wildewillie89

The problem is if they go hard on the teachers, then not many teachers would be left in the country. Of course, going hard is what we think is the right thing to do, but it would result in schools being closed. Probably needs to be a complete shift in culture/education - and then if teachers go against that then termination should occur. So rather than the schools taking the teachers for useless 3 or 4 day 'study' trips to the beach costing millions of baht, just have a educational seminar regarding this issue. Obviously must incorporate the police, as in Thai, public servants are all on the same level. So a police member is seen as almost like a colleague to a teacher. 
 

The other problem is the older generation controlling the culture of the schools. A young teacher fresh out of university started at my workplace not long ago. You could tell she was a hardworking individual who would not lay a hand on any students. However, seeing as every single other teacher does hit the kids, then it didn't take long for her almost to be forced into doing it herself. Almost like she would be looked down on if she didn't. Not many Thai have the strong will to stand up for things, especially if they are not officials yet as their job is generally not guaranteed. 

Sadly, it is also entrenched in the students minds. If a student misbehaves the rest of the class will tell you to hit them. Better just to take away part of their lunch time. Hitting is 5 seconds of pain, a lunch time is an hour of listening to all your friends have fun. But that would require some sort of effort on the teacher's part. We can all dream. I would suggest having a battle plan in place and a talk to the director if your kids are about to start school though.

11 hours ago, kunfish said:

I'd prefer to speak to Thais in English. I'm learning Thai outside of Thailand, but will only have a basic understanding to go shopping and such. Having been around people with English as a second language all my life, I feel I have a skill to communicate and understand pretty well what others are trying to say. This is can be an ego boost for them, a Thai person speaking English and communicating. Sometimes you run into Thai university students at random places, like temples, and you are asked to be interviewed and the kids get a kick out of the interviews while they practice their English. It's a lot of fun.

I get what you mean. I was pretty close with the Thai and Taiwanese communities back in Melbourne (when I knew no Thai whatsoever). Some people spoke good English, others didn't speak a word. You can rely on other forms of communication other than purely verbal. Naturally, the more time you spend with some people the easier communication got. Other people I was not close with in the community wondered how I knew exactly what they were thinking and they didn't, even though they could communicate with each other. You tend to pick up on small things like body language, facial expressions, emotions etc. 

Agree with the later part. I have been stopped numerous times in both Bangkok and the town (in Isaan) I live now to participate in interviews with students. Even when I take the dog to the vet, there will be the odd Thai in the waiting room who will attempt to communicate with me and ask me about my dog. The other day a guy walking his cows even introduced himself, that was the extent of his language skills, but he was keen to go out of his way to practice.

Yes, Thai is helpful. But by no means is it needed in everyday life by the majority of expats, or should be negatively pushed on people by other posters. 

Have been picked up by a speed camera, not in Khon Kaen, but a much less developed area. Mrs got the photo/fine in the mail. I have no doubt the ones in Khon Kaen work as the city is much more developed than many places that have working cameras. They make me slow down when I am there anyway. 

As for the crazy drivers, if they fall victim to a speed trap within the region of their family members jurisdiction, they can get off quite easily. If another region, not so easy. So many 'locals' may drive like that for those reasons. Also, a lot of the time the camera only capture one particular lane. The camera I got done for (not in KK) I have since been told all I have to do is drive in the other lane.

If the area near the 'restaurant' is surrounded by any government buildings it is very useful. Usually restaurants shout the officials a free lunch at the start, then the officials will come back most days. No risk of people not paying as usually they don't actually live in the immediate village, just work there. A lot of it I think is location. 

We sell our fruit from time to time, obviously the transaction is done through the wife and we get the same price as anyone else. Even selling our recycling the wife will get 1 or 2 baht extra (round up instead of them trying to round down). So would depend on your Mrs, rather than any 'farang' variable playing a part. 

Air quality has probably declined from where I was back in Melbourne. That is mostly due to people 'burning off' more than anything else though.

On the most part that has tapered off a little bit, still happens, but I had a good whinge to the people in my immediate area when I first moved. The Mrs put in an educational project for the villagers also converting their green waste into compost. A lot better now, but still a long way to go. At least the immediate area is pretty good now. 

On 28/08/2017 at 1:26 PM, Jip99 said:

 

 

Please don't say the dentist thingy is crap, you simply show your ignorance. My opinion is based on fact... of using dentists in Buriram, Prakhonchai and Surin  vs Dr Warin Leepai in Pattaya. Vastly superior. Maybe Ubon is different, I said beforeyour mileage may vary...

