robblok

16 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

Rubbish. It is a ballad, a song which tells a story. It neither promotes nor justifies violence

Against women! One might as well argue that the lyric "as they come to break down to he door" promotes needless vandalism against houses!

 

 

Many will disagree, it does portrait violence against woman. And in the past these things were accepted. You still see it here on this forum of people defending unfaithful spouses getting hit or worse. 

Im not sure where i stand, I do believe that muziek influences culture and culture influences murders. But at the other hand not everyone who listens to something like this is an idiot and thinks its ok.

Like so many things its perfectly ok for some people while dangerous for others who think its normal. 

I never got into a murderous rage after killing some Germans in VR but some people have linked computer games to violence too.

2 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Do give it a rest about "White guys and immigrants "

This thread is about a song not being sung and its nothing to do with White guys or immigrants 

 

Its about a song that promotes violence against woman or at least justifies it.  

5 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Really no need to bring race and Religion into the equation 

I brought it up because some people believe its not white guys doing it just immigrants and unfornuately that is not true. A Dutch Celebrity took his gf and put her head between the car door and closed it (forcefully). 

Then you got a group of guys that think woman are property and you can hit them if they cheat (not in my book)

I just dont know what would change these opinions, but songs, games and vids would not make normal people do it. 

However in Thailand they say all the violence in Lakorn is making people act that way. I wonder how true it is because after I watch a movie or play a game i never get murder needs.

29 minutes ago, robblok said:

If you say so violence against woman is on the rise we don't need songs to make it even worse. And guess what its not just muslims its a lot of white guys too. Now i liked this song but never really thought about it. Violence against woman should be curbed at whatever cost.

Actually, i recall that. I mean this is the same thing as movies and computer games. Has not shown to make people more violent. There are always idiots who do so. But its scaring how many woman get killed by BF's even in my country.

2 hours ago, mania said:

Ah the woke crew on steroids again ????

If you say so violence against woman is on the rise we don't need songs to make it even worse. And guess what its not just muslims its a lot of white guys too. Now i liked this song but never really thought about it. Violence against woman should be curbed at whatever cost.

9 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

The point is this, corruption exists in every society no matter what the political structure. Societies with free speech, a free press, rule of law and a functioning multi party democracy have lower levels of corruption. 
Why on earth would you want to deny Thailand the above mentioned anti corruption mechanisms by pretending there is no difference between elected governments and juntas?

 

BTW - I am not American, you’re wrong again.

It was just a guess about the American as they have crazy politics and so on. So they are used to strange things more often and as you see they are far more corrupt given the index.

What I am saying is that anti corruption under the Junta and under anyone will be the same. They wont go after the government in power. The system is rotten As long as corruption is this big you cant call it a real democracy.

There is not much difference corruption wise between a junta and an elected government. Other parts maybe but like i said both are equally corrupt and both have never done something to really combat corruption. Just use it as a weapon against their enemies.

3 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

You’re making the classic mistake of projecting your own limitations and shortcomings onto others.

The truth is, Thailand is already 95% of the way there (to becoming an open, democratic society that is).

 

Not with these corruption levels. Your showing your Thaksin bias.

22 minutes ago, zzaa09 said:

There's only one thing that requires change and to be severed. The basic crux.

Gonna be a while, yet. 

And then when it does come about, it'll take another good generation for the society and political workings to come around from the eras of this type of rule and all of it's associated misdealing. 

Yea.. i was foolish to think that something like that could change.. its just too deep ingrained in culture. 

12 hours ago, herfiehandbag said:

The difference is that if the government is voted in, it has to bear in mind that it must convince the electorate to vote it in again in four years time. Getting a working democratic process, not based on lies or ridiculous impractical proposals  will take several election cycles. Every time there is a coup that "timeline" is reset to zero.

 

That would probably eventually have been Thaksin 's downfall - Abhisit may well have been able to beat him after a couple of elections. Instead we have effectively had two decades of military rule and everything is back to year zero.

Even military governments go away eventually. So that argument does not make sense. My point is that it does not matter corruption wise. The sad fact is that they are all corrupt and will never do a thing to make it better. So unless politicians change nothing will change. 

But given that i know that now I wont support a miltary government anymore. But that does not  mean i like the corrupt other governements from Thaksin any better. The guy was hugely corrupt and a blatant liar so nothing to be happy about.

Im no ok with whoever will come knowing that nothing will change and the people will be robbed the same. 

I was just an idiot to believe things could be better. (I came here during Thaksins reign of corruption and was shocked thinking anything would be better not realizing they are all the same). Lets hope that there wont be any more violence.

1 hour ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Name a country with no corruption.

There isn’t one - only the levels vary.

Exposing government corruption is one of the main strategies for opposition parties to win elections - democracy counters corruption (to a degree).

Democratic Thailand will always be less corrupt than Dictatorship Thailand.

 

Don't let perfect be the enemy of good.

????

