the 50 Baht fee. We've been about 15 times over the years. We buy a big bag of carrots at the market and get there at dusk when the deer come out for feeding. The sun conures are my favorite. You can go inside the cage and feed them. 10 or 15 of them will come and sit on your shoulders and arms while you hand feed them. They are very gentle and playful birds. My kid loves going to the Night Safari.

Having said that, some of the animals there are in absolutely horrible condition.

This is what I have been told and read many of the negative reports.

Personally, I would like to see people boycott this place and put out of business those that make profits at the expense of the sufferings of these animals.

There is no way that I would contribute anything towards this so-called animal sanctuary travesty they call the night safari.

I understand that until a couple of years ago the animals were not well looked after and some died. It seems that a new European CEO was appointed and animal husbandry improved. On my last visit a couple of weeks ago the animals seemed well cared for and the place was clean etc. A great improvement. These types of places are important for preservation of the species, although I am not sure what CMNS is doing in this regard although I understand it has a programe of sorts.

Seems to me the most obvious answer here is that the mechanic removed the paperwork from the car and then forgot to put it back in. I think the point you all forget is that when they do something stupid here they never admit it because of 'loss of face'. Any excuse or lie will do because they can never admit they are wrong about anything. TIT.

And given the scenario you describe, or similar, the mechanic took the documents out of the car for whatever reason, quite possibly legitimate or as part of a company process, then put them back and somehow the blue book got separated, no intent to do anything wrong, later discovered, nothing much said.

And all of that could have been in any country in the world, and anywhere in the world it's possible that nothing would be said, for all sorts of reasons including simple embarrassment.

And I guess you've never overlooked something and kept quiet?

Why therefore make negative statements about Thai people, not fair.

Negative statements about Thai people? Not fair? Do you know me? Do you know anything about my attitudes?

Lets look at this from another perspective: If there is a genuine Scam going on (and I only asked the question) then am I right or not to bring this to the attention of other farangs on this board?

Also, my partner, Pim, is Thai. And she absolutely thinks they were trying to scam me and was upset at my soft approach to this matter by not going to their manager.

Think before you pour scorn, my friend.

the blue book is title to the vehicle

And all it takes to replace it is a police report and about 100 baht.

Again, the point of this thread was to report something that happened. The guys may well have been innocent of anything, but to me there were too many unanswered questions such as Why did three people look under the seat and not see the book ?? (etc). Perhaps the answer was that they did it that way to save loss of face. And that might well be the answer if the blue book is not that important!

nobody would put the blue book into the car;

a photocopy showing that taxes have been paid is sufficient

original insurance papers must be in the car

Whether it is correct or not to put the blue book in the car is not the point of this thread. But I have learnt my lesson about that and should have removed the blue book after coming back from the DL office.

I've never heard of mechanics stealing the blue book in order to run a scam of some sort. Even with the blue book they need your signature to transfer ownership. Sounds like the book fell off the seat and they found it later. You have been reading too many farang forums so will think the worst.

The only reason I had the blue book was because it was with the car documents and the reason for that was that we had just changed 'ownership' and therefore the number of the car at the DL office. Therefore the blue book was in the folder with the car documents. It could not have fallen off the seat at the front and ended up underneath and only retrievable from the back because of the design of the underneath of the seats. And indeed we all looked under the seat and 100% it was not there. When they returned the car, after they had driven it to the back of the garage it was there.