 

As regards food I can get all those you mentioned; nothing wrong with a la carte (your negative comment tends to label you) but I was simply referring to comparable quality and price.

 

Do you get out much?

 

 

Unless you have used every single dentist in those areas then it can hardly be 'fact'.

Many of these things are hit and miss. For example, on the most part, many of the doctors/dentists in my city (in Isaan) are rubbish. However, the odd one is fantastic. I had to go through 20 odd doctors to find my current doctor, but she is amazing. Paediatric Cardiology is her specialisation, but she has informed the hospital she will be the 'family' doctor, so also treats me as a GP - which is not the norm in Thailand. However, she is one of few I trust, has 'farang' thinking if you like. She goes out of our way, she has my full record, and says if I ever need to admit in a different hospital just to call her and they can discuss my history with her. I was admitted in a different city hospital and she actually rang the radiologist in that hospital to discuss my results over her weekend. 

She is extremely thorough with my daughter also. Although she works at the private hospital, if we need anything expensive done (expensive scans), she will book us into the government hospital and meet us there as she knows we have free medical at government hospitals. 

I agree with the premise that many aren't that good in Isaan, but I found the same in the bigger cities also. So it is really just searching for one you can trust wherever you are in the country. 

On 28/08/2017 at 0:45 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

Ah, this discussion about big dogs makes me nostalgic for when I was a doghandler in Antarctica. I had 24 Malamutes to look after. Now they really are big dogs. Broke my heart leaving them when my time was up. All the dogs in Antarctica were removed years ago, and the bases are the worse for it. Bl00dy bureaucrats.

 

boys do a lot better together than girls

Not mine. Same sex would rip each other up at any chance- fighting for supremacy and all that. I had to pair male and female on the trace to avoid problems.

Yep, many boy to boy have issues also. But more often than not it is a scuff up and it is forgotten about until the next one. Girl on girl is where vet visits happen, and the dogs will have issues forgetting the altercation. Although, of course, all breeds and all lines within the breeds are all different. There was some research done at the Animal Behaviour Clinic at the Tufts University Cummings School of Veterinary Medicine. Results found, of the dogs that came in from same household attacks, that 32% were male to male conflict and 68% female to female. To massively stereotype, maybe it is not to different from humans, guys usually get over things easier haha.

Would have been a fantastic experience living in Antarctica with the dogs. 

A video advertising this keeps coming up. Yesterday it had 90 comments, today 53 - so 37 people just decided to delete their comments over night haha...the ones remaining all positive of course.

3 minutes ago, GarryP said:

My assumption was that living in Thailand and being a Thai, your daughter will also learn Thai. Also she will most probably speak Thai with her mother so wouldn't it be good to understand what she is saying to others. About speaking Thai with you daughter, you are spot on. Speak to her only in English. It will greatly enhance her language ability. I am speaking from experience here as I royally effed up on this. My wife only spoke Thai so the only language spoken at home was Thai, and rather than bouncing from Thai to English with my son, I spoke only Thai. As a result my son is not bilingual, although he does has reasonable language skills. I will never forgive myself for this. 

We do not speak Thai in the house. As it is counter productive. She is surrounded by Thai with the family during the day whilst we are at work, and English at our home in the evenings after work. Of course, the Mrs will help her with the fundamentals, but yes, we speak English at home.

Ah, yes, your situation is completely different so I can fully understand your thinking now.

4 minutes ago, todlad said:

There is another factor here: it's what I call the "what did he say?" issue.

I speak almost no Thai and part of the reason is that whenever I try I am usually faced with laughter, blank stares or I am forced to repeat myself two or more times.

 

Of course, I could be total crap at speaking Thai so I get myself tested by saying what causes mirth and bewilderment to someone else and ask them to interpret what I just said and assess it on a scale of understanding ...

 

A very good example comes when I try to give our 1 Card number in Thai at TOPS. I have learned it perfectly and can say it clearly but it is very common for the check out operator to stumble when I try!

 

I accept the point about independence as perfectly fair and I have learned a lot more Russian by living over there than I ever will learn Thai, I am sure. For all of their faults, the Russians are more tolerant of a linguistic oaf like me and I happily did my shopping, travelling on buses and the metro there and could have basic conversations in all sorts of situations.

