Tod Daniels

I passed over the book called "Everyday Thai for Beginners" by Wiworn Kesavatana-Dohrs for ages at the bookstores only based on the title. Once I actually looked at it (and could read basic thai); I saw that it was quite an in depth book about proper thai language structure, situational thai vocabulary and conversations. It won't teach you to write, but man, if you have a spare thai handy about the house, it can teach you to read thai. Sadly as there is no pronunciation guide and the script is only in thai with the english translation, if you can’t read at least a little, it’d be a tough row to hoe.

The first three Benjawan Poomsan Becker books (get them with the c/d, not the stand alone ones; and her "Speak Like a Thai" c/d's with booklets are so well known internationally that they almost deserve their own thread. The Beginner and Intermediate have her method of engrish transcription, but the third book; Advanced, has just the RID's thai pronunciation in it.

I honestly doubt any other thai national has made such a concerted effort to target foreigners in learning the thai language. (FWIW: I doubt any other thai national has reaped as great of financial rewards Benjawan has either. But hey, that's why she's in business, so she can't be faulted for making money!! ). She hasta be one of the most well known 'learn thai' authors out there.

The old AUA two text book series is worth picking up. They are aptly named; "Reading and Writing". There are two books, one is blue; has a "W" on the cover and says 'workbook, mostly writing', the other is red; has an "R" on the cover and says 'text, mostly reading'.

I just returned from Kinokuniya Books at Siam Paragon, and there is NO shortage of books in their section about the thai language. Go to almost any large bookstore, pull up a chair and browse thru them to see what methodology is a good 'fit' for the way you learn things. A book I might find totally incompatible to my learning style, you might luv, an vice versa.

Good Luck

Would you be open to the possibility of T/V thai language learners forming a ‘thai conversation’ class? Something where you could teach a small-ish group (5-7 students) who have relatively the same level of thai a more conversational thai based program.

I’ve found over all, after touring more thai language schools than I can even remember that most thai conversation classes are quite lacking in both substance (material), and quality (something I call “bang-4-the-baht”) .

The ones I remember with the most distaste were ones where the teacher spent the better part of the class spouting her views to the class, (valueless) and there was very little actual conversation going on by the students.

The other equally meaningless ones were conversations about “thai-culture”. I have yet to see how knowing anything more than basic politeness (in any society) equates to a better understanding of the language. IMHO I feel ‘thai cultural indoctrination’ is something you don’t need to know, to speak polite thai, by any stretch of the imagination. I have also found it often holds no interest for some foreigners; as we’re pretty much “exempt” from the rigid cultural ‘rules’ which thais follow.

If a class program could be designed where some article or short story is read, and then discussed I think it could be a real benefit to raising everyone’s conversational abilities past the ‘routine pleasantries’ or ‘mundane yes/no question’ level.

What do you think schoopinij?

Would you be up for undertaking something like that?

FWIW: some of the threads on here posted by more advanced members of the Thai Visa Language Forum leave me shaking my head, too. EVEN after I run the thai words I don’t know thru a translator or dictionary. So never ever let that be an impediment to asking anything.

As an aside; in my younger days when I ran training classes for an international company in the US, I would write on the whiteboard; “There is no such thing as a stupid question; only stupid people who ask questions.” Obviously it kept the questions to a minimum. It was meant more tongue in cheek, to set the tone of my classes rather than to stop genuine questions.

Now that I've 'tempered' some due to my age, I firmly believe; "The only stupid question; is one you don't ask."

Like I said earlier; often the simplest questions on here get the best and most insightful responses.

Ask away. ... ..

If you have an Ed visa and are being honest <SNIPPED>

Again, more "worthless words 'o wisdom" about ED visas from the new ‘expert in residence’; "Colabamubai" . How did your response answer any of the questions the O/P asked?

Wait, aren't you the guy who paid for 6 months worth of classes at a private thai language school here in Bangkok, yet received a Multi Entry YEAR LONG Non-Immigrant Type-ED visa from somewhere in Canada? My question is; are you still attending school or was your remark "if you are being honest" meant as a rhetorical question? Kind of a pot/kettle question, doncha think?

ANYWAY: BACK ON TOPIC TO THE O/P

What ever neighboring country's thai embassy or consulate you decide to go to (and I think from Chiang Mai, you could go to Vientiane just as easy); with the proper documentation from your school you'll get another Single Entry Non-Immigrant Type ED visa without any problem. You’re far from the first person whose ever neglected to purchase a re-entry permit before leaving, thereby canceling your existing ED visa.

