1 hour ago, Walter Travolta said:

Nothing to do with my point whatsoever, unless you can prove me wrong with stats that show leaders of colour or gender other than white males on the left wing anywhere in Western politics, seeing my point was actually about left wing lies or virtue signalling conning the sheep for their votes. If you cant, I wont reply to something that takes my comment in a different direction than it was intended. I believe the Mods here call it going off topic. My comment about the Dems isnt off topic because it relates and aligns with exactly how the labour party operate, telling minorities how they are there for them and can trust them, yet when push comes to shove, they couldnt care less about them and then try and push the blame to the right haha - the world is waking up to all this BS. All the left want is their votes but now the left have been sussed, they have nowhere else to turn for votes, except the uncontrolled flow of immigrants from Mexico (USA) or the middle east and north Africa (into Europe), which has also been sussed

And the 2018 midterms was about the Dems being sussed, was it?

40 minutes ago, RJRS1301 said:

 think it is called quantative easing, they invested in more than government bonds. Essentially adding to the ever increasing debt burden for all 

I am not sure the debt is backed by much anymore.

 

The dollar is so strong that the US could pay negative interest rates on its t-notes.

The Trump administration is reminding people they can sign up for Obamacare coverage if coronavirus cost them their jobs — even as it fights to eliminate the law

• The Trump administration reminded newly jobless Americans they can still opt to sign up for health insurance under Obamacare on Friday.
• People who lose their jobs qualify to sign up for an Obamacare plan for up to 60 days...
• Trump recently refused to reopen the federal exchanges for people to obtain health insurance, even as 10 million Americans filed for unemployment last month.

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-administration-obamacare-coronavirus-health-insurance-job-losses-2020-4

3 hours ago, Logosone said:

America is truly a free country. God bless America and the freedoms you stand for. If Trump doesn't want to wear a mask, it's his prerogative. As Prof Wieler has clarified, there is no scientific evidence that they work.

Nonsense. If the government speaks with a disunified voice that sends a message. Next thing you'll be saying is that it's okay for people to attend mass meetings if that's what they want to do. 

34 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

Not nonsense. What you posted is true. What I posted is also true. So no, your response does not preclude any other truth from being the truth.

 

But using your logic, Texas, which has a nearly 50% higher population than New York, should have much higher rates of infection. DFW is a HUGE,  international air transport hub. Granted, New York has a very high concentration of people. Still, what about the population?

 

As far as you complaining about red states, just look at where most of the hot spots are. BLUE STATES. and how do you explain Louisiana, lower population, lower concentration and not very international, being one of the hot spots? Seriously, with blue states dominating the hot spot list, you're complaining about red state responses?

 

Now let's get specific on my claims.

 

1) Was encouraging people to party for Chinese New Year nine days after travel restrictions and declaration of a national health emergency a smart move? Yes or no?

 

2) Was Bill Di Blasio encouraging people to hang out in bars on March 13 a wise move? Yes or no.

First of all, it's interesting how you focus on Chinese New Year. It was foolish for people to be in crowds anywhere. But why do you focus on Chinese New Year? Ya think Chinese Americans pose a special danger?  And yes, Diblasio shouldn't have done it. But he was responding to the fact that people were actually boycotting Chinese restaurants. And the fact is that Republican governors are still being lenient about enforcement. And the Chinese New Year thing pales into insignificance compared to New York's density which is the overwhelming factor in the Coronavirus situations. It's also front loaded. So states that aren't so hard hit now will be harder hit later as New York starts to recover.

18 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

Bummer. Why do you think that means people should get a free ride PLUS vote to make other people pay more?

What are you on about? What has this got to do with a free ride? Workers used to be compensated in accordance with how productive they were. all through the 50's and 60's and into the 70's/ That's not the case anymore. What is there about that that you don't understand?

Just now, Crazy Alex said:

Yep. Everyone should pitch in. Why do you think your graphs proves otherwise?

Here's a better version without the pop-up blocking it.

As you'll not until the late 70's workers' pay increases kept pace with productivity. And then it just stopped. In fact in the 80's until well into the 90s real wages actually declined.

So that leads to the question, if workers aren't getting the benefit of it, who is?

17 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

On principle, I believe EVERYBODY should pitch in and pay at least a few thousand dollars in federal income tax. Like a brilliant Democrat politician once said, everyone needs to "have skin in the game."