I would be ok if the levels were not as much. You probably from the US or something like that where corruption and abuse of power is normal (see the whole democrat republican spats election stealing ect). I am from the Netherlands hardly any corruption. So I have higher standards. Most of us in Western Europe do

I state, there is no difference corruption wise between any of them. None of them will make rules that actively combat corruption. Democracy wont change a thing. I wish it would but it wont. Its just an other group of money grabbers. 

51 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

The courts have clearly been used as a political weapon, your refusal to acknowledge this fact reflects poorly on your honesty, intellect or both.

Should you ever (even inadvertently) find yourself mixed up in the Thai judicial system you will very quickly discover karma is a bitch.

Does it make the corruption and crimes not real ?

No they were real.

The only political part is that they went after him normally they allow corruption. (in their own circle)

So the crimes were real.. its just out of the ordinary that someone got punished for it. I am happy he got punished at least that shos some people can get punished for corruption.

2 hours ago, billd766 said:

Thaksin was not found guilty of any civil crimes but he was found guilty of some political crimes by the the military who committed a coup against a legally elected civilian government,

 

That is why no civilised country would extradite him back to Thailand.

What is the difference between civil crimes and political crimes. 

Because all i know he has been conviced for corruption and other fraud stuff. Now you might think its political (and going after him probably was) but that does not mean he did not commit the crimes.

4 hours ago, herfiehandbag said:

I hope so - but there are some who might try it. Arguably the best result would be an attempted coup which fails dismally. That may put the lid firmly on a number of boxes.

 

Of course it will be messy, which none of us ( in our right minds) want but I don't really see a way out of the present situation without making a mess.

There is no future for Thailand democracy does not solve its corruption problems. So basically new government only means different people benefitting. No change in at all otherwise. 

I really hope the current mob loses but only a fool will think the new government wont be corrupt. Only party that is a bit decent is move forward and they wont get enough votes.

Shins & the military government  ar both utterly corrupt so it really does not matter much what one lies to you. Still better have someone to lie to you that is voted in then that rolled with a tank in. But practically nothing will change. 

3 minutes ago, Burma Bill said:

Safe and Trusted Thailand!

Depends, was there just one life jacket or did just one person put it on.  Boats can capsize its up to people who cant swim to put on life jackets especially in bad weather.

Now if there were no life jackets then its all the fault of the captain and he should be jailed. If there were then its the mistake of the tourist.

21 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

You posted "Recently" and commented on a thread about Koh Tao deaths, no reference whatsoever to Taiwan or Thalidomide!

Great remark, dragging in covid and Thalidomide into it. Though i would change Taiwan for Thailand.

5 minutes ago, smedly said:

you know what - even if an autopsy was done I still would not believe the results - people are instructed what to say - even doctors

You know some people are paranoid too. Others have the Thaibashing syndrome.  What the case is with you i dont know but if you dont believe basics then a debate is impossible as there is no common ground.

Im not saying an autopsy is a bad thing I am saying that not having one does not mean there is a complot or murder. Just different way of doing things. 

16 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Hard to see how a dive instructor can't be fit and healthy.

You're lugging air tanks and weight belts around all the time.

Then there's lots of swimming, assisting the tourists on and off the boats, dragging the tourists that ran out of steam along in the water etc.

Seriously... When did you dive for the last time in Thailand. ? Dive instructors are not the ones lugging the air tanks and weight belts are setup in the morning. The swimming is a breeze.

I think you have a strange idea of what a divemaster does. Maybe because you dived in the UK and have not worked here. Here the lower minions or even the clients themselves take the tanks. I have dived in december. Carried my own tanks (just like other clients) and dive instructors were  not used like mules. Also I have in all my diving never seen a dive master assisting tourists that ran out of steam.

Maybe where you dived there were lots of currents but what you describe does not happen much on dives in Thailand. Diving is a really slow sport where you go through the water at a slow pace to see as much as possible. There are a few diving spots with current but i have yet to see a dive instructor pulling a client.

Just now, smedly said:

the point being - who told his friend these details, sorry but I just do not trust anything from this place

Paramedics said so. So unless the paramedics are in on it too then its a fact. But if you dont even believe this then not read the newspaper because you dont trust anything.

1 minute ago, PJ71 said:

From other posts of yours it seems you're heavily into fitness, for you to die in your sleep would be considered unsuspicious?

 

Really?

Yes, im heavy into fitness. though a bit less now because of an injury. But seriously without yearly in dept health checks you dont know anything. I might look healthy but i could have some underlying problems. Its not uncommon for people to have undiscovered health problems.

Just now, PJ71 said:

Yes, i know a few dive instructors and yes they're fit.

 

To suggest that a fit 48 year old man dying in his sleep is normal is quite simply, absurd.

Maybe what you and i consider fit differs. But i can say the majority is not that fit and a lot drink and party a lot. Even though padi says no drinking before diving (night before). These guys are here just on a holiday working part of the year here. No super humans nothing. I am suggesting he was not fit and suggesting he might have had health problems. As we have no records from his DR. Its a speculation both sides.