Just remember this time; IF you decide to leave BEFORE you extend the new visa after 90 days BUY a re-entry permit. ..

<SNIPPED>

Suck it up all ready, it's not like they are calling you a "kee nok farang". ..geez.

Actually, if we're gonna start writing thai in engrish, the term in thai is ฝรั่งขี้นก, which for people who can't read thai is pronouced in engrish like (fa^L rang^L khee^F nohk^H), but then again WHO cares (especially on this thread). Really though, either get the idiom right OR don't write it!! ..

And now back to the pissing match already in progress. ..

BUT, the previous post goes under the assumption that a person ALREADY knows the 'class' of the thai consonants. ..

Now for someone like me, (a person who NEVER learned the thai consonant classes), and only learned to recognize thai words by rote, do these rules narrow the choices down??

FWIW: I can't be the ONLY foreigner who can read and understand most written thai (by understand, I mean; being able to back translate the words to engrish and/or understand what is written in thai), yet only having learned thai words by recognition when I see them written, but who never learned the three classes of the thai consonants. Or am I the ONLY one who learned to read like this???

I know, after being able to read thai, (even at my low level), a sensible person might think I could memorize the consonant classes, but they just DON'T STICK in my head. ..

I’m still interested about if these basic ‘rules’ to discern toning in thai words holds true; as it would cut my guessing by at least half . ..

Any of the “heavy weight” thai language pundits wanna weigh in on what I snipped from the blog about it and posted earlier???

Don't be dismayed, tod. Most foreigners in Thailand are not able to read at this level. And from here, the only way is up.

For as many foreigners as Ive met who profess to live here, that sentence really makes me SO SAD. ..

This is their country, their language, &lt;deleted&gt;??

Thank frickin' God the only way is up. ..

Tod_daniels..................well you have voiced your opinion and quite frankly I disagree with you 100%

I assume as you consider it some sort of prank you won't be posting on this thread again <SNIP, SNIP, SNIP>

Hey, LOOK I'm posting again. ... and on this thread too . .. (Will wonders never cease?)

I honestly doubt if this poster is for real, but. ... Be that as it may , I sincerely hope she finds someone new; as the guy she’s saddled with now is a LOSER any way you read it.

FWIW: I saved her Jatujak addy just so I can go out there next weekend and see if indeed she has a shop there.

It has been my experience, having spent far more time than I care to admit, guiding clue-less foreigners all over that frickin' place; IF a thai has a shop at Jatujak Market, either they have a big bankroll (if they don't sell shit ) or they actually make money out there. Really, all in all, the turn over isn't too bad (given how big it is). Plain and simple, you either make money or you don't, and there's not a lot of "middle ground". They weed out the stores that can’t make the ‘cut’ pretty quickly.

For the foreigners as well as the thai nationals (that can actually read an ENGLISH LANGUAGE ONLY forum) who I've irked with my posts; sorry about that, deal with it, or take it to your grave.

I am sincerely sorry my posting penchants run closer to the "thai bashing" side of the line than the more ‘we-b-thai’ politically correct side, but. .. With that in mind, I've tried to reign in my errant postings which stray over the 'imaginary line' in the proverbial 'sand'.

BTW: I totally agree with the poster known as “NaiGreg”: thais are people too, no better and no worse than any I’ve met the world over.

I guess, anywhere you go; you take the good with the bad.

<SNIP> Man, you guys have got issues.

Hey go easy there, I 'resemble' that remark . (Although thanx for the compliment in your post. If indeed reminding you of youself is a compliment to anyone other than you) ... ...

And by being racist against other thai nationals, what I meant was; they'll slag another thai off as soon as they walk away. On this we must agree to disagree.

Personally I'm not here to win a frickin' popularity contest with either the ever smiling, yet diminutive, 'indigenous natives', nor the miscreant foreigners who seem to populate the glorious "Land 'O Thais". ..

I quit caring a long time ago what people thought about me, whether they voiced it to my face or behind my back. Then again, I'm just that way.

One of my favorite t-shirts (other than my KISS t-shirts) is one which says "I ain't here to impress none 'o you muther-f*ckers."