 

When I am out and about on my own here, my tactic is usually to start talking to someone in English and see what happens ... sometimes I am pleasantly surprised. I did this in Beijing a few years ago: as I am wont to do, I got lost coming out of a metro station, hopelessly lost. I walked over to a bus stop and just said loudly, does anyone here speak English. A young lady did and she solved my problem!

It is a tone language, so it is difficult for many. Just more added variables than something like learning Japanese. That is why I said many Thai do not necessarily understand when farang speak as the tones are all wrong, they just get the understanding from context. 

2 hours ago, GarryP said:

But you are not in that demographic so is your sole excuse that your wife can speak English? You are a young man on a new journey in your life. Shouldn't you be able to understand what your daughter is saying as she starts to learn the language. A perfect opportunity for you to learn too.

The assumption being that she will not be taught English? That I do not interact with her on a daily basis? That she is not of an age where were brain is still being wired? 

Again, I have no issues with naturally learning the language, as I have said many times. However, the time spent to learn the language at a competent enough level, that I will see some actual use for, I can see far better uses for to further develop my children...rather than myself. Those conversations I have with Thai people speak a sufficient enough level of English. Which is fantastic. Seeing as the kid will be surrounded by Thai on a social level, it would be counter productive as a bilingual student if I solely spoke Thai to her at a home level. 

Everyone obviously has different experiences/needs of course. 

1 hour ago, puchooay said:

The immersion method. That is how I learnt to speak Thai. There is no such thing as a difficult language if you use this method of learning. 

 

If the local language is the ONLY one being spoken then you will learn. 

 

I think your veiws on the Thai populatios' grasp of Thai has been distorted by the hiso crowd you appear to mingle with.

 

Nothing new there now,  is there? The haves putting down the have nots. 

 

 

I really don't have any issues with people who speak Thai, the issues is the expectations they feel they need to place on other members to learn it. Like I said, I have learnt some Thai. I am at a point now where I can understand basic Thai. However, the importance placed on members by other members to learn a level of Thai that is not that easy for many, I believe, is unjustified in today's society. To the members who have, fantastic, but it is not necessarily for the majority. It is why I likened it to the Pink ID, as many love that issue as well. Sure, it can help some people, but the majority get by just fine without it. 

As far as the immersion method, there is such a thing as 'difficulties' for some - numerous studies based around second language and brain MRI scans. Take the Australian Federal Police for example. Groups of officers go into full immersion mode and they pick the best officers to travel to the countries they need to go to. Some people pick it up easily, others fail miserably as one of my old tutors did. 

Seeing as it was the electoral commission that made the comments at the time regarding the level of Thai conversation required (re referendum), I don't think it necessarily extends to the people I hang out with. It was purely an issue that the department faced and recognised the country had failed its people in terms of education. 

But if we are to bring that up then one only needs to look at the international and national test scores. Thai students on average pass 1 in 5 exams. They do not score well on things like international PISA rankings (test is conducted in native languages). Unfortunately, that is one reason why the country is divided. The 'hiso' crowd do get some sort of structure in education, the rest do not - so even naturally gifted students sadly are failed unless put through a structured education. All it takes is a visit to the local school to see that. 

I think my views are not necessarily distorted, seeing as it deemed as a constant issue by various departments. I feel the level of Thai most farang can speak is just incredibly basic - which can only serve them so much depending on what they want to achieve. 

35 minutes ago, puchooay said:

Your last paragraph should contain adverbs of frequency. There are many expats who speak good Thai. I came her 19 years ago at 28 year old.  There was near zero English being spoken. In order to get on one had to speak Thai. 

 

I am more than happy to meet up and speak to your wife to prove the point that not all expats speak "weird Thai". 

A lot of expats speak a basic level of Thai that is understood by context, I wouldn't say many speak a 'good' or high level of Thai that is perfectly understood. I'm sure some do, but it would be the most tiniest of minorities.

But, again, that comes down to what people are wanting to communicate about. Many native Thai struggle with a lot of their own language. It is why Bachelor educated Thai cannot even pass the Thai component, but can pass the English to become an official. It was why the biggest criticism of the last referendum was the fact the native popuation wasn't educated enough to comprehend the conversation - regardless of political silences. 

Throw in the fact that most expats are over 50, and the undisputed science that learning a language is that much more difficult for that age, then the point stands. Incorrect tone/pronunciation would be found to be the majority.

