Kiwiken

All that is required for Evil to win is for good people to do nothing!

As I have said I am glad I was born in the 50's a more stable time and a rapidly changing World. The World is no worse or no better now than it ever was. Because We always expect more there is some pessimism. Religious Zealots have always come and go. look at history to the holy wars. To the crusades and jihads toing and froing. The Spread of Hinduism and Buddhism not always peaceful.The many wars of the 20th Century. Greek Philosophers of the ancient times noted the unruleness of youth and how they fear Civilisation would not survive. But We are still here. We always find a way. When the Day comes that We love Our children more than We hate Our enemies and We channel Our Hatred and set aside Prejudices to solve and advance Our World then that will be the best time to be. Faith and belief are not the problems. It is believing only your Religion is right. We were given the ability to question and learn it is a pity so many never ask why must we hate?

26 million...might buy 20 houses in a middle class Auckland suburb?

It's less than a small Ministry's policy advice fees.

MSD spends over $75 million on such "advice" each year, a flag referendum's worth every 4 months

in the context of the annual expenditure of the New Zealand Government it is a miniscule amount.

The 2015 Budget sets out $88.9 billion in Government spending for the coming financial year. The money spent on the flag referendum will account for about 0.0029 per cent of this budget.

So what else does $26 million get the tax-payer? Here are a few examples of similar expenses in the 2015/16 Budget:

*$26.8 million for development of Central City anchor projects for the Christchurch rebuild

*$27 million for the Crown's contribution to regional pest management

*$27.1 million for policy advice to the Ministry of Primary Industries

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/the-flag-debate/74003348/flag-referendum-where-does-the-26-million-go

Perhaps in Jafa land on 20 houses in Christchurch middle income parts 52 houses. In newer suburbs perhaps 130 houses but that is families not living in garages or caravans. 26 million may not seem much but is a lot of treatment of cancer sufferes who are told there is no money for treatment. Or for Students who,s classrooms are crammed and cannot get extra funding. Priorities not luxuries. A Nation is not wealthy by its flag or its richest but by how it looks after is most needy.

I grew up in the greatest place, in the greatest country, at the greatest time the world has ever known. I don't think it will ever be that way again.

Cheers.

Yeah, the 50's were a great time for white Americans.

I grew up in NZ and in the Southern Island. The families I grew up with were Brown and white and I did not know any different. I am glad I grew up in my Country because I learned and teach my children it is not the colour of skin or the accent that matters but how are person treats you. And as such it makes it so much more enjoyable for me to know live in a multicultural Society. Positive Change and diversity are good.

At least they went through the process

Would like to see Australia do the same

Every survey from the start said this wound be the result. Why waste the money.

If the survey indication showed any possibility of the citizens wanting a new

flag by all means, go through the process. Otherwise it is a waste of taxpayer money.

That's the point of a referendum and voting though... so everyone can choose to have their say. Not just 1087 people randomly surveyed..

You suggest elections are decided by a survey?

The point was every poll before the first referendum said Kiwis did not want to change the flag. Even though we have schools in desperate need of funding, Health needs. Housing crisis caused by 18,ooo houses lost in chch in 2011, plus Auckland burgeoning population. Our Government despite knowing we needed money on more urgent things chose to waste 26 million NZ$ (US$17) on a set of referenda most of us did not want. All to hide their corruption and Nepotism. Polling here is very good. The flag debate was a red herring to hide National ineptness and to big note John Key.

I believe those of us that were kids in the 60,s and teens in the 70's had it the best. Remember when we all felt optimism for the future when man walked on the moon in 1969. How free and easy life was. And then the 1973 oil shock, terrorism and the end of optimism. Up until 1980 life was pretty cruisy. After that New right economics, Friedmanitsm economic topsy turvy and life not so bright

Yeah the other choices weren't great. The Union Jack is OK but the bigger problem is the lack of distinction from Australia.

yep... very similar

Until New Zealand is assimilated as a new Australian territory, it can be confusing

It is more likely NZ will go to war with Australia rather than assimilate. Until they stop treating us like Mexicans are treated by the US. The disdain for Australia is very deep in NZ now

Deserves all he gets the scumbag . Threatening children with poison

Buddhism is the majority faith in Thailand but I hope they do not go down the path of declaring it the National religion. Better Secularism . You only have to look at Turkey to see what happens when you merge religion with the state.