And no, I’m not ‘talking down to you’; I’m trying to talk to you on my level. Gimme your hand, I’ll pull you up here. …

<SNIPPED> I've seen this kind of thing before in Thailand. <SNIPPED AGAIN!!!>

Kinda "casting dispersions" <sic> I meant 'casting aspersions' with a rather wide net there aren't-cha buddy ? If I might actually use the edit function and reprint a part of your post I think it could just as easily read;

I've seen this kind of thing before in Thailand. A Thai woman who feels the need to stick with her cheatin, lying, cheap charlie, and abusive THAI BOYFRIEND, only does so for one reason--she has no other options.

There are far more thai gurls stuck in worse relationships with their thai boyfriends than will ever be with foreigners here.

I still doubt this post or the poster is for real . Sadly, I couldn't even make it thru her 'last post', as it was just too horrific of thai-engrish At least she stuck with one color for the post .

Still, that's what makes T/V the go to forum for 'all-thingz-thai'.

Here's some thai-engrish 'chat-speak' 4 u "nansci45". Good luck 4 u in the future, have a long life 2, don't tink 2 mut. (But really, hang in there with the E/S/L classes ..

The way I think of กำลัง (gam^M lang^M) almost exactly like adding an “-ing” to end of a verb. It means you are currently do-ing it. It makes NO delineation between when you started or when you may stop; only that you are currently do-ing that 'activity'.

The word อยู่ (yuu^L) added after a verb which has กำลัง before it, is (from thai-language dot com); “a particle indicating the progressive tense or perfect tense”. To me this means, you started what ever verb you're doing at some time in the unspecified past, you are currently still doing what ever verb you mention, and you MAY continue to do it until some unspecified time in the future.

You will rarely hear a thai speaking 'street-speak-thai', or colloquially spoken thai who uses both กำลัง and อยู่ in the same sentence. It is my experience in eavesdropping on thais that they seem to "อยู่" a LOT more than they ever "กำลัง" .

Examples;

กินข้าวอยู่ (I'm) eating.

ดูที.วี.อยู่ (I'm) watching t/v.

เล่นอินเทอร์เน็ตอยู่ (I'm) playing on the internet. (Yes thais เล่น "play" on the computer or internet).

Don't forget that you can almost always leave the subject out (especially if you're talking about yourself) rather than using ผม or ฉัน (and YES, guys who are not gay, commonly use ฉัน among their close friends and family).

The way it seems to work is; UNLESS you differentiate at the beginning of a conversation or sentence you are referring to someone else, (or you're asking a question phrase) the thais will just think you're speaking about yourself. That's why sometimes it's frustrating to walk in on an existing conversation because the people talking already hashed out who they're talking about, and you don't have a clue.

On my Rosetta Stone cd they use "gam lang wing yoo"

Rossetta Stone doesn’t teach anything remotely resembling ‘street-speak’ or colloquially spoken thai; but polite, ‘proper’, medium level thai using pretty correct structure. Something that gets much more relaxed in a ‘street-speak’ environment.

Still FWIW: I'd still urge the O/P to at least peruse the thai-language dot com link I provided early on in this thread. I think most if not all the subsequent questions coulda been answered.

But again, not an uninteresting topic.

Sorry to the O/P, (evidently) known as "Nancy". ..

I hadta stop reading when the color changed to purple, as it was just toooo painful to even attempt to plow thru in thai-engrish . Although I concur with 'bkkjames'; it was a very 'colorful' first post.

Here's a thought; IF, in fact you're really a thai-gurl (or even a ti-ger), post this same thing on the T/V Thai Language forum in THAI. I think it'd be a far easier read than this mangled slow-motion-train-wreck of an engrish post.

FWIW: don't rely on Google Translates, or your ‘talking-dic’ so much, BUT certainly stick with those E/S/L classes; they'll pay off eventually.

I imagine if I had managed to get thru the post it could have brought a tear to my eye too, but then I'm known to cry easily.

Welcome to the T/V forum Nancy. If in fact your story is true, my condolences, and if this is a troll, man you have way tooo much time on your handz, get a life ..

I have personally seen it go both ways out at Changwattana. Sometimes they'll do the visa conversion (2000baht), AND the yearly extension (1900baht) in one felled swoop.

However more times than not, they do the visa conversion (tourist to non-o single entry 90 day) and tell you to come back when there's a month left to secure the yearly extension of stay.

It seems to be a crap shoot, and I can find abso-tively posi-lutely NO rhyme or reason on why sometimes it'll fly and other times it won't.

FWIW: I'm not quite sure about your 'two week' time frame dealy, but as I have pointed out, it is always a two STEP process from a tourist visa; first to a Non-O, then to the yearly extension of stay.