If it comes down to taking 20 odd years plus structured learning to comprehend the more complex conversations (which isn't even enough for many Thai), then I think my original stance remains, a person does not be able to speak the language to live here. Unless, like I said at the beginning, they like to endure mind numbing conversations. 

Be respectful but firm and things will go your/wife way. Also talk logic, as much as many members don't like to believe Thai follow logic, if you can prove it to be an effective outcome they eventually do listen/change. 

Wife and I lived with the in-laws for a while. No dogs inside policy, but when I first got my dog I explained the situation/breed standard, the bond it initially needed and the benefits it will bring to the family. They let it sleep inside and to this day love hanging out with it when they visit. Won't play with their own Labrador or Pug, but will with this dog. They think it's human lol.

Family will respect you if you can stand up for not only yourself, but the Mrs and any future family also. They will see you as someone who can look after the family in a loving sense and isn't afraid when it matters. Helped with me as I had a baby at the time so my decision was the final decision. Father in law respected that as he knows farang are more educated and generally do things in a safer way.

Westernising shouldn't cause friction. I wouldn't physically leave the drive way unless all members, including mother/father had seat belts on. The first few times I literally sat in the car not moving until they put them on. I showed them the crash test videos as to why I was doing this and the risk to themselves/children they are causing. Now mother in law even wears a helmet for her village run on the motorbike lol.

5 hours ago, Michael Hare said:

Thoroughly agree with what Gary P said about the importance of learning Thai. This is in order to understand what is happening around one and not to be dependent on others to translate and help out. No need to be Thai language perfect, but at least have a basic understanding. In many instances over the years I have seen “farangs” totally relying on their wives to translate. That would be okay if the wives spoke, read and wrote good English. But in many cases they don’t. What I hear is some sort of pidgin English.

 

What I don’t understand is this. Here we have retired farangs who can not speak Thai. They either don’t have enough time to learn Thai or can’t be bothered. At the same time they can not even be bothered to teach their wives proper English. What do they talk about together?

I think it is a massive oversimplification. I had to work with a group of 50+ age group not long ago, it is not easy trying to teach them. The brain's ability to absorb new information is on its last legs and some people just find it difficult to learn a new language. It has got to a point where a simple brain scan now can determine the success of someone learning a new language - why age is so important as the brain is still being wired.

You will get your odd success story that I'm sure someone will come along and say, but the majority of cases don't work out like that. It is explained by science, not how much one can be 'bothered'. 

Obviously people marry for various reasons, doesn't mean we should look down on them. It's a choice they made, they will have to live through potentially certain more stresses for that choice, but obviously they find some sort of comfort in the choice.

For them to have a proper verbal conversation, the level of language they would need to learn is more than basic I would think. Most farang have picked up a basic form of Thai from the odd conscious memory (children/some young adults can pick it up through unconscious learning). I wouldn't constitute that as enough to have a half decent conversation for many. Would take some serious years/structured learning and still due to variables such as age will not work. 

Interestingly enough the weird English we hear is almost exactly the weird Thai that they hear when farang try to learn Thai. Usually they will pick it up from context, like we do, rather than accuracy of tone or correct pronunciation.

1 hour ago, wildewillie89 said:

Expectations about language are set by governments, not individuals. My friends have married foreigners in Australia and the government provided them language courses. My sister now lives in Sweden, she was provided language courses. Thai is more about the number in the bank account.

Again personal circumstances are all different. A trip to a hardware store usually takes either walking around for 5 minutes or a simple image shown on the phone and the 4,000 staff can take you to where the product is. Other things mentioned are really not my focus/interest, or are so irregular they are insignificant. 

My focus, especially since having kids and animals in risky environments, is more science related issues. Best times to vaccinate your children, dogs etc. Seeing as the majority of 'Bachelor' educated Thai people can pass the English component of the Thai test and NOT the Thai language component, then I know the level of Thai I would need to speak to discuss these things would take a long time to learn. So I discuss them in English. 

Again, I think well done to those who can speak Thai. Some people can pick the basic form up. Even just living here you will pick up bits and pieces, I am unfortunately at the point now where I can understand a lot of topics of what is being discussed. However, I just feel the negative views that always come up on this forum re language are completely unjustified. It is like the pink ID, maybe can help you but by no means is it needed. 

