Mike Lister

Equity markets like the SET are a forward view of the economy, selected companies have grown but most have flatlined. Pockets of private wealth exist but wealth across the board has remained flat, if not fallen. The Thai economy is dependent on two things, customs or goods exports which represents about 60% of GDP, and, international tourism which represents around 12%. For the SET to begin to trend upwards, exports would also have to do the same. That would mean that businesses are growing, new businesses being created and the demand for Thai products increasing. In general, those things aren't happening, there is a lack of innovation and quality levels are low. Another factor is that the wealth in the country is on the hands of a few. So whilst the likes of Central Group expands overseas, the vast majority simply don't grow.

"Another person who believes this forum represents all retired expatriates".

I never said anything of the sort, you can't read properly or comprehend or both.

Correction, income of 1 million a year will potentially attract Thai Tax at 10% on the 500k that is assessable whilst the other 500k is free of tax.

Yes, sure, it's anecdotal. But the combination of all anecdotal evidence, surveys, personal knowledge, people I know, myself, all point towards the average being much much closer to 50k per month than 85k a month or 1 million a year. The likes of poster Ben Xioner are in the top couple of percent.

Even if the income is one million, allowances and deductions reduce that by half, if over 65. That means assessable income is only 500k, from memory that's 15 percent.

The average farang retiree lives here on much less than 1 mill, surveys in this forum over the years confirm that.

Absolutely, exit permits are just a matter of time, either that or RD sign off at visa extension time. The US used to do this for many years that I lived there, leaving the country became complicated at one point.

In Thailand, banks are the agents of BOT and they enforce and execute BOT policy. In the UK, for example, it's likely to be similar but they may also enforce HMRC rules as well. It's a joined up world.

I don't have all the answers on this, I only know that HMRC has managed to find a way to crack down on this loophole with non-doms and if you were HMRC you'd do the same. How they do it or what the mechanism is, I don't know. I also know that no system is foolproof and it is almost certainly possible to devise a mechanism that works, as long as everything works smoothly and to plan. But one thing that does strike me from your examples is that people would have to keep a fair amount of money in a UK account and also set up a reliable process to make sure their spending habits weren't detected. That may be fine for younger guys but it seems unlikely that the average pensioner is going to have that much spare cash, nor that they want to manage a system of that nature. Older guys want reliability, security, the comfort of knowing there wont be a letter in the mail or knock on the door that threatens their retirement in Thailand and/or, creates lots of hassle with their UK finances and relationships. I wish I knew more about the Visa/Mastercard settlement process but as said, it touches on all the banks and the Central Banks hence plugging this loophole is not impossible. As also said earlier, HSBC, at a minimum, has been watching card spending habits for a very long time and when they see something unusual, they will ask questions.

I don't see why, I think much of this is fear of the unknown rather than any serious impact, unless you're seriously high earners..

A few probably will but the vast majority who are settled here, have homes and families here, will certainly not, unless they are at the very high end of the income scale. I've been here for 22 years and have a family and home here, there's no way I would consider leaving for what is almost certainly a miniscule impact as a result of the tax rule changes. I have a home in the UK I could go to but the airfare and loss of rental alone would far exceed an tax impact.

Sure, there are always going to be work arounds and not everyone is capable of being caught. But I don't think ay RD is interested in casual users who visit here and there from time to time and use a CC. I think they are more interested in sustained use over time. I posted earlier, somewhere, about HSBC UK who called me because of sustained use of my UK credit card in Hong Kong in the 90's, they wanted to know if I'd moved to live there so I had to give them chapter and verse about my secondment and my UK assets, and this was long before Know Your Customer was introduced.

Many of the perps are hill tribe people, jailing them will alienate the police and make relations worse. The other problem is that most often, the police come from communities where these perps live and they understand what they are doing and why, even if they don't fully understand the negatives of burning. It's a social problem and an economic problem.

Tax forms and rules are available in English, the online system is not, currently. There is very little extra labour involved, many people now enter their taxes online.

For example?

I don't mean to rain on your parade and you probably already know this, but let me just state the obvious for anyone else who may be reading. Filing a joint return and not reporting your own income, if you have any, means the tax return is fraudulent and that you are avoiding tax. And because it's a joint return, your wife is also involved in that. Chances are you could get away with it for the next 25 years and there wouldn't be a problem......but!

Are you over 65? If so, I don't think you will be able to claim the 190k deduction if you file jointly.

I have a 13 digit number but the app asks fort he number on the back of my ID card which obviously I don't have, how did you overcome this?

Hahaha, I'm sorry, I saw Korat on the google map, it should have course said Buriram. But the same sentiment applies, I haven't been there for over twenty years but back then it was the pits.

Just thinking through this some more: It's not that a credit card would be interrogated for buying groceries but they might be for continuous levels of spending in a second country, in a different currency. Years ago I used an HSBC UK Mastercard to pay my bills in Hong Kong, it was easy and convenient plus my employer settled my bills from the UK as part of my expenses and per diem. Somewhere around the six month mark, my HSBC chappie called me and asked me if I had moved to live in HK because they could see that all my transactions were generated there. I said no, I'm on secondment, nevertheless I had to go through their interrogation about my UK assets and links to the UK vs HK. The message here is that the banks and card companies do watch these things so any work around is likely to be short lived.

Pretty much all the officers and staff in the Chiang Mai Districts 1 & 2 offices speak English at different levels, some of them speak it extremely well, why Bangkok is anything different is odd. Either you are exaggerating or you mean the one or two officers you spoke to don;t speak English as well as you might like. There is an English language version of the tax regulations and the tax forms that have been posted in other threads that discuss the new tax law, take a look.

I rent my UK flat using an agent ho takes care of most things.....it's my plan B.

Best post in the entire thread.

Yes, I agree