Did they issue you a Non-Immigrant Type-O visa with a 'permitted to stay' stamp of 90 days or what?

FWIW: the true meaning of the word ฝรั่ง can ONLY be interpreted via CONTEXT. Up country, in Nakhon Nowhere, where ฝรั่ง are thin on the ground, when a thai kid points and says to his mother แม่, ดูฝรั่ง!! (Mom, LOOK a foreigner!!), I take it with a grain of proverbial salt.

ANYWHERE ELSE in this entire country, especially a place with a high proportion of foreigners and my ears prick up to see what context the word is being used in. It can and is used in derogatory meanings in these areas; just as it can be an unambiguous term denoting a white foreign.

However the poser <sic> , poster known as SuperstarStatus obviously has a better take on all-thingz-thai than anyone else here compelling me to bow to his in-finite wisdom . ฝรั่งโง่เง่าเต่าตุ่นแน่ ๆ!

Now; trying to pull this totally hopeless thread, from the obvious "pissing match" it has degenerated into, back on topic I will stand by my assertions that;

The thais on average are some of the most viciously racist and prejudiced people you are likely to come across . Especially so against their own (as in AGAINST other thai nationals; who are NOT in their immediate circle of friends or acquaintances, not to mention people from any country they share a land border with to boot!). True they will be polite in interactions with others on the surface as it's an ingrained fault of their alleged cultural identity. However, once they're with their friends, or the other person's left, man you should hear some of the things they say. I mean it's truly mind wobbling.

I will not deign to comment about what the thais think of to what I like to call; "the myriad of mindless, sheep-like, 'wanna-b-thai' foreigners parading around in color coordinated shirts 'n snazzy rubber bracelets, hand-in-hand with their tattooed, gold-encrusted 'thai-in-tow") . That is the topic of another thread I'm sure.

Again we apologize for interrupting your regularly scheduled programming.

The post from July 30 has the names of "mái drii" and "mái jàt-dtà-waa" reversed.

Also they are all in the wrong order. The names are all from Sanskrit.

"èek" literally means "one" so it should naturally come first.

"thoo" = "two"

"dtrii" = "three"

"jàt-dtà-waa" = "four"

I was gonna point out the errors in the names and order of the tone marks in the post from July 30th too, but totally spaced it .

I also wonder(ed) about the veracity of the '4 rules' dealy about narrowing the guesswork in the toning of thai words. I ask that more learned posters weigh in and say whether these basic rules work or not ..

This is ripped shamelessly from the blog, (although I corrected and re-ordered them);

Rule #1

The first tone mark is; ่ , pronounced; ไม้เอก. The symbol somewhat looks like the small of a back, and when I injure my back, I’ll say ‘my back ache’. (I hope that mnemonic helps you remember the name.) When you see this mark, the word automatically becomes either a falling tone or a low tone, no exceptions. A 50:50 guess.

Rule #2

The second tone mark is; ้ , pronounced; ไม้โท. It somewhat looks like a toe, making the name easy to remember. When you see this mark, the word will always be either a high tone or falling tone, no exceptions. Another 50:50 guess.

Rule #3

The third tone mark is; ๊ , pronounced; ไม้ตรี. This mark, which I believe is only used for words taken from other languages, guarantees a high tone for the word.

Rule #4

The last tone mark is; ๋ , pronounced ไม้จัตวา. It’s a little plus sign, giving you the hint of something being added. In this case, using this tone mark guarantees the word to have a rising tone. There is one exception however, that being the word for noodles. Its written as ก๋วยเตี๋ยว (both are rising tones), but ก๋วย is pronounced with a falling tone. This is the only word I’m aware of that breaks this rule. I typically see this tone mark used for words borrowed/stolen from Chinese.

It has been my experience that ไม้จัตวา cannot denote any tone other than 'rising'. Even looking up ก๋วยเตี๋ยว in thai-language dot com yields; "guay^R dtiaao^R" as the pronunciation. This would lend me to believe that no matter how a word is spoken in casual or colloquial thai that ไม้จัตวา hasta denote a rising tone.

FWIW: I did find the 'basic rules' quite enlightening and if they actually work in practice, much more so given my discernment in toning unfamiliar thai words is quite horrific .

While quite honestly, the last thing the internet needs is another frickin' blog about something-’r-other it was of marginal interest, and I'll keep checking back to see if it gets any better. (I think a little better proof-reading BEFORE posting the topix couldn't be all bad either.)