Having a Mrs who ranked second for Thai language in M6 (in the country) and has since been used by the government in Malaysia regularly and for educational news purposes due to her language skills, the general reaction by her from farang who claim to speak Thai is one of a complex look. It is by far not an easy language to fully get. Just look at the last referendum for example, even half the native population weren't educated enough to comprehend a yes/no question. 

Thai test to become an official*.

I also would like to thank you for your wishes :).

35 minutes ago, GarryP said:

If I intend to live in a foreign country, I believe I should at least make some effort to learn the local language.  And from my own experience I have found life so much easier since I learned the language. Perhaps the examples I gave are not so applicable to you, but aren't car repairs, trips to hardware stores, understanding what officialdom requires, etc. important parts of our lives. You can own a car as a foreigner, so insurance and registration can be in your name.  Also, I definitely do not wish to rely on others for everything and have to use someone else as an interpreter of what is being said.  

 

I think as you drift through the threads on TV, you will find that quite a lot of people have become too reliant on their wives, and do not know what is going on around them because of this. Their wives also do not translate all that is being said and can be very selective in what they reveal. This becomes a non-issue once you speak the language. I am not saying that all wives are bad, but a good number of the sad stories we read about foreign men losing everything and being kicked into touch by the wife involve foreigners who cannot speak the language, are totally reliant on their wives for nearly everything and do not know what is going on around them.  They have lost all independence, something that both wives and husbands need to retain to a certain degree. 

 

Having said that I wish you all the best in your life with your wife and new child.  You certainly seem to have landed on your feet and are off to a much better start than most of us.   

 

Expectations about language are set by governments, not individuals. My friends have married foreigners in Australia and the government provided them language courses. My sister now lives in Sweden, she was provided language courses. Thai is more about the number in the bank account.

Again personal circumstances are all different. A trip to a hardware store usually takes either walking around for 5 minutes or a simple image shown on the phone and the 4,000 staff can take you to where the product is. Other things mentioned are really not my focus/interest, or are so irregular they are insignificant. 

My focus, especially since having kids and animals in risky environments, is more science related issues. Best times to vaccinate your children, dogs etc. Seeing as the majority of 'Bachelor' educated Thai people can pass the English component of the Thai test and NOT the Thai language component, then I know the level of Thai I would need to speak to discuss these things would take a long time to learn. So I discuss them in English. 

Again, I think well done to those who can speak Thai. Some people can pick the basic form up. Even just living here you will pick up bits and pieces, I am unfortunately at the point now where I can understand a lot of topics of what is being discussed. However, I just feel the negative views that always come up on this forum re language are completely unjustified. It is like the pink ID, maybe can help you but by no means is it needed. 

Having a Mrs who ranked second for Thai language in M6 (in the country) and has since been used by the government in Malaysia regularly and for educational news purposes due to her language skills, the general reaction by her from farang who claim to speak Thai is one of a complex look. It is by far not an easy language to fully get. Just look at the last referendum for example, even half the native population weren't educated enough to comprehend a yes/no question. 

34 minutes ago, transam said:

I have been to kids English seminars in Isaan for a bit of fun, just so they can hear a Londoner talk........I can tell you the controllers have a problem conversing with me with my best English....

Yep, most English teachers are shocking. The actual officials for your everyday stuff aren't that bad as generally to get that level of education in the first place they had a structured education, and keep more up to date. Explains the class disparity in the country if you like.

Where it falls down with teachers is that the education union is quite strong here compared to other departments, so officials within it are incredibly lazy/couldn't care less so go backwards very fast. 

Generally, there is at least one good English speaker in each office. My wife deals with all farang issues at her government workplace for instance, even if it has nothing to do with her portfolio. And if there isn't, then I'm sure members partners can take the few minutes out of their time once or twice a year. Not a huge deal.

Just now, GarryP said:

Perhaps you can get pretty much all you need without speaking Thai, but I do not want to be dependent on others. Take your motorcycle in to the local bike mechanic and try explaining the problem in English - it doesn't work. You need to take a Thai speaker with you. Go to hospital and talk to the doctors,  while many speak English to one level or another, you will find that if you are decent in Thai language you can often get much more information from them instead of just the basics. I have found that most doctors are relieved when they know I speak Thai and open up a lot more.

 

Renewing my motorbike registration and insurance, communicating with officials at the local district office, land office, etc. is no longer a frustrating experience and one where you need to rely on others. I do these things myself and do not need to be dependent on my wife. 