But to add to what I posted earlier. Like many I have been on the merry go round but on the other side I have met plenty of People happy and in good relationships. Like anywhere it is a game and sometimes you win. Maybe you are lucky but be always be wary

No doubt about it my friend you were the love of her life. She is so lucky to have met. In love with that big thing in you pant. Sorry I mean your wallet. Slept with you first night. You and the other 6 guys will help put a new well in the village. Can you help with her sick mother. Has she sent you pictures of her sick in hospital yet. Stress of looking after her sick mother. And her child needs urgent Dental care. Oh Yeah a storm damaged the roof on her home.

Rather strong words calling People liars I may not know 100 thai people on a first name basis maybe 20-30 if I am lucky . And some do have a firearm as I do in my Country. And non of them that I know is a Criminal but Business people and Farmers. My understanding is even in some areas Farang may own Firearms though I have little use for one in LOS . You sir make assumptions.

Don't know about the pistols but the long guns look like pieces of crap. I believe he is a collector. But like playing bridge in Thailand, he should of got permission from someone high up.

My thoughts exactly. Most Thais I know have a gun just think he likes them. Just didnt grease the right palm obviously

I know at least 100 thai people on first name terms and not one of them owns a gun.

You're telling lies, unless your friends are all members of the police force, or you ingratiate yourself with criminals.

Then again criminals are usually bare faced liars so maybe you'd fit in well.

Don't know about the pistols but the long guns look like pieces of crap. I believe he is a collector. But like playing bridge in Thailand, he should of got permission from someone high up.

My thoughts exactly. Most Thais I know have a gun just think he likes them. Just didnt grease the right palm obviously

To me more of a person with an obsession for firearms and harmless enough although obviously illegal. For me if there were several automatic weapons of a Military nature would indicate something more sinister. I wonder who was jealous of them that dobbed them in. But the law is the law. Hope is nothing more than someone who loves firearms

Assad may not be a good person but Isil is far worse. The transition must be slow and Extremists kept out. Despite what some think I believe even the Iranians know this

This man murdered innocent children who is he to complain about human rights. While I support capital punishment I hope at the least he gets preventative detention until his expiry date. I think they should put pictures of all his victims on a screen in his cell 24 hours per day.

I would love to see him send his Troops across the Border. Not withstanding that the South Korean army would smash him to bits on their own. I suspect 75% perhaps more of his Army would desert for better rations

The Union Jack simply says where the basis of Government came from, The blue is the vastness of the Ocean. The Four Stars are where We sit under the heavens and hope for the future. My Grandfather and his Brothers served NZ WW1 with My great Uncle wounded with Wellington Battalion Gallipoli and then killed later a Ypres. My Father fought WW2 NZ Division. Over 30,000 died for their Country. In 2 word wars. Their names written in blood on Our flag. Those who scream for freedom from Our so called colonial past should think of their sacrifice . As to Our current MP,s claim it is too often mixed with the Australian flag. We have used Our flag in One form or another since 1869 like Australia not formally adopting until March 24 1902. How you can confuse our flag 4 stars and Australia's 6 stars. I will be voting for the status quo as do my family. As to the Republicans the current system allows for a Governor General to be picked from the General Public who is of Good Standing. This has allowed us Maori, Euro descent and Indian among many others. A Republic will mostly be a Rich White and the bs that is US Politics

In NZ for years we ran a subsidised minimum lamb price. I artificially inflated the price of meat and very nearly Bankrupted our Country. No one has ever been held to account for this or many other hair brained actions that have pushed us toward 3rd world status.

Thaksin and those who oppose him a two sides of the same coin. The difference is he let a trickle got to the poor masses. That he did wrong is not in dispute. But Thailand has suffered coup after coup since 1932. The coup was unneccessary but coming since the PT won the election. The Rice scheme a bungled attempt to manipulate a commodity price and profiteer. But not enough to remove an elected Government. How many of Our Govts would be removed if Our militaries be haved this way. The problem is the dumbing down of Thai Society. No level of corruption is acceptable. But democracy should give transparent Government. Not closed door deal. In my own Country we are dumbed down so back door deals are done. Thailand just needs to breath and grow. There are a great many good people there. They just need a voice

True that everyone is two sides of the same coin.