Let me start by saying; by no means is my thai reading at a proficient level. This fact is evidenced by an existing post I made which other more learned thai readers said was about a ป.๔ (fourth grade) level. I do get by with things that interest me, just as if I am compelled to read a topic I have no interest in (like thai culture, tradition or history) my comprehension goes WAY DOWN .

I used thai songs, and TONZ of them to learn a lot of idiomatic expressions. Although you hafta be selective and early on try to stick with songs sung in bangkok thai (central thai; the official 'government approved version' of thai) instead of หมอลำ, ลูกทุ่ง, or songs sung in Issan, Lao, or Northern thai. I’d hear a song on the street ask a thai what it was and then come home to find it on You Tube. Then I’d either find the thai lyrics on a website or type the thai line by line off the song (a good way to teach yourself to type thai). After that I’d underline the words I didn’t know and start looking ‘em up, trying to guess the meaning of the sentence.

I've found for me, it all boiled down to memorization of thai words, and I mean hundreds and hundreds (really a coupla thousand) of them, to be able to get an idea of most things written in thai, even if the minutia eludes you.

Learning if it's an -ะ or a โ-ะ sound in between consonants was a tough one too. Again I just memorize the ones I come across routinely; (although there could be a thai language rule governing this that I am unaware of ).

The site thai-language dot com has quite a lot of stuff of interest. Here's an example;

http://www.thai-language.com/ref/consonants

Because the thai language is really a hodge-podge of MANY languages they needed to differentiate similarly sounding words by spelling, and some of the indic pali, sanskrit words which long ago were 'imported' into thai already had their own unique spelling which was used in the thai spelling. Factor in the HUGE number of engrish loan words popular in today's language and you've got a tough row to hoe, as far as getting a grasp of thai.

An example of two words which sound EXACTLY the same in spoken thai, yet have two completely different meanings is รถ (roht^H); car, vehicle, and รส (roht^H); of food, flavor or taste (usually said as รสชาติ). TOTALLY the same pronunciation in spoken thai discerned ONLY by context, but different in their spelling.

Once you make it past the transliteration or karaoke (thai written in engrish), and begin reading, the entire country opens up for you. Suddenly you're reading signs, adverts, menus, etc, and you notice 'short cut' signs on the streets (which your taxi driver thinks you can't read ), warnings about hazards at work sites, etc.

It has been a tough slog for me (and I've got a long way yet to go), but learning thai has been the endeavor which has provided me with the most 'bang-4-the-baht' here of anything I've undertaken.

Even if there is no dedicated beginners thread here, ask away, as sometimes the simplest questions garner the most interesting responses.

All I can say is DON'T give up, and DON'T EVER let learning thai get you down.

Again, thanx everyone for posting on this thread. It has been enlightening for me to see just how low a level I actually read at (much to my dismay. ..)

I routinely go to SE-ED Boox and peruse the teach engrish to thai book section, as it's been a good source of idioms, phrasal verbs, business words, etc. There are NO shortage of books written in thai to teach specific english grammar or phrases and they've provided me with quite a lot of vocabulary which I think woulda taken me a long time to come across in casual study/reading.

I just recently went back out to the Andrew Biggs Academy at Major Ekami and got some more of his books, as they give a 10% percent discount and it’s easy to get to for me.

He has a small ‘book’, really more like a ‘booklet’ which is called; “The Little Book of Questions.” It goes over the english words; Who, What, When, Where, How, Why, Which & Yes-No questions. There are some pretty good explanations in thai as well as english examples too. It’s a cheap one, and has actually increased my understanding and usage of those words in thai.

Although beware, sometimes thais will stare (more like gawk ) at you for being a foreigner, yet reading a book about speaking english which is written in THAI . Still the books are fairly easy to read, and often times good conversation starters when thais are curious enough to ask you about what your reading

So............ they nick you for a reentry permit on top of the TM7 <SNIP!!>

It goes without saying that an 'in-country' yearly extension of stay is only 1900baht, whilst the illustrious O-A multi entry visa (only available from your home country) is (per the thai embassy in L/A's website) $175.00 US!! (5600baht at 32 to the US dollar)

Factor in the 1900 for the extension here and another 3800 for a multi-re-entry permit and the difference is a whopping 100 BAHT.!! 5700 vs. 5600. .. Kinda splitting 'hares' <sic> , err hairs, here aren't we?