 

PS I barely speak with my neighbours, just smile, nod my head or say good morning.

 

Sure, when you get here, you can live comfortably enough without speaking the language, but as you live here longer and you invest time in learning the language to a reasonable level of competency many more things open up to you. It becomes a different place.    

The doctors I consider of a competent enough level to treat my family and I speak very good English. Even when I take my baby in for vaccines the doctor speaks to me about her development, not my wife. They love it, as they do not get to do it on a daily basis. Many will also ask for your services to help out their children so a good, close relationship is formed that is purely based around 'English'. 

All of those things you mentioned are not tasks that rely on people. They are quick tasks, tasks that are performed once a year that are actually directed at the Mrs anyway - as other than potentially vehicles, they are in her name. Anything more important should have a conversation before a decision is made anyway. 

In saying that, I can go up to my local government offices and speak English. I work for the city Tessaban, and on the odd occasion do work for my own Tessaban also. For those who are really having trouble with it, they probably find they can just write down the problem. As government officials have passed the English test so can write, but have just had no experiences with speaking. 

Like I said, people need to weigh up the pros/cons. For some, being able to speak Thai will be a huge advantage, but it seems the theme on this forum is very negative towards the people who don't. Which I really cannot comprehend why, as again, for many it is not that difficult to get by everyday life without speaking Thai. 

2 hours ago, Keesters said:

You asked about your rights and that is what I shall attempt to answer here. It depends on where you live. Dogs control is under the Tessabaan (City) not the police. In both Pattaya and Bangkok it is illegal to have your dog on the street unleashed. Any damage / mess it produces must be cleaned up by the owner. Of course that sound silly when there are thousands of stray/soi dogs running around but TIT. If your neighbor lets her dogs out for toileting / self exercise she is breaking the law. In Pattaya I have successfully  had the city authorities call and warn errant owners. In all cases the dogs and sometimes the owners have disappeared shortly after.

 

 

 

It may well depend on where people live (sometimes 'tourist' areas have different laws - but for non-tourist areas the laws are as follows).  Dog control comes under two different headings - if the dog has an owner or if it does not. If the dog has NO owner then, yes, it is a Tessaban matter. If the dog has an owner it is a police matter. In this case the dog has an owner so it is a police matter. 

That is why in the news when you hear about attacks it is the police or the Amphoe that deal with it, never the Tessaban - unless a stray/feral dog. Amphoe can deal with situations like this as they are in charge of heads of villages, so therefore are able to offer some services to the community. 

Although many Thai are unaware of these laws so sometimes by inference think they will get in trouble. For example. I was bitten by a neighbours dog (has bitten many people). The neighbour re-homed the dog as my father-in-law is the Mayor of Tessaban so he thought he would get in trouble. Legally, the only way he could get in trouble is if I informed the police. 

Re the leash/mess needing to be cleaned up. Again, a police matter in most places. Police advertise the penalties regarding doggie accidents in public and how much the fines are - not Tessaban. Tessaban have no real powers to fine people in non-tourist places. Even if something does fall within Tessaban jurisdiction, they contact the police/courts to prepare the fine. 

Tell the head of village to go and have a chat to them. They probably will not listen, but saves going to the police if they do listen. If nothing changes, then contact the police (head village could even do it for you).

Generally, most areas the local authorities (Tessaban), will only act on the dog if the dog does not have an owner. Seeing as this dog has an owner the local authorities will more than likely tell you to talk to the police. Police will warn the owner, and then fine them if they do not change their ways. If it is a big problem (ie a menace to society), some District Office/Amphoes can sometimes help with their services to the community (as boss of Amphoe is in charge of all heads of villages). Others will be lazy or deem it not a big enough problem and tell you to go to the police. 

8 minutes ago, anto said:

 

It all sounds just a little bit too perfect .Anyway good luck with it .I am imperfect myself and so is my Thai wife .We probably balance each other out in our imperfectness .And being rather naughty and evil we occasionally drink alcohol ,but do not smoke  .I don't have a Degree ,nor does my wife ,but she does have a profession ,and her own business .Been together 8 years .Still going strong ,but occasionally have arguments ,which blow over within a few hours .

Oh we fight like all couples do. That is why I said the travelling was important. To learn how to effectively communicate whilst fighting. Rather than just moving, having the stress of a new country on top of fighting. Once I literally sat her down on the pavement of a 7/11. Was a good way of taking the heat out of the situation as it was such a random thing to do, communication became a lot smoother. No one is perfect and many people have different ways to make things work, this is just my personal experience and what I found good things to look for.  

