Mike Lister

Yes, this is a concern for many people. The key is I think that you know that no tax is due so that's the main thing. Worst case is that you are required to file and it's a simple filing that the staff at the RD will do for you.

For @swissie in particular: The link below may be behind a paywall for you, in which case, there are some work arounds so PM me. Ambrose Evans Pritchard is the author, he's a superbly qualified economist but a bit of doom monger at times. Anyway, he picked up on the price of gold and asks the question, why and who? It's not normal buying by any means, he researched that. It's not a Western institution and it's NOT a Central Bank, it's somebody with deep pockets who is not price sensitive, Ambrose concludes it's China but doing so covertly. Why? WWIII, government deficits, over leveraging by governments, USD sinking into the sunset.....many possible answers. A good read. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/04/16/gold-price-surge-china-warchest-geopolitical-dystopia/

Quit baiting, you're sounding less like a respected cpa with every post. The discussion is NOT me, it is tax, please stay on topic.

Possibly, But there again, when I do walk in to the TRD office to file my tax return, nobody says to me, Mr Mike, according to the rules, you don't need to file, you can go home! Call me old fashioned if you like but I like that warm comfortable feeling of being able to instantly lay my hands on paper copies of my tax returns from three different countries each year, safe in the knowledge that my entire financial world is easily seen. God forbid that the Immi Dept should ever be so crazy as to reactivate tax clearance certificates in order to renew a visa, but in the 1 in 1,000 chance that they did, I'd be OK with that. And anyway, what's wrong with a little Thai tittering, it's charming and cute.

Peculiar name, must be a football player.

Goodness your memory is short, we had the full debate on this months ago and you were over me like rash for filing a return when I didn't need to, because there was no tax to pay and there was nowhere on the return to put excluded income. Well, I did anyway, because it took me all of fourteen minutes plus I got a free cup of coffee and I had a nice chat with the TRD folks and now I have the paper audit trail and a track record. There are worse ways for a retiree to spend an hour of their life.

Whereas nothing in my life is going to change or has changed regarding finances and where I live, neither will it. Owning the house we live in means my rent wont increase; our willingness to bring over significant funds and invest in THB in the early days and trust Thai banks, means we won't be forced to transfer funds to live for many years; our willingness to file taxes for several years means I am a known entity with a proven track record with TRD (even though I didn't need to file a return, cough cough). Sorry, couldn't resist. 🙂

Don't forget that you only need to explain these things, if you are audited or asked for additional supportive information, after you have filed.

That information has been available via the Sherrings site since January and has been posted many times previously. I would caution you to get your information from sources closer to the horses mouth, PWC, Sherrings, Mazzars etc. There are a number of offshore IFA run businesses that have teamed up with Thai CPA's to sell paid for tax preparation packages to expats here. Once you dig into them the costs can be as high as 10k baht per hour and are a lead in to selling financial services products such as pensions, investments etc. If these are the things you want, great, but everyone needs to understand what they are buying into.

Yes agreed. I can only quote from experience however, for us, it's 20 baht per CM, regardless of whether we use 2 CM or 10 cm....(we've never used more)

At least 50% of foreign visitors to Songkran don't get it, there are legitimate targets and there are targets that are off limits. Anyone clearly not participating but needing to be in the area for other reasons, anyone on their way to work, anyone not dressed for a soaking, are NOT fair game.

Ain't that the truth!

Coming back to basics for a moment, the core issue is that the TRD has reinterpreted their income rule to prevent tax evasion overseas. Why have Thai's invested overseas rather than in Thailand and what has been the impact of that? The why is probably very easy to assess. Investment returns in Thailand are poor, banks rates are low, bank charges are high and brokers fees are high. An offshore investment in an S&P tracker will return on average over 11% per year, every year. An onshore investment in the SET over the past 10 years has been very poor. (see below). Similarly, CDs or TD's in the West might expect 6% over 3 years, in Thailand it will be half of that, if you're lucky. Perhaps the most important aspect is the Thai bond market which is the highest yielding and safest onshore option of any, it's also the vehicle by which BOT and MOF finances government debt. US treasuries currently offer almost twice the yield of their Thai counterparts which means the bond market is hurting. I couldn't be bothered trying to wade through the bond sites statistical data but I'd be willing to bet there's been a decline in domestic sales. My guess is that the TRD rule change is in response to loss of captive market buyers, which, when interest rates normalise once again, should alleviate the problem (not that the tax rule will be changed back of course). If you're government and you're operating a budget deficit of some size and borrowing heavily to fund populist policies, you need buyers for the bonds that finance those things and who better than the native population. https://tradingeconomics.com/thailand/stock-market-return-percent-year-on-year-wb-data.html https://www.thaibma.or.th/EN/Market/SummaryStatistics.aspx

Further to GambOOler's reply above, all of which I agree with: If those two things, your SSc and your mutual fund disbursements are your sole source of remittances to Thailand and you earn no other income here, your Thai tax deductions and allowances (TEDA) under Revenue rules will far exceed your assessable income hence there would be no tax to pay. Your SSc is exempt by treaty and your mutual fund payments of 440k are under the approximately 450k deductions I expect you would receive. Lastly, any tax paid on your mutual funds in the US, could be offset against any tax due in Thailand. (without understanding your circumstances, it's difficult to be precise about your level of TEDA) Reading the following may help: https://aseannow.com/topic/1324294-the-simple-tax-guide/?do=findComment&comment=18829674

I don't know the answers to your questions but what I do know is that it's becoming almost impossible for a foreigner in Thailand to perform a banking related transaction, unless they produce their passport.

Thanks. In that case I agree.

Is that "should be able to" as in it's probably allowable, or is it "should be" as in it is deserved? Not trying to be pedantic, just trying to understand what's intended.

My personal interpretation is that the exemption applies to every year going forward, not just a single year. I'm not aware of additional guidance on this but I will look.

Re. a) The UK tax year ends 5 April, the last date for filing Thai tax is five days prior, I think that is close enough to where that wont be a massive problem. Re. b) no documents are required, UNLESS you are audited, so figure on what, 1:100 maybe? Re c) almost certainly yes it is.

I like that, you are of course quite correct.

After thought: If you pay for a Thai accountant to do your tax returns, in most cases you might well be paying for form filling rather than advice, unless your finances are out of the ordinary or unusual. The RD will do the form filling for free. If you're looking for tax advice, questions you can't get answered here or by the Revenue, a tax advisor may be the way to go. Paying a tax advisor to fill forms when you have straight forward and fairly simple and normal finances doesn't seem sensible. But many people will go that route, because of the scare factor and/or because they didn't bother to try and understand the issues.

I do mine on a spread sheet and arrive at the answer, based on my understanding of the rules, I have income from three countries. I take the numbers down to the District Revenue office and ask them to plug them into their system, which they are always very happy to do, it takes all of ten/fifteen minutes tops. When she's finished she will tell me who owes who how much and we have always agreed first time. She prints off the final page and we're done. Cost, zero.

Can everyone say what are their three biggest/top three issues in the don't know/unclear category, please?

Thanks, despite my earlier scepticism, I also am now leaning the same way.

.....and health care, and infrastructure, and transportation, and relative lack of crime/violence. But the beaches are nice and the girls speak better English.