Plus with an in-country yearly extension of stay you don't hafta hop on back to your home country to secure another visa either . Although FWIW; I concede, you do get your 'second' year 'free' with just a border run before your O-A expires, so there is that advantage). But you still needed a reentry permit to keep your visa alive after the first year runs out should you decide to exit/re-enter the glorious "Land 'O Thais", it really becomes much ado about nothing.

So in retrospect; your comment "they" (as I imagine you mean thai immigrations) really don't 'nick' you for all that much, now do they?

did we have "Naa nuwer jai Sewer" หน้า เนื้อ ใจ เสื่อ, my personal favourite

Beautiful body, heart of Tiger (Beautiful but merciless)

Used to warn young Thai men about women who squeeze a house and car out of them and then dump them, on the wall at my local wat.

I alway think it's funny that certain Thai ladies have been playing this same game for centuries, it doesn't just happen to foreigners.

on Thai2English I got หน้าเนื้อใจเสือ literally translated (by Thai2English) as naa (face/front/top) neua (flesh/body) jai (heart/spirit/mind) seua (tiger) with 'wolf in sheeps clothing' as the meaning. Not sure I understand the 'naa neua' part, rhymes nicely of course, but i don't understand the use of the words, the sentiment, as sarahsbloke points out, is universal

p.s. I disregarded the 'meat/beef' option for the word เนื้อ

I didn't know for quite a while that the term หน้าเนื้อ is a 'compound word/phrase', which doesn't carry the meaning of either of its component words but has a different meaning entirely. (This is not actually all that uncommon in thai word compounds as there are many words you can't break down and glean the real meaning in thai by its base components. )

Yes it is composed of the word หน้า; face, front, going forward, etc, and เนื้อ; meat, contents, flesh, song lyrics, etc, BUT when used together they carry the meaning of "hospitable- and generous-looking (like a timid deer)". I think that is because the RID lists หน้าเนื้อ as ชื่อสัตว์ป่าประเภทกวาง อีเก้ง เป็นต้น; the name of a wild animal of the type deer; the barking deer (muntjac) for example.

Hence the term หน้าเนื้อใจเสือ is roughly "face like a timid deer; heart like a tiger". In engrish it could be called like thai-language lists it: "full of courtesy, full of craft", or as thai-2-engrish lists it as "a wolf in sheep's clothing". Both fit the meant meaning of the idiom. I also believe หน้าเนื้อ could be along the same idiom in the US “doe-eyed”, or a “big eyed, beautiful girl”.

Still any way you interpret it, it’s a good idiom and one which EVERY thai knows the meaning of. It’s even in a famous song done by the two thai superstars, เบิรต์ ธงไชย(Bird Thongchai) and เสก โลโซ (Sek Loso) called อมพระมาพูด (Even if you sucked on a buddha amulet when you speak, I couldn’t believe you)

FWIW: Here’s the song;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRLYG2HOURM

This song actually has some fairly accurate engrish subtitles too, so hats off to the translator (which wasn’t me!!). Notice how they chose the idiom “wolf in sheep’s clothing” as the engrish idiom for หน้าเนื้อใจเสือ . Also listen at the end when they repeat the words อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ because they also throw in อมวัดมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ (even if you sucked on an entire wat when you spoke I couldn't believe you).

FWIW: อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ has become another famous thai idiom meaning a person who is totally unbelievable.

And here’re the thai lyrics;