3 hours ago, cyberfarang said:

You should write a book on how you achieved great success in Thailand where so many others have failed.

People just need to be smarter the way they do things. I travelled all around the country with the Mrs before moving here, even the insurgency in the deep South where she was working at the time. It does two things, gets all the travelling out the way, but also teaches you about each other. What stresses each other, how reliant you will be on one another, and how you deal with conflicts. It also serves as a good time to meet the friends. I am closer to some of her friends than she is now. Will help the guy with the family when it is time to marry as the friends are also considered daughters so they will go into bat for you.  

Thai are very generous. Of course I have dated women who were money focused, but those dates should only last the one night. If a Thai has a job, and is solely interested in the guy and not what he has, they will always either offer to pay full or at least their share for the date. They will pay for their share for something as small as an 8 baht bus ticket, or a 250 baht dinner - just like they do if go out with Thai friends. And most importantly will not expect 'gold' lol. A few farang teachers here had gfs, they always bought them gold. I bought my Mrs a blender for her birthday to help make the baby food.  

I like at least half intelligent girls to converse with, so I generally used to try and meet girls who graduated from one of the better universities here (as we all know the poor standard of education). It meant the girl was either naturally bright, or she had come from at least a middle class family to get a half structured education. Private universities didn't do much for me as many buy their way through. Written English should be comprehend-able if she got a reasonable education, however, spoken English should not be amazing due to a 'lack of interaction' with foreigners. I got lucky, the Mrs scored second highest in Thai language in the country in M6, so had a natural connection to languages so didn't take long for her English to develop. If a girl speaks perfect English, she generally has met a lot of guys in my experience. That is when Thai girls being famous for their 'giks' I think comes into play. 

If a high education then it will result in a good job, which results in the ability to be able to get a home loan (which is difficult for most in Thai). We. as foreigners, do not have legal rights to housing here, so I cannot justify paying for one. 

A poster mentioned earlier about how some girls do not reveal themselves. The Mrs is cute, but the first time I went to a nightclub with her she got dressed in everyday clothes. She literally did not have a dress. So the next day we bought one. She couldn't look anywhere but at her feet whilst on the BTS out of embarrassment (took her months to feel comfortable). We do not drink, but we got a free drink with the entry, she was gone just off that. So I new that she was definitely not a party girl. 

Finally, the family. The father-in-law does not drink or smoke at all. Worked hard his whole life and earns the combined salary of the wife and I combined. So he promised me when I moved here he would never expect money off me, including Sin Sord (even though he did have debt at the time). I told him straight up that I would never give him money. He pays for many things for our daughter like extra vaccines etc, will pay to have our garden maintained, cars washed etc. Is now wanting to buy us a bigger car with the second child on the way (already bought the Mrs a car that I drive and she drives his second car). Extended family should also go into bat for the guy after marriage. Numerous times uncles and cousins have told people to go away if they ever bring up the topic of farang/money. 

I think many guys fail as they choose someone too young, someone they cannot effectively communicate with, or they choose to live in 'tourist' areas so run out of money. Also education is important here to be able to navigate your way around government systems. My Mrs is a government official anyway so it is very easy for her, but it seems many find it difficult on this forum and the wife doesn't seem to be able to work it out for them. 

10 hours ago, cyberfarang said:

Right, you was in your early 20s. It`s a totally different game for the over 50s guys. To be honest when I was in my 20s and 30s in the days before the Internet took off, I did not need to try and find girls on dating sites, in those days I had no problems pulling birds, either at parties, in discos and pubs, at work, and even local girls from my neighbourhood, and I wasn`t a particularly good looking guy either, but still found it relatively easy to get dates with girls. I can remember my phone hardly stopped ringing, people inviting out and to parties, then once I reach 50 it all sort of faded away, which happens once we start getting old and probably why the older crowds feel a need to join dating sites. But I wonder why young guys would want to join dating sites. Do they lack confidence or due to their addictions of the social media have lost the art of interaction in the real world?

I had too much fun doing that back home. I purely moved to Thailand to slow down before going to an early grave. My dad hates I live here but thinks it probably saved my life. Best way to meet someone living in a different country is online dating.

Now i have a daughter and a son on the way. A easy going job, big house and a couple of dogs.