 

Now, being poor is mostly a matter of how one handles their finances and their life in general. That's no reason to give them a pass. The poor need to pay up like the rest of us. THAT is what I call "fair".

And then there's this: Owen Cass, a prominent conservative economist measured how many weeks it would take an average male worker in 1979 to earn enough to meet a family of 4's basic needs versus  what it would take in 2018. It turns out it would take about 30 weeks in 1979 and 53 weeks in 2018.

https://www.manhattan-institute.org/the-cost-of-thriving

8 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

On principle, I believe EVERYBODY should pitch in and pay at least a few thousand dollars in federal income tax. Like a brilliant Democrat politician once said, everyone needs to "have skin in the game."

 

Now, being poor is mostly a matter of how one handles their finances and their life in general. That's no reason to give them a pass. The poor need to pay up like the rest of us. THAT is what I call "fair".

Uh-huh.

https://www.epi.org/productivity-pay-gap/

13 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

It's certainly no surprise New York is a hot spot for the virus. Some hack there told everyone to party it up at Chinese New year and forget COVID-19 "misinformation NINE DAYS after the Trump administration declared a national health emergency and restricted travel from China. As late as March 13, Bill Di Blasio was telling people to go have drinks at a bar.

 

Where there are government disasters, there are ALWAYS big government liberals behind the scene, causing or exacerbating these disasters.

American states’ responses to the coronavirus follow party lines

Republican-leaning governors are slower to impose restrictions than Democrats

A new paper by researchers at the University of Washington finds that lawmakers in right-leaning states have been noticeably slower at rolling out social-distancing measures. Such delays have massive consequences. To arrive at this conclusion, the researchers compiled data on which rules were adopted by which states, and when such orders were first announced. They focused on five categories of policies: bans on large gatherings, school closures, restrictions on restaurant operations, business closures and stay-at-home orders.

https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2020/04/02/american-states-responses-to-the-coronavirus-follow-party-lines

3 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

It's certainly no surprise New York is a hot spot for the virus. Some hack there told everyone to party it up at Chinese New year and forget COVID-19 "misinformation NINE DAYS after the Trump administration declared a national health emergency and restricted travel from China. As late as March 13, Bill Di Blasio was telling people to go have drinks at a bar.

 

Where there are government disasters, there are ALWAYS big government liberals behind the scene, causing or exacerbating these disasters.

Nonsense. New York is a hotspot because it's the most densely populated part of the country and it's a center of international air travel. And lots and lots of tourists.

What makes your comments particularly ludicrous is that it's overwhelmingly GOP states that have been slow to act. Even now, the incompetent governor of Florida has given a special dispensation to people congregating for religious purposes. Several other incompetent Republican governors have done the same. But they have no choice, really do they? They are hostages to the political right.

5 of the 6 worst governors are Republicans. And the one Democratic governor who performed badly was upbraided by his fellow Democrats.

Of the 2 Republican governors who performed well, one is Larry Hogan, who you would probably call a RINO. He has publicly contradicted Trump.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/04/01/coronavirus-state-governors-best-worst-covid-19-159945

2 hours ago, Logosone said:

Yes, nobody gets punished for taking too many and too heavy measures. Only for too few.

 

Never mind that this man caused the giant global lockdowns with his flawed analysis (oh it worked in China, it's the way to go).

 

If you read his paper you will see a table where any figure from 490 to 490,000 is mentioned, this is not the first pandemic paper Ferguson has written, he knows exactly how to phrase it.

 

History will judge Ferguson by all the mistakes he's made and all the governments for their overreactions and the economic damage they will cause. 

 

Compare this with Trump's nuanced approach, he wanted to isolate NY, then reconsidered, he wants to open the economies as soon as possible. It just will not do to abdicate leadership alltogether to experts who are no good.

"Yes, nobody gets punished for taking too many and too heavy measures. Only for too few."

Exactly. It's obvious that the rule is to err on the side of caution. What is so difficult about that for you to understand?

And, of course, it's utter nonsense, to think it's only Ferguson whose advice governments are following.

As for Trump's "nuanced approach' He definitely wants to "open the economies as soon as possible." And way sooner than advisable. Remember his openly expressed with to open things up by April 12? Contrary to what everyone else in a position of authority was saying? That's what you call nuance?

  And what kind of nuance is this?"