อมพระมาพูด - เสก โลโซ - เบิรต์ ธงไชย

เธอเดินมาหาทำหน้าเศร้า

เธอบอกว่าเราไปกันไม่ได้

เธอบอกว่าฉันดีเกินไป สำหรับเธอ

คำพูดเธอนั้นมันง่ายดี

ยังโน้นยังนี้ทำหน้าตา

ทำเหมือนว่าฉันเป็นผักปลาไม่ใช่คน

แสร้งทำเป็นดี

บอกไม่มี ไม่มีใครใหม่

อยากจะพักหัวใจ

ไม่อยากมีใครมาพัวพัน

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

หน้าเนื้อใจเสืออย่างเธอ

ใครเตือนไม่ฟังว่าอย่าเผลอมีใจให้

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

หน้าใสใจเสือเชื่อไม่ได้

ประวัติโชกโชนเชือดใจมากี่คน

เคยนับบ้างไหม

ถึงแม้ว่าฉันยังรักอยู่

ใครใครก็รู้ก็ดูออก

แต่จะไม่ยอมให้เธอหลอกอีกต่อไป

พรุ่งนี้จะขอไปให้ไกล

ไม่อยากเจอใครที่ใจดำ

จะไม่เชื่อคนที่น้ำคำจำใส่ใจ

แสร้งทำเป็นดี

บอกไม่มี ไม่มีใครใหม่

อยากจะพักหัวใจ

ไม่อยากมีใครมาพัวพัน

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

หน้าเนื้อใจเสืออย่างเธอ

ใครเตือนไม่ฟังว่าอย่าเผลอมีใจให้

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

หน้าใสใจเสือเชื่อไม่ได้

ประวัติโชกโชนเชือดใจมากี่คน

เคยนับบ้างไหม

แสร้งทำเป็นดี

บอกไม่มีไม่มีใครใหม่

อยากจะพักหัวใจ

ไม่อยากมีใครมาพัวพัน

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

หน้าเนื้อใจเสืออย่างเธอ

ใครเตือนไม่ฟังว่าอย่าเผลอมีใจให้

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

หน้าใสใจเสือเชื่อไม่ได้

ประวัติโชกโชนเชือดใจมากี่คน

เคยนับบ้างไหม

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

หน้าเนื้อใจเสืออย่างเธอ

ใครเตือนไม่ฟังว่าอย่าเผลอมีใจให้

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

หน้าใสใจเสือเชื่อไม่ได้

ประวัติโชกโชนเชือดใจมากี่คน

เคยนับบ้างไหม

เคยนับบ้างไหม

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

อมวัดมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

อมพระมาพูดก็ไม่เชื่อ

ไม่เชื่อ ไม่เชื่อ ไม่เชื่อ ไม่เชื่อ

Enjoy

FWIW; more thais than you can shake a proverbial stick at (as well as hordes of foreigners who marry thai nationals get married at; บางรัก (Bang-Rak). Especially as it has the thai word for 'love' (รัก) in it . It is trouble free to 'get hitched' there, as they deal with plenty of foreigners every day.

As an aside, the place in bangkok when thais want to go get divorced is; บางจาก (Bang-Jak), as it has the thai word for 'apart or depart from' (จาก) in its name. ..

And don’t confuse the ‘dog-n-pony show’ that is a traditional thai wedding with ANYTHING which is legally binding . You can register the marriage at ANY Amphur and BANG, you’re married. Conversely, you can have a thai traditional wedding, and you’re ahead nothing, except showing the village what a rich foreigner you are and giving ‘face’ to your soon to be extended thai family..

Here's one from the volume 2 of excellent Speak Thai book and DVD series:

Wan pra my mee hin deeo (sorry can't show the tones):

Buddist holy days no have time single

Meaning: Buddist holy days don't occur only once: This is akin to our english saying 'Every dog has his day'.

<SNIPPED>

Could it not also mean something like 'holy days are not only on that single occasion'? ie; don't just treat the holy days as holy but be mindful of them every day? or, every day is a holy day?

Every dog has his day, to me, means even someone who is treated like a dog will, one day, have the tables turned

Wan Pra mai mee hun dieow Day (for) Buddha (do) not have occasion single?

I've heard the idiom วันพระไม่มีหนเดียว many times in my travels thru-out the glorious "Land 'O Thais". Especially in conversations with older or what I call; 'career monx' , when the conversation veers into territory concerning the state of the thais today.

It is much less prevalent with the young guys who I call 'wanna-b-monx', or 'poser-monx' . You know the kind, they're the ones whose family makes a HUGE deal out of their son becoming a monk for a coupla weeks/months (only to have him 'wash out and sneaks back home in the middle of the nite).

I think the meaning of this idiom is far closer to the poster known as 'bifftastic' than what 'charlie10' is alluding too. I also believe the site thai-language has the meaning wrong as well, saying it means ‘tomorrow is another day’, but that's just my opinion based on how I've interpreted it in conversations with older thaiz.

I'm not to say that the up-country thais don't pay attention to the moon or go to the temple often. It is my experience that most everyone goes at least twice a month (at least to get the 'winning' lottery numbers from a monk .)

I just think that in this instance; I took this saying to mean, (and yes I am adding context to the very ambiguous 5 word idiom): "Just because it's NOT a buddhist holiday, doesn't mean you can forget the precepts all good buddhists should follow in their lives."

It's similar to the derogatory idiom in the US; 'a Christmas/Easter Christian', or someone who is religious on religious holidays and when it's not a holiday their beliefs take a back seat in their lives. Like saying; 'Don't just be a Christmas/Easter Christian. ..."