But I wouldn't say the Rice Scheme was not enough to remove an elected government, history has repeated itself, absolutely no transparency for 2 years regarding to this scheme, continue lies to the public with massive losses. Please name a developed country that repeated the same corrupted, loss ridden scheme twice? It would be interesting to compare the two. Subsidies don't have to be sustainable, but it shouldn't be this outrageous. In any developed country, the PM should have stepped down or be charged already!

Coup happen not because of the Rice Scheme though, it was due to contant violence and unrest in the city by both parties. So I think its misleading to think coup happened because they were against a populist policy.

http://www.cityu.edu.hk/searc/Resources/Paper/WP36_02_PasukBaker.pdf

This is also a good read for those that are so anti coup yet pro Thaksin. General Sunthorn Kongsompong head of the 1991 Coup was one the main reasons for Thaksin sucess in his telecommunication business.

Thaksin and those who oppose him a two sides of the same coin. The difference is he let a trickle got to the poor masses. That he did wrong is not in dispute. But Thailand has suffered coup after coup since 1932. The coup was unneccessary but coming since the PT won the election. The Rice scheme a bungled attempt to manipulate a commodity price and profiteer. But not enough to remove an elected Government. How many of Our Govts would be removed if Our militaries be haved this way. The problem is the dumbing down of Thai Society. No level of corruption is acceptable. But democracy should give transparent Government. Not closed door deal. In my own Country we are dumbed down so back door deals are done. Thailand just needs to breath and grow. There are a great many good people there. They just need a voice

He should have not asked amnesty almost everyone agrees that was the catalyst for the street protests. I am not saying the coup would not have happened, it might (no way to know for sure) as there as an other reason for the coup too. But I do know that support for the coup would be real low if not for the street protests and his amnesty. So he gave them the chance because he did not want to face the courts for all the other cases still pending against him far more serious as what he is convicted for. But hey.. just blame the military its easier.

you mean I misread the current "government" got amnesty too??? for all current deeds and future??? but you don't mention that but hey... just tell half the truth

The current government got an amnesty, because they had to react you could say they were forced into it. (or at least they can use it as an excuse because of Thaksins amnesty and the street protests). Kinda like defending yourself when a burglar gets into your house. Most people are excused then too unless they use excessive force.

No half truths from me at all his amnesty started it (or gave it the perfect excuse) that is a fact nobody can deny. That the current goverment got an amnesty is not something I loose sleep over at night. Just as I wont loose sleep over it if they are convicted for staging the coup. I have not much love for them, just prefer them over the previous government but not as much as before.

I would not say his amnesty started it. Thai people did not care if he got an amnesty or not in the same way nobody cares that the army got an amnesty. The army in collusion with Suthep just needed any excuse to get out on the streets and stir up trouble. It could have been the rice scheme etc etc

I think it does not matter the reason it seems to be when the "Majority" wins an election and corrupt or not they seem to be favoring the masses and not elite. Then the Military which is Traditionalist step in. Thailand does need stability. Thaksin is what you deem him to be. Yingluck but a naive puppet of her Brother. But a Military cannot solve a Civil problem. Thailand need to mature. Corruption and nepotism come from Apathy. All Our Countries are guilty of this. But for the Grace a few years could see our Nations role down similar paths

My wish for Thailand is for it to embrace true Democracy. Government of the People by the People. Some Say the people are not educated enough to make decisions. Then the task of those who say that is to make sure that all are educated. I do not mean brainwashed I mean academically enabled. Otherwise no matter what Government the current trends will continue. And Thailand is better than that

Global One world Government. the one who do not exist "Illuminati"

TPP will rob Thailand of the freedom it has now. Will the Thai Government give the Thai people a vote on joining it. Or will they as My New Zealand Government decided. We are not smart enough to make a decision on such and issue or any Social issue. Just dumb enough to select a Social Dictatorship every 3 years. Think hard before you decide Thailand.