CDC RECOMMENDS MASKS, BUT TRUMP SAYS HE WON'T WEAR ONE BECAUSE HE MEETS 'PRESIDENTS, PRIME MINISTERS, DICTATORS'

lthough the CDC recommended that the American public begins voluntarily wearing face coverings in some public settings to prevent the spread of coronavirus in the U.S., President Donald Trump said Friday during the coronavirus task force meeting that he would not be wearing one because of the requirements of his job.

U.S. Surgeon General Jerome Adams said Friday that individuals who are asymptomatic can still transmit the virus to others and that "simple cloth coverings" worn over the face can, along with social distancing measures, help to curb community spread.

Trump however, said the recommendation was advice that he would not be taking.

https://www.newsweek.com/cdc-recommends-masks-trump-says-he-wont-wear-one-because-he-meets-presidents-prime-ministers-1496064

11 minutes ago, Forethat said:

According to La Repubblica, a study by Carlo La Vecchia (renowned epidemiologist) and Eva Negri at the Milan State University now shows that the number of infected individuals in Italy probably is at least ONE HUNDRED times higher than official numbers. According to this study, at least 5 million people in Italy are already infected, but it COULD be as many as 20 million (a third of the population).

 

https://rep.repubblica.it/pwa/locali/2020/04/03/news/milano_la_ricerca_dell_universita_statale_i_contagi_reali_in_italia_potrebbero_essere_5_milioni_-253027121/

I hope that's true.

6 hours ago, Nyezhov said:

 Can a physiscian freely prescribe medications in NY btw?

 

 

Yes. Except certain drugs with addictive potential, Of course, there are malpractice considerations. But that's a civil matter.

2 hours ago, muzley said:

Governor Newsom would have disappointed a lot of CNN viewers and presenters and Joy Behar with this! 55555!

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2020/04/02/gov_gavin_newsom_id_be_lying_to_say_trump_has_not_been_responsive_to_californias_coronavirus_needs.html

 

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/gavin-newsom-praises-trump-as-proactive-when-asked-on-the-view-if-hes-kissing-the-ring-to-avoid-retribution/

 

Cuomo is responsible for New York drama, he failed his people.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3J_RR0tJYn8

 

Given that we've seen how Trump reacts to negative comments from governors, what would you expect Newsom to say?

“Don’t call the woman in Michigan” — Trump’s pettiness was on display during Friday’s coronavirus briefing

One day after a Fox News interview in which he tried to offload blame for the failures of the federal government coronavirus response effort onto blue state governors like Andrew Cuomo (NY), Jay Inslee (WA), and Gretchen Whitmer (MI), Trump took things up a notch.

During his press briefing on Friday, Trump said he directed the official running the White House’s response effort, Vice President Mike Pence, to not call Inslee and Whitmer — even as hospitals in each of their states approach the point of being overwhelmed by coronavirus cases — because they aren’t “appreciative” enough of his efforts.

https://www.vox.com/2020/3/27/21197647/governor-michigan-trump-supplies-coronavirus-briefing

32 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Nobody, but nobody, expected that "nothing" would be done.

 

Here we have the good Dr Neil Ferguson on record:

 

"Our estimates – while subject to much uncertainty due to the limited data currently available – suggest that the impact of the unfolding epidemic may be comparable to the major influenza pandemics of the twentieth century."

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/195217/coronavirus-fatality-rate-estimated-imperial-scientists/

 

Fast forward one month and it's:

 

"UK deaths from the disease are now unlikely to exceed 20,000, he said, and could be much lower"

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2238578-uk-has-enough-intensive-care-units-for-coronavirus-expert-predicts/

 

Did he ever apologise that he was off by around 200,000? Ferguson got it wrong, he admitted it himself when he revised his paper and submitted a new one.

 

Even that one didn't take testing and isolating the infected into account. Mistake after mistake.

But that was his prediction. You know, to establish a baseline. And he said it was subject to much uncertainty. Better to overestimate the danger than underestimate.

29 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Following the party line neh? We much dont care what other countries do as long as they do what they are told when the shooting starts ????

 

You been living in a cave since 1945?

9 minutes ago, Logosone said:

We see this with the CDC in the US and the absolutely shocking mistakes they made in relation to test kits.

As for the CDC, yes that was a problem. That said the bigger mistake was that the FDA hindered private companies and labs from developing and manufacturing test kits and doing testing. Whereas in Germany, private tests were the way to go from the start.