Like I said, I could be wrong, and I'm sure an email to Benjawan Becker would probably shed more light on it; as she has a fantastic support staff.

Still for the most part I've found idioms all over the world which mean nearly the same thing no matter the language of origin. I think they are all somehow 'interlinked' in the human psyche based on experiences every human goes thru; and similar to things like the 'great flood myth', etc.

Good thread though, quite interesting. ..

While I am NOT known for my posting etiquette, I want everyone to know that I love my Mom. Happy Mother’s Day to all!!!

Here is a song by (of course. ..) เสก โลโซ (Sek Loso) called แม่ (mom).

The song live is here;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSpCJ-2jNlI

The lyrics are here;

ป่านนี้ จะเป็นอย่างไร จากมาไกล แสนนาน

คิดถึง คิดถึงบ้าน จากมาตั้งนาน เมื่อไรจะได้กลับ

แม่จ๋า แม่รู้บ้างไหม ว่าดวงใจ ดวงนี้เป็นห่วง

จากลูกน้อย ที่แม่ห่วงหวง อยู่เมืองหลวง ศิวิไลซ์ ไกลบ้านเรา

คิดถึงแม่ขึ้นมา น้ำตามันก็ไหล อยากกลับไป ซบลงที่ตรงตักแม่

ในอ้อมกอด รักจริง ที่เที่ยงแท้ ในอกแม่ สุขเกินใคร

อีกไม่นาน ลูกจะกลับไป หอบดวงใจ เจ็บช้ำเกินทน

เก็บเรื่องราว วุ่นวายสับสน ใจที่วกวน ของคนในเมืองกรุง

คิดถึงแม่ขึ้นมา น้ำตามันก็ไหล อยากกลับไป ซบลงที่ตรงตักแม่

ในอ้อมกอด รักจริง ที่เที่ยงแท้ ในอกแม่ สุขเกินใคร

อีกไม่นาน ลูกจะกลับไป หอบดวงใจ เจ็บช้ำเกินทน

เก็บเรื่องราว วุ่นวายสับสน กับบางคน ที่ใจไม่แน่นอน

ลืมเรื่องบางคน ไปซบลงที่ตรงตักแม่

P/S; I am sorry I make the thai font large, I can't read it if I don't.

As an aside; I can't listen to this song without having tears run down my face.

Again, Happy Mother's Day to all of you..

Are you sure that isn’t the engrish word “pundit” just back translated into thai, from what ever language it originally came from?

FWIW: I have some ป.๔-๖ text books teaching thai, but the material is not of interest to me, so it makes for a very hard slog..

I prefer to read things that I already know the subject, and can guess the story line, but in and of itself; that is self defeating, as I will never progress.

Perhaps that is why I am stuck at the level of reading that I seem to be stuck on .

As an aside; I have seen thais outside my gate struggling to decipher the daily thai newspapers, and it seems more like a group effort rather than one person can read it and understand everything..

Then again, I may be around stupid thais. I dunno .

What I DO know is that they can read thai better than I can, for sure. ..

To the poser <sic> , poster known as “jayboy”:

FWIW; my definition of a “solicitor” and yours may differ by quite a bit.

In fact, in America there is NO such thing as a ‘solicitor’, seeing as it’s an engrish term. Either you’re a lawyer, and passed the bar exam in your state or you didn’t. .. Quite different ‘bars’ to jump over, doncha think “jayboy” ?

My advice is; “Deal with it or take it to your grave.. ..”

A solicitor who is a “London Lawyer” (or even an American Lawyer) carries NO weight here in the glorious “Land ‘O Thais”, unless that person’s thaied <sic> , I meant ‘tied’ into a “Thai” (run and owned 51%) Law Firm.

My post was NOT a B/S post, except that it cast doubt on your original assertions , which; as a know it all ‘20+ year foreigner’ here, who only deals with “high level thai firms” or what ever you want to call ‘em, you are the obvious “expert in residence”.

Again, we will all bow down when you pass by, and tug our forelock too !!

Is that good enough for you; especially after hi-jacking this topic SOO far off the O/P’s original thread?

And lest we forget the original topic of the thread; it was about how could a foreigner, who is a lawyer, secure employment here in thailand? What it wasn’t about, was this pissing match between know it all foreigners. ..

This is why SOOOOO many threads here get ‘de-railed’ and no one is the wiser . ..